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Good afternoon, everyone. Simple enough question: what are some good 1st level wands for a witch to have? Playing Pathfinder Society, have 9 prestige points floating around and was thinking of updating some wands. Generally speaking, 3rd level Witch, Elemental Patron, starting to look at the witch more for debuffing than anything else now. So, preferably sticking to class spells so I don't need to worry about UMD, what are some wands that I should buy and why? I've got the wand of Cure Light Wounds, that's a given, but now I'm looking at a few others and would like input:
Wand of Enlarge Person: Good for buffing my allies, and, if they fail the save, I can use it on mounted opponents to remove the advantage of their mount (had a problem in a module where we engaged in a running battle with some mounted bandits and found myself next to useless, having prepared no spells with a greater range than Burning Hands. Not going to make that mistake again)
Wand of Mage Armor: Cheaper than Bracers of Armor +1, with 4 times the benefit. Got a +13 to Initiative, so no problem putting it on before taking too many attacks.
Wand of Ill-Omen: Started looking at this and it's a nice one. Better than misfortune, since I can keep hitting them with this.
Wand of Hex Vulnerability: Interesting little spell, since technically I can use it on an ally, and be able to hit them with my Healing Hex repeatedly, Don't have any enemy-targeting hexes that it would affect yet, so the penalty for having it repeatedly used on them wouldn't matter.
Any other good suggestions? I want to stay away from spells with saving throws, since with a wand it would only be an 11, but am otherwise open to debuffs, buffs, attack, or utility spells. Perhaps Comprehend Languages? Not really sure about that, since I've only run into about 3 encounters where understanding someone MIGHT have been a problem.
Also, not that it really matters, I'm planning on getting two wands using four of my prestige points, technically I have 12-13 prestige, but already spent two.

Cevah |

Wand of Enlarge Person: Good for buffing my allies, and, if they fail the save, I can use it on mounted opponents to remove the advantage of their mount (had a problem in a module where we engaged in a running battle with some mounted bandits and found myself next to useless, having prepared no spells with a greater range than Burning Hands. Not going to make that mistake again)
Note: 1 round cast, not standard action. You get no move action this round.
Note: Fort save against enemy mount. May not work.Wand of Mage Armor: Cheaper than Bracers of Armor +1, with 4 times the benefit. Got a +13 to Initiative, so no problem putting it on before taking too many attacks.
Good for 1 hour. OK, if you know you need it for only an hour, otherwise you will use it up quick.
Wand of Ill-Omen: Started looking at this and it's a nice one. Better than misfortune, since I can keep hitting them with this.
Note: From a wand, only lasts 1 round. Best time it to just before another caster attacks with a saveable spell.
Wand of Hex Vulnerability: Interesting little spell, since technically I can use it on an ally, and be able to hit them with my Healing Hex repeatedly, Don't have any enemy-targeting hexes that it would affect yet, so the penalty for having it repeatedly used on them wouldn't matter.
Note: From a wand, only lasts 1 round. Also, repeated uses are harder to use against an enemy. For party help, it is OK. Got a friendly hex to use?
Any other good suggestions? I want to stay away from spells with saving throws, since with a wand it would only be an 11, but am otherwise open to debuffs, buffs, attack, or utility spells. Perhaps Comprehend Languages? Not really sure about that, since I've only run into about 3 encounters where understanding someone MIGHT have been a problem.
Also, not that it really matters, I'm planning on getting two wands using four of my prestige points, technically I have 12-13...
Here are some I have thought about:
1st level:Blend -- Circ +4 Stealth
Forced Quiet -- Target cannot make loud noises.
Marid's Mastery -- Change BAB/AC based on touching water
Mount -- Summons riding horse for 2 hours/level.
Unseen Servant -- Invisible force obeys your commands.
2nd level:
Touch of Bloodletting -- If hurt, Bleed 1 & Exhausted for spell
/cevah

Exguardi |

Having access to an Unseen Servant at all times can certainly throw some GMs for a loop even at higher levels. "You see the MacGuffin clutched in the incredibly foreboding statue's hands." "I send an Unseen Servant to fetch it while we cower behind cover." "Hmm... 14 horrifying traps go off on your Unseen Servant..."
For best mileage of Ill-Omen and Hex Vulnerability, make sure to grab a wand-using Improved Familiar.
If you use Soothsayer with Hex Vulnerability from a familiar's wand I believe you could Fortune your allies and have it stick around and "proc" at the beginning of every combat, without the GM giving you an evil eye of their own for walking around Cackling for hours.

Cevah |

For best mileage of Ill-Omen and Hex Vulnerability, make sure to grab a wand-using Improved Familiar.
Unless your familiar also has hexes, the wand does no good in the familiar's hands. The spell makes them subject to your (i.e. the caster's) hex. If the familiar uses the wand, they are the "caster" whose hexes are affected.
Mudball is a fun little spell. It'll be a 25ft range touch attack that blinds a target until their next turn (assume they'll make the DC 11 reflex save). If you ready an action to launch after the targets turn begins they'll have to deal with the blindness right away.
Mudball does not make a good wand spell because it has Save: Reflex negates. Wand 1st level DC = 11. Not a difficult DC to save against. I suppose it is OK for a familiar to spam and get lucky, but I would not count on it. Also, each round at the start they get another save, and if they want to spend a standard, they can wipe the mud away.
/cevah

Shane LeRose |

Exguardi wrote:For best mileage of Ill-Omen and Hex Vulnerability, make sure to grab a wand-using Improved Familiar.Unless your familiar also has hexes, the wand does no good in the familiar's hands. The spell makes them subject to your (i.e. the caster's) hex. If the familiar uses the wand, they are the "caster" whose hexes are affected.
Shane LeRose wrote:Mudball is a fun little spell. It'll be a 25ft range touch attack that blinds a target until their next turn (assume they'll make the DC 11 reflex save). If you ready an action to launch after the targets turn begins they'll have to deal with the blindness right away.Mudball does not make a good wand spell because it has Save: Reflex negates. Wand 1st level DC = 11. Not a difficult DC to save against. I suppose it is OK for a familiar to spam and get lucky, but I would not count on it. Also, each round at the start they get another save, and if they want to spend a standard, they can wipe the mud away.
/cevah
. Please re-read the spell. Yes, it says reflex negates, but they don't roll the reflex save until the beginning of their turn. That's why you time it for after their turn starts. The reflex: negates line should also say (see description), but doesn't for some dumb reason. This means that in the hands of a monkey familiar trained to fire off a mudball after someone starts their turn you could really lock a bbeg down!

Rerednaw |
Well that's odd my post vanished.
Normally I'd recommend a wand of Infernal Healing for superior downtime healing as 1 charge = 10 hp. You already have a CLW wand though so it may not be necessary.
Hex Vulnerability suffers from the 1/r level limitation. Though it may be a way to sort of save a feat (Accursed Hex). Ill Omen has the same but it works with another caster.
On a side note, my witch double-traited Ill-Omen and started casting it Quickened once he hit 5th. Only used the combo once.
Overall I'd probably save on the prestige as there are quite a few nice boons...plus the cost of raise dead/recovery.

Cevah |

Cevah wrote:. Please re-read the spell. Yes, it says reflex negates, but they don't roll the reflex save until the beginning of their turn.Shane LeRose wrote:Mudball is a fun little spell. It'll be a 25ft range touch attack that blinds a target until their next turn (assume they'll make the DC 11 reflex save). If you ready an action to launch after the targets turn begins they'll have to deal with the blindness right away.Mudball does not make a good wand spell because it has Save: Reflex negates. Wand 1st level DC = 11. Not a difficult DC to save against. I suppose it is OK for a familiar to spam and get lucky, but I would not count on it. Also, each round at the start they get another save, and if they want to spend a standard, they can wipe the mud away.
/cevah
If the line said save: no, see text, you would be right.
Instead, it sais save: Reflex negates; see text, which means they get a save vs. the cast and saves at the beginning of the round.
I agree it should not have that initial save since you make an attack roll, but that is what RAW states.
/cevah

Exguardi |

Unless your familiar also has hexes, the wand does no good in the familiar's hands
True; although since a familiar can deliver Witch Hexes, and I do not believe using a wand counts as casting a spell for the purposes of discharging a held charge, you should be able to use a touch hex like the Healing hex then use the wand and have your familiar deliver the hex in the same round.
Make sense?

Cevah |

Cevah wrote:Unless your familiar also has hexes, the wand does no good in the familiar's handsTrue; although since a familiar can deliver Witch Hexes, and I do not believe using a wand counts as casting a spell for the purposes of discharging a held charge, you should be able to use a touch hex like the Healing hex then use the wand and have your familiar deliver the hex in the same round.
Make sense?
Almost. One problem:
Use hex w/familiar as toucher = standard actionUse wand = standard action
You only get one standard per turn. :-)
As to holding spells, hexes are not spells and have no such discharge rules.
/cevah

Gregory Connolly |

Infernal Healing is stronger out of combat than cure light wounds, but it is evil.
Ear Piercing Scream still does half damage on a made save, not that it does a lot of damage or has good range, but magic missile isn't on your spell list.
Summon Monster I takes a full round to use, and much like unseen servant can be put in traps way. It also creates smiting flankers on command.

Shane LeRose |

Shane LeRose wrote:Cevah wrote:. Please re-read the spell. Yes, it says reflex negates, but they don't roll the reflex save until the beginning of their turn.Shane LeRose wrote:Mudball is a fun little spell. It'll be a 25ft range touch attack that blinds a target until their next turn (assume they'll make the DC 11 reflex save). If you ready an action to launch after the targets turn begins they'll have to deal with the blindness right away.Mudball does not make a good wand spell because it has Save: Reflex negates. Wand 1st level DC = 11. Not a difficult DC to save against. I suppose it is OK for a familiar to spam and get lucky, but I would not count on it. Also, each round at the start they get another save, and if they want to spend a standard, they can wipe the mud away.
/cevah
If the line said save: no, see text, you would be right.
Instead, it sais save: Reflex negates; see text, which means they get a save vs. the cast and saves at the beginning of the round.
I agree it should not have that initial save since you make an attack roll, but that is what RAW states.
/cevah
???? Reflex negates means that when you make the reflex save it'll negate the spell. It doesn't mean you get a save when it's cast. The description in the spell clearly states when the save takes place, and yes the spell is negated once the save is made. No where does it state what you're saying. I actually can't even guess why you'd think this.
So my original statement stands. Mudball only needs a ranged touch attack to work. Time it so you hit the target after their turn starts. You could even say the monkey was flinging more than mud. ;)

Cevah |

???? Reflex negates means that when you make the reflex save it'll negate the spell. It doesn't mean you get a save when it's cast. The description in the spell clearly states when the save takes place, and yes the spell is negated once the save is made. No where does it state what you're saying. I actually can't even guess why you'd think this.
So my original statement stands. Mudball only needs a ranged touch attack to work. Time it so you hit the target after their turn starts. You could even say the monkey was flinging more than mud. ;)
You sure? That is how most spells with a save work. Spell is cast. You roll for a save. If you make it, it is halved, or negated, as per the spell.
Hideous Laughter has an initial save, with additional saves each round.
Glitterdust has an initial save, with additional saves each round.
I see Mudball working the same way.
/cevah

Torchlyte |
???? Reflex negates means that when you make the reflex save it'll negate the spell. It doesn't mean you get a save when it's cast. The description in the spell clearly states when the save takes place, and yes the spell is negated once the save is made. No where does it state what you're saying. I actually can't even guess why you'd think this.
Saves in that part of the block are normally assumed to occur when the spell affects a target. Compare it to Hold Person, which has a a similar entry but implies in the description that there is an initial save.