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Situation: You schedule a scenario and no one brings anyone who has any healing ability.
Five players, running a 1st level scenario with brand new characters.
I know there are rules for a GM to run a pre-generated character but I seem to recall that was only for if the party size was three since four is minimal legal. This is correct, right? I know in a home game this is what I have done in the past, a healer henchman, usually used as comic relief.
Assuming this is not legal, do I bully someone into playing a cleric or other healer? Seems like bad mojo to me
Or just run the scenario “as is” and proceed to kill them all? This does not seem like a fun option to me.
Just wondering if anyone else has encountered this in Pathfinder Society and how they went about fixing.
Seems from what I read the standard way of dealing with this is for everyone to acquire a wand of cure light wounds on the good chance someone in the party can use such an item, but this is not possible given 1st level with brand new characters.
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Also note that, even if there is no healie type at the table, that does not necessarily mean that they are devoid of healing.
Even if they are all new 1st level PCs, there are still potions of CLW, scrolls of CLW (amazing how many classes can use that scroll, even at 1st level), potions of IH, scrolls of IH (same here), and other things that might mitigate the issue.
A lot of PFS scenarios tend to have the mooks with a potion of CLW apiece, even at low tier, so check the enemies' gear for things that can help out the party.
And, if the enemies have one, a dropped wand of CLW can be used by even more PCs than can use the scroll...
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I think the OP was asking what to do when no one in the party can even use a wand (if one becomes available), when no one has maxed out their Heal skill, when no one even has a rank in use magic device.
If the party doesn't get lucky with dropped CLW potions, their only option may be to rest between encounters and not all adventures allow for this. Sometimes they'll have to quit early or die trying.
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Be responsible for your own healing, even when you can't afford a wand of CLW. I don't often play starting PCs, but the last time I did, I made sure my barbarian spent a third of his starting gold on a potion of CLW, and don't regret doing so.
A group of brand new players might warrant some pre-game advice or some tailoring of enemy tactics (as advised in the Guide) but other than that, you should run the scenario as written; don't add in extra 'GM PCs' or healing loot to be found in the adventure.
Experienced players should know better than to head in without any healing whatsoever...
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RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32
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Having someone play Kyra adds what, 2-3 CLWs, max? You'd get the same effect by having the party as a whole pitch in to buy that many potions or scrolls, except everyone gets to play their own PCs.
Just let them play their PCs, encourage some proactive shopping and good tactics, and everything should be fine.
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Yeah I once ran Tomb of Horrors (Advanced Dnd 1st edition) where no one brought a thief - can we say that was a short game?
If these guys where veteran players I would not care cause they would know what they are getting into.
But these people have never played in Pathfinder Society heck most have never played Pathfinder or 3rd edition Dnd at all. Seems asking them to either play a character they do not want or to just kill them all is not a good way to encourage more people to play pathfinder.
I will check starting gold and see who has the ability to use a scroll of cure light wounds and/or potions of cure light wounds. That might be a valid option.
The scenario is "3-21 The Temple Of Empyreal Enlightenment" - I do not see any potions or wands available for healing.
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Yeah I once ran Tomb of Horrors (Advanced Dnd 1st edition) where no one brought a thief - can we say that was a short game?Bringing a thief would be no help to you in Tomb. So many of the traps in there are of the "no save, no chance to detect, auto screwed variety" and in any event 1e thief find/remove trap skill chances are pathetically low.
I believe the most successful recorded approach to the Tomb was the fighter Robilar who excavated the place with orcish slaves and earth elementals. Far safer than actually dealing with the mad nonsense inside.
Been years since I ran that module, so I don't recall the traps - just remember it being as you say "auto screwed variety".
Did not find that module fun at all to run - I have always wondered how it made it so high in rankings.
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RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32
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Seems asking them to either play a character they do not want or to just kill them all is not a good way to encourage more people to play pathfinder.
If you think that "no healer at table = auto TPK", you're wrong.
That said...
The scenario is "3-21 The Temple Of Empyreal Enlightenment"
This one has a reputation. You shouldn't run it for a batch of firsties regardless of whether there's a healer at the table. Kyra won't save them.
I suggest switching to The Confirmation, then maybe coming back to ToEE later.
RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8
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The players are responsible for what they bring to the table, both as individual PCs and as a team.Got a missile weapon? got something to deal with DR? got healing handled? got traps delt with? That's all part of being an adventurer...
And if the players are responsible for what they bring to the table, why is "Hey you've brand new characters missing X, might I suggest one of you play X?" a bad thing. That's what I'm inferring from the thread. Relying on the GM to provide X is different.
Assuming this is not legal, do I bully someone into playing a cleric or other healer? Seems like bad mojo to me
Or just run the scenario “as is” and proceed to kill them all? This does not seem like a fun option to me.
Suggesting one of them 'take one for the team' and get a Kyra out of the closet.* isn't bullying. If no one offers to pick up the slack, then let the chips fall where they may. The OP was asking for tips on how to make the table legally fun, and not a TPK.
To use Library of the Lion...
*Party shows up and they're all playing Int/Cha dump stat Paladins/Fighters/Clerics.*
"Um, do any of you have skill characters? Or since they're all brand new PCS, anyone want to take a Lem for a spin?"
*Players grunt in disapproval*
"Ok, let us play!"
*
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Option 1: Play The confirmation. It comes with a built in solution to this problem.
Option 2: Encourage someone to snag kyra or play a cleric for one adventure. It doesn't matter what tactics you use, people are going to get hit. The heals and the channels should be enough to get you through the adventure.
After the adventure make sure everyone gets a clw or infernal healing wand.
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Option 1: Play The confirmation. It comes with a built in solution to this problem.
Option 2: Encourage someone to snag kyra or play a cleric for one adventure. It doesn't matter what tactics you use, people are going to get hit. The heals and the channels should be enough to get you through the adventure.
After the adventure make sure everyone gets a clw or infernal healing wand.
Just to be absolutely clear you are talking about the "Pathfinder Society Scenario #5–08: The Confirmation" correct?
If that would be a better start then that sounds like probably the best solution. I would hate to start them off with a total party wipe.
I would much rather have them get invested in their characters before killing them off, just kidding :)
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Option 1: Play The confirmation. It comes with a built in solution to this problem.
Option 2: Encourage someone to snag kyra or play a cleric for one adventure. It doesn't matter what tactics you use, people are going to get hit. The heals and the channels should be enough to get you through the adventure.
After the adventure make sure everyone gets a clw or infernal healing wand.
Just to be absolutely clear you are talking about the "Pathfinder Society Scenario #5–08: The Confirmation" correct?
If that would be a better start then that sounds like probably the best solution. I would hate to start them off with a total party wipe.
I would much rather have them get invested in their characters before killing them off, just kidding :)
They are. It was made as an introductory sort of scenario for new characters. It has the benefit of being able to be replayed/reran for credit (one of the very few options for this).
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If you've warned them of the dangers of not having anyone who has any capability of healing at all (even with potions) then it's really their choice to play hard mode.
If it's any consolation, the first game at level 1 isn't really the worst place to die. Let them play what they like.
I wouldn't necessarily consider playing without a healer hard mode. More often than not, I find the presence of a dedicated healer becomes a crutch that draws out fights. They spend their actions healing instead of controlling or grinding down the bad guys.
It is a little different at level 1 where a lucky hit can drop a PC in one shot, but even then you're usually better off working to end the fight rather than yo-yoing up party members up and down.
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Just to be absolutely clear you are talking about the "Pathfinder Society Scenario #5–08: The Confirmation" correct?
Yes. The NPC "team mom" patches people up on the way to the dungeon and hands out a few goodies once the team gets sent on its own.
SOMEONE should have use magic device on their class list. If not, one of them should be dangerously curious.
Most of the danger is in the last fight so there's nothing to recover from.
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The scenario is "3-21 The Temple Of Empyreal Enlightenment"This one has a reputation. You shouldn't run it for a batch of firsties regardless of whether there's a healer at the table. Kyra won't save them.
Yeah, that should not be someone's first ever PFS game...unless we want to start yet another "I hate haunts" thread.
It's also tricksy and requires knowledge skills and makes you evil and....
Our current "Level 1 marathon" set is First Steps part 1 ("Let's run errands in Absalom!"), Master of the Fallen Fortress ("Dungeon crawl time"), and the Confirmation ("Yay! You survived your first two assignments--now write your thesis").
These are all repeatable, and they make a nice intro to the world, the game system, and society play.
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The scenario is "3-21 The Temple Of Empyreal Enlightenment"This one has a reputation. You shouldn't run it for a batch of firsties regardless of whether there's a healer at the table. Kyra won't save them.Yeah, that should not be someone's first ever PFS game...unless we want to start yet another "I hate haunts" thread.
It's also tricksy and requires knowledge skills and makes you evil and....
Our current "Level 1 marathon" set is First Steps part 1 ("Let's run errands in Absalom!"), Master of the Fallen Fortress ("Dungeon crawl time"), and the Confirmation ("Yay! You survived your first two assignments--now write your thesis").
These are all repeatable, and they make a nice intro to the world, the game system, and society play.
Ok you talked my into changing plans, I think I will just take your starting scenarios and run with it. After running series everyone should be 2nd level I think and much better equipped to deal with 3-21.
Thanks everyone for the comments, much appreciated.