My question is when do all these occur? Also if a spell or ability states that it's at the beginning of a turn in what order to you do them in?
I have a character that just gained Fast Healing 5; with another ability I can add half my Constitution bonus to this. If I was taking Con damage at the start of my turn...do I get the Fast Healing with my normal Con first or take the Con damage THEN the Fast Healing with the reduced bonus?
I'm below 0 and 1 away from dying and not Stabilized. Do I roll for Stabilizing and if I miss it take the the -1 first and die....or do I get Fast Healing first and stabilize? If I was suffering from Bleed damage...do I take the Bleed damage first and die...or the Fast Healing first and negate the damage before it happens?
I am guessing that I am missing a ton of different types of damage that can happen....I know these are rare edge cases, but I am at the edge so I was just wondering if this is addressed anywhere as I cannot find it and the topics i found didn't give any good answers...
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Alost every one of the items you listed takes place AT THE START of a player's OWN TURN. Meaning: if you have 6 bleed and fasthealing 5, the bleed is stopped on your next turn, presumably at the same time that you take 6 damage from it, you heal 5, for 1 point total, and it is finished because you have healed. Likewise stabilization occurs on the start of your turn, if you fail the roll, THEN you take damage/keep dying.
Ability score damage happens immediately when a monster does damage, if it is a poison, it occurs, again, at the start of your turn. Think of the start of your turn as a "all together now" situation, with the exception that stabilization beats dying damage (per RAW).
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reyyvin; I agree on RAW regarding what Bleed says, but "not in my games" would be my answer... I mean, a spell that does 1 point of healing heals it, or you can apply a 1st aid (natural pressure), but fast healing 500 or regeneration 100000 won't stop it? Seems kind of silly to me. The regeneration spell would stop it, as would a fast healing spell... but the abilities don't? Makes little to no sense to me.
I mean, the spell is 7th level, the cost to add the ability to a creature is 6 RP... I don't see much difference in potency. Blessing of the Salamander is even lower level spell that grants Fast Healing, thus because it is a spell, would stop bleed. ?really? just because it is a spell it works? RAW sure, being "any spell" makes all the difference. RAI - No. Frellin. Way. If Regeneration can re-attach a severed limb, it CERTAINLY can stop bleeding...
i would say accumulate effects and then apply them after all various effects have been tabulated. so con damage would be applied AFTER fast healing since they happened at the same time.
basically:
figure out what stuff does based on original stats
VVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVV
put it together so all damage and healing is added to each other.
VVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVV
apply effects.
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Dying:
Stable Characters and Recovery
On the character's next turn, after being reduced to negative hit points (but not dead), and on all subsequent turns, the character must make a DC 10 Constitution check to become stable. The character takes a penalty on this roll equal to his negative hit point total. A character that is stable does not need to make this check. A natural 20 on this check is an automatic success. If the character fails this check, he loses 1 hit point. An unconscious or dying character cannot use any special action that changes the initiative count on which his action occurs.
So, first you make the check, then you lose 1 hit point.
Characters taking continuous damage, such as from an acid arrow or a bleed effect, automatically fail all Constitution checks made to stabilize. Such characters lose 1 hit point per round in addition to the continuous damage.
If you are suffering from bleed damage you can't try to stabilize.
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Bleed and Fast healing (he is speaking of the critical hit deck, but it is applicable to all form of bleeding damage)
Jason how about Fast Healing and Regeneration? Would those stop Bleed damage or would the creature still need Magical Healing or a Heal check?Bleed damage bypasses DR. Of course, in your game, you can rule it anyway you like. That was one of our design choices on this product. We give you the basics, but because the deck represents a fundamental shift in how crits work, we wanted to make sure it had the flexibility to work for your game.
Still.. if it was me, Bleed would bypass DR.
Jason Bulmahn
GameMastery Brand ManagerI would actually say that both Fast Healing and Regeneration stopped bleed damage entirely. Although, if the initial source of the damage was one that could not be regenerated (such as scoring a critical hit with an acid arrow against a troll), then I would let that bleed continue.
Once again though, this is one of those gray areas that we left for you to rule in a manner that works best for your game.
Jason Bulmahn
GameMastery Brand Manager
I am almost sure there is a errata somewhere, but I was unable to find it with a quick search.
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Sequence of the effects:
Generally if several effects happens and there isn't a defined sequence in which they should be resolved, you resolve them in the way more favourable for the affected character.
So if you are suffering from a bleed effect and have regeneration or fast healing, first you apply the effect of regeneration or fast healing, closing the wound and curing X hp of damage. At that point the bleed effect has stopped and you don't suffer from it.
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Step 1
Bleed: A creature that is taking bleed damage takes the listed amount of damage at the beginning of its turn. Bleeding can be stopped by a DC 15 Heal check or through the application of any spell that cures hit point damage (even if the bleed is ability damage). Some bleed effects cause ability damage or even ability drain. Bleed effects do not stack with each other unless they deal different kinds of damage. When two or more bleed effects deal the same kind of damage, take the worse effect. In this case, ability drain is worse than ability damage.
Bleed (Ex) A creature with this ability causes wounds that continue to bleed, inflicting additional damage each round at the start of the affected creature's turn. This bleeding can be stopped by a successful DC 15 Heal skill check or through the application of any magical healing. The amount of damage each round is determined in the creature's entry.
Notice the difference. The Bestiary update hasn't jet tricked down to the CRB.
Step 2:
By the above piece, any amount of fast healing or regeneration that derive from a spell, spell like ability or is supernatural stop the bleeding.
Step 3:
Extending that to a EX form of fast healing/regeneration seem logic but it is not necessarily RAW.
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Link to Jason Bullman post. Less useful as it is old and it is possible to argue that it was meant for a specific product.
Since there is no RAW order of operations I had my DM rule what order things that happen at the start of a turn happen. His favoured method comes from 4.0 which had many more status affects and did outline order of operations. All things that don't involve a check happen first.
* Take all static damage first; ability damage before HP; HP will always be last in this list.
* Take all static healing next; things like fast healing happen here.
* Rolling signifies the beginning of your turn...if you were dying and not stabilized you would roll here and if you failed take a -1 to HP.
So in my previous turn if I was dying with Bleed damage and taking Con damage....
I would take the Con damage, then the Bleed Damage, then my Fast Healing would kick in and Stabilize me and I wouldn't have to roll.
I agree with him and it seems like a good way to do it....