The book is now available at Paizo as well now. Thank you for the review.
Some minor typos, but the content is really solid and seems fun.
A few questions:
1) Aligned Infusion - Do I select the alignment each time I infuse a blast, or do I select when I choose the infusion?
2) Kinetic Bomb - It says "Reflex negates (see text)". The text then says nothing about what reflex negates. I assume reflex negates the splash damage, but not the damage to the primary target?
I'm a little surprised this actually isn't Reflex halves like an alchemist bomb.
3) Defeaning Burst - I assume it does not affect you?
4) Temporal Preparation - 1 burn per surprise round or 1 burn at the beginning of the day to act during any surprise round?
Some other notes:
Chronological Defiance very strong, possibly too strong. Maybe I haven't read enough on other class powers as far as delaying effects, but the ability to delay multiple rounds EVERY effect on you at-will seems extremely powerful.
Greater Future Glimpse really seems like it should cost 2 burn. I realize burn on utility talents is pretty limiting, but it feels a little odd to me that a higher level version of an ability is better and can be used just as frequently.
Future Glimpse is your own rolls, and there was an error, Greater Future Glimpse shouldn't have a burn cost, as well as working on any reroll, not just Future Glimpse related ones (so if you took improved Iron Will and such.)
Switching Future Glimpse to your own rolls seems pretty reasonable. I didn't even read it as "any" until I saw this post, that would be insanely powerful!
Funny though that you mention Greater Future Glimpse shouldn't have a burn cost. The ability to roll twice on all of your own rolls feels really quite powerful to me.
And it seems for me, third reading is the charm. I think your intent is that Greater Future Glimpse is an effect that you trigger in addition to triggering Future Glimpse (I was just assuming Greater Future Glimpse with burn cost of 1 meant for 1 burn you get the effect of Future Glimpse + Greater Future Glimpse).
In which case, I honestly think the burn cost of 1 is appropriate.
Oh, can't wait to for this to go live on paizo... I've had a cart I've been building up for awhile now, and, well, I think I deserve a present.
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Some minor typos, but the content is really solid and seems fun.
A few questions:
1) Aligned Infusion - Do I select the alignment each time I infuse a blast, or do I select when I choose the infusion?
2) Kinetic Bomb - It says "Reflex negates (see text)". The text then says nothing about what reflex negates. I assume reflex negates the splash damage, but not the damage to the primary target?
I'm a little surprised this actually isn't Reflex halves like an alchemist bomb.
3) Defeaning Burst - I assume it does not affect you?
4) Temporal Preparation - 1 burn per surprise round or 1 burn at the beginning of the day to act during any surprise round?
Some other notes:
Chronological Defiance very strong, possibly too strong. Maybe I haven't read enough on other class powers as far as delaying effects, but the ability to delay multiple rounds EVERY effect on you at-will seems extremely powerful.
Greater Future Glimpse really seems like it should cost 2 burn. I realize burn on utility talents is pretty limiting, but it feels a little odd to me that a higher level version of an ability is better and can be used just as frequently.
It's bound to happen when you're working with as small a team as we were, but I think it's overall a fun product.
1. As written, you can pick an alignment PER blast, so if you're feeling particularly good or chaotic, you can switch on the fly. Most games aren't going to run into creatures who switch DR/regeneration much, so it's a small boost that probably won't factor in much.
2. Since Kinetic Bomb is a splash weapon (as per its description), it follows splash weapon rules for avoiding splash damage, which is why a reflex save wasn't listed in the text. Reflex negates was just a balance choice, since it scales like a bomb but can be used more often due to how the ability works.
3. Nope, does not affect you.
4. 1 Burn at the beginning of the day to act, basically making it akin to the Diviner's specialization.
I probably should have clarified that you can only delay one condition at once, that's my bad. If we do an update for this, that'll be in the notes, good catch.
As for future glimpse, it appears you've got the right of it in your third post. It's just an upgrade to the old form, no super combos (at least none of which I'm aware) just yet.
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You mean like this Tels? Kineticists of Porphyra
Thanks for replies :)
One more thing I noticed: several of the infusions don't list associated blasts.
1) Aligned Infusion (Universal) - any?
2) Diverging Infusion (Time) - chrono, epoch?
3) Incorporeal Infusion (Universal) - any?
4) Kinetic Bomb (Universal) - any?
5) Lagging Infusion (Time) - chrono, epoch?
6) Nullifying Infusion (Universal) - I assume any blast that deals the damage type it can negate.
7) Seeking Infusion (Universal) - any?
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Thanks for replies :)
One more thing I noticed: several of the infusions don't list associated blasts.
1) Aligned Infusion (Universal) - any?
2) Diverging Infusion (Time) - chrono, epoch?
3) Incorporeal Infusion (Universal) - any?
4) Kinetic Bomb (Universal) - any?
5) Lagging Infusion (Time) - chrono, epoch?
6) Nullifying Infusion (Universal) - I assume any blast that deals the damage type it can negate.
7) Seeking Infusion (Universal) - any?
Oh noodles, I can get that sorted out, seems like we might need to do an update, I thought these were all golden...Oh, I see what happened with some of them, they were cut off in the editing process. That's life though.
1. Any (as a note, all universal infusions are 'any')
2. Chrono, Epoch
3. Any
4. Any
5. Chrono, Epoch
6. Correct, I wanted to say any energy blast, but there was also physical composites that dealt energy damage. It was hard to get an 'exact' description for that.
7. Any
EDIT: All missing associated blast are now listed in the guide, just in case.
I do hope that helps clear up any issues with this, please leave a review if you can and if anyone's interested, I put up some design notes in the thread for the product. If you're on the fence about picking it up, hopefully the design notes about how different things work should help to sway you in one direction or another.
I think what I might end up doing is if like a few people leave reviews, since I do plan on redoing the Barb guide (someday), I'll allow anyone who's done a review to make a flavor quote for one of the chapters or something. If I can think of anything better though, I'll be sure to inform everyone.
Definitely going to get that book, N.Jolly, just wish the Campaign Setting actually had the races stats in it because then I'd get it too. :/
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Definitely going to get that book, N.Jolly, just wish the Campaign Setting actually had the races stats in it because then I'd get it too. :/
You can actually scope them from the Porphyra Wiki, although I can understand wanting them in book. I'm sure it was just a page space thing since there's a lot of racials to throw in and LOP is always adding new races, so it's kind of hard to keep an accurate head count of jazz like that.
I did a review of the setting myself, I like it, but I can totally understand the issue as cross referencing things can be annoying, and it's not great for when you're without internet. Personally, I think a book of just racial stats would be nice, something bare bones that comes with the campaign setting so that it doesn't have to be cross references.
Let me know what you think of Kineticist of Porphyra! For the small problems it has, it's overall a great book for people looking for new content. At least from this thread, no one's found any SUPER COMBOS to break any of my content which was something that worried me. Personal opinion, sound is the coolest new addition for having their own personal soundtrack follow them around.
You mean like this Tels? Kineticists of Porphyra
Is anyone else having issues downloading this file? I've tried other items I've purchased from Paizo and they work fine so I don't think the problem is on my end. I'd like to look this over and post a review but it's kinda hard to do when I can't read the content, haha.
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You mean like this Tels? Kineticists of PorphyraIs anyone else having issues downloading this file? I've tried other items I've purchased from Paizo and they work fine so I don't think the problem is on my end. I'd like to look this over and post a review but it's kinda hard to do when I can't read the content, haha.
I sent a message to Mark about it to find out if it's on PDG's end, hopefully we get this all cleared up soon enough. Personally I do hope this does well enough to warrant a sequel, I have a few ideas that didn't make it in here that'd be fun to tool around with for a sequel book.
I'm liking this quite a lot~ I was surprised to see the direction wood took. Thematically it's my favorite element, but it seems to get the short end of the stick. I am glad you at least did something for it, though, and from what I'm seeing it can be great to use for prolonged fights now.
I'm gonna drop my commentary into a spoiler tag since it's a little longwinded.
1 - I'm glad to see Wood get an expanded element blast in great oak blast, but as it is, it doesn't seem like it's associated with any infusions. I would assume either it can only take universal infusions, or it can take those in addition to ones normally connected to wood blast and the seasonal blasts?
2 - Speaking of blasts. Nothing seems to list any of the non-3rd party infusions they can take, unless I'm just missing it. Are there any old infusions usable by the new blasts?
3 - Sickening infusion indeed. Toxic infusion does the same thing except only for 1 round, and it's 4th level for 3 burn, versus sickening infusion being 2nd level, 2 burn, and applying for 1/3 your kineticist level. It's basically turned toxic infusion into a tax for getting greater toxic infusion, especially if you take both wood and sound. :|
4 - Arboreal infusion is my new favorite. I was planning a wood/earth build, and if I stack this with greater toxic and bleeding infusions (especially those made via earth and autumn blasts) I could potentially devote the rest of my time taking on smaller foes while the big guy progressively loses 2 Con per round. And said Con gets harder and harder to resist losing thanks to his Con bonus to Fort dropping as well.
5 - It's a bit of a shame the only new utilities Wood has are a clone of an earth utility you have and adding sickening to said talent. I honestly can't justify taking three talents for that, I'll admit.
6 - Moving on to other stuff. I feel like the time element is somewhat OP, even with the damage reduction to its hit dice and its lack of composites beyond epoch blast and alteration amplification (the latter of which strips it of any infusions besides universal). Just the thought of an elemental scion of time is chilling. Image at 20th level, they just pop greater time thief on every enemy on the field, not only freezing them in place, but getting several move actions per turn from them. It's something I'd suggest should require the kineticist to concentrate on to maintain or else take burn to give it the duration, or at least make it only able to affect one foe at a time.
7 - Light somewhat disappointed me, only in that I was hoping it'd be an energy type, but considering time and sound both utilize energy blasts, I can't be too mad (and if you're compressing photons so tightly that they begin to act more like matter than energy, they're going to be doing things like physical damage). Otherwise it's more or less how I conceptualized it myself, in that it deals a lot with illusions. Seems fun to play.
8 - Sound is another one I'm glad you added, since we don't see sonic damage as often as the big four of acid, fire, electricity, and cold (although I'll admit I kinda miss acid... maybe add an earth or wood talent that makes half their blasts' damage acid?). Again, seems like a unique and fun element to play with.
9 - Back to the elemental scion archetype. Aside from a time elemental scion, I think this is absolutely beautiful. Honestly, if not for my wanting autumn blast so I can double the duration of my bleed, arboreal, and greater toxic infusions, I'd probably go with this archetype and go pure wood (and even then, with my blasts being advanced to d10s and with great oak blast being lumped in, I just might do so regardless). I can imagine a void kineticist using a gravitic void blast would be scary too, considering that's gonna be doing 2d12s (or possibly 4d6s).
10 - That actually brings up a question: what are you treating as the advancement beyond a d10? 2d6, or d12? Not only does this affect void elemental scions, but also anyone who takes void (gravity), time, and sound (despite not getting a real composite, they'd be able to make a gravitic distortion alteration gravity blast). I'm leaning toward 1d12 just to simplify things and keep the average damage from rising too much further, even if rolling 20d12 is going to net you some really ridiculous numbers, especially if you can do a full-action kinetic whip and nail every hit XD
Okay so. Yeah, I'll be off to make a wood elemental scion with these rules now. Thanks, dude~
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@Onyx Tankuki: Before anything else, I have to say that I was pretty interested in your take on Light that I saw in homebrew. My design was already finalized by then, and I thought about talking about what I did for Light's simple blast, but I also didn't want to start talking about things before they were out, which was the only reason I didn't post in your threads. As you did, I'll spoiler this too.
Simple Blast: A phytokineticist gains wood blast as a simple blast wild talent. She can use all of the infusions listed below with wood blast and its composites
I will make sure to include a note that in the next edit run that Great Oak should be included in the associated blast though.
2. There are some old infusions that are usable with new ones (thundering blast with sonic), although the numbers are more limited. Most of them have Wood's text about being able to use all listed infusions with X blast and composites, although I suppose I should add that to both of Sound's blast so that there's no confusion.
3. Toxic infusion is terrible, I feel no shame in making a better version, and Greater Toxic Infusion is okay enough where Toxic isn't the worst prereq. As stated in my guide, Toxic Infusion is terrible.
4. Mort and I were talking about this earlier, I didn't mention it to them, but I joked that if you land this multiple times, by a strict reading of the rules, you'd make like 10 trees in their space. For balance sake, you make 1 tree no matter how many times you seed them, but if you want, make a forest using this with Kinetic Blade or Elemental Annihilator.
5. Wood is hard to write for, I think I stated earlier in the thread where while I don't like the Wood that Paizo put out, I could sympathize with what was done. In that vein, originally Wood was going to have a corollary to Earth Rider where they could summon a stump and ride it, but Wood was already getting a lot of discounted Earth talents.
6. Seeing people's reaction to Elemental Scion's capstone, I'm probably going to make an official errata for it later. I'll be sure to post it in this thread as well as the product discussion, and it will go into effect immediately. Fun fact: During the rough drafts, that was their level 15 ability as a placeholder. It could have been a lot worse...*shudders*...
7. I talked about this up top, but light as its own energy type is such a tricky slope for a lot of the same reasons that were mentioned in you thread, making it a hard call for what I wanted to do with Light. In the end, I took the easy way out, and I would again, as I'd rather go with a physical blast rather than doing something incredibly different.
8. Sounds was a lot of fun to design, and I think flashy players will have a lot of fun with it. As for acid, if this product sells well enough, I do have ONE more element I didn't get to tool around with that has acid as a primary blast, but we'll save that for if the numbers are good on this.
9. I know a lot of players who wanted to solo element (I ONLY PLAY FIRAH! INFERNO RAAAAAGE!), and this felt like a fun way of helping them do that. None of the boost aside from 20th (which will be getting an errata) are that intense, and really I think a lot of monokineticist are going to enjoy the hell out of it.
10. Remember that there has been a LOT of debate on the increases to weapon size. For the purpose of my guide, it would go d3 to d4 to d6 to d8 to d10 to d 12. I don't think there's anything more than of which the guide would pertain.
I'm glad you liked the content, it'd help me and mine if anyone who's picked this up can leave a review either here or on drivethru RPG (or both if you want to cross post) as it helps both myself and other perspective customers know what you did and didn't like about this product.
Also I'm taking suggestions for the alternative capstone for elemental scion, off the top of my head I'm thinking it has to be a choice between:
A: Reduce all burn cost by 1
B: All wild talents count as though you have accepted 1 burn for the purpose of their effects.
Both are still super powerful, but not as game breaking as both together. Let me know if you all like A or B more, or if I should just scrap them and start over. And thanks everyone who's already picked this up, spread the word and let's keep this awesome class going!
You mean like this Tels? Kineticists of Porphyra
It's almost like you want me to buy it, or something.
Also I'm taking suggestions for the alternative capstone for elemental scion, off the top of my head I'm thinking it has to be a choice between:
A: Reduce all burn cost by 1
B: All wild talents count as though you have accepted 1 burn for the purpose of their effects.
I like option B, but that might be because it's the stronger of the two options--there aren't many utility talents that have an up-front burn cost, whereas there are many that have better effects or action economy by accepting a point of burn.
If the issue is that certain powers would be overpowered if you could spam them this way (the Time Thief powers would admittedly be awesome overpowered if you could have a dozen extra swift and move actions), then perhaps you just need a rider on the capstone saying something like you can only apply the free burn to one instance of a given power at a time.
That way you can avoid armies of elementals or twenty extra move actions (which, really, what would you do with those?), but still let you gain the benefits of less-worrisome talents.
Honestly I think cutting it down to the latter option would be best. Dumping all burn cost by 1 is nice, but that's basically giving you free composite blasts that you can both empower and maximize with a move-action gather power. Composite blasts that are already doing more than a typical kineticist is capable of for seven out of ten elements (force hits for 10d10; epoch and sonic boom are dealing 20d6 (20d8 with their respective boost composites); thunderstorm, ice, void, glorious, great oak, metal, and blue flame are doing 20d8 (20d10 with their boost composites)). I'm not sure how common it is to be tossing out a guaranteed 240 damage for free (not accounting for resistance and DR) at 20th is but it seems pretty damn strong. And keep in mind that at this point you'd also be able to plop 6 burn's worth of infusions on, so there's a decent chance this is being dealt out to several enemies at once. Unless each individual infusion and metakinesis' cost is being reduced too, in which case... yeah, that would be pretty horrific.
So yeah, ignore much of the above, I read the thing wrong XD Still, it's pretty horrifying, as you're pretty much putting any infusion on your blasts that you so wish, as I believe the most expensive one is 4 burn naturally. Basically the only way you'll be spending burn is on the kinetic blast itself and on any added effects you'd take burn for on one of the infusions.
Oh, also, I should note that I did forget that the first die only increases at 1st if you only have one simple blast, and composite blasts only get a single die advancement (my mistake was forgetting void had two simple blasts and that the damage die increase for elemental scion's first level only applies to wood, chrono, earth, and light blasts and not to great oak, epoch, metal, and glorious); that means the only way you're getting d12s is a gravitic discordant alteration gravity blast, which probably isn't the best idea to be shooting for I wouldn't imagine (since that's 4 burn for a 10d12 bludgeoning damage blast, when its easy to get 20d6, which is the same max damage and double the min damage).
Anyway, yeah. If you go with the automatic effect-for-burn, that could apply to defense and utility talents, as well as infusions that have something like that. It should probably be optional though, rather than just happening regardless. For example, you may not want to reduce a target of your suffocate to 0 HP, or you may wish for a pulling infusion to only drag a foe 5 feet.
I do have a few suggestions for alternate capstones:
- Each element could get a unique composite blast at 20th. I'd imagine these could vary wildly to fit the element's flavor, but in most cases there'd be a damage increase, it could apply any infusions that your other element's blasts could use, and it'd cost 3 or 4 burn.
- You gain all of your element's composite blasts (except for boosts) without needing to fit the prerequisites of having their other blasts. For example, an air scion would be granted access to blizzard, charged water, lightning, plasma, sandstorm, spring blasts. This could be imbalanced though, since aether, sonic, time, and void wouldn't get anything from this, but coincidentally they are the ones that get the boosts, so they could be granted access to all of said boosts. This may not entirely fit the flavor of the archetype though, since the point is to keep the element pure rather than have control over anything else.
- You can apply two substance infusions to a blast simultaneously. Although the cost isn't reduced any beyond the initial 6 burn you're able to bypass, this could result in interesting combo effects, like having a lingering decaying kinetic bomb epoch blast that deals its splash damage twice and hits for two Con damage each time, or tacking pure flame onto a blue flame blast to ensure whatever effect your other substance infusion would apply makes it through.
- The effect your defense talent would normally grant you for spending burn on a talent of your element is always in effect if it would apply an effect that lasts 1 round, or you can use the effect once per turn as an immediate action if it's an instant effect in addition to it triggering when they use talents. For example, a water scion would always have both the armor and shield bonuses to AC, while an aether scion would be able to regenerate 20 HP on their bubble once per turn without needing to spend burn on an aether talent.
- And extra effect that always gets applied to your element's composite blast, dependent on the element. Pretty similar to the double-substance idea, except the effect is set, and may not necessarily be the same as something an infusion would have done. For example, earth and metal blast might explode on impact, leaving shards on the ground, treating the space or area they hit as difficult terrain, or you could have negative, gravity, and void blasts inflict 1d4 Str bleed.
You mean like this Tels? Kineticists of PorphyraIs anyone else having issues downloading this file? I've tried other items I've purchased from Paizo and they work fine so I don't think the problem is on my end. I'd like to look this over and post a review but it's kinda hard to do when I can't read the content, haha.
Yeah, can't download it...
It just doesn't start to download...
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You mean like this Tels? Kineticists of PorphyraIs anyone else having issues downloading this file? I've tried other items I've purchased from Paizo and they work fine so I don't think the problem is on my end. I'd like to look this over and post a review but it's kinda hard to do when I can't read the content, haha.Yeah, can't download it...
It just doesn't start to download...
It looks like it might be an issue on Paizo's end, if you're having problems I'd send an email to gedakm@gmail.com, looks like they're trying to sort everything out.
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| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
@Rayous
You've got some valid concerns in there, let me take the time to respond.
I'm not sure I'd say will's a better save to go against myself, and water has a lot better AOE. I can admit Time's Echo does make it pretty intense, so since I am going to go through a re-edit of some things, I'll probably add a clause that any effect for Time's Echo allows an additional save at the beginning of the foe's round. A note for dazed, we can hit that with a 2nd level spell at earliest, so I don't think 8th/9th is really that bad for the level of power.
Sound has reduced damage for that reason, and if you're adding Cacophonous Infusion, you're also not adding any other substance infusion. This is simply to keep you from being worthless when silence comes up, a 2nd level spell. I didn't want a 2nd level spell shutting down an entire element, as I'm sure you can understand.
I do like me some K. Blade/Whip.
Since Kinetic Blast is treated as a weapon, I took it to mean that you couldn't use Kinetic Blast while under the effects of Gaseous Form, although if I'm wrong in this respect, I will be sure to change it. You are probably right that it should be 4th level though (I could probably throw a burn onto it as well.) A note that the freedom of movement effect isn't permanent, it's only while you're in gaseous form.
You're right about Grasp, that will be getting errata'd to only 1 active at a time.
Light Speed Travel is 'safer', but it's also the only movement option for either element. And at 19th level, that's really not an amazingly impressive thing to do. Hell, that's the kind of thing you get to 19th level TO do, at least in my opinion.
Again, Pitfall should have been (and will be) limited, although it does have a restricted use for where it can be used. Also it does not create an extradimensional space.
As for Slumbering Serenade, it's normal sleep, so all of those options still work to wake them up. If it's an issue, I can include that those options still work to wake them up. And the balance is that they can burn that standard action to stay away. They could just fall asleep and hope for someone else to wake them up, and the duration of the sleep is actually shorter than the hex by half.
You do bring up some good points, and as I've said, I'm thankful for said review. Talking with the publisher, I should have an updated format ready for everyone in a week with some of the edits discussed in this post and others (elemental scion's capstone for one), so I appreciate the feedback.
EDIT: I did actually take note of what you said before about Time's basic blast, does anyone else think Time should be pushed down to a d3?
The perception skill allows for sleeping characters to make checks (at a +10), combat has a -10 modifier. This generally means you have to seriously flub a perception check to not wake up in any combat encounter. Even a free action by your fellow players to say "wake up" in normal conversational voice is only a DC10 before modifiers.
The sleep spell further details what actions can wake a sleeping character.
Sometimes the rules for particular situations are tucked away in odd places.
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I talked with the publisher, and they've okayed an updated doc once we've got a clear amount of errata to add to this sucker. As such, let me respond as I did before, and again, thank you for the feedback:
For dazing, I did a quick search and found Touch of Madness, level 2 spell that dazes for 1 round, pretty nice if you ask me. I'll admit blade/whip/flurry do allow for a solid chance of landing those debuffs, but they come with the natural disadvantages of those styles, which is being in melee or in flurry's case, pathetic damage. But you have sold me, it's now going to be a fortitude save, word of god promise.
I could push Time's Echo up to 3 (this is of course already factoring in the additional save.)
Cacophonous is at 3 specifically for that reason, although I'm not sure how often it'll be shutting down silence. I could see dropping it down and removing that ability from it, right now it's in a teeter spot for what I want to do with it.
Fade has been moved up to 4th level as well as costing 1 burn now (and Winds to 6th respectively), let me think on how to handle the speed. I think the increase in burn cost should help even out the speed though.
I can agree that light speed has some nice distance, I think cutting the distance of it down could work, I'm working at the edit doc as we speak, maybe something more like 50 ft at base with 5 ft more per kineticist level.
For Pitfall, I have mentioned that it's not extradimensional space, I can mention that it's actually compressing earth, maybe with a caveat that it can be ended prematurely and that the earth fills back up.
Can do on Slumbering, I actually checked the SRDD afterwards and you're right, it's not a condition. Solid call there!
You know, normally someone offering to collect every time that I've screwed up on a project would fill me with dread, but I'm actually pretty cool with it if you'd like to do that, much appreciated!
EDIT: If email works better for you, mine is n.jolly@ymail.com.
Know that I want to work with everyone to help make the best product I can, and since I'm still new I'm going to make mistakes. I'll take all criticism you have if that's what it takes to make me better, just like I do with my guides!
The perception skill allows for sleeping characters to make checks (at a +10), combat has a -10 modifier. This generally means you have to seriously flub a perception check to not wake up in any combat encounter. Even a free action by your fellow players to say "wake up" in normal conversational voice is only a DC10 before modifiers.
The sleep spell further details what actions can wake a sleeping character.
Sometimes the rules for particular situations are tucked away in odd places.
Sometimes I hate how this game packages rules. But QSS, an extra line in Slumbering Serenade won't kill me. Fun fact; that wild talent was based off of the Yawn move in Pokemon.
Also I'm taking suggestions for the alternative capstone for elemental scion, off the top of my head I'm thinking it has to be a choice between:
A: Reduce all burn cost by 1
B: All wild talents count as though you have accepted 1 burn for the purpose of their effects.Both are still super powerful, but not as game breaking as both together. Let me know if you all like A or B more, or if I should just scrap them and start over. And thanks everyone who's already picked this up, spread the word and let's keep this awesome class going!
I like option B myself. I honestly think you could even grant them a bonus infusion/talent alongside that and it would still be fine, it is a capstone.
The problem with it currently I think mostly comes from A, where reducing the burn cost of utility talents leads to cheese like the Time Kineticist that can roll 3x on every D20 roll. Interestingly enough, I don't think any of the Paizo utility talents have that issue in my mind, but then, so few of them have burn cost that it also wouldn't feel like a buff!
On a different note: Reanimating Infusion is very non-specific about what it brings back. What CR zombie? I actually do like it thematically, especially with Void Healer, but I think it could probably use some tweaks both for balance and clarity. I think having a single zombie is simpler for record keeping, just making sure it's the right CR. Or maybe provide an option to switch between a higher CR single zombie or a lower CR "army."
I did actually take note of what you said before about Time's basic blast, does anyone else think Time should be pushed down to a d3?
I don't think it does. I talked to my DM and he and I at least feel that you handled the untyped damage appropriately. Dropping reduces your average by 1 per die, or about 10 damage less on average at high levels. That's the same as saying that everybody has Resist Time Kineticist 10. The key is that *everybody* you against has it. I think it works out pretty well, especially since you are already lower damage by virtue of being an energy blast.
I could push Time's Echo up to 3 (this is of course already factoring in the additional save.)
Probably a good call. I agree with Rayous that Time is definitely the heavy hitter here. Light is probably the weakest element in my mind, just because there are so many things, especially at higher levels, that don't care about illusions.
Cacophonous is at 3 specifically for that reason, although I'm not sure how often it'll be shutting down silence. I could see dropping it down and removing that ability from it, right now it's in a teeter spot for what I want to do with it.
You could just increase the burn cost for dispel. That means at the lower levels casting the dispel is harder, but at higher levels it'll get easier with burn reduction. Overall though, I'm not that concerned about it. Like you said, it's to counter a level 2 spell, you're getting it when spontaneous casters get a level 3 spell. I could see an argument for pushing it back but I think being able to get around Silence is more important to have access to it earlier.
Fade has been moved up to 4th level as well as costing 1 burn now (and Winds to 6th respectively), let me think on how to handle the speed. I think the increase in burn cost should help even out the speed though.
I think he's right in the speed I think, although I'm not sure about "not removing your offensive options." You can't blast right? You could put a note about maybe not being able to use Wild Talents? There's a lot of ways to make sure this isn't too strong.
I can agree that light speed has some nice distance, I think cutting the distance of it down could work, I'm working at the edit doc as we speak, maybe something more like 50 ft at base with 5 ft more per kineticist level.
Honestly I think it should be a Standard action by default, a move action with burn, and Medium range (100ft + 10ft/lvl). You're giving it as an alternative to Ride the Blast which normally requires a Standard. You're comparing it to Dimension Door which is usually a Standard but you *also* can act after which is one of the drawbacks of DD. Moving it to Standard w/o burn or Move w/ burn feels like a good balance of power. The Medium range also brings it more in line with Ride the Blast. Thinking about it though, Close might even be reasonable, because a move action medium range teleport is still *awesome*. So what if you can only do it 50ft (at level 10), that's still better than most.
lol, and even after pointing it out I somehow added a space between ev and erything.html
<==Fail
You see it randomly on the forum, when someone copies in a link with plain text the forum inevitability places a space in there. If you want to link something in a post, follow the example for URL links in the "How to format your text (Show) " spoiler below the post box.
That probably want your fault.
It looks like it might be an issue on Paizo's end, if you're having problems I'd send an email to gedakm@gmail.com, looks like they're trying to sort everything out.You mean like this Tels? Kineticists of PorphyraIs anyone else having issues downloading this file? I've tried other items I've purchased from Paizo and they work fine so I don't think the problem is on my end. I'd like to look this over and post a review but it's kinda hard to do when I can't read the content, haha.Yeah, can't download it...
It just doesn't start to download...
Alright, hope everything gets resolved soon ;)
Basic Chronokinesis needs to have mending intalicized when it's talking about the spell. Amazing stuff so far though!
ESPECIALLY kinetic crafter. Who makes items Kineticists can make... except they can't?
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@...well, everyone!
Keep in mind that I am reading all of these comments and suggestion, and they are going into the edit doc. I'd also like it noted that other things that we're not particularly discussing are being mixed around, but one that I will mention is that Wood is getting Imprisoning Infusion. Other things involve Cerebral Kineticist being able to ignore 2 burn at 1st level and Elemental Avatars getting a 2nd elemental defense before United Defense.
For dazing, I think it's a bit more in line now especially with how Time's Echo now works. Sure it still wrecks a solo fight, but there's a LOT of things that wreck a solo fight by 9th-111h level. The single big boss paradigm is innately flawed like that.
Time's Echo has been pushed to 3 and given different text so now they have to fail the initial save to be subject to the additional save at the beginning of their next round.
As for Cacophonous, as Sycondaman mentioned, the damage decrease helps balance that out. I could possibly see pushing up the additional burn to 2, but we'll see where that goes.
I think the burn cost for fade will validate the increased movement speed. Hell, I could see letting them attack with it active now since it's not free anymore, but again, work in progress again.
I really want to keep Light Speed at a move action both thematically and mechanically, there are not enough true ways to short burst teleport. Shortening the distance to around 50 + 5 ft should help keep it from being too bad.
Time's blast is...it's hard to balance. Really sonic resistance is as rare as an item of scarce rarity, so it's basically untyped. I'd probably boost Epoch instead of lowering chrono, since I think 1d3 damage would turn off a lot of people from playing Time. If I saw an element had a 1d3 blast, I'd probably never consider playing it myself.
Kinetict Crafter to me felt like another thing people needed, but they didn't know they needed until it existed. I seriously wouldn't be shocked if something like it came out in later books officially.
So far I started with Infusions, I have a lot of them cleared now, and I'm moving onto other sections. I want everyone to know that I am dedicated to making the best project possible, so any suggestions or critiques are welcome. I'll try to keep everyone updated on progress, hopefully by the new years we should have a full edit run under our belts and be that much closer to making a product you openly get mad about not being able to use in PFS.
I don't have your book yet (I have every intention of picking it up later this evening), but I will mention you should probably balance Time's typeless damage around Aether's force damage, to some extent. They're both, essentially, the same, except Force is a little better as it affects incorporeal creatures whereas typeless Time damage (whatever it is), probably doesn't have the same benefit.
Be wary of reducing the damage, because it's typeless, to such an extent that it is rendered useless. I would hazard a guess that 75% as good as the energy blasts is probably a good benchmark for a typeless damage blast. I know things like this have been done in the past, a class has some typeless damage method that gets nerfed into the ground to make it 'balanced' only to have rendered it completely useless.
Looking forward to reading Kineticists of Porphyra later tonight. I don't get to see Star Wars tonight, but this is definitely a good consolation :D
If I remember correctly, kinetic blasts are treated as magic, so they deal half damage to incorporeal creatures. Force deals full damage because it's force. I agree it should be about the same though.
If I remember correctly, kinetic blasts are treated as magic, so they deal half damage to incorporeal creatures. Force deals full damage because it's force. I agree it should be about the same though.
Yup, I'm aware. But force damage has nothing in this game, that I know of, that resists it, and yet, there are things in this game that force damage does better against than others. In all regards, force damage is, essentially, typeless, so a truly typeless damage should deal the same damage as force does.
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If I remember correctly, kinetic blasts are treated as magic, so they deal half damage to incorporeal creatures. Force deals full damage because it's force. I agree it should be about the same though.Yup, I'm aware. But force damage has nothing in this game, that I know of, that resists it, and yet, there are things in this game that force damage does better against than others. In all regards, force damage is, essentially, typeless, so a truly typeless damage should deal the same damage as force does.
Yeah, force does have some advantages. It's the original reason Epoch did 2d3. I didn't want it to overshadow Blue Flame, although fire has WAY better form infusions, while time has none. Fire's better for AOE, time's definitely a solo target element. I'm messing around with other things for Epoch Blast, although don't expect it to get any new form infusions.
BTW, a question that's probably worth asking again: do any of the new blasts work with existing infusions (other than "any" blast infusions)? There was no listing in the book for that.
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BTW, a question that's probably worth asking again: do any of the new blasts work with existing infusions (other than "any" blast infusions)? There was no listing in the book for that.
All elements (such as light) work with any infusions listed in their given infusions. For example, light works with 'Brilliant' infusion. Let me pull a quote here real quick:
Simple Blast: A photokineticist gains light blast as a simple blast wild talent. They can use all infusions listed below with light blast and its composites.
The bold text is meant to show that if a talent is listed in the element's description, it can be used with that element. Since I'm doing some editing, I might throw in a few more form infusions to each element that isn't Time.
Gotta say, I'm on board with Time doing nonlethal damage. Maybe 1d3 nonlethal and 1d3 untyped on chrono and up it to 1d6 nonlethal and 1d6 untyped for epoch?
Gives a slightly better damage range than other base blasts to start with, but same range for the composite. The fact that it's not all actual damage could be the balance factor?
I could see having Epoch do 2d4 with half of it being non lethal, although I'd rather keep Chrono at 1d4 myself. It is an interesting idea though, definitely something to think about on my end.
EDIT: I will admit, I am seeing the light on half non lethal for this.
Gotta say, I'm on board with Time doing nonlethal damage. Maybe 1d3 nonlethal and 1d3 untyped on chrono and up it to 1d6 nonlethal and 1d6 untyped for epoch?
Gives a slightly better damage range than other base blasts to start with, but same range for the composite. The fact that it's not all actual damage could be the balance factor?
Also makes it 100% useless against a large number of creatures in the game. Namely undead and constructs as they are immune to non-lethal damage.
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Also makes it 100% useless against a large number of creatures in the game. Namely undead and constructs as they are immune to non-lethal damage.Gotta say, I'm on board with Time doing nonlethal damage. Maybe 1d3 nonlethal and 1d3 untyped on chrono and up it to 1d6 nonlethal and 1d6 untyped for epoch?
Gives a slightly better damage range than other base blasts to start with, but same range for the composite. The fact that it's not all actual damage could be the balance factor?
To be fair, negative is 100% hosed against them, as opposed to time, which is only 50% hosed. It's why I made 'Pure Negative Infusion' to give negative a reason to live against things like that.
well, they list some on page 10 and 11 under the wild talents list. That said, we could use a chart for the composite blasts and clarification of which ones are sonic and which are vibration as sound gives the choice.
Sonic and vibration are both able to be used with the same talents across the board, there'll be a line in the edit to clarify this.
Simple Blast: A vibrokineticist can select either sonic blast or vibration blast as their simple blast. They gain one of them when they first select sound, and must select sound again with expanded element to gain the other. They can use all infusions listed below with sonic blast, vibration blast and their composites.