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Some races have spell-like abilities with a caster level equal to their character level.
If I'm reading the recent ruling on SLAs correctly, that means that a creature with an arcane spell as a SLA qualifies for the Arcane Strike feat and calculates the extra damage from it based on their character level. Is this correct?
Yes.
As long as the SLA in question appears on one of the arcane spell lists that takes precedence, then yes, you're correct.
Bold is mine. I am not sure that this is always correct. For some creatures, probably NPC monsters more than PCs, their stat block includes a caster level. When I looked in the universal monster ability entry, it explained that caster level = creature's hit dice if no caster level is specified. I didn't see anything in the description about caster level improving by adding character levels. I think means that adding the feat to monsters can produce oddities, at least in some cases.
For example, a succubus has caster level 12 with its SLAs. If I'm the GM and I made a super-succubus that adds, say, 5 levels of fighter, then the caster level of those SLAs is still 12 (fighter levels add nothing to it). So Arcane Strike doesn't improve even though overall level and hit dice have gone up.
Let's say that super-succubus was changed to lose the 5 fighter levels and add 15 sorcerer levels instead. Now the monster has two caster levels: 15th for sorcerer spells and 12th for the SLAs, so Arcane Strike would improve based on the 15th level for sorcerer casting (basically, use the higher of the two caster levels the creature has).
Do I have that right?
Yes friend. Adding character levels grants more Hit Dice which is what the SLAs are concerned with for all purposes if there is not a Caster Level specified for their abilities.
A Succubus specifically has a CL of 12 for her Spell-like abilities. So giving her more hit dice will never increase the caster level of those abilities.
Much appreciated, wanted to see if what looked reasonable to me also seemed reasonable to someone else.Yes friend. Adding character levels grants more Hit Dice which is what the SLAs are concerned with for all purposes if there is not a Caster Level specified for their abilities.
A Succubus specifically has a CL of 12 for her Spell-like abilities. So giving her more hit dice will never increase the caster level of those abilities.
I tried to find an example of a creature that doesn't have a Caster Level specified but I couldn't find one =(
I tried to find an example of a creature that doesn't have a Caster Level specified but I couldn't find one =(Much appreciated, wanted to see if what looked reasonable to me also seemed reasonable to someone else.Yes friend. Adding character levels grants more Hit Dice which is what the SLAs are concerned with for all purposes if there is not a Caster Level specified for their abilities.
A Succubus specifically has a CL of 12 for her Spell-like abilities. So giving her more hit dice will never increase the caster level of those abilities.
Sorry to resurrect this but i was about to ask the same question as the op, but I figure i'd add to the creature you mentioned, Drow have tons of spell-like abilities most of which appear on the wiz/sorc spell list, all their spell-like abilities improve with character level.
So has a ruling changed this combo of racial spell-like ability and arcane strike?
Yes, there is an faq to the effect that SLAs are not spellcasting for feat or PrC pqs. So you actuallymhave to be an arcane casting class to take arcane strike.
Yeah, what he said. One of the big guys at Paizo didn't want people getting into the Evangelist prestige class a little early so they killed off the option after a year of it being okay. Can't have PrCs making a comeback, can we?
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Yeah, what he said. One of the big guys at Paizo didn't want people getting into the Evangelist prestige class a little early so they killed off the option after a year of it being okay. Can't have PrCs making a comeback, can we?
Well, admittedly, they were tentative from the get go. A "we'll see" situation. So they took a year, saw, and decided "no, we would rather not have to worry about this with stuff later on."
Good lord Urgathoa knows they have more than enough loop holes that leads to trouble. Just look at Racial heritage.
What problem was there? People getting into Prestige Classes early so they could be, you know, worth the effort?
Yeah, what he said. One of the big guys at Paizo didn't want people getting into the Evangelist prestige class a little early so they killed off the option after a year of it being okay. Can't have PrCs making a comeback, can we?
On the one hand I can see why they want less loop holes, but on the other most PrCs feel weaker than base basses so I'm not sure what the big deal is.
Still I actually prefer than people mostly single class in pathfinder. The 3e/3.5/5e mishmash builds do my head in :)
That's how I feel when erratas come out that basically remove things from the game.
I will say that the PrC thing wasn't a big loss, since I pretty much only see people talk about when they mourn the loss of the resulting arcane strike loophole.
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Yeah, gods forbid that we care about a normally suboptimal option becoming viable for a short period of time and then doing a complete 180....
Yeah, gods forbid that we care about a normally suboptimal option becoming viable for a short period of time and then doing a complete 180....
It matches weapon expertise at level 5 before far surpassing it, applies to both melee and ranged attacks, uses an action that many martial characters do not use often, and opens up other options such as riving strike (which in turn debuffs saves for the casters).
It is a fairly good feat. Hardly anything I would call 'subpar'.
Yeah, gods forbid that we care about a normally suboptimal option becoming viable for a short period of time and then doing a complete 180....It matches weapon expertise at level 5 before far surpassing it, applies to both melee and ranged attacks, uses an action that many martial characters do not use often, and opens up other options such as riving strike (which in turn debuffs saves for the casters).
It is a fairly good feat. Hardly anything I would call 'subpar'.
I think Azten was talking about PrCs, not Arcane Strike.
Snowblind is correct.
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PrC's where not adjusted into the same paragon as the regular classes when Pathfinder had the blanket improvements for the classes overall. (Wizards D6 hp, bloodlines being core part of Sorcerers, and so on)
With the adjustment of the Skill Point regs and other concerns (the 1 skill point giving +3 to class skills was a PF improvement), the PrC's where not given any boost to keep up with the full classes that were. This made them weaker than what they would be when used in 3.5 and PrC's made after this kept that same progression.
My thought is that PrC's should have an earlier entry point, and advance parent class abilities to a limited extent.
Also, Shadows should not cost money to replace.
And we even got one recently that advances your class features.
Which one was that? I must have missed it.
Evangelist from Inner Sea Gods, completely advances your main class at 2nd and later levels.
see what you're asking for is what they are doing with archetypes. A class that accents a certain part of the class. Which is why they don't do prestige. Any idea is better off as an archetype.
Don't hold your breath.
having seen the recent prestige classes that have come out last few month, Their good for what they are, but still not something that the boards fill are good or worth. like there's a grand total of what, 10 prestige classes that are "worth looking at". So that means if we're lucky there'll be one that is maybe worth looking at.
PrCs are supposed to be generally weaker. Especially with archetypes and variant multiclassing.
PrC's are supposed to be focused. People keep comparing things back to the way they were in 3.X when base classes generally sucked and people bought bookloads of PrC splats in order to find a PrC to jump into.
PrC's back in the day were so good that it didn't make sense to stay in a base class. They haven't gotten worse in Pathfinder, it's just that the base classed got a major retooling.
Still most PrC's are worth it if you accept the idea that their purpose is to more tightly focus the options from the base class, not replace it as something more viable.