domain advice for an battle cleric

[Fiddich]

Okay, some background information. We're doing a 3rd party module "the worlds largest superdungeon" ...i am pretty sure thats the name, if not its the flavor of it.

The dungeon is closed once we enter, no summoning, no teleporting out, no planar travel. We are starting at level 1, and planning on reaching about 18.

I have chosen to be a battle cleric. Obviously, couldnt pass up Aasimar as a very synergistic choice on race. The GM is allowing me to choose any domain/subdomain combo without having a deity restriction (bit of a homebrew world).

I've reviewed the class guides here, and found very negative things said about domains that are flavored to damage. My main question is thus: is the destruction domain that bad? Or is there another domain that would be acceptable at damage dealing. My intent is not to be a blaster, but am planning on being front line. My other domain was planned to be defense subdomain.

Recommendations?

[Markov Spiked Chain]

Destruction doesn't look horrible. But I'm a big fan of Growth, with a reach weapon, especially if you pick up Combat Reflexes and can afford a moderate (~14) dex. I'd consider Tactics over Defense, too. I've also had fun with Eagle(Familiar, Fly, Overland Flight, Improved Evasion) and Wolf (Improved Trip) as second domains.

Being able to win initiative (by rolling twice,) get 20' reach, move up and attack on the opening round is huge. You've got an enormous threatened area (50' wide) that's going to give you a lot of AoOs from any melee opponents. You don't really need 20' reach after round 1, so the 1 round duration is fine.

[Errant Mercenary]

First, Crusader cleric is great for battle clerics! Free relevant feats.

As for Domains, if you go for a hit hard cleric:
Destruction adds some damage, and the aura at 8 is powerful with the right group. If youre on your own in melee then Rage subdomain replaces the aura for Rage at 8.

Combine with Strength domain, Ferocity Subdomain to go with the extra damage.

Otherwise, Liberation is amazing for frontlines too.

[Fiddich]

Thanks for the tips.

I should have mentioned that the dungeon is all very close-in, so reach might be a bit of a hard one.

Looks like I have more research to do.

i do love the aura on Destruction, we are a melee centric group with a Magus, Monk, Warpriest, and Bloodrager already.

Cheers!

Fid

[RainyDayNinja]

Heroism subdomain is awesome. You get Heroism as a domain spell, and an aura that duplicates its effects for allies within 30 feet for a few rounds per day.

[Jiggy]

RainyDayNinja wrote:

Heroism subdomain is awesome. You get Heroism as a domain spell, and an aura that duplicates its effects for allies within 30 feet for a few rounds per day.

Not only that, the aura is only a swift action to activate.

I built a very successful battle cleric with the Heroism and Sun domains, and played him from 2nd to just shy of 12th.

By the way, why Aasimar?

[Fiddich]

Jiggy wrote:

RainyDayNinja wrote:

Heroism subdomain is awesome. You get Heroism as a domain spell, and an aura that duplicates its effects for allies within 30 feet for a few rounds per day.

Not only that, the aura is only a swift action to activate.

I built a very successful battle cleric with the Heroism and Sun domains, and played him from 2nd to just shy of 12th.

By the way, why Aasimar?

from a completely meta-game perspective ....meaning a nice +2 bump to wis and cha. Also from an rp standpoint, my friend in the party is playing a negative energy "zombie" cleric, and I want to screw with him and his misguided ideology.....ergo the whole celestial rp thing.

[Renegadeshepherd]

There is a lot to cover here so plz be patient...

1) domains on the whole: most people look down on damage dealing domain powers to some degree that's true. And to some extent they have reason to do so as it is t always a good choice or the best choice available. That's said they do have a place and sometimes are the best choice. The trick is to find what combination of about half a dozen variables will come together to synergize with you best. These variables can include level, campaign length, weapon choice, race, and etc. to put the best package together ill touch on what matter most....

2) damage domains: the top contenders are evil/demon, glory/heroism, plant/growth, destruction/domain. Each has their own pluses and minuses to both you and your party and must be examined closely (but I'll be brief). Heroism is very rewarding to a party as then everyone gets a boost as long as there isn't an evangelist or bard nearby BUT its bonuses are small for boosting you personally takes a while to work proper. Demon is the single best personal accuracy and damage dealing booster there is among the domains. An important thing to remember is that this level 1 power grants the same bonuses to any weapon you are attacking with; meaning that even though it's pretty good on its own with one weapon you can use TWF and natural attacks to great effect as your bonuses are applying to more attacks. Destruction is a mixed bag because its level 1 is only slightly above average. The main issue with its level 8 is that its a double edged sword. You and the party can deal massive damage with the proper high crit weapons and such but so can your enemies. This domain I feel is the most dependent on a groups makeup than anything else and that's why it isn't higher rated. Growth is like a rock or strong foundation for a battle cleric as you can't go wrong with it... The ability to grow is huge as it's near guaranteed damage increase and extra battlefield control.

3) desired goal: believe it or not a battle cleric is not an all consuming idea or resource drain so you got to decide how one fights and what they want to achieve. Tanking, big damage, control, or battle with side support all are possible. If you want max damage then demon based builds present themselves as being high DPS but weaker in defense. Heroism is strong group support, growth is good control and damage while destruction is group shock and awe.

4) archetypes: this is a big one! This and domain go more hand in hand than anything else on the list. Crusader is made for tank clerics or clerics that NEED a martial weapon (usually crit fishing for destruction). You only have one domain with em so you got to choose well. Crusaders will not have the high damage numbers even with demon domain but they are hard to kill and accurate. Vanilla cleric has two domains, which is sexy, but finding two of these domains in the same deity is tricky and that deity may not be one you want to be part of. Furthermore the vanilla cleric will likely have overlap on his swift action economy with the domain powers...meaning you may not be able to use two domain powers in the same round. This is good and bad In That you have two resources to draw upon but you can't usually nova as well as you might want to. Evangelist is the laager to choose from and its a good one. Remember how I mentioned that heroism was loved by a group? Well now let's double down on that :) an evangelist allows you to boost bard style the party at the cost of some channeling, medium arm prof and one domain. This archetype will not only make you and the party more accurate but also do more damage per hit as well.

5) weapon(s): some weapons are only good for certain tactics and others are good for everything. Unfortunately you only get one more weapon than simple unless you took crusader or some other resource to get prof. That said as it relates to domain powers some weapons are clearly better certain domains. Reach weapons and growth are ridiculous as you get more reach, 18-20 crit range weapons are awesome for destruction, and normal high damage weapons lend themselves to demon high base damage. Heroism is good for all of em.

6) levels: since your goin from level 1-18ish any of your choices can work well enough. Each will have sweet spots but I favor demon as its bonus is welcome at all levels and on the rare occasion you face a good alignment enemy it's 8th level power is helpful. Failing that I like heroism just so your group loves you more.

7) channel smite/guided hand: a peripheral issue but one worthy of note is that feat combo. For those who channel negative energy adding a little damage with the first feat and increasing accuracy with the second is worth a look. The combo allows you to make your strength as low as a 13 for power attack and still maintain accuracy. With a higher wisdom you get higher save, better skills (perception), and more spells. In effect your trading strengths damage for those bonuses at the cost of feats. Is it worth it? Maybe maybe not as it depends on the build. I would say its best used for those who favor domains that have fewer swift actions and the weapon was what you wanted to begin with.

Whew!!! Hope something in there helped.

[Fiddich]

Renegadeshepherd wrote:

There is a lot to cover here so plz be patient...

1) domains on the whole: most people look down on damage dealing domain powers to some degree that's true. And to some extent they have reason to do so as it is t always a good choice or the best choice available. That's said they do have a place and sometimes are the best choice. The trick is to find what combination of about half a dozen variables will come together to synergize with you best. These variables can include level, campaign length, weapon choice, race, and etc. to put the best package together ill touch on what matter most....

2) damage domains: the top contenders are evil/demon, glory/heroism, plant/growth, destruction/domain. Each has their own pluses and minuses to both you and your party and must be examined closely (but I'll be brief). Heroism is very rewarding to a party as then everyone gets a boost as long as there isn't an evangelist or bard nearby BUT its bonuses are small for boosting you personally takes a while to work proper. Demon is the single best personal accuracy and damage dealing booster there is among the domains. An important thing to remember is that this level 1 power grants the same bonuses to any weapon you are attacking with; meaning that even though it's pretty good on its own with one weapon you can use TWF and natural attacks to great effect as your bonuses are applying to more attacks. Destruction is a mixed bag because its level 1 is only slightly above average. The main issue with its level 8 is that its a double edged sword. You and the party can deal massive damage with the proper high crit weapons and such but so can your enemies. This domain I feel is the most dependent on a groups makeup than anything else and that's why it isn't higher rated. Growth is like a rock or strong foundation for a battle cleric as you can't go wrong with it... The ability to grow is huge as it's near guaranteed damage increase and extra battlefield control.

3) desired goal: believe it or not a battle...

wow.....thanks. High damage is not necessarily my aim, I just want to stand front line and more than just heal. I like the heroism synergy. Thanks for the response.

[Jiggy]

Fiddich wrote:

Jiggy wrote:

By the way, why Aasimar?

from a completely meta-game perspective ....meaning a nice +2 bump to wis and cha.

I was afraid you'd say that.

Here's the thing: for a frontline cleric, WIS/CHA are not your priority stats. STR is your top priority. WIS is a secondary stat, about on par with CON. CHA only needs to be a 10.

Now, for a caster cleric who's all about offensive spells? You'll want a high WIS for your save DCs. For a support/healing cleric whose spells are mostly buffs and condition removal and you invest feats in channeling? Then you want to prioritize CHA.

But for a battle cleric? WIS is your 2nd or even 3rd-highest stat, and CHA is your 2nd lowest. Aasimar is actually a poor choice for a battle cleric, mechanics-wise.

[Renegadeshepherd]

Jiggy is correct. If you were an evangelist cleric a vanilla aasimar would fit well but even then there are still better choices.

[Jiggy]

Renegadeshepherd wrote:

Jiggly

>:(

[Renegadeshepherd]

Jiggy wrote:

Renegadeshepherd wrote:

Jiggly

>:(

.

Damn spellchecker.

[Funnyman50]

I am playing a battle cleric and I have war and the sub domain justice. The feet is nice and roll twice for inti is great.