So I'm playing a western style game where we're outlaws, and the DM wants us to really cut loose and make some broken characters. Normally I'm all over this, but I've never done anything with ranged characters before.
Just looking for whatever I can do to make a really broken 1 shot 1 skill sniper. What I was kinda looking at was 11 levels in gunslinger for deadshot, and the signature dead feat for deadshot. Then all other levels (we're level 12 at the start) in rogue. Using deadshot and sneak attack for a single massive long range attack. I'm really not sure if this is the best rout to go though...
A bit of rules for the game:
- 108,000g to start
- 25 pt buy for stats
- Core, Advanced, and all "Ultimate" books are open
A bit of restrictions for the character:
- Has to be goblin, taking the climb speed racial
- Int 14+, he's smart
- Has to be a gunslinger, he's a hired killer
Any help would be greatly appreciated.
At level 11-plus, you're not likely getting 1-shot kills on anything equiv-level without a crit unless you have a death attack. Even then, Fort saves tend to be high.
Your best bet if you really, really want to 1-shot stuff is to pick your battles. Get lots of Knowledge ranks and only go for generic low-CR enemies without class levels.
It's pretty easy to break PF, I could make a 12th level kukri fighter do 300+ damage a round. I know gunslinger can do some crazy stuff with deadshot, I just want to know how to optimize deadshot really.
I wouldn't really expect much from dead shot, it's a feat designed to save money rather than increase power.
Dead shot and sneak attack don't work well together, as you only get the sneak attack once, so I don't see it really working, unless I'm missing something .
EDIT: alrighty I see where I made the mistake, still sneak attack seems pretty much useless, but it lets you hit for middle of the line damage a high accuracy. That could be of some use I suppose.
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Uhm, ask the GM if Deadshot works with haste and Rapid Shot. And a Double Hackbut. You're looking at 16d12 plus 8 times static bonuses. Sneak Attack for d6 isn't quite worth the loss of +1 to BAB and all saves + the bonus feat you get for 12th lvl gunslinger.
Pick the goblin feat that lets you use Medium weaponry, sneak somewhere and snipe some people with a giant gun.
Dead shot is not a one shot one kill deed. You increase the chance for a crit and get a 2 more times basic weapon damage at level 11. It is like vital strike ++ but not as good as a full attack. But if you have a wizard friend with named bullet cast a bit before the shooting. Think it Will be fine.
But i dont Think the rogue part is a good plan.
Doesn't seem like you'd get 8 times your static bonus's , the ability clearly spells out that the damage increases by the base weapon damage only. Though I'm sure it's something that's been argued about.
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I think so too, just checked it. (haven't ever played a gunslinger, I'm afraid that I'll just optimize it too much for the groups' tastes) Even then, 16d12 is still an average of 104 damage and 4 chances of a x4 crit. While not gamebreaking, it's still usually more than half of a CR 14 creature, before adding in Deadly Aim (after the FAQ it works with gunslinger touch attacks), bonuses on guns, and the Named Bullet makes it even better.
In short, a one (technically two)-shot Gunslinger can definitely work. Throw in Oil of Silence for more sniper-y shenanigans.
Huh, so lemme show you guys what I'm looking at right now. I did decide to drop rogue.
Large size double hackbutt does 6d6 (1d12 M to L = 3d6)
+7 damage from 24 dex
+8 from deadly aim
+2 from musket training (guns everywhere setting makes this start at lvl 1)
+1 weapon enhancement
GM is very liberal with the interpretation of dead shot, so with a +12 BAB, Boots of Speed, A speed weapon, and rapid shot, I get 6 attacks. I think it's fair to say I'll hit 5 of these going after touch AC. That's 30d6+18, or 120d6+72 on a crit. Assuming ~3 per d6 we have 108 normal damage, and 432 crit.
Thoughts/Suggestions?
How do you use a large gun when you are small?
You Will be better served with a rifle to Get a good chance to hit them far away. And there the goblin gunslinger feat May allow you to use a medium sized rifle.
And speed weapon dosent stack with the boots or the spell.
Get rapid shot.
It specifically says under the firearm rules that larger sized weapons don't require anymore hands to wield, I could wield a huge sized one if I wanted.
I stopped at large only because of weight limits, making out of mithril limits the weight to 18 lbs, and my 8 str small size can only carry about 23.
With distance the range on the hackbutt is already 100ft, using the signature dead feat I can use dead eye as many times as I need to hit touch ac at any range increment.
I see now that speed and haste can't stack, so I'll replace it with greater lucky for 3 rerolls, way more chances to crit.
young template + fey creature template
adds +8 to dex, +8 to stealth, makes you tiny (bonus to AC and to hit) get access to short range teleport every 1d4 rounds, can go invisible like a ninja, helps to boost that int, get DR
it does scale your level 1 however
If you're going to spend a large amount of time at level 15+ I think a Knight Errant Luring Cavalier or Dune Drifter might fit the bill.
At level 15 Knight Errants can make one roll an automatic 20, once per day.
Luring Cavaliers can add twice their level as damage on a single attack roll in exchange for one challenge use.
Dune Drifters get a tonne of cool gun stuff, including access to Dead Shot.
Cool, never seen that errata before.
I'm not fond of the tiny/fey idea, and I already have an alchemist. I want this to be a gunslinger.
After a bit of looking I found dune drifter, really cool stuff their, but still not really what I'm looking for.
So, again with the math. same assumptions as above but with a med hackbutt, and only speed/haste (not both) and rapid shot.
+12/+7/+2 BAB 3 attacks
Rapidshot 1 attack
Speed/Haste 1 attack
We'll assume 4 hit
8d12
+7 from 24 dex
+8 deadly aim
+2 musket training (starts at lvl 1 from guns everywhere setting)
+1 weapon enhancement
12d12+18 for 90 average damage.
~40% crit chance (19-20 4 chances, let's keep this bit simple) 48d12+78 for 366 average damage.
Still very good damage, but I'm looking for even more, what else can I do here? Getting names bullet isn't going to happen.
The hackbutt is still a bad idea. It is a 3 meter long gun on weels. You will not have it set up to make the million dollar shot often enough. And after 50 feet you wont be shooting after touch AC.
Turn one you set up your giant gun.
Bad guy charge you or is out side first 50 få. Range.
You shoot and it dosent look that good with you targetting normal AC.
Bad guy dies or most likely charge you or if he charged you in last turn he will rip you apart in this one.
Also remember that if you get the jump on him and get a surprise round then you only get a standart action in the first turn. So no dead shot there.
With a rifle you can pehaps only assume to do 4d10+16( assuming normal gunslinger and not musket Master) but you wil be worth it also out side your niche.
I can see the appeal of the cannon sniper. But i think it will prove a bit underwelming unless you sleep with the GM.
Well I can shoot the hackbutt anytime. All it's going to do is -4 to hit and knock me prone. With distance I've got a 100ft range increment, and I can take signature dead for deadeye for no grit cost touch ac at any increment.
Free action to drop prone and I can shoot all day just with a -4, when you're hitting touch that's no big deal anyway. I'll have the gun set up more often than not. We've ran a little trial run of the game, and another player is basically my partner in crime. He's a big dumb Minotaur. Walks into whatever is going on while I go set up.
I'm also sure my GM will have no problem with my goblin tinkering on the gun to make it collapsible so it doesn't seem so silly huge carrying it around.
Then go for it:)