Creating a new character for a homebrew campaign. Currently the goal is an arcane caster who, in a perfect world, can take over as party face from our paladin. Note that we are playing with sloooooow progression (5-6 sessions per level) and are currently 4th level.
My big question is about building an arcane caster who can charm the natives. We are entering very unfriendly but not quite hostile territory, so the party needs good people skills. Are there traits, feats, and/or items I can get to make an arcane caster a big hit with the ladies (and everyone else)?
I would note I am very hesitant to play a sorc or arcanist, as slow progression means it will be months before I see level 3 spells. Additionally, I love the idea of a ratfolk (an approved PC race due to setting) using illusion and enchantment to begile the more traditionally beautiful races who look down on his people. Third party content is accessible on a case by case basis, so if there's any hidden gems out there I'd love to hear about it. Thanks for the help!
|
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Clever Wordplay trait allows you to use INT instead of Charisma for a skill.
Mask of Stony Demeanor gives you a +10 to bluff for telling a lie.
A masterwork tool of that skill will give a +2 bonus.
The spell Raiment of Command is an effective +7 to diplomacy but can be up to +12 to bluff and disguise while appearing to be a specific authority figure.
Heroism gives a +2 to skill checks.
Moment of Greatness doubles moral bonuses such as those from heroism.
Memory Lapse and Charm Person help when something goes very wrong.
Ease of Faith + Clever Wordplay (diplomacy) and a wizard can be an excellent face.
Just play a bard.
Is the Cosmopolitan feat worth taking or are wizard feats too precious to use on extra class skills?
Edit: Extra Trait feat would serve the same purpose, so same question for it as well.
If you are looking for class skills, the feat Extra Traits is often going to be mechanically superior than Cosmopolitan, because it will get you not only two class skills but also an extra +1 on each of them. However, the fluff might be a stretch, and depending on what class skills you want, you might run into the problem of them being the same category (such as the only traits that give you your desired skill are both social skills.)
But, I would at least look into Extra Traits before you go for Cosmopolitan. If you're Int-based, you will probably have an excess of languages, and as a wizard you can cast Comprehend Languages anyway.
Just play a bard.
I honestly never seriously considered the bard. Our party has limited divine casting and no arcane casting. While the mundane fighters would enjoy the buffs and I'd have party face in the bag, I don't feel like I'd have much to do in combat besides be a buff bot since the bard gets so few spells and each level takes over a month. Am I missing something?
|
Not sure it will be a better option than those above since it might be skill point starved, but a sorcerer with the PFS Upstanding (Diplomacy) trait is another option. It will have the correct stat for bluff, diplomacy, and intimidate. Which covers all of the "face" skills. Unless your GM is going to have stat boost items lying around, the number of spells/day makes up for the level of spells, IMHO.
or (ninja ed...) if you can deal with limited casting go bard...
|
|
If you start going feats we are going from working our way through social encounters to full blown making friends out of enemies in combat.
With just the things you have access to right now you are rolling at a +23 to diplomacy or a +28 to bluff and when you level you get heroism bonuses.
If you want to do even more than that look at the Silver Tongued racial trait for human or the Diabolical Negotiator feat for following Asmodeus.
Just play a bard.I honestly never seriously considered the bard. Our party has limited divine casting and no arcane casting. While the mundane fighters would enjoy the buffs and I'd have party face in the bag, I don't feel like I'd have much to do in combat besides be a buff bot since the bard gets so few spells and each level takes over a month. Am I missing something?
You can't really make a "full caster bard", but it is entirely possible to spec your Bard into being an entirely capable melee character without losing any of your buffing capabilities. Of course, it sounds like the 9th level caster will do your team better. A Wizard with Clever Wordplay will do just fine as a party face.
A bard would probably be a better face than the paladin. He gets all the social skills, plus a lot of detection skills and the skill points to actually use them. Play a human or half human for the extra spells. Bards get illusion and enchantments spells so you can focus on them. You only really need a few illusion spells to be effective. Bards also get early access to a couple of spells namely heroism as a second level spell.
A bard also has some decent weapons so can contribute to combat by actually fighting. If you have a decent DEX you can go the archer route. You don’t have to go full all out archer just enough to be useful when not doing something else. If you went archeologist you would also fill the role of the “Thief”. This would also allow you to use wands of cure light wounds to act as a backup healer.
Just play a wizard or witch that doesn't dump Cha; Int-based casters should have plenty of Skill Ranks. With the Friend in Every Town, Influence, or Trustworthy trait, you can gain one of the "face" skills as a class skill.
Witch might be a better choice for the Charm hex, if you want to go that route (not really recommended with a paladin in the party*).
*- Using many magical charm/compulsion effects to make others act in a desired way/influence their decisions is often considered criminal.
|
|
Clever Wordplay alone is always better than even the best diplomacy traits. The best one gives a +5 from making it a class skill plus bonus. Even if you have a 10 in charisma you will have 5 bonus on your int and this will only increase as you get levels. If you dumped CHR you might be getting as much as 7 diplomacy from this one trait alone.
The truth is that it is very very easy to make very high skill checks no matter what class you are if you use a little bit of resources. Play whatever class you actually want to play and you can change what needs to be changed from there.
So here's a couple of followup questions. If I rolled wizard and used traits to get a good diplomacy score (clever words combined w/ some trait to make diplomacy a class skill) would I need to bother with the enchanting tree at all or could I make it an opposition school?
Second question: will I want bluff as well as diplomacy? I'll have a positive cha score and can at least make it a class skill if I take the Extra Trait feat. Is that a necessary tool for the party face as well or can I survive on diplomacy alone?
|
|
You don't need a positive chr score at all.
You can bluff if you want to while still doing diplomacy.
-2 chr
+10 mask of Stony Demeanor
+4 ranks
+2 tool
+2 Raiment of command (for their opposed check penalty).
=
+18 without it as a class skill and without a stat bonus.
Next level this goes to +23.
If you make it a class skill add 3 more. If you make it an Int check add at least 7 more. (Maybe the Student of Philosophy trait.)
Your bonuses are so high with just these that at level 5 Hostile enemies become indifferent to you on an average roll. If you took Silver Tongued or the Asmodeus feat they even become friendly to you.
As for your school you can pretty much do anything you want. Enchantments are fine if that is what you want to do but don't feel forced to do it just because of diplomacy stuff. You are so diplomatic on a 1 that in this town that dislikes you everyone is friendly and if you roll any better they are helpful if you need something.
The Enchantment school is something that needs to either be hyper-focused or dropped completely; if you're not planning on making it your schtick in combat (and i would not recommend doing so, since everything and it's dog resists or is immune to enchantments) it's better to make it your opposition school and depend on skill checks.
Human int based caster, pehaps arcanist. Focused Study To get skill focus(linguistics) at level 1 and spend your feat on oratory, with a starting int of 18 you Will have +11 in the relevant face skills at level 1 and they key of int. Get the trait bastard and with a familiar and wis 12 you Will have sense motive +8. This Will need you to spend 2 skill points pr level to keep relevant but that is it. You Can be a GOD or a blockbuster on the side:)
Edit: fixed a number
Not really considered a caster but how about an investigator? Especially the empiricist can use lots of skills with int from level 2 on and clever wordplay fixes diplomacy. He is THE skillmonkey and can add his inspiration die to important rolls (and on many skills it's even free).
And you don't have to care about arcane spell failure.
Student of Philosophy might even be better than clever wordplay for an empiricist investigator as you already get to use int for diplomacy to gather information.
I have just recently had this same issue, my solution was a human wizard with 20 starting Int (18 + 2 racial), student of philosophy (social) and world traveler (human) traits, for magic items the headband of intellect +2 bonus skill is bluff. So in total (adjusted for level 4):
Diplomacy +6(Int)+3(Class)+1(trait)+4(ranks) = 14 (before magic items)
Bluff +6(Int)+4(ranks) = 10 (before magic items)
sense motive is more for the druid or cleric in the party anyway, and disguise can be covered with spells and items if really needed.
*Note - SoP only adds int to some (not all) diplomacy and bluff rolls, but they cover almost all uses of those skills that a face wants (with the exception being maybe gather info).
And as Ragoz has said there are plenty of magic items that boost this through the roof.
I actually happened across an old exploiter wizard concept I'd created, and I'm thinking that might be a great option for this campaign. I wouldn't give up full spell progression, can party face w/ some combination of the traits kindly listed above, and use arcanist exploits (DM ruled I can use the Extra Exploit feat) to make sure my spells fit the situation.