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Ok. I know with firearms, or really ranged weapons, you can’t shoot if you are blinded/it’s complete darkness where you can’t see because you can’t draw line of sight.
My question is if you are using a dragon pistol, or other scatter shot firearms, with a scatter shot to do a cone instead of a normal ranged attack, are you still allowed to do the cone attack even if you can’t draw line of sight?
If that’s confusing. Can one make a cone scatter shot attack with a firearm if you are blinded/can’t see?
You can make ranged attacks in the dark; your target would have total concealment.
Total Concealment: If you have line of effect to a target but not line of sight, he is considered to have total concealment from you. You can't attack an opponent that has total concealment, though you can attack into a square that you think he occupies. A successful attack into a square occupied by an enemy with total concealment has a 50% miss chance (instead of the normal 20% miss chance for an opponent with concealment).
You can't execute an attack of opportunity against an opponent with total concealment, even if you know what square or squares the opponent occupies.
Scatter Firearms, however, ignore concealment. You just choose a direction for your cone, and make all your attacks as normal; no miss chance. It's dark, so you can't see what you're shooting, but other than that it works the same.
Yep. They aren't an attack roll, as long as the scatter-wielder can guess where the target is they can try, and since it's save, no concealment. Same as a wizard with a fireball.
Isaac,Scatter shot isn’t a save, it’s an attack role for the scatter shot which you do an attack roll for all in the cone and doesn’t missfire unless all the attack rolls misfire. I think you’re thinking dragons breath ammo which is also a cone but is a reflex save/1’s misfire.
Quantum, so you are saying it would ignore total concealment because it’s a cone? As said I know you normally can’t shoot a ranged weapon if you don’t have line of sight. Which is why I am trying to figure out by the rules if firing as a cone would still be allowed.
Spike, my bad, you are correct. (My gunslingers generally use double barrel, and I keep a dragon for deagon's breath, so I've never used it for scatter)
From scatter:
A weapon with the scatter weapon quality can shoot two different types of ammunition. It can fire normal bullets that target one creature, or it can make a scattering shot, attacking all creatures within a cone. Cannons with the scatter weapon quality only fire grapeshot, unless their descriptions state otherwise. When a scatter weapon attacks all creatures within a cone, it makes a separate attack roll against each creature within the cone. Each attack roll takes a –2 penalty, and its attack damage cannot be modified by precision damage or damage-increasing feats such as Vital Strike. Effects that grant concealment, such as fog or smoke, or the blur, invisibility, or mirror image spells, do not foil a scatter attack. If any of the attack rolls threaten a critical, confirm the critical for that attack roll alone. A firearm that makes a scatter shot misfires only if all of the attack rolls made misfire. If a scatter weapon explodes on a misfire, it deals triple its damage to all creatures within the misfire radius.
It ignores concealment for specific abilities. Darkness or blindness I suppose they would have concealment as normal? Though invisibility is on the list...
Final call, I'd say as long as the shooter could shoot in the right direction, the target wouldn't have concealment cause cone. Line of sight can be guessed using other senses which is supposed to represent the 50% miss chance, or needing to guess where they are (there is a bit for that). The shooter can declare to attack square X, and if their target is in it it would hit fine. Darkness, they can determine a square X. Blindness? GMs call I'd say.
That’s what I was thinking.
The only weirdness is concealment and total concealment. I am also of the thought it is meaning any concealment, so it should work like cone for a spell as it’s effecting an area... which goes along with burst effects. This is another reason I thought to ask. Discussion makes me think of other things. It should work just like spells for burst effects because it’s effecting an area and not just a target creature or the like.
I just kept getting caught up on the line of sight thing for ranged weapons (feel very silly for that.)
I think they should adjust that part where it says concealment in scatter weapon quality for people that might have the same initial issue as I did. It’s an area effect and shouldn’t be stopped except by total cover.
Ok.
Thanks, mates!
Keep in mind that list is examples not all inclusive.