[PFS] Fixing Invulnerable Rager


Advice


Character Sheet (While Raging/Shifted):
Rahim
Male wereboar-kin skinwalker (ragebred) barbarian (unchained, invulnerable rager) 3 (Pathfinder RPG Advanced Player's Guide 79, Pathfinder RPG Bestiary 5, Pathfinder Unchained 8)
CN Medium humanoid (shapechanger, skinwalker)
Init -2; Senses low-light vision; Perception +8
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Defense
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AC 6, touch 6, flat-footed 6 (-2 Dex, -2 untyped penalty)
hp 44 (3d12+18)
Fort +8, Ref +0, Will +5
DR 1/—, 2/lethal; Resist extreme endurance
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Offense
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Speed 40 ft.
Melee chakram +8 (1d8+6) or
. . bite +9 (1d4+6), 2 claws +9 (1d6+6), gore +9 (1d6+6), 2 hooves +4 (1d4+4)
Ranged darkwood composite longbow +2 (1d8+3/×3)
Special Attacks rage (15 rounds/day), rage power (beast totem, lesser[APG])
Spell-Like Abilities (CL 3rd; concentration +0)
. . 1/day—speak with animals
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Statistics
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Str 19, Dex 7, Con 18, Int 13, Wis 12, Cha 5
Base Atk +3; CMB +9; CMD 13
Feats Combat Expertise, Extra Feature
Traits adopted, berserker of the society, fiend blood, tusked
Skills Acrobatics +4 (+8 to jump), Bluff +4 (+0 vs. non-shapechanger humanoids), Diplomacy -3 (-7 vs. non-shapechanger humanoids), Disguise -3 (-7 vs. non-shapechanger humanoids), Handle Animal +5 (+1 vs. non-shapechanger humanoids), Intimidate -3 (-7 vs. non-shapechanger humanoids), Knowledge (nature) +7, Perception +9, Survival +7; Racial Modifiers +2 Handle Animal, +2 Perception
Languages Common, Protean
SQ change shape, change shape (+10 speed), change shape (gore), change shape (hooves), change shape (scent), fast movement
Combat Gear wand of cure light wounds; Other Gear mistmail[APG], chakram[APG], darkwood composite longbow (+3 Str), cloak of resistance +1, 140 gp
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Special Abilities
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Beast Totem, Lesser (Su) Gain 2 d6 claw attacks while raging
Change Shape (+10 speed) (Su) You choose to gain a +10 bonus to base speed when shifting into bestial form.
Change Shape (Gore) (Su) You can choose to gain a gore attack that deals 1d6 points of damage when shifting into bestial form.
Change Shape (Hooves) (Su) You can choose to gain 2 hoof attacks that each deal 1d4 points of damage when shifting into bestial form.
Change Shape (Scent) (Su) You can choose to gain scent with a range of 30 feet when shifting into bestial form.
Change Shape (Su) Shapeshift into bestial form, granting animal-like powers.
Combat Expertise +/-1 Bonus to AC in exchange for an equal penalty to attack.
Damage Reduction (1/-) You have Damage Reduction against all attacks.
Damage Reduction (2/lethal) You have Damage Reduction against non-lethal damage
Extra Feature Gain additional feature in bestial form.
Extreme Endurance (Fire) (Ex) At 3rd level, the invulnerable rager is inured to either hot or cold climate effects (choose one) as if using endure elements. In addition, the barbarian gains 1 point of fire or cold resistance for every three levels beyond 3rd. This ability
Fast Movement +10 (Ex) +10 feet to speed, unless heavily loaded.
Low-Light Vision See twice as far as a human in dim light, distinguishing color and detail.
Rage (Unchained, 15 rounds/day) (Ex) As a free action, gain temp hp, bonus to melee att/dam, thrown dam, will saves, but AC penalty and limited actions. 1 min fatigue when ended.

Character Build Outline

Summary, Rahim is currently a level 3 Unchained Barbarian (Invulnerable Rager) who planned to use mistmail to help power moonlight stalker. Both mistmail and Invulnerable Rager have seen recent changes.

Other notes: The character has a tier 1 gencon book from last yet, allowing access to skinwalker. Also an Extra Traits boon and a Treasure Map + Factor boon which he's been using to make money. Because of these things I'd like to minimize the GM credit I need to apply to the character to fix and minimize the PP needed to retrain as I've already spent 8 of my prestige refreshing the treasure map boon.

I get to sell the mistmail for free, as well as retrain my archetype for free if desired. Anything beyond level 3 hasn't been set in stone yet and can be freely changed.

I'm just really not sure how to best salvage the character. The only long term concealment granting item I can find is a lesser cloak of displacement and it's a long read to getting enough money/fame to buy a 24k gold item.

Do I keep Invulnerable Rager and grab something other than increased DR 3 times or do I go straight unchained and retain the increased DR, losing about 1/2 to 1/3 of my DR from level 8+?

What do I do about the moonlighter stalker chain? I've already got combat expertise, I guess I could just retrain that and suck up the loss.

Having enough prestige for the cloak doesn't occur until around level 7/8.

I'm just really lost about what to do. There's some hope that John Compton will allow some more additional free retraining but I'm not holding out hope.

Any and all suggestions are appreciated.


I was under the understanding you can't get the increased rage Dr anyways. So that solves that.

Silver Crusade

Grabbing increased DR was never an optimal choice for the invul rager when things like superstitious, witch hunter, spell sunder, and the beast totem line existed. Those two lines should be first in your rage power choices, as both help out both offensively and defensively. If you really do want to stay impossible to damage, Stalwart and Improved with Combat Expertise is a good way to do it, and since THF barb needs only like 1-2 feats, it shouldn't be hard to pick up that line in between Extra Rage Power.


You may wish to note the character has 6 natural attacks, I'm pretty sure swapping to THF is not the way to go...

Stalwart and Improved Stalwart are somewhat tempting, but that also requires picking up Endurance and Diehard. That's a lot of feats (and the Iounstone to get Endurance is more expensive and less useful than blindfight/+2 wisdom.


If you go Strength Surge at 4 and Savage Dirty Trick at 6 you can blind people with your first attack and then have concealment as you unload the rest of the blender. Combat Expertise feeds into Improved Dirty Trick if you go that way.

Silver Crusade

Pirate Rob wrote:
You may wish to note the character has 6 natural attacks, I'm pretty sure swapping to THF is not the way to go...

I'm not suggesting it, and natural weapon needs just as few feats as THF, I'm just saying that improved DR was never a great call here, and that Stalwart/Improved + Combat Expertise is an overall reliable way to get some iron clad DR.


Then why mention THF at all?

Also, is Stalwart actually any good? It looks pretty sub optimal to me.

3 feats to get stalwart for ~-6 to hit and 5DR. Just swapping back to normal barbarian and using those on Extra DR 3 times for +6DR seems a lot better. Am I missing something?

I guess it gets better with improved stalwart, but that minus to hit is still rough and doesn't come online until level 11.

---

Hmmm savage dirty trick looks quite neat. I think on one of the secondary hooves that's basically no damage lost too. (although that -5 is rough if using a secondary, and strength surge doesn't appear to be available to unchained barbarians)

Best totem can get bumped to 8 easily so this is a possibility.

Silver Crusade

Pirate Rob wrote:

Then why mention THF at all?

Also, is Stalwart actually any good? It looks pretty sub optimal to me.

3 feats to get stalwart for ~-6 to hit and 5DR. Just swapping back to normal barbarian and using those on Extra DR 3 times for +6DR seems a lot better. Am I missing something?

I guess it gets better with improved stalwart, but that minus to hit is still rough and doesn't come online until level 11.

I wasn't thinking, I'm too used to THF barbs.

And considering you don't really need to worry about accuracy as all of your attacks come off of your full BAB except for your hooves, and there's always Reckless Abandon to buff your accuracy. If you're going the DR route, your AC shouldn't be too high on your concern list (and it's balanced out by the beast totem natural armor boost if you don't want to go too low).

Not sure why you're saying taking extra DR 3 times nets you +6 DR since it's only +1 DR each time, and Invul Rager still picks up some token energy resistance which is nice.

I can admit it comes online a lot better with improved stalwart, so if you don't want to wait for that kind of DR boost you're still better going Invul and just taking the classic rage powers, and the savage dirty trick is really sick. For 1 rage power, it's straight up amazing...jeez, reading over some of this stuff is making me realize how out of date my guide is...


Unchained Increased Damage Reduction is 2 DR instead of 1. Makes it a much more attractive option.

You may notice the character has a 7 dex and was planning on wearing mistmail. AC is not planned to be a relevant defense.

Unchained barbarians also get Reckless Stance instead of Reckless Abandon. Having to spend a move action to turn it on is problematic.

Scarab Sages

A one level dip of unbreakable fighter will give you both prerequisites for stalwart. Stalwart is a great way of increasing DR while allowing you to use other rage powers. Of course, if I was going to make a DR build, I'd go fighter with armored juggernaut AAT.


Just for comparison:

I currently have a PFS lvl 15 Invulnerable Rager (his full build is in my character list and currently playing in All for Immortality part II). He is an absolute beast in most cases. His AC is usually around 14 when he is pouncing around the battlefield and he has a DR of only 7/-. That doesn't matter much, when he can fly across a battlefield 120 ft and deal 200+ damage to a target. What I use to protect him is not his AC or his DR, it's come and get me and additional AoOs. Not much stands when you can deliver massive damage and then respond hit for hit on anything that survives. Additionally, on things that I judge have a low fort I can attempt some crowd control by activating dazing assualt. That culminates in A LOT of Fort Saves that can interupt or cancel an enemies turn.

Defensively, he is practically immune to spells, SLAs and SUs that require a save. He also gets a reroll on any failed save that can be refreshed by rage cycling. I gave him a ring of evasion to utilize his high saves and rerolls to completely negate Reflex save based damage. IMMUNITY to magic is pretty nice at high levels.

His biggest weakness is stat debuffs / drain that requires an attack but no save. I have yet to find a safe guard vs that particular thing.


Bah, just realized savage dirty trick is also not PFS legal for unchained barbarians.
:(


Pirate Rob wrote:

Bah, just realized savage dirty trick is also not PFS legal for unchained barbarians.

:(

Yikes, sorry to lead you astray. I didn't realize they had made such drastic changes, I only ever go for the classic barbarian.


Not sure if its legal but here is what I recommend...
1 level dip into Unbreakable- Fighter. It grants Endurance and Diehard. Those are handy for ANY Barbarian but also give you a shortcut to Stalwart. As mentioned by N.Jolly, Stalwart and Improved Stalwart are GREAT with Invulnerable Rager because they stack, however, fighting defensively or full defense takes away from full attacks so I suggest getting Combat Expertise. That would give you DR 18/- at level 16 while using Combat Expertise!

Guarded Life and Greater Guarded Life are also great choices for Rage Powers given your DR vs nonlethal, making you one tough cookie to kill at higher levels.


chuffster wrote:
Pirate Rob wrote:

Bah, just realized savage dirty trick is also not PFS legal for unchained barbarians.

:(
Yikes, sorry to lead you astray. I didn't realize they had made such drastic changes, I only ever go for the classic barbarian.

It wasn't so much a change as an omission for brevity. That rage power is from one of the player companions, instead of from the main rpg line.

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