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So I'm in a group playing Council of Thieves and we got to Part 3 of the AP. We came across a poem known as Cugney's Wedding. The marriage in the poem had two women, a man, and a dove marry by a cleric of Erastil. We tried to gain access to Delvehaven and thought that because this is a cypher of sorts that we had to replicate what was in the poem to gain access. My character (Cleric of Sarenrae) convinced the party to marry each other. We had a female half-orc Paladin of Iomedae, a male human fighter/barbarian/rogue, and a female identified tiefling sorceress. I summoned doves with the GM approval to use Summon Monster III to replicate the dove that was married in the poem. We perform the ceremony with myself as the cleric to accept the vows of the remaining party... and the dove.
The party makes their vows and recites the poem to the letter but replacing the poem names with their own. The GM explained that the symbol of Erastil glowed, my link with the married summoned dove broke and won't desummon, grass grew where we stood and the marriage was a success. We then find out it didn't let us into the place we tried to get into. Now the party is rather upset with me since I got them all to marry. So a few questions on how things would work at this point.
While I know it is all up to the GM in the end. Just wanted some feedback on how my character will think it will affect her according to how Golarion's stance would be.
1: If the party gets a divorce, how will that affect them since Erastil heavily frowns upon that. Also how will that affect me who performed the ceremony.
2: Since I performed the marriage under Erastil instead of Sarenrae, will that affect my position as a cleric of Sarenrae.
3: If I had to address the divorce to break the vow, will that make my character possibly shunned by Erastil or Sarenrae?
Also is there anything else to keep in mind since I did this?
Both myself as a player and as the character are finding this to be completely hilarious since we all did this in vain.
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D&D/Pathfinder is, of course, supposed to be potentially usable to play any genre imaginable, but this is the first I've ever heard it used to run a romantic comedy.
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This thread needs more attention, we might learn how to make an aasimar with wings! OP, we need you to deliver!
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InnocentSoul wrote: While I know it is all up to the GM in the end. Just wanted some feedback on how my character will think it will affect her according to how Golarion's stance would be.
1: If the party gets a divorce, how will that affect them since Erastil heavily frowns upon that. Also how will that affect me who performed the ceremony.
2: Since I performed the marriage under Erastil instead of Sarenrae, will that affect my position as a cleric of Sarenrae.
3: If I had to address the divorce to break the vow, will that make my character possibly shunned by Erastil or Sarenrae?
Also is there anything else to keep in mind since I did this?
Everything that follows is IMO. Caveat Emptor, and all that.
First. Whacky.
1: Erastil, as described, tends to be all about marriage to promote stability in the community. How marrying a dove promotes stability, I have no idea, but I didn't write that poem. Since the GM had some visible signs that Erastil (or *someone,* anyway...) approved that 'marriage,' even if it was quite deliberately a sham to open a door, then it seems the GM is fine with it, at least.
1a: Note that any god (or archdevil...) could have bonded the character to the dove and made some grass grow. It's not like Erastil appeared directly (or, even if he appeared to, it's not like the party would have anyway of knowing it wasn't something pretending to be Erastil). It's entirely possible that some other entity is having fun at your expense.
2: A cleric of one faith should be able to marry (or bury) someone of a non-rival faith without incident. Overseeing an Urgathoan marriage ceremony involving ritual bloodletting and undead bridesmaids might be a bit more questionable. :)
3: Erastil isn't supposed to be a big fan of divorce, but then again, he's not supposed to be a fan of people marrying animals (or each other just to get past a locked door). So who knows. On the other hand, Erastil shouldn't be opposed to infertile couples breaking up and finding new partners with whom they can be fertile, or with dissolving marriages that, for whatever reason, are a threat to the community (even if that 'threat' is nothing more than a sham or political marriage standing in the way of a marriage that would indeed promote stability and healing and inter-connectedness between feuding elements of a community or whatever), so it's not as simple as 'divorce = bad.'
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Set wrote: 1: Erastil, as described, tends to be all about marriage to promote stability in the community. How marrying a dove promotes stability, I have no idea, but I didn't write that poem. Since the GM had some visible signs that Erastil (or *someone,* anyway...) approved that 'marriage,' even if it was quite deliberately a sham to open a door, then it seems the GM is fine with it, at least. What is really funny is that my character doesn't know that two of the characters (The tiefling sorceress and half-orc paladin) are starting to build a relationship with each other. Even those characters are still not 100% sure about their feelings yet but there is something there.
Set wrote: 1a: Note that any god (or archdevil...) could have bonded the character to the dove and made some grass grow. It's not like Erastil appeared directly (or, even if he appeared to, it's not like the party would have anyway of knowing it wasn't something pretending to be Erastil). It's entirely possible that some other entity is having fun at your expense. I do have a feeling that this could be accepted by Erastil, however this can be true that either another god... or archdevil (like Asmodeus) may be doing this too. My cleric understands it as Erastil doing this from her point of view but this is based on that Erastil's holy symbol glowed with a bright light while grass grew on the spot that they took their vows from. To her, that is something Erastil has the power to do. Though she could be just as naive to other potential deities having influence especially since she knows mainly on how Sarenrae handles things.
Set wrote: 2: A cleric of one faith should be able to marry (or bury) someone of a non-rival faith without incident. Overseeing an Urgathoan marriage ceremony involving ritual bloodletting and undead bridesmaids might be a bit more questionable. :) I did have a feeling that would be the case since there are many towns with only one temple or shrine and only a priest of one religion that respects and allows worship of multiple religions, I know that the Sandpoint Cathedral was an example of observing multiple religions with Father Zantus who worships Desna.
Set wrote: 3: Erastil isn't supposed to be a big fan of divorce, but then again, he's not supposed to be a fan of people marrying animals (or each other just to get past a locked door). So who knows. On the other hand, Erastil shouldn't be opposed to infertile couples breaking up and finding new... The thing that I find the most hilarious is that the only one that is infertile with any of them in this case is the dove since it cannot breed with humanoids obviously (save for weird polymorph situations). The tiefling that is in this group is intersexed. This is due to the random rolled trait for tieflings in Council of Thieves. We all thought it was so funny that the player is enjoying playing along with it due to the comedy that would ensue. So 'technically' she could have a successful fertility situation with either PC. In turn making it so the other PCs can do the same with either PC depending on what the tiefling would use (though I hope the players save those details from the group). While the human PC is in a relationship with an NPC in the story, it is yet another rather comical dilemma here, especially if and when the NPC would find out that he is married to two party members AND a dove. However while the gods have accepted the marriage, the government will probably say something else about it. Also since two of the characters are secretly in love, it isn't as bad... though the dove is rather awkward and the human PC is just going "whatever". Well since the sorceress wanted a familiar, this is probably what she'll get at this rate.
I just hope my character isn't shunned for this by Sarenrae since it was to both the deities' and cleric's point of view: a mock wedding. I'll keep up on this each session since the comedy just gets better by the minute. My group has done some crazy things but going with my suggestion to do this was just too funny NOT to do. Especially since my cleric is going to try to force them to grow up and act like a married couple when they start to bicker (which is common). :P
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Updates:
Well after dealing with the marriage and it locked things into place, things really got interesting at that point. Two of the characters that married finally expressed their interest for one another, the fighter is deciding to take his vows seriously and quit going to brothels for pleasure, and the dove that was summoned is slowing becoming the sorcerer's familiar since the player was going to get the arcane bloodline from Eldritch Heritage (I don't know how the GM is going to do this as mechanics with the bird, but this is really an interesting twist). We find out that the poem is actually used for something else, which now EVERY character questions my judgment.
On a completely separate note, my character decided to confront a noble in Cheliax that is a player character's side story and demanded the truth out of this NPC, so I tried to cast Zone of Truth on the guy, because I flashed my holy symbol of Sarenrae out at this man, he immediately used an item that called the Alarm spell to summon in a bunch of Hellknights that proceded to try to arrest me for heresy against Asmodeus. I threw up Obscuring Mist, and got the heck out of the area. After that for the next month in game time, I had to lay low since there are wanted posters with my picture, with a huge reward if I get turned in, saying I'm wanted for heresy. Pretty much the penalty I found out for this is death so I have now made my character who is the social character now ostracized from everyone. Also need to make a new alias and identity, but that is not something Sarenrae probably wants. Under the circumstances though, if I don't do this then I will be put to death, up until this point, I have hidden all traces of Sarenrae identifying items on my person. Now I have hidden all traces of my old identity entirely until my character can be permitted to leave town.
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InnocentSoul wrote: Updates:
Well after dealing with the marriage and it locked things into place, things really got interesting at that point. Two of the characters that married finally expressed their interest for one another, the fighter is deciding to take his vows seriously and quit going to brothels for pleasure, and the dove that was summoned is slowing becoming the sorcerer's familiar since the player was going to get the arcane bloodline from Eldritch Heritage (I don't know how the GM is going to do this as mechanics with the bird, but this is really an interesting twist). We find out that the poem is actually used for something else, which now EVERY character questions my judgment.
On a completely separate note, my character decided to confront a noble in Cheliax that is a player character's side story and demanded the truth out of this NPC, so I tried to cast Zone of Truth on the guy, because I flashed my holy symbol of Sarenrae out at this man, he immediately used an item that called the Alarm spell to summon in a bunch of Hellknights that proceded to try to arrest me for heresy against Asmodeus. I threw up Obscuring Mist, and got the heck out of the area. After that for the next month in game time, I had to lay low since there are wanted posters with my picture, with a huge reward if I get turned in, saying I'm wanted for heresy. Pretty much the penalty I found out for this is death so I have now made my character who is the social character now ostracized from everyone. Also need to make a new alias and identity, but that is not something Sarenrae probably wants. Under the circumstances though, if I don't do this then I will be put to death, up until this point, I have hidden all traces of Sarenrae identifying items on my person. Now I have hidden all traces of my old identity entirely until my character can be permitted to leave town.
Sarenrae cares about justice and goodness. Sounds like your identity is preventing you from being able to effectively go about issuing justice and goodness to others that Sarenrae has requested you to do. Try to find or craft a Hat of Disguise and start putting some points in Disguise. Do what you must to carry out Sarenrae's divine will.
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Maybe the dove is really a polymorphed angel of Shelyn ?
Those half-celestial have to come from somewhere, you know.
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Pathfinder Maps, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Maps, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber
On a tangent, is "until death" something either deity recognizes, or "as long as you are on the material plane". This is important as resurrected people might be freed from marriage vows if the former.
Actually, it may be the latter as legal issues tend to recognize resurrected individuals the way we view someone that recovered from illness or serious injury.
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Stereofm wrote: Maybe the dove is really a polymorphed angel of Shelyn ?
Those half-celestial have to come from somewhere, you know.
Oooh, like a Cassisian? Those guys often have a dove as their true form. ^_^
Pathfinder Maps, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Maps, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber
KestrelZ wrote: On a tangent, is "until death" something either deity recognizes, or "as long as you are on the material plane". This is important as resurrected people might be freed from marriage vows if the former.
Actually, it may be the latter as legal issues tend to recognize resurrected individuals the way we view someone that recovered from illness or serious injury.
The time factor might present some difficulties in regard to a long delayed Resurrection or True Resurrection. While it would be reasonable to wait out the day per level time limit for a Raise Dead spell before declaring somebody legally dead, it would not be reasonable to wait out the 10 years per level limit for the more powerful spells.
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