Is it possible to make a survivable front line fighter that wears light armor?
I've been trying to come up with an idea, but my builds are getting nuked right out of the gate.
There are ways - Lore Warden, Ustalavic Duelist with smart use of AWT... However, I'm of the wisdom that Fighters are best optimized with heavy armor.
For other types of armor, Barbarian/Swashbuckler/Unchained Rogue/Brawler/Daring Champion Cavalier are better.
Depends on what the fighter has, and what you are aiming for.
I mean...if you grab a race with natural armor (such as tiefling), then it tends to be easier to grab great AC without going heavy. Tieflings also have a feat they can take for more natural armor, adn you can grab good old dodge.
Also, what else have you done? Have you at least given them 14 dex? Tried to use reach builds for better distance and survivability?
Have you tried mutagenic warrior? It is a fighter archetype that eschews armor training (which is nothing for you), and give you mutagens instead. Mutagens with delicious natural armor to replace the heavy armor AC. Also wings, because you get a few alchemist mutagens later too.
That archetype doesn't com on immediately (the current version only comes on at level 3 since it replaces the level 3 class feature)... but if you can't survive until level 3, then something might be wrong with your game. It is hard to even by most heavy armors at level 3, so the AC problem shouldn't be that huge of an issue (it will mostly be a comparison of light and medium armor). What exactly do you mean 'nuked right out of the gate'? Just that you are unhappy with the numbers, or that you are literally killed immediately? Because if you are...how do bards/magi/other gish classes supposed to survive even moderately?
Is it possible to make a survivable front line fighter that wears light armor?
If you mean the fighter class: Sure. Go for Dex and a shield, then you should be fine. A fighter with Dex 16, studded leather and a large shield starts off with AC 18, and can improve fast afterwards.
Yes, you lose some damage, but thanks to Weapon Specialization, weapon training and bonus feats you will be fine. And favoring Dex over Str means better reflex saves, initiative and skill checks. AC wise a fullplate is hard to beat, but such a thick armor has drawbacks: Less move speed till level 7 (if you get armor training at all), higher base costs (1.5k is quite relevant on first levels) and high penalties on some checks.
Thanks for the input.
I'm actually thinking of an actual fighter class character.
Wasn't there a feat under discussion that allowed a ighter to use dex for damage with light weapons and rapiers?
A high dex along with dodge and studded leather might be a place to start...
Thanks for the input.
I'm actually thinking of an actual fighter class character.
Wasn't there a feat under discussion that allowed a ighter to use dex for damage with light weapons and rapiers?A high dex along with dodge and studded leather might be a place to start...
Those are slashing grace and fencing grace, respectively.
not particularly great for fighters. The first one only works in a 1 weapon/1handed style (which only really works 'well' when you are a swashbuckler...in which case you might as well use a swashbuckler) and the other.... well... obviously uses rapiers. Which are 1 handed weapons, and not good for TWF, so you go back to the slashing grace problem.
There is a fighter archetype that can do TWF effectively with two 1 handed weapons.... eventually. At level 9. Which means you have to play levels 1-8 with either a subpar style or with HUGE TWF penalties for low levels.
Honestly, you would be better off just going with elven curved blade. You can get good 2 handed power attack with it (just needs 13 str), and you can eventually get the agile weapon property on it.
This all assumes you stay single class, of course.
For Slashing Grace a saber, scimitar or cutlass works well. Two-Weapon Defense is good for dual wielding for a small shield bonus or you could go shield with Shield Focus. A kukri makes a decent off-hand weapon. All of these have an 18-20 critical range as well. If you take the Exotic Weapon Proficiency for the saw-toothed saber you can dual wield them as light weapons.
Learned Duelist looks nice with any of those^ weapons or a rapier. Go high DEX. You could do well with Sword Lord as well but you have to use a Dueling Sword.
Two-Weapon Warrior would be your best bet for two-weapon fighting.
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You can, I've done it, and there are a few ways, though going plate and shield is by far the most straight forward. Here's what I've seen.
Tanking without AC: most commonly practiced by Maguses (Magi?), this involves finding other ways to mitagate not getting hit. Blur, mirror image, displacement, improved in invisibility just give straight up miss chances. Great ways to not get hit, and you don't need armor.
Dex builds: as others have mentioned, there are dex-based options now. A swashbuckler can just straight up deny attacks with opertune parry. Heck, RAW, you can even deny critical hits by just having a really high to hit. With enough Panache and combat reflexes, you can Parry all attacks against you for a round, and a 15-20 rapier, you can easily get it back too.
Tank with hitpoints: I have a friend. Made a barbarian and poured everything into con. Has an AC of, like, 10 when he rages. He also has over 400 HP and doesn't die till -200 for some reason (I don't have his build.) with diehard. When he goes on the defensive he gets DR 14 or something stupid from a feat. He doesn't need AC.
Lastly, and I know I am going to get flack for this, but Mithral breastplate is light armor in everything but proficiency needed to wear it, and it has only 3 less armor than full plate. Max dex is 5. So a fighter with 18 dex and mithral breastplate has the same AC, a better touch AC (worse flat footed) than a 12 dex fighter in full plate (assuming their shields are the same)
Hope that helps.
Edit: one last thing:
So both nature and Lore Oracles can get their charisma to AC instead of dex. I have a bookish lore oracle at level 13 with 32 AC and he's really not even trying (he just has a +2 buckler). If you made a battle-based lore/nature oracle you could probably get pretty high.