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Christ, man, where do you game, Cheliax? I have never seen a game day be that orderly and frankly it would creep me out.
just the opposite...Theocracy of the Pale! :)
seriously man, I'm 40 years old. I have to drive an hour for my games. To show up at a game day, not knowing if I'll make a muster? Or if the table even has enough to make a table? Or if there's no judge for my game? that would be a waste of about 2 1/2 hours of my time and at least $20 in gas. fugeddaboutit.ORGANIZED play is the only way to roll!
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Im with Chernobyl, doing it without an organising protocol like Warhorn seems to be doing everyone a disservice.
And we seem to have gotten a bit off topic with the mustering issue, and I dont see how it's really related to the topic at hand, extra GM chronicle sheets. Again I dont even see why if we raise the topic of extra gm chronicle sheets, then we be extension raise the topic of extra Player chronicle sheets.
Sorry for the derail. Back to the topic at hand, I can see the need for multiple Gm crediting in areas where the judge pool is poor - when a majority of the GMing is done by a small pool of people, who don't get to play often - but that's a problem with the judge pool and not the chronicles, I think. Players should not be afraid of becoming judges. Its not that hard to do, and it makes you a better player in the long run.
Players who outright refuse to judge is a whole different issue.Players who are completely incapable of judging is something else as well.
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Chernobyl: I dont want to ever see a time when somebody is forced to gm. I do it because I enjoy it.I know long time players of rpgs who have never gm'd a day in their life. I have never asked why.. it's not my place to ask.
Im also with Chernobyl in some respects. I live about an hour away from the gaming venue on average ( a little more for one.. a little less from another). If Im going to a game I want to know A) There is enough people attending (which I can more or less tell from Warhorn B) Whether there is a judge for the game (otherwise the game prob wont be on) C) what the level/class split is. (Table full of bards? bzzzz) What I fail to understand in part is how an rpg convention can be announced over certain dates and THEN the organiser sets about recruiting gms. It makes far more logical sense to me that it's thought about: Ie how many tables/players do we want, then what scenarios and then recruiting gms before the con is ever announced to the public.
This of course may matter a lot less to people who live just around the corner from a venue, or game at a guys house etc. I can only talk from my perspective.
Pandar: We do get dropouts and new sign ups. Generally I have pregens with me as the new player is REALLY new.
Getting back to the topic, I dont see how getting multiple chronicle sheets from a scenario is going to destabilize the campaign. If it helps us retain gms or recruit new ones then i think that is a good thing.
Venture-Captain, California—San Francisco Bay Area South & West
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What I fail to understand in part is how an rpg convention can be announced over certain dates and THEN the organiser sets about recruiting gms. It makes far more logical sense to me that it's thought about: Ie how many tables/players do we want, then what scenarios and then recruiting gms before the con is ever announced to the public.
When you're planning a com with 150+ tables, you can't expect to be able to recruit all the GMs you will need from your local pool. And until they see what scenarios are being considered, and a rough cut at the schedule, GMs will be reluctant to commit; if there's a scenario that you really want to play for some reason you're not going to sign up to judge something else in the time slot where that scenario is being run.
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TriOmega: Is it common for Warhorn to be used in America to organise tables? I can only speak for a Australian perspective myself. ive actually seen in been used in conjunction with a con own registration system to quite a good effect.
Comicpalooza used it, to middling effect. Origins used its own registration system, which involved actual money paid for tickets. Pretty sure that helped with player commitment. Ironhelixx uses Warhorn to great effect for their Roll20 online games. (Link.)
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Chernobyl: I dont want to ever see a time when somebody is forced to gm. I do it because I enjoy it.I know long time players of rpgs who have never gm'd a day in their life. I have never asked why.. it's not my place to ask.
Neither do I. I do my fair share of judging, but I enjoy playing too. I just don't like situations where the same person winds up judging all the time because no one else will step up. Judges should get a chance to play as well. It takes effort to run a good game, and one person should not feel obligated to put forth the effort all the time. That was one of the problems with the LFR campaign, the unlimited replay led to players never wanting to judge because they wanted to get their newest character from the newest splat book up in levels...it led to lopsided judge pools, at least in my area, and was a detriment to the campaign in my opinion.
I don't think that unlimited judge credit chronicles would have the same effect, but I'm not sure how much benefit it would have.
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Yeah, Origins and Gen Con (I've heard) have "pay per game" situations. Not for me. I shouldn't have to pay to get in and then pay for each game.
The cons out here, typically have between 8-10 slots of gaming, each slot representing a 4 hour game. Typically 3 slots on a full day, 2 otherwise, and sometimes there's a midnight madness game that will happen for the die-hards.
Each slot may be advertised with several different scenarios, and likely have multiple tables of each scenario in a given slot. Kublacon had about 20 tables reserved for each slot, for on the order of 200 tables at the con.
At the recent Kublacon if you judged three slots you got your convention attendance for free. So it was worth it to judge. I can't see paying to go to a convention, and then paying to judge a game. If that's how it works at Gen-con, they can keep it.
Gen-Con and Origins likely have 3-5 times that many, or so I'm told. Even with pre-mustering that would be chaos. I don't know how they pull it off, and I'm not sure I'd want to experience it - 100 tables for the special interactive last year? yeesh. I'm all for the experience of a big con, but there comes a point at which organizing becomes unweildly, and just proper mustering the tables takes too long.
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That was one of the problems with the LFR campaign, the unlimited replay led to players never wanting to judge because they wanted to get their newest character from the newest splat book up in levels...it led to lopsided judge pools, at least in my area, and was a detriment to the campaign in my opinion.
I don't think that unlimited judge credit chronicles would have the same effect, but I'm not sure how much benefit it would have.
LFR had replay for players and no certs for judges. It led to difficulties getting judges.
RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8
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Christ, man, where do you game, Cheliax? I have never seen a game day be that orderly and frankly it would creep me outAfter Comicpalooza's players and GMs not showing, scrapping tables that were organized and cobbling together tables from who was there, followed by Origins having actual tickets with names and confirmed tables with overflow GMs putting together tables of similar leveled characters with the walk-ins, I wouldn't want it any LESS orderly than that.
TOZ, I'll speak to Origins vs home.
Friday I didn't have any events scheduled, so I showed up with a couple low level characters who I knew could 'survive' an audit (my higher level charactes are a mess, recordwise, so I'd not bring them for fear of disrupting a table). I didn't schedule any events, so I was very much 'generic boy' that day. I didn't expect to play, and was grateful for the tables that let me join.
Saturday, I had one (one!) person for the beginner's box afternoon slot. I worked with Mike and Mike to get her to a first steps table, and appologized for the inconvience. I then followed up to make sure she had fun after the scenarion. Heck, she got a chronicle sheet out of the first steps, and would just have had fun at my table.*
In both cases, it showed that even an organized event, with tickets, reservations etc. can go sideways.
Now there's a difference between that and a table at Ravenstone/Guardtower/Packrat/Soldiery/other FLGS. There, we're going to have walk-ins. We want walk ins. walk ins = new players/potiential new players. That a person scheduled to *play* steps up and runs something, either cold, or with a GM kit prepared, to me should be rewarded, even if they're running Mists of Mwangi for the 2nd time.
For me that's what the society, hells, the hobby needs. Not just "Play Play Play!" But "Grow Grow Grow!" Right now running a scenario for the 2nd, 3rd, 25th time just rewards the person with a higher number of games ran.**
So that's why I argue for another shot at GM credit. The arguments for, and against, have convinced me that it shouldn't be unlimited. Because most scenarios have two tiers, two sheets is enough (IMHO).
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Yeah, Origins and Gen Con (I've heard) have "pay per game" situations. Not for me. I shouldn't have to pay to get in and then pay for each game.
And, yes, you're correct. Both Origins and GenCon require you to buy a badge just to get into the convention itself, and then "event tickets" to play most games (though, I know that Origins also has "ribbons", which you purchase to get unlimited play access in certain rooms, particularly for board games).
I think that it's just the way it has to be done at a convention of that size, which features a wide variety of games and other activities. I know that, when GenCon (unsuccessfully) expanded to Southern California a decade or so ago, one of the issues they ran into was a gaming community that was accustomed to local / regional conventions which did not charge for individual events (in addition to the badge itself).
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In both cases, it showed that even an organized event, with tickets, reservations etc. can go sideways.
Now there's a difference between that and a table at Ravenstone/Guardtower/Packrat/Soldiery/other FLGS. There, we're going to have walk-ins. We want walk ins. walk ins = new players/potiential new players. That a person scheduled to *play* steps up and runs something, either cold, or with a GM kit prepared, to me should be rewarded, even if they're running Mists of Mwangi for the 2nd time.
For me that's what the society, hells, the hobby needs. Not just "Play Play Play!" But "Grow Grow Grow!" Right now running a scenario for the 2nd, 3rd, 25th time just rewards the person with a higher number of games
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Yeah we typically have at least 2 brand new players, either to pfs or the store, that we need to accommodate.
At the last con I was at there wasn't enough low level stuff, so the newer players played quest for perfection as a pick up game.
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Christ, man, where do you game, Cheliax? I have never seen a game day be that orderly and frankly it would creep me outAfter Comicpalooza's players and GMs not showing, scrapping tables that were organized and cobbling together tables from who was there, followed by Origins having actual tickets with names and confirmed tables with overflow GMs putting together tables of similar leveled characters with the walk-ins, I wouldn't want it any LESS orderly than that.
Why not? That's when the REAL fun happens...hehe. You could have tables with sessions being run by GM running scenarios from memory because none of the modules you needed were printed. You can have your sign in sheets be on a napkin and chronicles sheets filled later and mailed to each players. Oh think of the fun it would be if it was even more chaos.
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TriOmega: Is it common for Warhorn to be used in America to organise tables? I can only speak for a Australian perspective myself. ive actually seen in been used in conjunction with a con own registration system to quite a good effect.we use it for all the cons here and many local game days in the northern california area, and have been for years...5 seasons of pathfinder, 4 years of LG, so at least 9 years in my experience. It feels really odd for random assignments at some of the out of area cons now. In my experience, in a convention setting, the absence of pre-mustering leads to poor tables character mixes, DM's running cold, and worst of all (in my opinion), late musters - nothing like a 4 hour game having to be run in 3 1/2 hours by an unprepared judge who didn't know what game he was running.
This is ORGANIZED play, right? then it should be! :)
Hey I ran several games a kubla that way wand it went fine :). But then again, I have been told I am a freak of nature in my ability to run things cold and fast (ran a scenario cold and in 2 hours due to time restraint requests this Tuesday).
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Why not? That's when the REAL fun happens...hehe. You could have tables with sessions being run by GM running scenarios from memory because none of the modules you needed were printed. You can have your sign in sheets be on a napkin and chronicles sheets filled later and mailed to each players. Oh think of the fun it would be if it was even more chaos.
Bah. I keep all of my scenarios on my iPad, so I never have to worry about printing them unless the venue is without power outlets. (So far, not a problem.) And I have a cheap printer for travel to cons
In both cases, it showed that even an organized event, with tickets, reservations etc. can go sideways.
Indeed, which is an argument for having the aforementioned organization in place as well as countermeasures for such things, which Origins had.
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This thread didn't need to be Necro'd.
Mike said recently that changes are coming to replayability, which would (presumably) also happen to reGMability.
(I love making new words!)
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RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32
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This thread didn't need to be Necro'd.
Mike said recently that changes are coming to replayability, which would (presumably) also happen to reGMability.
(I love making new words!)
The problem here is that your new word kinda reads like "reg-ma-bility".
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When you run a scenario the first time, you receive table credit and can apply the Chronicle sheet, 1 XP, 2 PP, and max gold to one of your characters (following the rules on pp. 39-40 of the Guide to PFS Organized Play).
/QUOTE]I just GM'd my first adventure. Am I correct that I can apply that chronicle sheet to a character that also has a chronicle sheet for PLAYING that same adventure?
