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People who spend (too much) time on these boards have probably heard of the Ragebred Vivisectionist (optionally additionally Beastmorph) with Feral Mutagen getting 6 natural attacks with sneak attack. I'm interested in giving it a try, however...
I really like Beastmorph (I can get Pounce with 6 natural weapons? Yes please!), but I don't care for trading away my persistent mutagen, since my combat style kind of relies on my mutagen being active. Is there a way I can get that back?
I've never seen an example of the build past level 3. I imagine without magical weapons (besides the Amulet) it probably trails off even harder than most martials, but it's got sneak attack and extracts to make up for that, at least in part. Where do I take it after level 3? I'm kind of lost on this one...
The game I'm thinking of using this build in intends to go Mythic. I'm even more lost on what to do with my mythic stuff. Trickster path, or Champion? There's no Mythic version of Improved Natural Weapon - what do I do with my mythic feats?
...so, yeah, I really hope you guys can help me out some. I have other concepts I can go with if I can't figure this one out, but I'm on a bit of a time crunch, so I'm entreating you for assistance.
once you get your pounce, you can split off into master chymist to get extra mutagen uses per day, making up for persistant
I'm liking Master Chymist a lot! I will have to ask my GM if they'll allow Master Chymist to progress my sneak attack, since it would progress bomb damage... thank you ^_^
I was thinking a good base for a Natural Attack Build would be Tengu. Take the Claws Trait, and now you have 3 Natural Attacks Full Time.
Take a level in White Haired Witch. Acquire a Helm of the Mamoth Lord. Now you have 5. A level in Monk or Brawler with Improved Unarmed STrike, and that makes 6.
White Hair gives a Bonus Grapple like the Grab Ability. Wear Armor Spikes, and then you'll Damage when you start a Grapple, too.
Take Hamatula Strike, and your Piercing Attacks: Gore and Bite, also get free Grapples.
Take Snake Style, and so will your Unarmed Strikes. Take Feral Combat Training, and so will your Claws.
So that's 12 Attacks/Round.
You want Sneak Attack Damage?
I like to use a few methods for locking in Sneak Attack Damage. I just worked something out
1Slayer1: Bounty Hunter, Studied Target, Tracking, Dirty Fighting, Improved Dirty Trick
2S1Brawler1: Snakebite Striker, Sneak Attack +1d6, Brawler's Cunning, Martial Training, Unarmed 1d6
3S1B1Arcanist1: Sorcerer and Wizard Spells, Dimensional slide, Improved Feint
4S2B1A1: Dirty Trick
5S3B1A1: Sneak Attack +1d6, Feat
Dimensional Slide is a Teleport that has a range of 10' and you can use as often as you want with no disorientation, so it seems just lovely to achieve Flanking and lock in your Sneak Attack Damage.
The Dirty Trick Combat Maneuver can be used to Blind your opponent, no sight, no Dex bonus to AC, and you lock in your Sneak Attack Damage. If you run into an opponent with Bindsight or the Blindfighting Feat, use Dirty Trick again and make him Deaf as well as Blind. That should do it. Bounty Hunter Slayers have a Dirty Trick Class Ability that resembles Swift Dirty Trick.
Improved Feint also locks in Sneak Attack Damage. After that, maybe start taking levels in Ninja and get Vanishing Trick and False Attacker. There are other Rogue Talents that really help.
Consider some way of using Moonlight Stalker feats.
There are other Rogue Talents that help you lock in your Sneak Attack Damage. Gloom magic, I think?
So I got a chance at work to really look at this build in Mythic, it's looking really good. Just in case anyone is ever looking to actually play the Ragebeast past level 3, here's the options I came up with that made me decide the build can remain useful and fun to play...
Discoveries
Must have: Feral Mutagen, Greater Mutagen, Grand Mutagen (note you can get these from Master Chymist if you go that that route)
Cool: Psychokinetic tincture, Wings, Tumor Familiar, Vestigal arm, Mummification
Feats: (If Mythic: Weapon Finesse. Get the Mythic version too, play as a Small Ragebred and use Reduce Person and Cat's Grace... and Titan's Bane, so you can hide underneath Medium sized creatures and sneak attack them all day long), Extra Discovery... still working on these
Mythic Path Abilities - Trickster
1st: Titan's Bane, Supreme Stealth(?), Path Dabbling(save for later?), Legendary Item (Amulet of Mighty Fists?)
3rd: Vanishing Move (spend an MP for a full-attack of sneak attacks...), Fickle Attacks (especially if your GM will let it apply to sneak attack dice), Ethereal Trapsmith
6th: Bloody Streak (+tier to sneak attack dice as long as you keep hitting with them), Class Mimic, Enduring Elixir
Master Chymist PrC
what you give up: "Beast shape" progression from Beastmorph, 3 levels of casting, free extracts known per level, 3 special extracts from Vivisectionist (awaken, baleful poly, and regenerate), discoveries and grand discovery, instant alchemy @ 18th; sneak attack progression from Vivisectionist - ask your GM about this one, since Master Chymist advances bomb damage and sneak attack replaces bomb and advances at exactly the same rate. If they say no, skip the PrC.
what you get: Full BAB and slightly bigger HD, 2 to 5 additional mutagens per day, 5 special mutagen upgrades (pick from: +1 die size to bite and claws, 2x mutagen duration, evasion, greater/grand if you didn't get them as discoveries, growth if you're not using the Titan's Bane version, dark vision, scent, and free healing), and +2 to +6 damage with all your natural attacks.
Hope that helps anyone who comes after me!
(P.S. for Scott: That build looks really interesting, to be honest, but your post didn't really help me, since I was asking questions specifically about the Ragebeast build [Ragebred Vivisectionist with Feral Mutagen, gets 6 naturals with sneak attack at level 2] and your post didn't cover it at all. But you should totally post that build somewhere it'll get seen, it's unique!)
gatherer818 wrote: (P.S. for Scott: That build looks really interesting, Well, thank you.
gatherer818 wrote: to be honest, but your post didn't really help me, since I was asking questions specifically about the Ragebeast build I'm sorry it wasn't helpful, but I do think I offered you a "six-natural-attack build - progression option," as per the title of your thread.
Perhaps one or more of the readers might find some not-useless advice for a build like this: and extra attack for a 1 level dip, a Wondrous Item that gives yet another attack. Another dip and another Feat, and you double your attacks.
gatherer818 wrote: I've never seen an example of the build past level 3. That sounds like there is room for a diversity of ideas.
gatherer818 wrote: Vivisectionist Including ways of locking in your Sneak Attack Damage. I offered methods for Flanking, Feinting, and Blinding your opponents to promise you will get your Sneak Attack Damage as alternative options to your Mythic levels idea.
Anyway, I'm glad you found it interesting, and I hope some reader will find it useful.
Tengu Cult Leader Warpriest.
* Claws (2x natural attacks) Bite (1x natural attack)
Traits
* Fate's Favored (For divine favor buffing)
* Whatever
Feats
Lvl 1: Weapon Finesse (dex to hit)
Lvl 3: Weapon Focus Claws (Pushes damage from 1d3 to 1d6)
Lvl 5: Weapon Focus Bite (Pushes damage from 1d3 to 1d8, claws advance too)
Sneak Attacks
* 1d6 at lvl 3, +1d6 for every 3 levels thereafter
Equipment
* Agile amulet of mighty blows (dex to damage)
* Helm of the Mammoth Lords (Gore 1d8 damage)
* Wyrven Cloak (Stine 1d6 damage)
Warpriests tap out at 3 attacks with iterative modifiers. This tengu starts off with 3 full BaB, ends up with 5.
A fun build for pumping out lots of attacks, each with good damage die and lots of sneak attack add ons.
I have an idea for a "Dragonpig" build.
Wereboar skinwalker Bloodrager X/Dragon Disciple 4. Strength build, with extra feature feat. This should net you a gore, 2x hoofs, 2x claws and a bite attack as early as level 6. and +4 str as of level 9.
Furious Viscious Amulet of Natural Armor, possibly cloak of the mantaray, for an extra attack and a bump to your damage. Use your arcane spells to buff yourself. Could be a fun idea.
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