Assuming that the new SLAs qualify for spellcasting prerequisites ruling allows for gnomes or other races with multiple SLAs to enter Dragon Disciple without any Sorcerer levels, would Kensai 12 / DD 8 be gaining enough over a straight 20 level kensai to justify the two lost caster levels?
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As a kensai, I would not want to give Iaijutsu Master / Weapon Master.
I'm also not sure giving up two caster levels is worth the +4 strength on an archetype that is typically dexterity based.
As always. Play what you consider fun. If you have a concept for a half-dragon with a sword, go for it.
What new SLA qualifiers?
A recent FAQ clarified that SLAs allowed a character to meet prereqs requiring spellcasting/caster levels.
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As a kensai, I would not want to give Iaijutsu Master / Weapon Master.
I'm also not sure giving up two caster levels is worth the +4 strength on an archetype that is typically dexterity based.
As always. Play what you consider fun. If you have a concept for a half-dragon with a sword, go for it.
What new SLA qualifiers?A recent FAQ clarified that SLAs allowed a character to meet prereqs requiring spellcasting/caster levels.
Do you have a link to the FAQ? I'm curious if SLAs count as prepared or spontaneous casting and if they can count as divine or only arcane.
I'd like to see that FAQ too. Bump.
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FAQ: http://paizo.com/paizo/faq/v5748nruor1fm#v5748eaic9qow
Spell-Like Abilities, Casting, and Prerequisites: Does a creature with a spell-like ability count as being able to cast that spell for the purpose of prerequisites or requirements?
Yes.
For example, the Dimensional Agility feat (Ultimate Combat) has "ability to use the abundant step class feature or cast dimension door" as a prerequisite; a barghest has dimension door as a spell-like ability, so the barghest meets the "able to cast dimension door prerequisite for that feat.
Does this mean that a Rogue with Minor Magic does qualify for Arcane Strike then?ZanThrax, yes (we almost included that as an example in the FAQ answer).
clarification is needed on the arcane/divine question.
If you don't know what a SLA counts for (arcane or divine), then what kind of prerequisites can it fill?
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If you don't know what a SLA counts for (arcane or divine), then what kind of prerequisites can it fill?
According to the FAQ, it can.
As stated, the arcane/divine question needs to be addressed. Until then, apply common sense.
Common sense would be, if the SLA is casting an arcane spell, count it as arcane unless obviously granted by a divine source (example: if the sla were granted as a cleric/oracle class feature.)
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Even still, being a gnome magus wouldn't qualify you for DD. The requirement specifically states you must be able to spontaneously cast 1st level arcane spells. Gnomes get SLAs for 3 cantrips and a SLA for a 3rd level Bard spell assuming its the arcane version. They can't spontaneously cast any 1st level arcane spell.
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True, but I'm not sure if a SLA counts as Spontaneous casting. It qualifies for Arcane Strike, as the feat states you have to be able to cast arcane spells. It doesn't state that you have to prepare or spontaneously cast spells. Dragon Disciple does. Absent any other FAQ, I'd rule that a SLA allows you you to qualify for feats or PRCs that require you to be able to cast spells, but not ones that require you to prepare or spontaneously cast spells.
As a kensai, I would not want to give Iaijutsu Master / Weapon Master.
I'm also not sure giving up two caster levels is worth the +4 strength on an archetype that is typically dexterity based.
Well, I was thinking more a Strength than Dex build.
Absent any other FAQ, I'd rule that a SLA allows you you to qualify for feats or PRCs that require you to be able to cast spells, but not ones that require you to prepare or spontaneously cast spells.
DD doesn't actually require spontaneous casting though. It requires the "ability to cast 1st-level arcane spells without preparation." I'd say that SLAs are certainly cast without preparation. Gnome was just the first example race I thought of with more than one SLA. I'm certain that one of the others has at least two that are first level.
Either that or any race that has one first level arcane spell as an SLA and then do a Preferred Spell build.
Assuming SLAs qualify if they are arcane spells, would Darkness as a spell like ability (tiefling) qualify for Dragon Disciple since it is not level 1?
To qualify to become a mystic theurge, a character must fulfill all the following criteria.
Skills: Knowledge (arcana) 3 ranks, Knowledge (religion) 3 ranks.
Spells: Able to cast 2nd-level divine spells and 2nd-level arcane spells.
So first off, you need level 3 at least for the skill ranks. No big deal.
The second requirement is where you were focused though, and the wording is tricky here. You need to be able to cast "spells" of both types. Not spell. Spells. As in more than one. You could argue that repeated casting of the same spell counts as spells, but I am thinking it means more than one spell of that level.
All that being said, if I was your DM and you had a Wiz 3 / Cleric 1 that had a second level SLA of divine origin, I'd let you in early, and see it as a rule bent instead of broken.
Edit: I just realized Daylight is level 3, so it would not qualify as a 2nd level spell, unless the answer to my question above is a "yes" as well.
you'd think exceeding the prerequisite spell level would allow access, but I'm sure many would disagree based on the letter of the rules wording.
You need to be able to cast "spells" of both types. Not spell. Spells. As in more than one. You could argue that repeated casting of the same spell counts as spells, but I am thinking it means more than one spell of that level.
If this is true, than the minor magic rogue trick would not qualify the rogue for arcane strike, but we've already been told it that it does satisfy that prerequisite.
What's good for the goose is good for the gander and all that.
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The second requirement is where you were focused though, and the wording is tricky here. You need to be able to cast "spells" of both types. Not spell. Spells. As in more than one. You could argue that repeated casting of the same spell counts as spells, but I am thinking it means more than one spell of that level.
Your interpretation would bar a pure caster from entering the PrC at the level at which he first obtains 2nd level spells.
A fourth level sorcerer or oracle, for example, knows only a single 2nd level spell.
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On the flip side, if a Gnome is able to take Arcane Strike and have it scale with character level simply by using SLAs, then it just became much more attractive for a martial class.In general that safely balances with the fact no standard race trait allows a race with a bonus to str (or mutable like humans and halfsies) the spells...the norm best case is a Teifling/aasimar who have to spend a whole lot to get high str anyway...so the extra damage at 1/5/10/15/20 really doesn't throw the balance off to speak of. For gnomes it helps to mitigate their smaller die and -2 str...again doesn't throw the balance.
Now add to rogue? Generally taking the minor magic + arcane strike is a heavy cost at low levels for 1 damage...and as it scales it still doesn't scale with other things the rogue can need or want.
Now if you start adding in all the alt racial things...it opens up a bit more... But the damage isn't enough to really overpower a character.
No but it is very nice for a finesse build, and there are several races with a bonus to dex that have SLAs. Oread does have a bonus to STR, but their SLA is Magic Stone, so I guess it counts as Divine instead of Arcane, but I don't really know.
The second requirement is where you were focused though, and the wording is tricky here. You need to be able to cast "spells" of both types. Not spell. Spells. As in more than one. You could argue that repeated casting of the same spell counts as spells, but I am thinking it means more than one spell of that level.Your interpretation would bar a pure caster from entering the PrC at the level at which he first obtains 2nd level spells.
A fourth level sorcerer or oracle, for example, knows only a single 2nd level spell.
While I agree that Meat is incorrect here, your reasoning is incorrect also, at least for oracles. At fourth level, an oracle knows 1 spell base, plus either Cure/inflict moderate wounds, plus a spell from her mystery.
I have two questions:
1) Has there been a FAQ on whether the feat Spell Mastery is allowed for Magus?
2) If yes, why not just use that feat to avoid confusion?
Sean's said that they don't intend to change Spell Mastery to open it up for other prepared casters because they don't want to have the CRB referring to non-CRB classes. But he also said that it's not an unreasonable house rule to open it up for other classes.
Spell Mastery wouldn't cause the Magus to be able to cast spells without preparation - just prepare them without a book. Which means it wouldn't let me get into DD without a dip.
But in any case, Preferred Spell is much more desirable than Spell Mastery anyhow because it allows a Magus who uses one attack spell constantly to prepare the various utility spells and buffs that he might need and then choose exactly what metamagic flavour is needed at the time of the fight. And if a Magus takes Elemental Spell, or a one level Admixturer dip, he can choose his energy type on the fly as well, to reduce issues with enemies having resistance or immunity to his favourite spell's damage type.