Lead lined walls stopping Divination

[LucyG92]

I've heard many times that walls lined with lead can stop attempts at Divination. Does this method require you to have no windows? Can the spell 'find its way in' via those?

[Claxon]

Ask your GM because it's best to clarify this sort of thing with them.

By the rules it would only blocks divination spells with the scrying descriptor, not all divination spells. And a strict interpretation of the rules seems to imply that something must be fully enclosed in lead to block scrying attempts.

[LucyG92]

Yeah, it does seem that way. Is that how people usually run it? Forgoing daylight to ensure people can't scry on you seems reasonable, I suppose. And unfortunately I am the GM! :)

[Tacticslion]

There are such things as "lead glass" which mmmmaaaaayyyyyyy function as lead - after all it only needs a "thin strip" (whatever that means).

I might recommend looking at lead paint and transparent paint.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lead_paint

https://www.naturalpigments.com/art-supply-education/transparent-opaque-pai nts/

(Sorry - I'm on a phone, so fancy link-making is a frustrating exercise I limit to once per post. Today. >.>)

Anyway, also consider:

a) health risks, 'cause, you know, lead (not that PF people would necessarily know this); and...

b) the original idea behind lead blocking scrying: lead was the thing that protected against radiation and thus things like "X-ray vision" - hence it was used in D&D (and inherited in PF) to block certain kinds of divinations - mostly scrying and "detect" spells - things that let you "look" through walls; also consider what else blocks similar things, like one foot of stone or whatnot.

As an aside, look at the "line of effect" rules - generally they require a full foot-wide opening to allow magic to pass through (fireballs impact and explode under lesser holes, for example), when thinking of whether or not "holes" allow magic through.

These can all be factors in the decision.

In any case, none of those will block commune or contact other plans or similar.

[Claxon]

LucyG92 wrote:

Yeah, it does seem that way. Is that how people usually run it? Forgoing daylight to ensure people can't scry on you seems reasonable, I suppose. And unfortunately I am the GM! :)

I don't run it that way. In fact I actually made a house rule that:

5ft of earth, 1 ft of stone, 1 in of metal, or a thin strip of lead block scrying spells and teleportation (but not dimension door) and that openings don't count, unless they're very substantial openings...and yes it's basically GM fiat.

Why? Because I don't like scry and fry and I don't like scrying or teleportation to be the solution to everything.

Teleportation remains great for over world travel, but doesn't let you jump to the end of a dungeon. Scrying and teleport works, but not against "fortified" structures and people who are prepared. Ultimately I decided on this to reduce the power of these spells. Otherwise it makes "bases" kind of pointless since a moderate level wizard can bypass all your fortifications.

[All_might!]

Well I asked superman and he thinks it should work.

[Pizza Lord]

I think you're fine if a predominance of the surrounding area is protected by lead. Like Tacticslion mentioned, leaded glass should be sufficient (in my opinion, as this is the Advice thread), assuming you've otherwise got your walls infused or lined with blocking materials. Similarly, if someone lived in a cavern, the surrounding walls of which contained a preponderance of lead ore or traces, I would probably count that as blocking (or at least give a penalty or bonus to any checks, depending on the spell of course) whether there was a passage or corridor leading into the cavern or whether there were a solid shell of lead ore surrounding the area. In other words, don't feel you have to have a lead fireplace or chimney cover because a brick chimney would be an 'open doorway' to scrying (again, assuming a reasonably complete surrounding of blocking material).

[Chuck Mount]

I'm with the others. It's up to the individual GM. Personally, I run it as having a secure room. A wizard might have a lead vault in the cellar with a lead door where he holds secret meetings. I also have never had a problem with "scry and fry". I've never played with a group that thinks along those lines. It's too easy... Maybe. If they try it and it doesn't work... they're on someone's radar and they might be able to try it with them.
I played in a campaign where anything organic blocked either scrying or teleportation. It was 1st edition and my memory is awful. My character had ivy grown (magically) all over his tower and that worked. GM decision.

[Queen Moragan]

What we've always done, since 1st edition, is add powdered lead to to the mortar in stone, brick, and log structures. Wooden walled structures or interior walls of a room can be covered in lead foil (same as aluminium or tin foil), then paneled, plastered, painted or whatnot. Powdered lead can also be added to plasters and paint.

For extra protection we use lead plates, 1/8 or 1/4 inch thick.

For superior protection the lead is 1 inch thick.

For the ultimate protection the lead is 1 foot thick.

Game wise, you add it to the mortar, it obscures line-of-effect for teleportation and divination, reducing success. The teleportation fails or just moves you as far as you can go without passing through a wall. Divination's get clouded and are not completely accurate. So you need a clear room for divinations and you open a window or use a balcony for teleports. Normally a floor of a tower would be clear of lead so magic would work in and out.

Plates cannot be teleported through, and they stop all divination.

A one inch barrier of lead makes it hard for Gods and Artifacts to see through.

One foot of lead is a barrier to Gods and Artifacts.

I remember most of this from somewhere way back, I've never seen anything really contradict it. So we always assume stuff like this is there.

Just this year we made an inch thick box to hold a troublesome sword.