#Secret Symbol
How about this as a rewrite?
Improved Symbol (Ex): At 6th level, the secret sect knight can reveal her secret symbol to frighten her enemies. If the secret sect knight reveals and boldly presents her symbol in battle, her foes must succeed on a Will saving throw (DC 10 + 1/2 the secret sect knight level + her Charisma bonus) or become shaken for 1 minute. In addition, while the symbol is revealed, she gains a +2 morale bonus on Diplomacy checks with members or allies of her sect, and a +2 morale bonus on Intimidate checks against all other creatures. This bonus increases to +3 at 11th level, and +4 at 16th level. The secret sect knight can use her secret symbol as a holy focus when casting her spells. Revealing or hiding a secret symbol is a swift action. This ability replaces the teamwork feat gained at 6th level.
I would also add language to the effect of "Whether or not the save is successful, a creature cannot be subjected to this ability again for 1 day." to stop it being a "use every swift action if possible" kind of ability. And change it to a standard action from a swift. Also the allows judgement and symbol on 1st turn due to not using up swift actions
I'm OK with your changes, El. Someone else?
I would also add language to the effect of "Whether or not the save is successful, a creature cannot be subjected to this ability again for 1 day." to stop it being a "use every swift action if possible" kind of ability. And change it to a standard action from a swift. Also the allows judgement and symbol on 1st turn due to not using up swift actions#Secret Symbol
How about this as a rewrite?
Improved Symbol (Ex): At 6th level, the secret sect knight can reveal her secret symbol to frighten her enemies. If the secret sect knight reveals and boldly presents her symbol in battle, her foes must succeed on a Will saving throw (DC 10 + 1/2 the secret sect knight level + her Charisma bonus) or become shaken for 1 minute. In addition, while the symbol is revealed, she gains a +2 morale bonus on Diplomacy checks with members or allies of her sect, and a +2 morale bonus on Intimidate checks against all other creatures. This bonus increases to +3 at 11th level, and +4 at 16th level. The secret sect knight can use her secret symbol as a holy focus when casting her spells. Revealing or hiding a secret symbol is a swift action. This ability replaces the teamwork feat gained at 6th level.
Done! made revealing a standard action and hiding the symbol a swift.
Calling Frontier Huntsman done, so on to Christos Gurd and his gunslinger MCA (whatever it is :D).
Lindley Court (Scorpion Knight/Siege Lord – Sum/Gun) will be up once we finalize Secret Sect Knight.
#Secret Sect Knight
Thoughts? a=Is it good? Bardess seems happy, anything else on this one or is it good?
ok guys, brace yourselves this one is a bit of a weird one. see i decided to make it really hard on myself and do a Gunlinger/wizard that felt distinct from spellslinger(even though i totally stole and modified arcane gun) and then i thought "hey you know what would make this REALLY hard to do, make it a 6th level caster so it can be a semi reasonable blaster." so...yeah, here is the Gunsage Prototype.
GunSage
Found in the west there exists a certain kind of gunman, one who incorporates some limited arcane studies into his deadly art. These gunslingers, called GunSages, lack many of the true spellcasting powers of a wizard. They make this up however with studies of the tertiary abilities associated with arcane practices. Masters of damage dealing spells, they push the limits of their spellcasting.
Secondary: Wizard
Skills: 2+int
Base attack bonus: as magus
A Gunsage adds 3 skills from the wizard skill list to add to his class skills.
Class abilities
The spellslinger gains the ability to turn a single firearm into an Arcane Gun. An arcane gun is a normal one-handed or two-handed firearm in the hands of others, as it was a normal firearm before the gunsage imbued it with magic. In a gunsage’s hands, it can fire projectiles (bullets and pellets) and cast magic.The Gunsage may only have one arcane gun. Spells fired through the arcane gun that require an attack roll have a ×3 critical hit multiplier.
A Gunsage can cast any ranged touch attack, cone, line, or ray spells through her arcane gun. When she casts through the arcane gun, the gun’s enhancement bonus (if any) is a bonus to the spell’s attack rolls or to the spell’s saving throw DCs. Yet there are dangers inherent to this method. If any of the spells’ attack rolls result in a natural 1 (a misfire), or a natural 20 is rolled on any saving throw made against the spell by a target (an overload), the arcane gun gains the broken condition. If the arcane gun already has the broken condition, the gun explodes. When a gun explodes, it lets loose a blast of force, or if the spell has the acid, cold, electricity, or sonic descriptor, it deals that type of energy damage instead. In the case of spells with multiple descriptors, roll randomly among the descriptors to determine the type of damage dealt by the blast. The blast is centered on a single intersection within the gunsage’s space (gunsage’s choice) and deals 1d6 points of the appropriate energy damage or force damage per level of the spell cast. Any creature within the blast other than the spellslinger can make a Reflex saving throw to halve the damage. The Reflex save DC is calculated using the spell level of the spell being sacrificed.
A Gunsage can attune her arcane gun at the start of each day. That attunement lasts until the spellslinger attunes to a new gun, even if a formally attuned gun is destroyed.
This replaces the base attack bonus lost.
Deeds: a gunsage only knows a single deed at 1st level. At 3rd and every other level after that she gains another deed. A gunsage counts ½ her levels as gunslinger levels to determine what deeds are available for him to select. This modifies deeds.
Arcane Grit: A gunsage uses her Intelligence in place of her Wisdom to determine her total grit. A gunsage can only regain grit from a killing blow if that killing blow was done with her arcane gun. This modifies grit.
Student of Evocation: A gunsage gains access to the Evocation arcane school, as the wizard class feature, using her Gunsage level as her caster level. When preparing any spell that isn’t of the evocation school, the gunsagemust use two spell slots of that level to prepare the spell. This replaces nimble.
Spells: A gunsage casts spells as a magus of her level, but uses the sorcerer/wizard spell list. A gunsage treats all sorcerer/wizard spells of 7th level and higher as if they were not on her spell list. A gunsage may cast gunsage spells in light armor without incurring arcane spell failure.
Arcane Gun Training: The Gunsage applies the benefits of gun training to spells fired through her arcane gun. This modifies Gun training.
#Gun Sage
Are you thinking good Fort/Will saves or Good Ref/Will saves for this one Christos?
ref/will
#gun sage
casting touch range spells through dummy bullets would be interesting.
#Gun Sage
I don't think we have to reduce the level of deed accessibility to 1/2 gun sage level. that's a major nerf. We need to keep gunslinger and wizard level equal to gunsage level. I know we've done half level on other class features in other MCAs (like channel Positive Energy for the Divine Emissary Pal/Clr), but that's a secondary or even tertiary ability. Deeds are a core ability that we should try to keep at equal to level.
So a few options on deeds.
1) We could simply swap reduced BAB (full to 3/4) and deeds lost for spells. then just go with two deeds per level of deeds, chosen by gun sage.
if that doesn't seem a fair swap (which I think may not quite be), then...
2) Go with only 1 deed of each level of deeds, chosen by the gun sage. Then allow spell slots to be sacrificed to gain access to additional deeds. eg. A 4th level gun sage has chosen his 1st and 3rd level deed, he then sacrifices a 1st level spell slot and a 2nd level spell slot for the day, allowing him to access an additional 1st level and 3rd level deed of his choice for the day. He can choose to do so whenever he rests to regain spells. At 19th level, he could have his single deed of each level chosen, then choose to sacrifice two spell slots each of 1st to 6th level spells to gain access to all his deeds. this would reduce his spells per day (when he chooses to do so on a given day) to 5/3/3/3/3/3/3. Allows for versatility, but still allows both spells and deeds, just a choice of how his resources are used.
**Along with the above, maybe we can have his choose his single ded for the day whenever he rests for the day, like memorizing your spells, he needs to focus on his deeds and can access 1 of his choice each day, then choose to sacrifice spell slots for more if he so chooses?
ooh number 2 grants it a pleasent degree of modularity, i think bandw2's idea could be a new deed for them as well.
Also makes it much different from the other gun/Wiz, Gun/Sor, Gun/Mag MCAs out there.
well then, sold american
we REALLY need to update the cross reference chart. i didn't see the spellbond slinger originally because i was only referencing the chart.
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Anyone else seen a show/read a manga called BERSERK? Because I'm itching out a concept for a Cavalier/Barbarian a' sorts, based around the protagonist of said franchise. And a Cavalier/Fighter based around the franchise's prime antagonist.
we REALLY need to update the cross reference chart. i didn't see the spellbond slinger originally because i was only referencing the chart.
Updated!
#gun sage
casting touch range spells through dummy bullets would be interesting.
Arcane gun allows you to cast spells that require an attack roll. Ranged touch spells fit this category, so they are already covered under the arcane gun mechanics.
#Secret Sect Knight
Calling this one done also, so Lindley, you're up with your Scorpion Knight/Siege Lord MCA.
#Gun Sage
Here's a tweaked and tidied up version of the Gun Sage.
In the far reaches of the west are found certain gunmen who incorporate a limited form of arcane magic into their deadly art. These gun sages lack much of the true magical powers of a wizard, but make up for this deficiency through their tertiary study of arcane practices. Masters of damage dealing spells, gun sages push the limits of their spellcasting nearly to the breaking point, allowing them greater versatility in their martial and arcane endeavors.
Primary Class: Gunslinger.
Secondary Class: Wizard.
Alignment: Any.
Hit Dice: d8.
Bonus Skills and Ranks: The gun sage selects three wizard skills to add to his class skills in addition to the normal gunslinger class skills, one of which must be spellcraft. The gun sage gains a number of ranks at each level equal to 4 + Int modifier.
Weapon and Armor Proficiency: The gun sage is proficient with all simple and martial weapons, all firearms, and light armor, but not with shields. She can cast sorcerer/wizard spells while wearing light armor without incurring the normal arcane spell failure chance. Like any other arcane spellcaster, a gun sage wearing medium armor or heavy armor, or using a shield incurs a chance of arcane spell failure if the spell in question has a somatic component. A multiclass gun sage still incurs the normal arcane spell failure chance for arcane spells received from other classes.
Spellcasting: A gun sage casts arcane spells drawn from the sorcerer/wizard spell list. A gun sage treats all sorcerer/wizard spells of 7th level and higher as if they were not on her spell list. A gun sage must choose and prepare her spells ahead of time. To learn, prepare, or cast a spell, the gun sage must have an Intelligence score equal to at least 10 + the spell level. The Difficulty Class for a saving throw against a gun sage’s spell is 10 + the spell level + the gun sage’s Intelligence modifier. A gun sage can cast only a certain number of spells of each spell level per day. Her base daily spell allotment is given on Table: Gun Sage. In addition, she receives bonus spells per day if he has a high Intelligence score. A gun sage also gains cantrips and uses a spellbook like a wizard. A gun sage otherwise learns, prepares, and casts spells as a wizard equal to her gun sage level.
Arcane Grit (Ex): This is exactly like the gunslinger’s grit ability, except that the gun sage uses her Intelligence instead of her Wisdom to determine her total grit. In addition, a gun sage can only regain grit by making a killing blow with either her arcane gun or an evocation spell.
Arcane Gun (Su): At 1st level, a gun sage gains the ability to turn a single firearm into an arcane gun. An arcane gun is a normal one-handed or two-handed firearms in the hands of others, as it was a normal firearm before the gun sage imbued it with magic. In a gun sage’s hands, it both fires projectiles (bullets and pellets) and casts magic. At 1st level, the gun sage decides whether she wants to have one or two arcane guns at a time. If the gun sage chooses to have only one arcane gun at a time, spells fired through the arcane gun that require an attack roll have a ×3 critical hit multiplier.
A gun sage can cast any ranged touch attack, cone, line, or ray spells through her arcane gun. When she casts through the arcane gun, the gun’s enhancement bonus (if any) is a bonus to the spell’s attack rolls or to the spell’s saving throw DCs. Yet there are dangers inherent to this method. If any of the spells’ attack rolls result in a natural 1 (a misfire), or a natural 20 is rolled on any saving throw made against the spell by a target (an overload), the arcane gun gains the broken condition. If the arcane gun already has the broken condition, the gun explodes. When a gun explodes, it lets loose a blast of force, or if the spell has the acid, cold, electricity, or sonic descriptor, it deals that type of energy damage instead. In the case of spells with multiple descriptors, roll randomly among the descriptors to determine the type of damage dealt by the blast. The blast is centered on a single intersection within the gun sage’s space (gun sage’s choice) and deals 1d6 points of the appropriate energy damage or force damage per level of the spell cast. Any creature within the blast other than the gun sage can make a Reflex saving throw to halve the damage. The Reflex save DC is calculated using the spell level of the spell being sacrificed.
A gun sage can attune her arcane guns at the start of each day. That attunement lasts until the gun sage attunes to a new gun, even if a formally attuned gun is destroyed.
Deeds: This is exactly like the gunslinger ability of the same name, except that the gun sage gains only one deed of each level of her choice. Each day, the gun sage can change what deeds she has access to. The gun sage can also gain additional deeds by sacrificing spell slots. She can sacrifice a 1st level spell slot to gain access to one additional 1st level deed for the day. At 3rd level and every four levels thereafter, she can sacrifice one spell slot of each subsequent level to gain access to one additional deed of each subsequent level (a 2nd level spell slot for a 3rd level deed, a 3rd level spell slot for a 7th level deed, and so on). For example, a 7th level gun sage could sacrifice two 1st level spells and one 2nd level spell to gain access to two additional 1st level deeds, and one additional 3rd level deed. The gun sage can sacrifice up to two spell slots of each spell level for a total of three deeds of each level, including the deeds he gains normally. The gun sage selects her deeds every day when she rests to regain her daily allotment of spells, including those she gains by sacrificing her spell slots.
Student of Evocation: At 2nd level, a gun sage gains the wizard’s arcane school ability, but must specialize in the evocation school and gains all abilities related to that school as a wizard equal to her gun sage level. In addition, due to the rigors of her gun training, a gun sage must choose four opposition schools instead of two. This ability replaces nimble.
Bonus Feats: This is exactly like the gunslinger ability of the same name, except that the gun sage can also choose a metamagic feat, an item creation, or Spell Mastery. The gun sage must still meet all prerequisites for a bonus feat, including caster level minimums.
Arcane Gun Training (Ex): This is exactly like the gunslinger’s gun training ability, except that the gun sage also applies her gun training bonus to spells cast through her arcane gun.
Table: Gun Sage
Base
Class Attack Fort Ref Will Spells per Day
Level Bonus Save Save Save Special 0 1st 2nd 3rd 4th 5th 6th
1st +0 +0 +2 +2 Arcane grit, arcane gun, deeds, gunsmith 3 1 — — — — —
2nd +1 +0 +3 +3 Student of evocation 4 2 — — — — —
3rd +2 +1 +3 +3 Deeds 4 3 — — — — —
4th +3 +1 +4 +4 Bonus feat 4 3 1 — — — —
5th +3 +1 +4 +4 Arcane gun training 1 4 4 2 — — — —
6th +4 +2 +5 +5 5 4 3 — — — —
7th +5 +2 +5 +5 Deeds 5 4 3 1 — — —
8th +6/+1 +2 +6 +6 Bonus feat 5 4 4 2 — — —
9th +6/+1 +3 +6 +6 Arcane gun training 2 5 5 4 3 — — —
10th +7/+2 +3 +7 +7 5 5 4 3 1 — —
11th +8/+3 +3 +7 +7 Deeds 5 5 4 4 2 — —
12th +9/+4 +4 +8 +8 Bonus feat 5 5 5 4 3 — —
13th +9/+4 +4 +8 +8 Arcane gun training 3 5 5 5 4 3 1 —
14th +10/+5 +4 +9 +9 5 5 5 4 4 2 —
15th +11/+6/+1 +5 +9 +9 Deeds 5 5 5 5 4 3 —
16th +12/+7/+2 +5 +10 +10 Bonus feat 5 5 5 5 4 3 1
17th +12/+7/+2 +5 +10 +10 Arcane gun training 4 5 5 5 5 4 4 2
18th +13/+8/+3 +6 +11 +11 5 5 5 5 5 4 3
19th +14/+9/+4 +6 +11 +11 Deeds 5 5 5 5 5 5 4
20th +15/+10/+5 +6 +12 +12 Bonus feat, true grit 5 5 5 5 5 5 5
we REALLY need to update the cross reference chart. i didn't see the spellbond slinger originally because i was only referencing the chart.Updated!
well damn, i just realized i had been reading it left to right. Well now i know i need to do gunslinger/alchemist next at least.
Yeah, primary's are along the top, secondary along the side, so the first column is all alchemist primary combos, then bards, barbarians, etc.
I usually just use the Primary Class list, as it lists them by primary and tells you what the secondary is.
Yep my bad, oh well whats done is done.
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Alright, I actually managed to finish my draft a few weeks ago, and I'm so glad to be able to toss it in so we can refine it!
Primary: Summoner
Secondary: Gunslinger
Skills: The scorpion knight selects any three gunslinger skills to add to his class skill list, one of which must be Knowledge (Engineering).
Weapon and Armor Proficiencies: Scorpion knights gain proficiency with medium armor and with one martial weapon of their choice. They do not suffer arcane spell failure with medium armor. This replaces the spells lost from diminished spellcasting.
Diminished Spellcasting: Scorpion knights can cast one fewer spell per day of each spell level, to a minimum of 0. If this would reduce him to 0 spells each day, he only gains the bonus spells from a high Charisma modifier.
Arbalest Eidolon: The scorpion knight’s eidolon has a light ballista integrated into its form, granting it exceptional ranged prowess. This functions as and modifies the summoner’s eidolon, except as noted in the full write-up of the arbalest eidolon.
Abundant Ammunition: The scorpion knight is able to cast abundant ammunition as a spell-like ability a number of times per day equal to 3 + her Charisma modifier. This can only be used to summon ballista bolts that fit her eidolon, and new bolts are not summoned until the old bolts have been fired. This replaces summon monster I, and effectively delays her summon monster progression by two class levels.
The arbalest eidolon can select from the following evolutions in addition to the normal evolutions for an eidolon, except for those that grant natural attacks:
One-Point Evolutions:
Punch: An arbalest eidolon with this evolution that confirms a critical threat with its ballista attack automatically pushes the target back five feet. By spending an additional 3 evolution points, this increases to pushing the target ten feet.
Two-Point Evolutions:
Caustic Bolt: An arbalest eidolon with this evolution can deal acid damage with five bolts each day. This evolution can be taken an additional time for every 5 levels the summoner has, granting an additional five caustic bolts each day.
[i]Flame Bolt: An arbalest eidolon with this evolution can deal fire damage with five bolts each day. This evolution can be taken an additional time for every 5 levels the summoner has, granting an additional five flame bolts each day.
Ice Bolt: An arbalest eidolon with this evolution can deal cold damage with five bolts each day. This evolution can be taken an additional time for every 5 levels the summoner has, granting an additional five ice bolts each day.
Spark Bolt: An arbalest eidolon with this evolution can deal electricity damage with five bolts each day. This evolution can be taken an additional time for every 5 levels the summoner has, granting an additional five spark bolts each day.
4-Point Evolutions:
Large Launcher: An arbalest eidolon with this evolution becomes large-sized, which causes it to gain a +4 bonus to Strength and Dexterity, and gain a +2 bonus to natural armor and Constitution. Its ballista attacks function as if they came from a heavy ballista. The scorpion knight must be at least 8th level before selecting this evolution.
By spending an additional 6 evolution points, the arbalest eidolon becomes huge-sized, giving it a +6 bonus to Strength and Dexterity, and a +4 bonus to natural armor and Constitution. Its ballista attacks function as if they came from a gate breaker ballista. The scorpion knight must be at least 13th level before selecting this evolution.
Table: Bolts/Day:
Summoner Level Bolts
1st 6
2nd 8
3rd 10
4th 12
5th 14
6th 17
7th 20
8th 23
9th 26
10th 29
11th 32
12th 35
13th 39
14th 43
15th 47
16th 51
17th 55
18th 60
19th 65
20th 70
#gun sage
what I meant is that, he could cast friendly touch spells at ranged, probably with a DC of 10 on the attack roll. as CG said, a deed would be cool for this.
"I WILL HEAL YOU FIRE GUNFIRE!"
Turns out mobile internet actually works where I am at.
@Wolf, I can really empathize with having a summer cold - I am on the last spell of mine. Get well soon!
# gun sage
In martial arts rules I wrote, I read the BAB of the martial arts classes as the level of Monk for unarmed damage. The same principle can be used for deeds; give the gun mage deeds as a gunslinger of a level equal to the gun mage's current BAB.
# Scorpion Knight
Abundant Ammunition is likely to run out fast - if it is intended to be the main source of ammunition it needs to escalate over levels.
About the arbalest golem, I think it would be better to give the weapon stats directly rather than referencing some equipment. Either that, or allow the eidolon to carry any siege weapon of an appropriate size.
Overall, this now feels a bit weak - I fail to see any real reason for the diminished spellcasting. But I've not analyzed this in depth.
Alright, I actually managed to finish my draft a few weeks ago, and I'm so glad to be able to toss it in so we can refine it!
** spoiler omitted **
** spoiler omitted **...
Just a couple of questions.
1) How is the re-loading and set up taken care of? If its automatic then this should be called out, as well as any attacks of opportunity this may provoke. Can the various siege and reloading feats be taken? Does it count as a natural weapon or is a wielded weapon? I know abundant ammo references ammunition but is it intended to work on siege ammo?
I'm working on some tweaks to take care of action, loading, etc. Also, the energy bolt evolutions and larger launcher evolutions aren't needed, at least no in their current forms. The Energy Attack evolution applies to all natural attacks. We simply make the ballista a natural attack (counts as two attacks) and a manufactured weapon. this allows natural attack evolutions to function with it. Also, there's no need to limit the number of bolts it can fire. the ballista loads like a normal ballista, but the eidolon counts as a full crew (reload is two full rounds). Then there are some special abilities I've got to help with that, that will replace evasiona dn improved evasion.
For the Larger launcher, we simply add a caveat to the Large evolution. Stay tuned.
EDIT: Also, as a gunslinger secondary, it isn't very gunslinger-y. It's almost more of a crossbow expert instead.
When some develop their talent for summoning, they find their eidolon is pulled from the Plane of Siege. This long-range partner, in some cases, leads to the summoner developing his melee talents, to form a perfect duo. These are the scorpion knights, and they are mighty.
Primary Class: Summoner.
Secondary Class: Gunslinger.
Alignment: Any.
Hit Dice: d8.
Bonus Skills and Ranks: The scorpion knight selects three gunslinger skills to add to his class skills in addition to the normal summoner class skills, one of which must be Knowledge (engineering). The scorpion knight gains a number of ranks at each level equal to 2 + Int modifier.
Weapon and Armor Proficiency: The scorpion knight is proficient with all simple weapons, plus one type of firearm and one martial weapon of his choice. He is also proficient with light, but not with shields. He can cast summoner spells while wearing light armor without incurring the normal arcane spell failure chance. Like any other arcane spellcaster, a scorpion knight wearing medium or heavy armor or using a shield incurs a chance of arcane spell failure if the spell in question has a somatic component. A multiclass scorpion knight still incurs the normal arcane spell failure chance for arcane spells received from other classes.
Arbalest Eidolon: A scorpion knight begins play with the ability to summon to his side a powerful outsider from the Plane of Sieges called an arbalest eidolon. The arbalest eidolon forms a link with the scorpion knight, who, forever after summons an aspect of the same creature. This is exactly like the summoner’s eidolon ability except for the changes described in the Arbalest Eidolon entry below.
*As I said above, this needs more "Gunslinger". It's sort of, meh. Any aspects of the gunslinger class you want to add directly to the summoner chassis?
Arbalest eidolons are living mechanisms of shifting flesh that are summoned by scorpion knights from a little-known plane called the Plane of Sieges. Like an eidolon, an arbalest eidolon is subject to its scorpion knight’s will and functions in all ways as an eidolon, except for the changes described hereafter.
ARBALEST EIDOLON ABILITIES
An arbalest eidolon’s abilities are determined by the scorpion knight’s level and by the choices made using its evolution pool. An arbalest eidolon’s qualities are similar to those described in the Eidolons description block of the Advanced Player’s Guide, except with the following changes.
Special: The following new abilities are gained by all arbalest eidolons as they increase in power. Each of these bonuses is described below.
Ballista: The arbalest eidolon is summoned with a light ballista as part of its permanent form. A light ballista counts as two of the eidolon’s natural attacks and is treated as both a natural attack and a manufactured weapon. The light ballista reduces the eidolon’s total evolution point by two (only 1 point at 1st level, 2 points at 2nd level and so on, up to a maximum of 24 at 20th level). As part of the eidolon, the ballista moves at the same speed as the eidolon, and the arbalest eidolon is considered to have a full crew for the purpose of loading and using the ballista. The ballista otherwise functions as a normal light ballista.
Endless Bolts (Sp): The arbalest eidolon is under the constant effects of an abundant ammunition spell (see the Spells chapter of Ultimate Combat). When summoned, the ballista of an arbalest eidolon comes into existence loaded. Each round thereafter, the arbalest eidolon must reload its ballista using the appropriate action. A sufficient number of bolts are conjured to load the arbalest eidolon’s ballista each round, and therefore it does not need to carry a supply of ammunition.
Rapid Reload (Ex): The arbalest eidolon gains Rapid Reload as a bonus feat. This reduces the ballista’s reload time from two full-round actions to a full-round action. This ability replaces evasion.
Ballista Training (Ex): An arbalest eidolon adds its Dex modifier to the damage dealt by its ballista. This ability replaces devotion.
Lightning Reload (Ex): The arbalest eidolon gains the Lightning Reload deed, and is considered to have at least 1 grit point, even though it does not have the grit class feature. This reduces the ballista’s reload time from a full-round action to a standard action. This ability replaces improved evasion.
Base Forms
Each arbalest eidolon must choose the biped or quadruped form as its base form. Each of these forms otherwise function as those listed in the eidolon description of the Advanced Player’s Guide. A scorpion knight cannot select the aquatic or serpentine base form.
EVOLUTIONS
An arbalest eidolon may select any evolution listed in the Advanced Player’s Guide or Ultimate Magic. However, due to the arbalest eidolon’s nature, the following evolutions have no effect and cannot be added to the eidolon as an evolution: channel resistance, gills, incorporeal form, no breath, undead appearance, unnatural aura, and web, or any evolution requiring the aquatic or serpentine base form. A scorpion knight cannot use the Improved Damage evolution on the arbalest eidolon’s ballista.
The following list includes new evolutions specific to the Scorpion Knight multiclass archetype or rule changes to existing ones.
1-Point Evolutions
The following evolutions cost 1 point from the scorpion knight’s evolution pool.
Knockback Shot (Ex): When an arbalest eidolon with this evolution confirms a critical hit with its ballista attack, the target is automatically knocked back 5 feet. By spending an additional 2 evolution points, targets are knocked back 10 feet instead on a confirmed critical hit.
2-Point Evolutions
The following evolutions cost 2 points from the scorpion knight’s evolution pool.
Energy Bolts (Su): An arbalest eidolon with this evolution deals 2d6 points of energy damage of the chosen type on a successful hit. The scorpion knight must be at least 9th level and have the energy attack evolution before selecting this evolution.
3-Point Evolutions
The following evolutions cost 3 points from the scorpion knight’s evolution pool.
Improved Energy Bolts (Su): An arbalest eidolon with this evolution deals 3d6 points of energy damage of the chosen type on a successful hit. The scorpion knight must be at least 13th level and have the energy bolt evolution before selecting this evolution.
4-Point Evolutions
The following evolutions cost 4 points from the scorpion knight’s evolution pool.
Greater Energy Bolts (Su): An arbalest eidolon with this evolution deals 4d6 points of energy damage of the chosen type on a successful hit. The scorpion knight must be at least 16th level and have the improved energy bolt evolution before selecting this evolution.
Large (Ex): An arbalest eidolon with this evolution also improves its light ballista to a heavy ballista. The ballista now counts as three natural attacks. If the eidolon spends 6 additional evolution points for the Huge evolution, its ballista improves to a gate breaker ballista. The ballista now counts as four natural attacks.
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Okay, so one thing was that I wanted to have was sort of making it so the Eidolon is ranged and the Summoner himself is melee. That's why I threw in the medium armor. I'm thinking diminishing spellcasting in exchange for CHA-based grit that's meant to be done with 1h and 2h slashing melee weapons, with one deed at 1st and every 2 thereafter? I can whip up some of those deeds if need be.
#Scorpion Knight
If you want Medium Armor, then it should probably be added in at 7th like the Magus.
Cha grit and Deeds (only 2 deeds per level) could either be swapped for diminished spellcasting, or the summon monster and gate abilities. Personally, If you ware wanting to go more melee, I would get rid of the monster summoning, and keep normal spellcasting.
So, swap out summon monster and gate, for 1st to 15th level deeds, putting 1st level deeds at 3rd level, 3rd level deeds at 7th, etc, with 15th level deeds at 19th level. Then have Cha grit.
I suppose we could go with diminished spellcasting and put medium armor in right off the bat, making it a much more melee oriented summoner.
Do you want this one to have the gunsmith ability or not?
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#Scorpion Knight
Yeah, good ideas. Diminish spellcasting for medium armor, replace summon monster with deeds, etc. I don't personally think the scorpion knight would ever really use firearms, mainly using swords and shields. I was thinking of making a whole new set of deeds for that purpose. For example,
Scorpion Sting (Ex): At 3rd level, the scorpion knight can expend one grit as a free action when he makes an attack against an adjacent target in melee to reduce his armor bonus to AC by 1 until the start of his next turn to do +4 damage. At 9th level he can expend one grit to reduce his armor bonus by 2 and deal +8 damage, and at 15th he can expend one grit to reduce his armor bonus by 3 and deal +12 damage. He cannot use this deed in the same round as a deed that increases his AC.
Arbalest Armor (Ex): At 3rd level, the scorpion knight can expend one point of grit as an immediate action to cause his arbalest eidolon to suffer a -2 penalty to AC until the start of his next turn. In response, he gains a +4 armor bonus to AC against that one attack. At 9th level, this bonus lasts against the next two attacks, and at 15th level this bonus lasts against the next three attack. He cannot use this deed in the same round as a deed that lowers his AC.
Claw Shielding (Ex): At 3rd level, the scorpion knight can expend one point of grit as a move action to gain DR X/magic until the start of his next turn, where X is equal to his shield's total bonus to AC. At 9th level, this improves to DR X/silver, and at 15th level this improves to DR X/-.
And other stuff like that. Thoughts?
#Scorpion Knight
If you've got other new deeds, post them up.
Also, to go along with the flavor of this MCA, and if we're adding in Medium Armor and shields, lets limit shields to all but tower,and weapons limited to all simple weapons, plus the ballista, double crossbow, hand crossbow, repeating crossbow, scorpion whip, and one type of one-handed melee weapon.
EDIT: Also, Saves? Good Fort/Will or Good Ref/Will?
EDIT 2: Have you thought about giving this guy the Nimble ability (max +4) instead of medium armor? That would keep him mobile.
For a range-focused class, getting medium armor at 7rh seems pretty pointless - by then you have Dex boosters that make medium armor obsolete.
Interesting archetype design comments, including some bashing of us: http://paizo.com/threads/rzs2r8q1?Question-about-Archetypes#3.
e) Multiclass Archetype: This borrows features from another class, typically when a player has a concept that combines features from multiple classes, but they don't want to multiclass. They might want to play a wizard with a gun or a magus with witch hexes. However, these are deceptively difficult to design well. If poorly designed, the archetype either leaves the character worse off than if they simply multiclassed or steps on the toes of another class. I personally find that the best multiclass archetypes try to combine class features to create unique mechanics and flavor. For example, hexcrafter lets a magus spellstrike with curses. Worthless or clumsily written ones simply copy/paste abilities from other classes, which is a reason I personally avoid the MCA thread.
Lets not take this personally.
;-; i took it personally.
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#Scorpion Knight
Hm... Good Fort/Will would be my thought. And while the eidolon is certainly ranged, my concept was that the summoner himself was more of a... not "tank", per se, but close enough to one. And as for deeds, let's see here...
Pincer Tactics (Ex): At 7th level, the scorpion knight can expend one point of grit as a swift action while flanking to gain an additional +2 circumstance bonus to attack and damage rolls until he ends his turn not flanking that opponent.
Chitin Slam (Ex): At 7th level, the scorpion knight can expend one point of grit as a standard action to make a shield bash attack with a +4 competence bonus to the attack roll.
Beady Eyes (Ex): At 7th level, the scorpion knight can expend one point of grit as a full-round action to deal +1d6 precision damage on all attack made against a single creature for ten minutes. This can only affect one creature at a time, attempting to use this ability on a different creature causes the first beady eyes effect to immediately end.
That's all I have at the moment, unfortunately.
#scorpion knight
maybe a deed that let's him gain temporary hit points equal to an amount of damage he just took?
also, maybe one that let's him provoke an AOO for an extra attack on an enemy(as a swift action?).
Hey, I'll be unavailable for the next two days, no internet access, etc. I'll see everyone end of Sunday.
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So I was reading through the latest versions of the new classes that will be put out for Pathfinder. They are essentially what MC Archetype is doing... combining two classes to make a new class.
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The Arcanist combined the arcane knowledge and versatility of the wizard with the eldritch might of the sorcerera.
The Bloodrager fuses the bloody rage of the barbarian what the blood-based magic of the sorcerer .
The Brawler merges the fighter and the monk together into a vicious, no-holds-barred puglisit.
The Hunter take the marital danger that is the ranger and pairs it with the druid's animal companion.
The Investigator mixes the focus of the alchemist and the resourcefulness of the rogue into a master of inquiry.
The Shaman intertwines the divine magic of the oracle with the arcane magic of the witch into a master of spirits.
The Skald blends the ferocity of the barbarian with the utility of the bard into a leader that can make others rage.
Th Slayer combines the ranger and the rogue's individual combat prowess into a being of devastating fury.
The Swashbuckler merges the gunslinger and the fighter to make a daring and dashing melee combatant.
The Warpriest turns the divine nature of the cleric into a raw weapon that fuses with the fighter's battlefield mastery.
--
My question for those here is how effective would mixing a class, that is already a mix of two classes, with another class?
For those that haven't read it yet here is the play test version for download: http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/advancedClassGuide
they all seem like pretty good MCA's, so i wouldn't push them together, they're too obviously 2 classes. like the blood rager is obviously a sorc and barbar put together.
that basically means you laid claim to a class mixing a rogue, alchemist and (bard or wizard). The investigator has extracts and rogue stuff, with it's own combination power. what ever it is that you want, just pick rogue or alchemist as base with bard or wizard as secondary, and have a portion of it mimic what you wanted from the investigator.
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#Bandw2
I will be honest, I did this before knowing what sort of classes the new ones would be, I didn't know it would be classes mixing two base classes.
Though what do you mean the Investigator has extracts, no it doesn't.
Also, the abilities I am most interested in is Inspiration, Keen Recollection, Studied Combat, Studied Strike, True Inspiration, and Investigator Talents. There is also Trapfinding and Trap Sense but those are secondary.
I am especially interested in combining Keen Recollection and Inspiration with Loremaster and Jack of All Trades.
Here is a link to the Investigator Advancement Table.
Like an alchemist, an investigator prepares his spells
by mixing ingredients and a tiny fraction of his own
magical power into a number of extracts, and then
effectively casts the spell by drinking the extract. The
power they lend creates powerful effects, but also binds
the extract’s effect to its creator. Extracts behave like
spells in potion form, and as such their effects can be
dispelled by dispel magic and similar effects, using the
investigator’s level as the caster level.
btw that picture has extracts per day in it...
hmm, i thought up an idea, since we will largely have people who will probably want stuff from the new classes. How about for these we remove all the stuff from one class and fill it with another?
like for Investigator, you removed teh extracts per day, poison resistance, and other odds and ends, and add bard spells, versatile performance, and some other stuff. etc etc.
Just a note, we have already parceled out hybrid mcas well aware of their nature. Its only fair, especially now that the hybrids can multiclass with their parents anyways.
Just a note, we have already parceled out hybrid mcas well aware of their nature. Its only fair, especially now that the hybrids can multiclass with their parents anyways.
the advanced classes can multiclass with their parents now?
still I find it weird being able to get stuff from 3 classes together in this way.
Dont forget the ACG will also have a section regarding homebrew classes and the like (but not a points builder like in ARG) which will still give useful guidelines.
As long as the trades are fair and within the theme of the MCA it should still be alright.
In fact im starting to think of the MCAs as the real hybrid classes now
Ehrmagherd have we not already discussed the ACG classes and MCAs, as well as having multiple peeps in the playtest threads saying "these are heavily reminiscent of MCAs"? Yes we have.
We will be mashing ACG classes together.
# Scorpion Knight
* I think Elghinn is being generous saying there is little gunslinger in here. It looks more like a alternate base form (which while I like it is very reminiscent of Elghinn's own cannon-eidolon for (can't remember which MCA).
* I'm not seeing any "Knight" here, so I would suggest changing the name. Scorpion is flavorful and cool, but I'm not seeing a lot of that either. :)
* Lindley's proposed deeds are definitely a step in the right direction.
Interesting archetype design comments, including some bashing of us: http://paizo.com/threads/rzs2r8q1?Question-about-Archetypes#3.
e) Multiclass Archetype: This borrows features from another class, typically when a player has a concept that combines features from multiple classes, but they don't want to multiclass. They might want to play a wizard with a gun or a magus with witch hexes. However, these are deceptively difficult to design well. If poorly designed, the archetype either leaves the character worse off than if they simply multiclassed or steps on the toes of another class. I personally find that the best multiclass archetypes try to combine class features to create unique mechanics and flavor. For example, hexcrafter lets a magus spellstrike with curses. Worthless or clumsily written ones simply copy/paste abilities from other classes, which is a reason I personally avoid the MCA thread.Lets not take this personally.
Eh, I'd take that all on the chin. A decent summation of the various MCAs out there - I'm pretty much on board with this critique - I prefer less of the copy pasta and more of the new mechanics and flavor. One thing I don't care at all about is stepping "on the toes of another class". I couldn't care less about that.
Though Cyrad should have said MCA threads… ;)