So my recent character a kobold summoner paracosmist (from beyond the breach) ash part of his back story gave his eidolon essentially a command to be given free will. Does this mean his eidolon could have a different alignment? Are there any other issues I'm not thinking of with this?
Eidolons can be entire characters unto themselves or unthinking slaves.
It is up to you on the RP front. The mechanics are what they are, but the kind of person the Eidolon is falls entirely on you.
I was just trying to confirm cause another player is most likely going to bring up eidolons have to be the same alignment or something as he tends to know those rule and tends to get really salty when rules aren't followed. So I'm just covering my bases with this, the alignment difference is a small one, the summoner is Cg the eidolon might be Cn or N idk she tends to intimidate, threaten, try to kill people the threaten said kobold. And being a kobold you can imagine the long list of threatening things.
Unless he's the DM, tell him to deal with it. If he's the DM... just write CG on the sheet and play how you want to. It's not a huge deal.
I feel your pain dealing with rules sticklers, though. Good luck.
He is our back up DM and our usual DM refers to him with rule concerns
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Eidolon: A summoner begins play with the ability to summon to his side a powerful outsider called an eidolon. The eidolon forms a link with the summoner, who, forever after, summons an aspect of the same creature. An eidolon has the same alignment as the summoner that calls it and can speak all of his languages. Eidolons are treated as summoned creatures, except that they are not sent back to their home plane until reduced to a number of negative hit points equal to or greater than their Constitution score. In addition, due to its tie to its summoner, an eidolon can touch and attack creatures warded by protection from evil and similar effects that prevent contact with summoned creatures.
An eidolon has the same alignment as the summoner that calls it and can speak all of his languages.
So, RAW and RAI, it has the same alignment. If your DM rules otherwise, that's fine, and the player can deal with it.png
Additionally, there' nothing stopping you from playing the Eidolon as CG with heavy Neutral leanings.
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Technically, it still doesn't have free will at all. It is simply obeying the order to act like it has free will, but it is entirely your slave.
Your character could be ignorant of this fact or in denial of it if you like of course.
Well the I've been playing it she mostly obeys him unless it's something she feel strongly about such as killing thieves or necromancers or someone she dislikes then no amount of his pleading stops her.
Well it's supposed to obey orders, but thing is the order was given to obey only what she feels like obeying, or something along those lines.
Technically, it still doesn't have free will at all. It is simply obeying the order to act like it has free will, but it is entirely your slave.
Your character could be ignorant of this fact or in denial of it if you like of course.
I don't believe there is RAW stating that. Could be wrong.
From a gameplay perspective the eidolon is controlled by the player, but I really don't see any rules saying the Eidolon lacks free will or is the summoner's slave.
I am presuming that when it states Eidolons act like summoned creatures, it is including this from Summon Monster. "If you can communicate with the creature, you can direct it not to attack, to attack particular enemies, or to perform other actions."
If that doesn't apply, then summoners never have any particular control over their eidolons at all as far as I know.
Eidolons don't count as summoned creatures though, if they did they would receive benefits from spells that effect summon monsters but they don't.
I know eidolons have their own will to some extent. I don't remember where it's from, but I remember reading that eidolons will by default obey most commands, but they will refuse to follow an order that would be pointless or having no other effect but to harm them.
Eidolons are very blank slate. They could be the slave or the master of the summoner. My current eidolon is just a good friend of the summoner. They consider each other to be equals.
Consider you are an eidolon. You can't be permanently killed, but can only explore and influence our world while summoned. Your summoner however can be killed. You want to keep that guy alive.
Eidolons have a more servant-master relationship with their summoner, slave doesn't go into the equation. Yes, an eidolon's default is to follow the commands of their summoner. However, Eidolons can ignore commands that go against their morality (almost never happens considering that they share alignment with their summoner), that go against them exclusively ("stand in that fire" as a command would not be followed while "check that burning building for survivors and save them if there is any" would), and finally gm discretion (albeit rarely) (Eidolons are living beings from another plane of existence and have their own lives there. Certain commands might be disagreed with because of what they think is right and they might also disagree with commands if they think a different course of action benefits them and/or their summoner).
Eidolons also don't have to be told to do anything in order to follow a course of action. They aren't automatons or normal summons and can make decisions for themselves (like when your eidolon saves a little kid out of a stream without being told (LG) or when it eats a particularly clumsy minion for not succeeding in its mission (CE)).
Also, the book you are looking for that told me most of this stuff was the ultimate campaign guide.
I probably should have added this not that it matters anymore my questions have been answered prior but I will regardless, a paracosmists eidolon gets a more powerful eidolon in exchange for giving up summoning abilities and spells, additionally a paracosmists eidolon never goes away and is essentially comprised of dreams, thoughts, etc of the summoner.
An Eidolon could be a slave, though. Like you said, they're living things with thoughts and feelings, and they can be subjugated if that's how you wanna roleplay your summoner.
There was a guy on this very forum who played it like the Summoner had married his eidolon. You can fluff it however you want because in the end you control the actions of both of them. If you want the summoner and the Eidolon to be equals, or slave and master, or butler and boss, or lab partner, or whatever. It's all possible and equally 'right'.
Actually that's kind of funny my group has a rule we spoke about that a summoner. Should one occur(our group rarely plays casters aside from myself) that a summoner may not have sex with his eidolon as it is incredibly creepy in our minds
Actually that's kind of funny my group has a rule we spoke about that a summoner. Should one occur(our group rarely plays casters aside from myself) that a summoner may not have sex with his eidolon as it is incredibly creepy in our minds
Well, roleplaying your own girlfriend is a hilariously depressing prospect, I'll give you that.
Actually that's kind of funny my group has a rule we spoke about that a summoner. Should one occur(our group rarely plays casters aside from myself) that a summoner may not have sex with his eidolon as it is incredibly creepy in our minds
What if you wanted to be a creepy character?
I actually had a concept based around that—a sorta codependent, mentally unstable summoner that creeps out the rest of her party by being way too close to her eidolon. It'd never be confirmed that there's anything physical going on, but it'd always be skirting the limits.
Actually that's kind of funny my group has a rule we spoke about that a summoner. Should one occur(our group rarely plays casters aside from myself) that a summoner may not have sex with his eidolon as it is incredibly creepy in our mindsWhat if you wanted to be a creepy character?
we usually just run our characters by the gm, to make sure. Creepy things are cool we just avoid certain things is all
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You could play the romance as cute too though. There are tons of magical girlfriend anime to draw from. As long as you don't have a servant relationship with your eidolons, it doesn't have to be creepy.
There actually I think was a thread debate a while back concerning as to whether or not it qualifies as rape to command an eidolon to have sex with said summoner . That's when we decided on the rule.
If you use the command, yes. Yes it is. I remember that thread; not nearly as fun as the succubus vs. druid one. :/
You could play the romance as cute too though. There are tons of magical girlfriend anime to draw from. As long as you don't have a servant relationship with your eidolons, it doesn't have to be creepy.
the characters actually have a weird relationship of dependence where the kobold has an issue being separated from her and /she get way more brutal, like it hasn't happened really yet but when it does she gets bordering evil levels of brutal.
If you use the command, yes. Yes it is. I remember that thread; not nearly as fun as the succubus vs. druid one. :/
or the succubus in a grapple one
Eidolons already have free will. They simply recognize you control when they're around so they tend to just do what you say.
Eidolons: Outside the linear obedience and intelligence scale of sentient and nonsentient companions are eidolons: intelligent entities magically bound to you. Whether you wish to roleplay this relationship as friendly or coerced, the eidolon is inclined to obey you unless you give a command only to spite it. An eidolon would obey a cruel summoner's order to save a child from a burning building, knowing that at worst the fire damage would temporarily banish it, but it wouldn't stand in a bonfire just because the summoner said to. An eidolon is normally a player-controlled companion, but the GM can have the eidolon refuse extreme orders that would cause it to suffer needlessly.
gm isn't deciding anything I've played the refusal as an in character thing
Sitcom about a summoner who dates and marries his eidolon.
Clever girl...
If you use the command, yes. Yes it is. I remember that thread; not nearly as fun as the succubus vs. druid one. :/or the succubus in a grapple one
One and the same. :P
gm isn't deciding anything I've played the refusal as an in character thingThe point is eidolons are never mindless slaves to your PC. They're intelligent creatures already.
Exactly what I was saying.