Pretty much topic, like it would count as cover should you sneak up behind them, idk just stating something I would dig
The thing is that stealth is more than them seeing you. They have to not hear you as well. While eyes are very much directional, hearing is not.
Yea but by that logic cover should never matter, or even give you a bonus, both would be an instance "with real world logic' not gameplay mechanics, where they couldn't see you and had to hear you, but on one you get a bonus.
Except actual cover will muffle sound, due to the way sound travels. Just being behind a person is not enough, despite what some video games and movies may tell you.
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Thwarted by physics again. Still though, in a world where someone can be a good enough wrestler to beat a dragon in a wrestling match, (I'm in a home with a chick whose character can do just that) and will soon be able to wrestle incorporeal creatures, I don't think being able to be stealthy enough to just sneak up behind someone is that tall of an order.
Doing so would break the KISS rule too hard. Too much effort keeping track of it for too little benefit.
I can definitely see that, perhaps make it only matter outside of combat?
But you can be good enough to do that. Just get Hide in Plain Sight. Boom, problem solved. The thing is, you should only get to be that good without investment.
If your GM has common sense then it IS taken into account very easily.
I don't say that facetiously or to troll the OP - I'm sincere. If I were running a game and a player said "I want to sneak up from behind," I'd absolutely give a small circumstance bonus, probably +2. I can't recall the reference, but I know I've read or heard developers talk about the good, old +2/-2 circumstance bonus.
@Wildebob: Well my Gm at Society play just said no pcs/enemies see in all directions.
@mourge40k: Well yea I know about that and plan to get it, however that ability is to use stealth when you could otherwise be observed, I'm questioning how they are observing me when it was specified that they were looking one direction and I approach from the other.
Also isn't being a high level ranger or a level in shadow dancer the only means to get hide in plain sight? This should be a class skill for all stealth classes, Shadow dancer dip means losing one BAB which I need more of anyway and frankly the Ranger getting is just kind of silly, they benefit very little from stealthy tactics.
@mourge40k: Well yea I know about that and plan to get it, however that ability is to use stealth when you could otherwise be observed, I'm questioning how they are observing me when it was specified that they were looking one direction and I approach from the other.
Also isn't being a high level ranger or a level in shadow dancer the only means to get hide in plain sight? This should be a class skill for all stealth classes, Shadow dancer dip means losing one BAB which I need more of anyway and frankly the Ranger getting is just kind of silly, they benefit very little from stealthy tactics.
No, it's also an advanced talent for rogues, and the Stalker bit of the Vigilante can nab it at level 8. Pick up Hellcat Stealth, and you can hide pretty much whenever and wherever you want. It's like the grappling you mentioned earlier: I'm willing to bet that the character you mentioned earlier has dumped a lot of focus into being that good at grappling, and that same line of thought applies to stealth for me.
Or, you know. You could just be a caster and win at whatever you try your hand at.
Ugh don't get me started on my general disdain for full casters lol. Also yea she plays a tetori.
Although it seems I may not be fully aware of my options to be a beast at stealth. So thanks for giving me a few things to look into. :)
Many ages ago, when this ancient planet was not quite so ancient, I made a game system. That game system had a meticulous initiative tracker.
It went like this:
Each point on the initiative tracker was 1 second. Real time. Nothing abstract.
We started everyone at 0 - at the beginning of combat, zero seconds have elapsed.
There were no "rounds". The initiative counter just kept getting higher.
Every action had a time-factor from 1 second to, well lots of seconds.
For example, a dagger has a 2-second attack while a greatsword has a 4-second attack.
Another example, standing up takes 2 seconds, falling prone takes 1 second.
Spells all had various numbers of seconds, the best ones often took longer.
Yes, I had a very big list of every possible action and its time-factor.
Each combatant named an action and rolled a d10.
You subtract your DEX mod from your d10 roll then add the time-factor of your action.
For example, if you had an 14 DEX and rolled a 7, your initiative result would be 7 - 2 + 4 = 9. You would make your first attack on 7.
For your next attack, you roll a 3. 3 - 2 + 4 = 5. You add that to your last action so 7 + 5 = 12. Your next attack will happen on the 12th second of the battle.
And your third action might be on the 18th second, and your fourth action on the 25th second, and so on.
In that system, I had Facing. You could automatically see anything in a 90 degree arc in front of you (you see it all with no perception checks unless something in that arc was using Stealth) and you could not see anything in the rest of the 270 degrees (perception checks would be allowed based on sound or other non-visual senses as appropriate).
In that complex initiative system, I allowed anybody to turn 90 degrees in 1 second (180 degrees in 2 seconds). That's a bit abstract, but I didn't have fractional seconds to work with. You could change your facing before you roll initiative (add 1 or 2 seconds, then roll and figure out the timing of your next attack) or after you roll initiative (roll initiative, figure out the timing, add 1 or 2 seconds), or after you finish action (after you kill the orc, you add 1 or 2 seconds to change facing). In other words, you could stick it in anywhere but you couldn't interrupt the die-roll or the action-time.
It was easier to learn than it is to describe, but it was also very complex. I liked it and my players liked it. For example, it gave dagger fighters more attacks than greatsword fighters so their average damage worked out to be much more similar over time than it does in Pathfinder, making a "knife-fighter" concept actually viable. Another benefit was that weak spells were quick while devastating spells were slow and interrupting them was very easy, especially for highly mobile guys with quick weapons and good DEX mods.
In that system, I did have facing and it worked.
But Pathfinder is not that system.