Has anybody ever tried to model that kind of 'gimmick archer' with PF? My first thought was an Arcane Archer, but looking more closely, an Alchemist might be a better choice. Grenadier archetype, maybe get rid of the mutagens somehow.
Can an alchemist craft magic arrows without multiclassing or major rules-hoop-jumping?
Is third party allowed? New Paths had alchemical arrows and Super Genius Games had an alchemist product that had ways to get rid of mutagen easily.
Alternatively house-ruling alchemical arrows with a fighter that invests craft alchemy would be good.
I've thought a lot about both.
Sure if you have two feats and 5 skill points. Craft (Bows) 5 ranks to Master Craftsman to Craft Magic Arms and Armor should let you make your own magic bow as well as magic arrows. You can't do it below level 7 as an Alchemist and it isn't optimal, but for this concept it might be the best way.
yes, my next character is (baring it not fitting the game type) going to be such a character. And the answer lies in the alchemical archer archetype from the genius guide to Archer Archetypes
It can be added to any class in exchange for a specific suite of abilities from each class. It gives you the ability to create extraordinary ammunition (any type including arrows).
1. Bola - trip or disarm
2. Grapple - think batmans grapling gun. Can also be used to grapple targets
3. Caltrop - i think you understand what this does
4. Injector - put poison or a potion in a flying needle
5. Alchemical ammunition - this one is the most important. The DC's for the saves here scale with your level and ability scores (either dex or int depending on if you have a certain feat), and it lists a handful of alchemical weapons and items that can be added to a piece of ammunition, though it only has what was around when it was released (the core book) but leaves room for more to be added at dms discretion. If your dm is ok adding more from the alchemical section of Ultimate Equipmant, you have your green arrow/batman type character.
It also gives you the ability to craft this ammunition faster then normal, which will be a needed if you are going to keep up a steady supply.
Sure if you have two feats and 5 skill points. Craft (Bows) 5 ranks to Master Craftsman to Craft Magic Arms and Armor should let you make your own magic bow as well as magic arrows. You can't do it below level 7 as an Alchemist and it isn't optimal, but for this concept it might be the best way.
Sounds good. As you say, not optimal, but it seems to work.
I was tinkering with the idea just now on paper ... ironically, another thing I'd want to trade out is the extracts themselves, which don't really fit the concept.
I pretty much just want the bombs and bomb-altering discoveries.
I give you Hawkelf
Elf Alchemist (Silent Runner alternate racial trait)
Str 11 (1 point)
Dex 20 (17 points +2 race)
Con 12 (5 points -2 race)
Int 18 (10 points +2 race)
Wis 7 (-4 points)
Cha 7 (-4 points)
Max Ranks: Craft(Alchemy), Craft(Bows), Knowledge(Arcana), Perception, Spellcraft, Stealth, Survival, Use Magic Device
1 Improved Initiative
2 Frost Bomb
3 Extra Discovery: Smoke Bomb
4 Explosive Missile
5 Master Craftsman
6 Stink Bomb
7 Craft Magic Arms and Armor
8 Force Bomb
9 Extra Discovery: Alchemical Simulacrum
10 Doppelganger Simulacrum
11 Extra Discovery: Dispelling Bomb
12 Poison Bomb
13 Extra Discovery: Sticky Bomb
14 Greater Alchemical Simulacrum
15 Extra Discovery: Blinding Bomb
16 Inferno Bomb
17 Extra Discovery: Acid Bomb
18 Sunlight Bomb
19 Extra Discovery: Tanglefoot Bomb
20 Explosive Bomb, Madness Bomb, Fast Healing
For Hawkelf you just use a dex mutagen and be happy you kept all that poison stuff as the build relies on sniping with Explosive Missile. I think I just made an effective archer without a single archery feat!
I haven't done it in PF, but...
I did have a GM allow me to use Craft Bows, Craft Alchemy, and Knowledge Engineering to make arrows that make use of alchemical items, as well as replicate 3rd level spells or less (with approval).
My caster level was my ranks in either Alchemy or Engineering (depending on the spell being replicated and what the GM felt most appropriate).
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For Hawkelf you just use a dex mutagen and be happy you kept all that poison stuff as the build relies on sniping with Explosive Missile. I think I just made an effective archer without a single archery feat!
How does he hit anything? without Precise Shot and Improved Precise Shot he's most likely at a -8 on ranged attack rolls.
True Strike, Invisibility, Fly are all on his extract list. He can throw the bombs too, he hasn't lost this ability and would do just that if cornered by a foe with high AC. This is a sniper who always has the right effect not a DPR archer.
Impressive GC
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True Strike, Invisibility, Fly are all on his extract list. He can throw the bombs too, he hasn't lost this ability and would do just that if cornered by a foe with high AC. This is a sniper who always has the right effect not a DPR archer.
Check out the Grenadier archetype for more alchemical goodies.
Here's what I've got so far, built with the Grenadier archetype and the Weapon Champion archetype (archetype stuff marked with an asterisk, stuff not listed in order acquired):
(DM insists on rolled stats, please don't talk about the buy, there wasn't one.)
Android Alchemist L4
S12, D18, C14, I20, W13, Ch6
Traits: Pragmatic Activator, Bruising Intellect
Feats: PB Shot, Precise Shot
Features:
Alchemy
Throw Anything
Bomb 2d6
Swift Alchemy
Discovery: Explosive Missile
*Grenadier Archetype
MWP: Rapier (subject to change)
Alchemical Weapons
Precise Bombs
*Weapon Champion archetype:
Favored Weapon (Bows)
+1 to confirm threats w/Bows
+1 to attack and damage w/Bows
Considering asking the GM if I can lose the extracts for bonus archery feats or something. I had also briefly flirted with taking Firearms for the favored weapon, as targeting Touch AC lessens the need for Precise Shot.
I imagine you could do something fun with a build like this:
Human 'Zen Archer' Monk 3/'Trapper' Ranger 1/'Grenadier' & 'Vivisectionist' Alchemist 3
[25 points] Str 14, Dex 14, Con 13, Int 12, Wis 18, Cha 10
Dodge [1st], Mobility [Human], Improved Unarmed Strike [Monk1], Point Blank Shot [Monk1], Precise Shot [Monk2], Weapon Focus (Composite Longbow) [Monk2], Point Blank Master [Monk3], Snake Style [3rd], Throw Anything [Alchemist1], Spring Attack [5th], Precise Bomb [Alchemist2] & Shot on the Run [7th]
BaB +5; Fort +9, Ref +10, Will +8
For more crafting you could sub out Spring Attack & Shot on the Run for Master Craftsman & Craft Magic Arms & Armor.
Eh?