Current Build
This is the side project I've been working on, essentially bringing a character from a forum RP a long time ago into Pathfinder. However, while working on this, I began to really like this class combination for use on a future PFS or home game character (with a proper race). So if anyone could give me some feat ideas not only for the linked example (11th lvl feat plus 4 more levels of ES), but for a PFS legal character as well.
What is a hellpyre?
Also, There's a lot of suboptimal stuff there. Ki Stand, IUS (for a magus at least), Pool Strike are quite terrible, as is Toughness at that level.
What weapon are you using?
Are you married to CHA? You could grab that arcana that lets you use your Arcane Pool for Ki stuff, and not lock yourself into ES (which is terrible eats into your swift actions that you need for ninja's vanish, if you want to spell combat before 8).
IUS can actually work for a Magus, but only if they're Hexcrafters.
What is it about Ninja/Scion that's appealing? Every way I can figure it's a pretty sub-par combination, so I'm curious.
The second question, and in a lot of ways the more important one, is which way you want to go with this. Are you looking to optimize the character you have here, are you looking to optimize the character on a conceptual level, or are you looking to go with what's cool?
Like I mentioned, the linked example is me bringing an old story character of mine into Pathfinder rules, hence the player created race and the class choices. (inborn magic user that spent spent his youth training at a ninja academy) I just wanted to put him up to Eldritch Scion/8, Ninja/8, but in the process came to want to build this class combo on a real character.
So yes, some suggestions for useful feats for him would be nice, but mainly I'd like suggestions for feats/tricks/arcana/spells or even races for a proper Eldritch Scion/Ninja character.
You don't really need Ninja levels to be a ninja. While Eldritch scion is kinda really crappy, I'd still take most levels in that one instead of Ninja, if possible. A few levels of Ninja can help, if you have a concept in mind tho.
One combo that springs to mind is going ninja 2/Magus6 getting Ki Arcana at lvl 6 and Ki leech with Spell Blending.
Problem is, this works way better with straight Magus, because you don't lose your Spell recall from it.
You could also try something silly like Flurry of stars+rapidshot+throwing magus, and then take Flamboyant arcana->arcane deed(Precise Strike).
With all that said, you would be way better off with a different class combination.
Ninja 2/Dawnflower Dervish Bard X could pull off the same star flurry but better. You could combine that with a Natural attack build too. Aasimar or Tiefling are good choices for that build.
Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
Would you be able to expand on the character's personality and/or background a bit? It would help to get a better idea of the character and what you are trying to get as a fully fleshed out pathfinder build.
It was a long time ago, before Twilight made vampires sparkly, when I decided to make a roleplay thread with inspiration from the Judas Priest song "Love Bites". Micheal "Knight" Walker sneaks into a teenaged girl's window for a quick drink of blood before moving on. Unfortunately, he's blasted by a vampire destruction spell the girl had set up before bed, though it turns out that since he's only half-vampire he's not destroyed and is magically bound to her by the runes now around his neck. Thus begins the RP of Love Bites Knight must protect Lyla from various threats like nine-tailed foxes, evil runecasters, Lilith, a ninja, demons, nephilim, and even Satan. Over the course about a week, the two come to love each other to the point of going to hell to rescue each other is a thing. That's actually impressive considering all the craziness that entered her otherwise normal life, as well as the fact that he is Satan's son.
Anyway, Knight a.k.a. Lucian is generally a good guy, though bad things happen to the people he gets close to. In ancient Rome, his Magister dies; in New York, his best (female) friend is killed because of him; and more recently, the ninja academy he was training at was destroyed (secretly by another ninja who was also secretly his sister) and he got the blame. Because of all this, he's depressed and spends a lot of time wallowing in his past failures (hence why I chose the Sentimental drawback). His time with his Magister taught him some magic as well as a love of languages, while his time as a ninja trainee taught him martial combat.
Overall it was very much like InuYasha, which I was still into at the time, and some Naruto thrown in.
This character embodies my ideal in terms of magic combat. A caster that manipulates magic while leaping nimbly around the battlefield, ready to unleash a powerful spell or to augment his already considerable martial prowess as he fights in close. My first ever Pathfinder (Society) character is the closest I could get since the ACG wasn't even announced yet (Sorcerer/4, Fighter/1, Dragon Disciple/2). The Magus appeals to me as he is a magic swordsman (like Kratos Aurion), however I like spontaneous casting more than book casting. The Eldritch Scion is like a Sorcerer Magus. The Ninja, while not a pure combat class, has the battlefield mobility that I enjoy, and has a number of neat tricks and works great without armor.
What are the mobility options of the ninja that you enjoy?
Flavour-wise, I see using Dex for primary AC as being a nimble opponent who can dodge, twist, and jump out of the way of attacks. The high Ref save and having Acrobatics as a class skill supports this (my PFS character tries to Acrobatics, but it's not a class skill for his 3 classes).
Ki Stand is that one move from every martial arts movie you wish you could do, while Fast Stealth, Light Steps, and No Trace speak about just how quickly and quietly he can move.
The Ki Pool itself can grant a 20ft. increase to base speed for 1round, and all the inherent Ki Pool abilities are swift actions.
Acrobatic Master, Feather Fall, High Jumper, Vanishing Trick, Wall Climber, Ghost Step, and Unbound Steps have varying degrees of usefulness, but the all contribute to moving around. I particularly like Wall Climber.
Combat Trick, Rogue Talent, and Feat can expand options even further.
Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
So after reading a bit I have an idea for the character's class build that keeps it thematically but helps round you out a bit more, I decided to PM it to you since it seems a bit off topic since I haven't even looked at feats yet.
EDIT: "reading the Character sheet" I did not refresh page before I sent the PM so didn't have all the info you posted.
K-kun the Insane wrote: Flavour-wise, I see using Dex for primary AC as being a nimble opponent who can dodge, twist, and jump out of the way of attacks. The high Ref save and having Acrobatics as a class skill supports this (my PFS character tries to Acrobatics, but it's not a class skill for his 3 classes).
Ki Stand is that one move from every martial arts movie you wish you could do, while Fast Stealth, Light Steps, and No Trace speak about just how quickly and quietly he can move.
The Ki Pool itself can grant a 20ft. increase to base speed for 1round, and all the inherent Ki Pool abilities are swift actions.
Acrobatic Master, Feather Fall, High Jumper, Vanishing Trick, Wall Climber, Ghost Step, and Unbound Steps have varying degrees of usefulness, but the all contribute to moving around. I particularly like Wall Climber.
Combat Trick, Rogue Talent, and Feat can expand options even further.
There's nothing stopping your Magus from being Dex based; in fact, that's what every magus does anyway, most of the time (very rare is the STR based ones and they are hard to build).
Since you are going to pump DEX your reflex saves will be close to ninja levels, but there's nothing stopping you from taking lightning reflexes to make them even better.
Ki Stand is terrible. So terrible that there are Rogue Talents that are better.
Expeditious retreat grants 30 feet increased landspeed for minutes and it's a first level magus spell. Basically the equivalent of 1 pool point.
Every single ability you list is a 1st-2nd level spell at most (so 1-2 pool points), except worse in some way, or master tricks. And the Magus (even the scion) gets 2 of these spells for free on leveling up. And he uses them as less than swift actions. Hell, the Arcane Bloodline Eldritch scion gets two spells as a single swift action, and Spiderwalk is one of the spells he can pick.
The master tricks can be recreated at higher levels as well.
He also gets some awesome stuff that actually helps with battlefield mobility, like Bladed Dash.
I suggest the following: 2 Levels of ninja, if you really must, and find something the Magus doesn't recreate easily. The rest full Magus. You can take extra trick to take an extra trick if you want even.
I'm starting to lean towards Eldritch Scion/6, Ninja/4, Snakebite Striker/6 for the character example, with the Ki Arcana. (Potentially ES/10, N/4, SS/6 @ECL20th) Granted, this means he has lower level spells than normal at 16...Perhaps I should up him to 20...But that's ridiculously powerful. Not even the Pregens get that close.
As for PFS, I am limited by what books I have, though I like the Ki Arcana and the Bladed Dash, so I'll have to see if those books are legal and if so find/buy them.
Core Rulebook
Pathfinder Society Guide to Organized Play
Inner Sea World Guide
Advanced Player's Guide
Advanced Race Guide
Advanced Class Guide
Ultimate Combat
Ultimate Magic
Ultimate Campaign
Ultimate Equipment
Bestiary
Bestiary II
Bestiary III
LoneKnave wrote: There's nothing stopping your Magus from being Dex based; in fact, that's what every magus does anyway, most of the time (very rare is the STR based ones and they are hard to build). They're actually very easy to build-- easier than a normal Magus in point of fact since you free up 2-3 feat slots. The problem is surviving the lower levels, which makes them harder to pilot. But if you're building for level 7+ (when you can just wear medium armor), or are willing to play it safe, or have some other way to boost AC (rolled stats, for example, or a Tiefling sinking one of those saved feats into Armor of the Pits), then Strength is a good way to go.
On the main topic: straight-Magus actually has better mobility options than any sort of hybrid. For example:
Acrobatic Master? The Magus can take Flamboyant Arcana, which grants the Derring-Do deed to boost Acrobatics and other skills.
Feather Fall? 'Tis on the Magus spell list.
High Jumper? Why not just Fly? Jump is also a Magus spell.
Vanishing Trick? Declare Spell Combat, full attack. Cast Vanish.
Wall Climber? Cast Spiderclimb.
Ghost Steps? Dimension Door. The Magus also gets to be the single best user of that spell in the game, for the record.
Ki Pool movement boost? Bladed Dash, Dimension Door. Pick your flavor of high-velocity death dealing.
Ki Stand? Once a Magus has Flamboyant Arcana, they can take Arcane Deed for Kip-Up, which is the same concept but much better (note that Extra Arcana is a feat, so you can spend your actual Arcanas elsewhere).
That said, I think there's been a slight misstep in this thread. We've ignored elaborating on why, really, such a combination is a bad idea.
The simple fact is, casting classes are almost required to be an all-or-nothing affair. For example, let's look at two builds: Scion 4/Ninja 4 and Scion 8.
Scion 4/Ninja 4:
Spell Combat (only while Focused)
Spellstrike
Eldritch Pool: 2+Cha points
One Magus Arcana
Two second-level spells known; 1 2nd level spell per day (+bonus spells from Cha).
Caster level 4th (6th with Magical Knack)
The first two Bloodrager powers
Sneak Attack +2D6
Poison Use
One Ninja Trick
No Trace +1
Uncanny Dodge, 4th level
Ki Pool: 2+Cha points
Scion 8:
Spell Combat (active at all times)
Spellstrike
Medium Armor
Eldritch Pool: 4+Cha points
Two Magus Arcanas
Three third-level spells known; two 3rd level spells per day (+bonus spells from Cha).
Caster level 8th
Three Bloodrager Powers
The two italicized items are incredibly valuable to your ideal of magical combat. The 8th level Scion is much more free to manipulate magic since he can use spell Combat at any time instead of being restricted to (at best) (2+Cha)x2 uses per day. He is much more able to leap around the battlefield with more spell slots to use with abilities like Bladed Dash and raw access to spells like Haste and Fly. He is ready to augment his martial prowess with Haste. He can unleash a powerful spell in the form of an 8D6 Shocking Grasp (with Intensify Spell and Magical Lineage of course), twice the damage of the ninja-hybridized Scion.
To be more blunt about the last point: the hybrid build does not have powerful spells. 4D6 (average 14) at level 8 is not overly impressive. Further, CL4th means that it'll be outright ignored by anything with Spell Resistance-- it's generally expected that a caster will have CL8 for an even chance at breaking the SR of an 8th level encounter; this puts you closer to a 30% chance. The first build has extremely limited spells. This would be acceptable, if that was your aim... but it is, to be frank, drastically out of line with your stated intentions.
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