So my Gm is letting us use custom items so long as we do the math right and frame it as if we found it in a rule book. I ran by him an on command ring of enlarge person. He said OK as long as it was a once per day activation. I just would like if someone could double check my math because this seems way to cheap for what I'm making.
Weak Ring of Enlarge Person
Aura Aura faint; transmutation; CL 1st
Slot ring Price 4000- gp;
DESCRIPTION
On command, this mundane looking iron ring allows the wearer to use the magic spell enlarge person on themselves once per day.
CONSTRUCTION REQUIREMENTS
Forge Ring, enlarge person; Cost 2000- gp
The formula for a command-activated magic item is : Spell level x caster level x 1800gp. So, at caster level 1, that would be 1 x 1 x 1800gp = 1800gp.
That allows an unlimited number of uses per day. For a charged item, you divide that cost by (5 divided by the number of charges per day). So for 1/day, you divide the cost by 5. That gives you 1800/5 = 360gp for 1/day item of Enlarge Person that takes a command word to activate. It will last for 1 minute once activated.
You appear to have used the formula for use-activated or continuous items. Use-activated in this case means using the item normally (such as lighting a lantern or something similar). In addition, you applied the multiplier for duration, which only applies to continuous items, not ones that need activating.
However, the item pricing formulas are actually the last place you look to price an item. You are supposed to compare to existing items first, and price accordingly. So the actual price could be different.
okay - it goes as Jerra said
1*1*1800{command} * (1/5) = 360gp which will take 1 day to craft.
The item goes in a ring slot, takes a std actn (that provokes) to activate, and Enlarge Person only lasts 10r once per day.
That should be it.
You can lessen the price by choosing a specific class or alignment that it works with, in this case it might be best to leave it alone.
Command word activated items do not provoke and attack of opportunity.
A command word can be a real word, but when this is the case, the holder of the item runs the risk of activating the item accidentally by speaking the word in normal conversation. More often, the command word is some seemingly nonsensical word, or a word or phrase from an ancient language no longer in common use. Activating a command word magic item is a standard action and does not provoke attacks of opportunity.
The text from spell completion:
Activating a spell completion item is a standard action (or the spell's casting time, whichever is longer) and provokes attacks of opportunity exactly as casting a spell does.spell trigger is found under wands:
Wands use the spell trigger activation method, so casting a spell from a wand is usually a standard action that doesn't provoke attacks of opportunity. (If the spell being cast has a longer casting time than 1 action, however, it takes that long to cast the spell from a wand.)Wondrous items aren't actually 'casting' a spell, so casting times for the spell used to create the item is irrelevant. Now, you can of course use casting times to modify the cost of an item, because custom items are GM fiat anyways.hmmmm....
this item is not a Wand and does not use Craft Wand. BTW - a wand of Enlarge Person takes a round to activate...
the last paragraph is, well, just statements...
It also sounds like it doesn't have a slot so should have a price increase.
So my Gm is letting us use custom items so long as we do the math right and frame it as if we found it in a rule book. I ran by him an on command ring of enlarge person. He said OK as long as it was a once per day activation. I just would like if someone could double check my math because this seems way to cheap for what I'm making.
Weak Ring of Enlarge Person
Aura Aura faint; transmutation; CL 1st
Slot ring Price 4000- gp;
DESCRIPTION
On command, this mundane looking iron ring allows the wearer to use the magic spell enlarge person on themselves once per day.
CONSTRUCTION REQUIREMENTS
Forge Ring, enlarge person; Cost 2000- gp
Ring Slot is really where the problem is.
Rings bestow magical powers upon their wearers. Only a rare few have charges—most magic rings are permanent and potent magic items. Anyone can use a ring.
The maths are based on it being a 1st level spell being used once per day, and Enlarge Person really isn't that great of a spell. So that 360 (or whatever) gp price seems about right. That said, the cheapest ring is a prisoner's ring at 250gp, the next jump up is 1,000gp.
1,000 gp seems like the right price to land on.
Other things to consider are breaking up those rounds into choice duration, like other like magic items who contain buffs rather than utility spells.
I'd price this at 1k. A wand gives similar utility, but requires a longer action and being a spell-casting class. On the other hand you could use the wand as often as you need to.
The text from spell completion:
Activating a spell completion item is a standard action (or the spell's casting time, whichever is longer) and provokes attacks of opportunity exactly as casting a spell does.spell trigger is found under wands:
Wands use the spell trigger activation method, so casting a spell from a wand is usually a standard action that doesn't provoke attacks of opportunity. (If the spell being cast has a longer casting time than 1 action, however, it takes that long to cast the spell from a wand.)Wondrous items aren't actually 'casting' a spell, so casting times for the spell used to create the item is irrelevant. Now, you can of course use casting times to modify the cost of an item, because custom items are GM fiat anyways.
If the casting time is irrelevant, then why does the RAW state:
"Activating a magic item is a standard action unless the item description indicates otherwise. However, the casting time of a spell is the time required to activate the same power in an item, regardless of the type of magic item, unless the item description specifically] states otherwise."
As I said, a wondrous item isn't actually casting a spell. It is not a spell trigger or a spell completion item.
For example, I can make a Hat of Disguise using no spells at all, so how could the casting time possibly matter?
If you read wondrous items descriptions, even the ones that duplicate spell effects, they say things like 'gain the benefits of...' or 'as if under the effects of...'. What they do not say is: 'you cast a spell of...'
That's why if the item takes more time than a command word, like a 'Bowl of Conjure Water Elementals', it will specifically say so. If it automatically used the casting time of the spell, the words:
On command as a full-round action, the bearer may summon a water elemental.would be irrelevant. Thus the dire collar, which does not contain such words, activates with a normal standard action despite the fact that the enlarge person spell has a longer casting time.
First, the quote doesn't mention "casting" a spell, it says "activating a power", so spell completion, spell trigger or otherwise is irrelevant.
Second, not fulfilling a pre-req when crafting an item doesn't remove the pre-req. The pre-req is still there, the crafter just doesn't have to cast the spell as part of crafting.
Any item that needs to be activated, not just an item that "casts" a spell, follows this general rule for activation time unless the item specifically states otherwise.
The rule I listed is not more general. It's in the exact same section as command words; it's the exact same level of specificity.
Activating a magic item is a standard action unless the item description indicates otherwise. However, the casting time of a spell is the time required to activate the same power in an item, regardless of the type of magic item, unless the item description specifically states otherwise.
Only specific exceptions in the item description override this general rule. Other general rules do not
So my Gm is letting us use custom items so long as we do the math right and frame it as if we found it in a rule book. I ran by him an on command ring of enlarge person. He said OK as long as it was a once per day activation. I just would like if someone could double check my math because this seems way to cheap for what I'm making.
Personally, I'm with the people that say a ring isn't the right slot for what you want, FWIW.
Certainly, my sorceress just made a belt for another character in one of my games that you might find interesting. We used the magic item creation rules for pricing and it came out pretty good, I think. I'll give the details as I remember them, but adjusted for as though a wizard had made it & you are finding it in a shop. It's a good thing that there were 2nd-level spells involved -- I strongly recommend having spells in effect for at least 3 minutes; that's enough to outlast any fight, IMO, which reduces your book-keeping. Lots of fights last longer than one minute, however, so you do have to count rounds -- a real pain! :)
I started out by making a standard Belt of Giant Strength +4. That's good all the time, and was priced as a standard such belt. It seemed so thematic! And there's a real argument that can be made, IMO, that it's the correct slot for including a spell effect that boosts STR as well as reach. For +4 STR, it costs 16,000.
So yes, I included Enlarge Person on-command (standard action to activate, does not provoke). The cost formula for a command-word item is "Spell level × caster level × 1,800 gp," which at 3rd CL (the minimum wizardly level for the other effects) costs 1 × 3 × 1,800 = 5,400, but then it's × 1.5 as an add-on ability = 8,100 gp. It lasts 3 minutes per activation.
I also added in the effects of Cat's Grace, activated only at the same time as Enlarge Person. (The point, really, was to offset Enlarge's penalty to Dex & further penalty to AC from size.) It lasts as long as the Enlarge, which is convenient. That's going to cost 2 × 3 × 1,800 = 10,800, but × 1.5 again = 16,200 gp.
I then reduced the cost of the latter two effects based on how often the wearer could activate them per day. If you pick 1/day, you'd divide the two costs by 5, getting 1,620 & 3,200, respectively. Add those to the constant Belt of Giant's Strength (16,000), and you get 20,820 gp.
Now, my Belt of Giant-Sizing may be way beyond your purse right now, so bear in mind that you can drop the price significantly by turning it into a Belt of Giant Strength +2. That reduces the price by 12,000 gp, taking it to 8,820 gp. ( People who know the rules better than I do may choose to leap in on that statement! There's issues of which would be the most expensive effect, in that case.)
However, I took a different route to economy. Having a known good-aligned "customer" (and being of good alignment myself), I subtracted 30% from the total cost of the item and created one that would function only for those of good alignment (and that's the constant STR boost, everything). I don't know if your GM would permit that if you're looking in a shop for something! If so, it would make the final price 14,574 gp (+4 STR base) -- or 6,174 gp (+2 STR base). (Plus, of course, I was able to make it for half-price, albeit at a higher CL.)
I took you through the math to show you how the formula works for higher caster levels, as well as to show you an item I'm pretty darned proud of! I hope you like it -- and that I didn't utterly misinterpret the size of your purse! LOL
Varitsa's Belt of Giant-Sizing
Price {fill in appropriate one}; Aura moderate transmutation; CL 8th; Weight 1 lb.
{Price +4 Strength 20,820 gp or +2 Strength 8,820 gp any alignment;
OR +4 Strength 14,574 gp or +2 Strength 6,174 gp, if restricted by wearer's alignment.}
This belt is a thick leather affair, decorated with huge metal buckles. The belt grants the wearer an enhancement bonus to Strength of {+4 or +2}. Treat this as a temporary ability bonus for the first 24 hours the belt is worn. In addition, once per day the wearer may gain the combined effects of enlarge person and cat's grace; it is not possible to gain the effects of one without the other. These effects last for three minutes once activated. { Only characters of ___ alignment gain any benefits from wearing this belt.}
~~ Construction Requirements ~~
Cost {half of market cost}
Craft Wondrous Item, bull's strength, cat's grace, enlarge person
Limitations like class and alignment should almost never reduce the cost to craft a custom magic item, only the market place value.
LOL! I'll take care not to show our GM this thread. I pointed out that the belt would be worth less than 70% if my fellow PC goes to sell it -- maybe no more than 50% (of the standard 50% fractional value). "Who am I going to sell this piece of junk to? I have to ask everyone who walks into my shop if they're a do-gooder?" And the GM poo-pooed the theory!
I do think that in the game I GM I'll allow the reduction in creation cost, just because the "ingredients" for making magic items are so vague and unspecified. It's easy to assume that the alignment restriction permits substituting cheaper materials -- or fewer, if a standard item requires nine sets of one thing where now three will do. That sort of thing. OTOH, you'd better believe that shopkeepers will react punitively!
In point of fact, my friend swore off any intention of ever selling her beloved belt, so it may not come up. :)
I also want to point out, for the sake of the record, that my GM did require that I have the proper alignment for an alignment restriction.
Owner - D20 Hobbies
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Enlarge Person is one of those spells that are not permitted to use formulas for costs.
It provides Reach, weapon size increase, bonuses to attack and changes to abilities.
For this reason, various prices for Enlarge Person have ranged between 8,000 go and 12,000 go to previous versions.
Also "restricted" discounts (like alignment) are not on creation or purchasing but on selling. So you don't get a discount buying or creating a restricted item.
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Owner - D20 Hobbies
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Dire Collar is animal only.
Cloak of the Hedge Wizard does have it, shared (multiple similar abilities, where two abilities share one pool of activation).
So it may be that the price is relaxed a bit, or it could be the hedge wizard item is incorrectly priced (like bracers of falcon aim, feather step boots, jingasa, and other errated for price items.)
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lastly, the feat used to make a ring is Forge Ring. No big difference other than the CL should be 7+ but to keep costs low we are sticking to 1st level.
Nothing force you to give rings a minimum CL of 7.
creator can create an item at a lower caster level than her own, but never lower than the minimum level needed to cast the needed spell. Using metamagic feats, a caster can place spells in items at a higher level than normal.
The forge ring feat require you to have a CL of 7, not the item.
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So, again, the Dire Collar is a thing that exists and costs 1,000. It implies but does not state it must be used on an animal, but a barbarian with 3 Int probably counts. Okay, so the last part is a joke, but the collar is enlarge person on an invalid target using someone else's action (both of which would be an increase in price, not a decrease). 1/day Enlarge Person item can't be more than the collar.
Dire Collar
Price 1,000 gp; Slotneck; CL 3rd; Weight 2 lbs.; Aura faint transmutation
This leather collar resizes to fit almost any size of creature. Once per day on command, the creature that fastened the dire collar to the animal can cause that animal to grow larger and more bestial. The collar's fastener must be within 30 feet of the animal to do so.The animal gains the benefits of an enlarge person spell (despite the normal targeting restrictions of that spell) for 1 minute.
You can fasten the dire collar to whoever you want, but it work only on animals. Who can benefit from the effect is clearly spelled in the description.