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In the Iron Gods, during the first book, there comes a time in a cave where the PCs battle a gremlin, "Jeznik". In the same room, there is a door, that's clearly not supposed to be opened yet. One of the PCs is a Wizard of metal. He wanted to get into this door, so he casts warp metal on it over and over again...I was not prepared for this. The door has 20 hardness, 720 hit points, and a break DC of 45, against what are presumably level one PCs. Since there will be several more locked "super doors", I'm sure this will come up again. I guess I'm looking for advice, on how to let him use his spell, but, without breaking the game. Or, more clarified rules on "warp metal", because, there's going to be alot of metal... The only justified reason I could give him was, that it was sky metal, so it didn't work, he didn't seem satisfied with the response, and I wasn't really either. Thanks in advance!
Can you link to the spell? The only Warp Metal I can find is new, level 4, and doesn't obviously do what this player wants.
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Um, even as a Metal specialized Wizard they definitely shouldn't have warp metal (4th level spell) in the first book.
Even then or whatever they're using they still have a very limited amount so it they want to blow all their 4th slots on opening doors okay. The doors have lasted this long, maybe they self repair? Would definitely cut down on the 5 minute/1 door Advenure day.
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Let your caster feel special. Who says he wasn't supposed to go through that door? Clearly, he was. He can also do it to walls, by the way.
Is it going to break the story? No! It's just going to make you turn to a different page than the one you thought. Let him run with it and feel like he made a good, thematic choice.
I found where you are in the story, the PCs should still be either level 1 or 2 at that point. That means your wizard won't be casting any 4th level spells at that point (won't even be able to cast 2nd level spells). Unless the warp metal spell you're talking about is not the one Rysky linked above, it's impossible for the wizard to be casting it at this point in time, barring a scroll or wand of it. You said "repeatedly casting" so scroll is out, and a fully-charged wand of warp metal is over 20 times their WBL at those levels, so I'd call that one out too. I'm just not seeing how the wizard is accomplishing this.
Magneto vs Ironman
FIGH...
OHHHH. THAT looked painful. Squeegie on isle 2.
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Make the door a composite of several materials that interact with magic differently. Since the warp X spells state that it doesn't work until the entire thing s affected, it would require Warp Wood, Warp Metal, Transmute Rock to Mud, and possibly a few other things to bypass.
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/w/warp-metal there's the link, I've thought of a few ways to deal with it since I posted, appreciate all the advice. And I'm not sure how he was casting a 4th level spell at 2nd level. My answer could have been as easy as "he opened the door, and it lead to a long hallway, that had collapsed in on itself, and the legs of one of the second expeditionists sticks out of the debris..." just threw me off at the time. Again, thanks.
You use tags, as explained in the "How to format your text" section.
In this case, if you border the link in [url] tags, if will show up as a link.
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Really though, banning shortcuts is heavy handed railroading and takes a lot of fun out of it. Wait until he takes the spells to shut off technology or take control of robots or the other tech spells. Your wizard is going to find shortcuts and quick answers and that is just what is going to happen, unless you want to cheat him out of his character.
Naw, I want all the PCs to enjoy their characters, I'll be more prepared next time. Thee are plenty of creatures in the area I could have thrown behind that door even, I won't stop him again...now how about that spell vs androids? Lol.
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I think I posted on here twice before, so sorry for the stupid question, but, my link copied to the clipboard didn't work how I expected, how'd you do that rysky?
Below the post box there is a spoiler "how to format your text" that has all what you can do to posts.
For links you simply put: [ url = link here ] whatever text here [ / url ]
Without any spaces.
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I think I posted on here twice before, so sorry for the stupid question, but, my link copied to the clipboard didn't work how I expected, how'd you do that rysky?
Below the post box there is a spoiler "how to format your text" that has all what you can do to posts.
For links you simply put: [ url = link here ] whatever text here [ / url ]
Without any spaces.
Thanks
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Really though, banning shortcuts is heavy handed railroading and takes a lot of fun out of it. Wait until he takes the spells to shut off technology or take control of robots or the other tech spells. Your wizard is going to find shortcuts and quick answers and that is just what is going to happen, unless you want to cheat him out of his character.Naw, I want all the PCs to enjoy their characters, I'll be more prepared next time. Thee are plenty of creatures in the area I could have thrown behind that door even, I won't stop him again...now how about that spell vs androids? Lol.
Androids are fleshy enough that it wouldn't bother them.
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ThanksI think I posted on here twice before, so sorry for the stupid question, but, my link copied to the clipboard didn't work how I expected, how'd you do that rysky?
Below the post box there is a spoiler "how to format your text" that has all what you can do to posts.
For links you simply put: [ url = link here ] whatever text here [ / url ]
Without any spaces.
Np, though I got ninjaed by Saethori :3
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Ok, so he has a 19 intelligence score, which does grant him one lvl 4 spell 1x per day, at level 2. As far as multiclassing goes, he made his spell book his arcane bonded item, which supposedly made it so he could cast twice...I put the kabosh on that. But he will be able to use the spell. Thanks to all of your advice, I know how to deal with it.
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Ok, so he has a 19 intelligence score, which does grant him one lvl 4 spell 1x per day, at level 2. As far as multiclassing goes, he made his spell book his arcane bonded item, which supposedly made it so he could cast twice...I put the kabosh on that. But he will be able to use the spell. Thanks to all of your advice, I know how to deal with it.
No it doesnt. wizard does nopt get access to level 4 spellcasting until level 7. Int only grants bouns spells once you get access to the spell level in question.
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Ok, so he has a 19 intelligence score, which does grant him one lvl 4 spell 1x per day, at level 2. As far as multiclassing goes, he made his spell book his arcane bonded item, which supposedly made it so he could cast twice...I put the kabosh on that. But he will be able to use the spell. Thanks to all of your advice, I know how to deal with it.
*Multi-casting
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Ok, so he has a 19 intelligence score, which does grant him one lvl 4 spell 1x per day, at level 2. As far as multiclassing goes, he made his spell book his arcane bonded item, which supposedly made it so he could cast twice...I put the kabosh on that. But he will be able to use the spell. Thanks to all of your advice, I know how to deal with it.*Multi-casting
A spellbook is not a legal choice for an arcane bonded object. That said all arcane bonded objects allow you to cast one spell from your spellbook once per day. It sounds like your group has a lot of misunderstandings about the rules.
Yeah, here's the line he missed when he thought he could cast 4th level spells at 2nd level. From the Getting Started section of the Core Rulebook, under the heading "Abilities and Spellcasters": "In addition to having a high ability score, a spellcaster must be of a high enough class level to be able to cast spells of a given spell level. See the class descriptions in Classes for details." (Emphasis mine)
So you don't have to worry about Warp Metal until the end of the second module or the beginning of the third.
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Here ya go burko.Assuming the spell Rysky has pointed out is the spell your 1st- to 2nd-level caster is trying to use;
The obvious reply is that it is likely too high of a spell level for him to cast himself. That is one reason it's failing.
The other reason it isn't working is probably because it only targets wooden objects. Hmmm... either one of those very clear explanations should be sufficient. Your special/enchanted/unknown reason explanation should have been sufficient.
We can clearly tell it isn't because you're trying to cheat a player out of an ability, only make sure everything's on the up-and-up.
... wat?
Edit: lol just noticed the copy/paste error on the target line. Yeah, don't enforce that. That's a dick move, don't do that.
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Sorry for wasting your time, I GM two nights a week, different groups. One group varies, the other is usually six guys. It's enough to try and draw the maps, raise the stats of bosses, memorize key points of the story, and NPCs. I just don't have time to memorize every stat for every race, and class. That's why I asked for help.
As written, this spell can't affect metal at all.
Targets 1 Small wooden object/level, all within a 20-ft. radius; see text
On topic, i would say the door becomes permanently stuck if this spell was used on a high-tech metal door like many found on Iron Gods.
A warped door springs open (or becomes stuck, requiring a successful Strength check to open, at your option).
Is it written that way in the source or just a website error though?
In the source (Magic Tactics Toolbox) it is written as "Targets 1 Small wooden object/level, all within a 20-ft. radius; see text"
The wooden is an obvious typo, but there are no (un)official clarifications regarding it. I'd play that spell as if it said "1 Small metal object/level" instead.
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A spellbook is not a legal choice for an arcane bonded object. That said all arcane bonded objects allow you to cast one spell from your spellbook once per day. It sounds like your group has a lot of misunderstandings about the rules.Ok, so he has a 19 intelligence score, which does grant him one lvl 4 spell 1x per day, at level 2. As far as multiclassing goes, he made his spell book his arcane bonded item, which supposedly made it so he could cast twice...I put the kabosh on that. But he will be able to use the spell. Thanks to all of your advice, I know how to deal with it.*Multi-casting
As soon as we think we've got them figured out, something like this happens. In all fairness, even though it says how many spells a wizard can do in a day, bonus spells are pretty vague. We thought it meant if your int score was higher, you could use the granted bonus spells. I got it now, they are kinda in a bank, until you are high enough to use them.
Really though, banning shortcuts is heavy handed railroading and takes a lot of fun out of it.First off, every adventure [path] is a railroad. If your GM lets you go elsewhere, then you are no longer on the adventure path. It's not heavy-handed when the GM takes step to preserve the game for everyone. Otherwise, just assume the PCs are going to win and go watch TV or read a book and complain about how the author seems to know exactly what the characters he's writing about are going to do.
Please pardon me as I interrupt this argument to point out that even if it were legal for the 2nd-level wizard of metal to cast Warp Metal once a day, it would not have derailed the adventure path.
The party in Fires of Creation was hired by the town council to rescue the the fifth expedition that went into these caves, especially the wizard Khonnir Baine (this is not a spoiler, this is the initial plot hook). The cave inhabitants that the party encountered, if made friendly, inform the party that Khonnir went through the open door, not the other locked door. Going through the locked door would let the party succeed at Khonnir's original mission, but not their own mission.
And the wizard could cast Warp Metal only once a day. Nofx Johnson could have easily ruled that it takes three Warp Metal spells to open that door. What will the party do for the rest of the day after the wizard casts the first Warp Metal? Go back to their mission to rescue Khonnir Baine, of course. They will explore the science deck, rescue Khonnir Baine {sorry about the slight spoiler), and level up before the wizard opens the door.
The locked door gives access to the engineering deck. The module intended for the party to repair direct access from the science deck to the engineering deck after rescuing Khonnir Baine. Warp Metal, if it had been legal, would have been a creative alternative solution that would not change the adventure.
By the way, the party in my Iron Gods campaign, after rescuing Khonnir Baine, persuaded the repair drone in room B2 to open the locked door for them.
Since it is settled that you don't get a bonus spell before you can cast that spell level in question, back to warp metal, since the spell and problem loom in the near future still.
There are several ways to deal with the spell and it's relatives, especially when it comes to quest-doors:
- the spell does not work on enchanted materials (heavy-handed, but solves a lot of problems)
- the spell works on enchanted materials only if they miss their save (= their maker's) as per standard rules; reduces the problem, if you remember to enchant your doors
- the important doors are made of stuff not covered by an available spell
- the doors are a golem in an unusual form, responding only to the command of his master; being immune to magic, this "door" cannot be warped or magicked open; I had fun with that one once until a player twigged to the trick - you can't use it more than once or twice
- the important doors are inside the area of an antimagic field or zone, negating magical attempts to break in (you can have a few shenanigans with Create Demiplane in that regard, using it as a "corridor")
Normal doors are usually not an obstacle to adventurers anyway...picking the lock, kicking them in, casting knock, polymorphing, disintegrating, charming the keyholder or having them eaten by an ooze are only some means of entry...bypassing doors entirely is another can of worms: gaseous form and windwalk, dustform, ethereality, becoming really small...