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I'm trying to make use of Body Bludgeon. So far I'm looking at 10th level Barbarian (obviously), looking at IUS, Imp., Greater, and Rapid Grappler, with the Brawler rage powers, strength surge and animal fury.
As I understand it, with Rapid Grappler, I can, as a full attack, grapple, pin, and then smack somebody with somebody. Is this correct? Then once I have somebody pinned, I can attack with him three times a round, right? Does Improved Savage Grapple let me pick up people my size? (Since it treats me one size larger and body bludgeon requires one size smaller) (Should also mention it is from Brutal Pugilist archetype)
Lastly, what am I doing wrong, what can I do better? The only thing I'm married to is Body Bludgeon, I'm open to any and all suggestions.
I'm trying to make use of Body Bludgeon. So far I'm looking at 10th level Barbarian (obviously), looking at IUS, Imp., Greater, and Rapid Grappler, with the Brawler rage powers, strength surge and animal fury.
As I understand it, with Rapid Grappler, I can, as a full attack, grapple, pin, and then smack somebody with somebody. Is this correct? Then once I have somebody pinned, I can attack with him three times a round, right? Does Improved Savage Grapple let me pick up people my size? (Since it treats me one size larger and body bludgeon requires one size smaller) (Should also mention it is from Brutal Pugilist archetype)
Lastly, what am I doing wrong, what can I do better? The only thing I'm married to is Body Bludgeon, I'm open to any and all suggestions.
Improved Savage Grapple only counts you as large for defensive purposes.
I would try multiclassing with Druid and use Wild Shape to get a Large form. Maybe something with Rake or Constrict, so you could automatically deal damage to your grappled oponent, while using him to hit his allies.
Yeah there are a couple of different dips that would help but that puts off body bludgeon. Do I need Catch Off-Guard for it or am I considered proficient in "bodies?" What's the best way to boost my grapple CMB? Are there any other grapple based rage powers?
Enlarge Person would be easy enough to get. Is there a way to go bigger (without dipping)? Not against multiclass afterwards, but I want Body Bludgeon at 10th.
Rapid grappler doesn't let you full attack, it just lets you make a grapple check as a swift action after you have maintained a grapple with a move action in the same round (standard actions can be move actions).
I could have been clearer with that. Should be, in one round, grapple with standard action, pin with move action (greater grapple), then Body Bludgeon with swift action (Rapid Grappler). Then once pinned, three grapple checks should give me three attacks with Body Bludgeon.
Duergar is probably out (not a good fit anyways). Most likely limited to fairly standard races, but again Enlarge Person is easy to come by (I could even do a custom Ring of Enlarge Person).
just remember, dual wielding party members is frowned upon by most parties
You don't know my group!
Titan mauler. You can dual-wield two-handed weapons (like bodies) and at 14th level can become enlarged while you rage.
Titan mauler. You can dual-wield two-handed weapons (like bodies) and at 14th level can become enlarged while you rage.
Cool visual, but Body Bludgeon doesn't work that way. I only get to attack with a grapple check and I think three is the most I can get. Besides I don't have enough feats for two weapon fighting.
Am I proficient with the bodies, or do I need Catch Off-Guard? I'm assuming I do since they are improvised weapons. If so that leaves me without Power Attack. Would Power Attack be a better choice than Rapid Grappler? Either one I didn't take I could get at 11th level so would it matter for one level? (Guess that one is game specific) Is there any way to get Improvised Weapon Proficiency without Catch Off-Guard?
I might suggest a dip into Alchemist if you're not against dipping. Get mutagen and the ability to use enlarge person, giving you +4 to strength and making you large. Just a thought.
I am * SO* going to hit my players with one of these builds! :-D
Titan mauler. You can dual-wield two-handed weapons (like bodies) and at 14th level can become enlarged while you rage.Cool visual, but Body Bludgeon doesn't work that way. I only get to attack with a grapple check and I think three is the most I can get. Besides I don't have enough feats for two weapon fighting.
I believe you could still have one in each hand, even if you're not using TWF. Grappling with one hand is only a -4 penalty :P
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The Living Monolith Prestige Class will allow you to enlarge person on yourself 3 times per day at level 1. If you take it to level 5 that becomes righteous might instead, and you gain some very nice defensive abilities.
my buddy (Chaotic Fighter)beat a huge dragon to death with another huge dragon. your build concept is invalid. next question
Okay, so this is my first time posting a "build" so let me know if I'm missing anything. One note: I tend to build without magic items then add them in later.
Str 20 (+5)
Dex 13 (+1)
Con 14 (+2)
Int 10 (0)
Wis 12 (+1)
Cha 10 (0)
20 pt buy (I'm not used to point-buy but I think that's fairly standard here.)
Racial bonus and two level ups into Str
Fast Movement (+10 ft), Rage, Rage Powers (5), Savage Grapple (half penalties to grappling, always get AoO against someone grappling you), Pit Fighter (+1 Insight to CMB/CMD when grappling, +1 to something else), Improved Savage Grapple (no penalties when grappling, one size larger when determining what he can grapple)
Feats:
1. Improved Unarmed Strike
2. Improved Grapple
3. Power Attack
4. Greater Grapple
5. Rapid Grappler
Rage Powers
1. Brawler
2. Strength Surge
3. Animal Fury
4. Greater Brawler
5. Body Bludgeon
So grapple:
10 (BAB) +5 (Str mod) + 4 (Greater Grapple) + 1 (Pit Fighter) = +20 total
I can Strength Surge for another +10 once per rage but it eats my immediate action so I lose Rapid Grappler for that round.
Greater Grapple gives me a grapple as a move and Animal Fury gives me a free bite. +5 to maintain grapple, +2 if bite hits gives me +27 to grapple.
Rapid Grappler, if I didn't Strength Surge, gives another grapple check and another bite, success and I can hit somebody with somebody!
Am I right that I keep the + 5 from here on out?
Second Round gives me three grapple checks (+25/27), three bites on the person I'm grappling, plus three attacks with the person I'm grappling.
So two rounds, four bites, and four attacks that damages the person I'm attacking and the person I'm attacking with.
Brawler/Greater Brawler gives me three attack unarmed w/ 1d6 Dmg (meh)
Probably grab a greatsword for what I can't grapple (plus longbow)
If I power attack, does that affect my CMB?
Is there anything that would help me grapple that I can replace Brawler with?
Call me silly, but at level 10, isn't a Potion of Enlarge person a minor business venture? Negligible, even?
If you have that much worry about rag-dolling medium creatures, just quaf down one of those. For a few minutes you're the hulk and, unfortunately, they're Loki.
Yeah, and in Pathfinder I think they are only 50 GP each, so I'm not worried about that. Also I forgot Rage in my numbers so grapple should be another +2.
And I like the idea of going alchemist after getting Body Bludgeon. Have rage, mutagen, and enhancement to strength. Not to shabby.
@durngrun: if you want to get your grapple check higher, as I'm sure you do, take a look at the following items:
Gauntlets of the skilled manuever: adds +2 CMB to one type of combat manuever. Grapple in your case. ultimate equipment4,000 gp
Anaconda's coils belt: provides a +2 competence bonus to grapple checks. Ultimate equipment 18,500 gp
Brawling armor property: gives a +2 bonus on unarmed attack and damage rolls, including grapple. So that's another +2. Ultimate equipment +1
Dusty rose prism ioun stone + slotted into a wayfinder : if your DM allows it, ioun stones can combine with a wayfinder to gain special resonate abilities. The dusty rose prism ioun stone when placed Ina wayfinder gives a a +2 to your CMB/CMD.
All of these bonuses stack since they are of different types of bonuses and of to different values, whether it be to your CMB directly or your grappling CMB. The total gained from these can reach as high as +8.
However, since most of these items are cheap with the exception of the anacondas belt, your looking at a +6 to your grapple check.
Also, the shirt of immolation is a nice grappling item. It will cause the short to burst into flames and deal 1d6+10 points of fire damage to the grappled enemy. 10 rounds/day. Nice item.
Okay, just found Hive Totem and Hive Totem Resilience. Together gives +2 to CMB and strength checks and CMD vs Bull Rush, Drag, Trip, and Grapple (plus immune to swarms, yay?). I could give up Power Attack for Hive Totem Toxicity for higher bite damage and poison bite (Con Dmg no less, only once per rage, though).
So lose Brawler/Greater Brawler and grapple is at + 24 without any gear (when raging), + 29 to maintain grapple, +31 with successful bite.
With Enlarge Person and Bull's Strength (or Belt) that's another + 4. Can grapple and attack with medium size creatures.
Gauntlets of the skilled manuever: adds +2 CMB to one type of combat manuever. Grapple in your case. ultimate equipment4,000 gp
Brawling armor property: gives a +2 bonus on unarmed attack and damage rolls, including grapple. So that's another +2. Ultimate equipment +1
These are great! I had heard Brawling Armor mentioned a couple of times but wasn't sure what it did. With what I posted earlier, I think I'm at + 31 to grapple (+36/+38 to maintain). That has to be pretty good for 10th level!
These are great! I had heard Brawling Armor mentioned a couple of times but wasn't sure what it did. With what I posted earlier, I think I'm at + 31 to grapple (+36/+38 to maintain). That has to be pretty good for 10th level!Gauntlets of the skilled manuever: adds +2 CMB to one type of combat manuever. Grapple in your case. ultimate equipment4,000 gp
Brawling armor property: gives a +2 bonus on unarmed attack and damage rolls, including grapple. So that's another +2. Ultimate equipment +1
Also pick up a Cord of stubborn resolve. Belt slot item. It allows you to rage cycle essentially. You take 1d6 nonlethal to be immune to fatigue condition. Now you can rage once per round, so to get off strength surge and other 1/rage powers.
Also pick up a Cord of stubborn resolve. Belt slot item. It allows you to rage cycle essentially. You take 1d6 nonlethal to be immune to fatigue condition. Now you can rage once per round, so to get off strength surge and other 1/rage powers.These are great! I had heard Brawling Armor mentioned a couple of times but wasn't sure what it did. With what I posted earlier, I think I'm at + 31 to grapple (+36/+38 to maintain). That has to be pretty good for 10th level!Gauntlets of the skilled manuever: adds +2 CMB to one type of combat manuever. Grapple in your case. ultimate equipment4,000 gp
Brawling armor property: gives a +2 bonus on unarmed attack and damage rolls, including grapple. So that's another +2. Ultimate equipment +1
Is that also in Ultimate Equipment? I may have to get that book. Thanks for all the great items!
It is. My barbarians love the belt. It is probably one of the best barbarian items you can get. Besides a furious weapon.
Ooh, just remembered. Headband of havoc. Also in ultimate equipment. Allows you to increase a rage power by +4 levels, and 1/per day as an immediate action, after spending 2 rage rounds, you can rage as an immediate action. So if you need to roll a save or something of the sort, and you wish you could rage. Well now you can.
Redo!
Looking at the ACG, wondering about Grabbing Style.
At first glance this appears to give me Two Weapon Fighting with my grappled opponents. ( Well, Grabbing Master does, to be precise.) Am I correct this would work with Rapid Grappler? What's the best way to grab all the feats needed? I assuming a dip in Unarmed Fighter would be best, but haven't studied the new classes yet. Are there any new rage powers to assist with grappling or CMB in general?
From the Unarmed Fighter archetype:
At 1st level, a unarmed fighter gains the Improved Unarmed Strike feat and any single style feat (see Chapter 3) as a bonus feat. The unarmed fighter need not meet all the prerequisites of the style feat he chooses, but style feats that grant additional uses of the Elemental Fist feat cannot be taken until the unarmed fighter has that feat. This ability replaces the bonus feat at 1st level.
Does this mean I can take Grabbing Master before Grabbing Style?
So quick build: Edit (Rage Powers)
Barbarian (Brutal Pugilist) 10/ Fighter (Unarmed) 2
Take fighter levels at 7 and 12
1.????
2.(Rage Power: Brawler)
3.Improved Grapple
4.(Rage Power: Animal Fury)
5.Extra Rage Power (Hive Totem)
6.(Rage Power: Hive Totem Resilience)
7.Grabbing Style, Bonus: Grabbing Master, Bonus: Imp. Unarmed
8.
9.Greater Grapple (Rage Power: Hive Totem Toxicity)
10.
11.Rapid Grappler (Rage Power: Body Bludgeon)
12.Bonus: Gabbing Drag
Ok, so move first fighter level to nine, take Grabbing Style as bonus and Grabbing Drag as your level feat. Move Greater a Grapple to seventh level and Grabbing Master to twelfth. That should work, right?
Barbarian (Brutal Pugilist) 10/ Fighter (Unarmed) 2
Take fighter levels at 9 and 121.????
2.(Rage Power: Brawler)
3.Improved Grapple
4.(Rage Power: Animal Fury)
5.Extra Rage Power (Hive Totem)
6.(Rage Power: Hive Totem Resilience)
7.Greater Grapple
8.(Rage Power: Hive Totem Toxicity)
9.Grabbing Drag, Bonus: Grabbing Style, Bonus: Imp. Unarmed
10.
11.Rapid Grappler (Rage Power: Body Bludgeon)
12.Bonus: Gabbing Master
Make sure I've got everything right...
While raging, if the barbarian pins an opponent that is smaller than her, she can then use that opponent as a two-handed improvised weapon that deals 1d8 points of bludgeoning damage, assuming the opponent is sized Small. Larger or smaller creatures used as a bludgeon deal damage based on their size using this base damage. A size Tiny creature deals 1d6 points of damage, a size Medium creature deals 1d10 points of damage, and so on. The barbarian can make a single attack using the pinned opponent as part of the action she uses to maintain the grapple, using her highest attack bonus. Whenever the barbarian hits using the pinned opponent as a weapon, she deals damage to her target normally, and the grappled opponent used as a bludgeon also takes the same damage she dealt to the target. If the pinned opponent is unable to resist being pinned for any reason, the barbarian can use that opponent as an improvised weapon without grappling or pinning the opponent, until the creature is reduced to 0 or fewer hit points, at which point the creature becomes useless as an improvised weapon. A barbarian must be at least 10th level before selecting this rage power.
You are a quick hand at grappling.Prerequisites: Dex 13, Greater Grapple, Improved Grapple, Improved Unarmed Strike, base attack bonus +9 or monk level 9th.
Benefit: Whenever you use Greater Grapple to successfully maintain a grapple as a move action, you can then spend a swift action to make a grapple combat maneuver check.
You can grapple two foes as easily as one.Prerequisites: Grabbing Drag, Grabbing Style, Improved Grapple; base attack bonus +12, brawler level 8th, or monk level 8th.
Benefit: When you are grabbing two opponents while using Grabbing Style, you can use your grapple to move or damage one or both opponents you are grappling, instead of just one.
After I have two people successfully grappled, I can make three grapple checks a round and each grapple check applies to both creatures grappled? So six attacks a round, each attack deals damage to both the grappled creature and the creature attacked, and all attacks are at my highest attack bonus?
Titan Mauler should work. You lose Savage Grapple but I like the idea of hitting people bigger than me with people smaller than me.
I'm also thinking of moving the first fighter level to first level. Second level has to be twelfth level to get Grabbing Master.
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Go w giants dual wielding ogres, dual wielding dwarves, dual wielding halflings, dual wielding battle axes. All raging.
Unstoppable!
dot
Consider taking potion glutton, accelerated drinker or a sipping jacket so you can quaff the enlarge potion without wasting an entire turn.
I would like to second (third? fourth?) the opinion that Brutal Pugilist is NOT the way to go here. Go Titan Mauler. Ignore the text of Titan Mauler as written as well as the errata. The creator of the prestige class has posted on this topic and it is clear that the intent of the archetype was to be able to wield weapons that are normally too large for you to wield. The intent matches the fluff and while I would normally argue for the crunch > fluff, but if the developer of the rules backs up the intent that is difficult to argue.
Brutal Pugilist doesn't let you do anything you can't already do. It just makes doing things that you can already do easier. Titan Mauler DOES make you do things that you can not already do. AND it makes it easier for you to do those things. In fact, it lets you do the things you want to do: it lets you wield over-sized opponents. (if you use the developer's intent)
I also would suggest taking Imbicatus' advice and going with Living Monolith for at least 1 level past 10th. There have been some other great suggestions as well. Particularly this one:
Go w giants dual wielding ogres, dual wielding dwarves, dual wielding halflings, dual wielding battle axes. All raging.
Unstoppable!
Oh, and if you are already sinking a feat into Endurance you might as well sink one more into Iron Will and go for a few levels into Horizon Walker to get immunity to fatigue and exhaustion.
Yeah, I kinda came to the same conclusion with Brawler. I was mainly taking it to get the 1d6 damage but it's not worth it with this build. As of now I'm thinking Fighter (Unarmed) 2/Barbarian (Titan Mauler) 10. Looking at...
F1L1. Imp. Grapple, Bonus: IUS, Grabbing Style
B1L2.
B2/L3. ???? (Rage Power: Animal Fury)
B3/L4.
B4/L5. ???? (Rage Power: Hive Totem)
B5/L6.
B6/L7. Greater Grapple (Rage Power: Hive Totem Resilience)
B7/L8.
B8/L9. Rapid Grappler (Rage Power: Hive Totem Toxicity)
B9/L10.
B10/L11. Grabbing Drag (Rage Power: Body Bludgeon)
F2/L12. Bonus: Grabbing Master
That leaves me two open feats (three if human but I was thinking half-orc).
Is there any way to get Body Bludgeon, Rapid Grappler, and Grabbing Master on a character quicker then that?
Is there anything I need to make this character more effective?
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I actually made a character designed just for this for my party to laugh at. So, ten levels of barbarian, 3 levels of monk of the empty hand with hamatula strike. You grapple, then use your victim as a pircing improvised weapon (thanks to the monk dip) to qualify for hamatula strike, piercing one man with another and starting a second grapple. I did use a gnome to kill half the party (it was a -high risk- adventure, they wants to die often.)
On a more serious note, 8 levels of Druid is the best way to things going. Take the powerful form feat, along with the +4 to Druid level when determining which shapes you can assume. Couple that with titanic armor and you'll be a huge elemental using gargantuan creatures as your weapons. Also consider brutal pugilisk, for the extra nice stuff for improvised weapons -and- a bonus to damage when sun drink unattended objects(if there's only one bad guy, pull a hulk and sunder the ground with his face!)
Shaman Bond: Monk and Barbarian do not play well together. Alignment clashes and all would not allow a Breaker and Kata Master to mix. Sorry.
Durngrun Stonebreaker: That build looks better to me. It seems like it is doing more what you wanted it to do. :) Not sure about your other rage powers though... they don't seem to work towards the theme that you are going for much. Even though the brawler powers didn't add much I feel that they at least match the theme. Plus at least with those you do not have to focus on using a weapon as much which seems to be what you are going for.
You could go for some of the generally helpful powers like celestial to help out your healer. If you aren't worried about the hitting you while grappling and want to make sure you land your roles you could go for Reckless Abandon. Have you thought about going for the intimidating line of powers and with Cornugon Smash? Stacking debuffs is a good way to ensure you are able to grapple successfully for those hard to grapple foes.
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Enlarge Person would be easy enough to get. Is there a way to go bigger (without dipping)? Not against multiclass afterwards, but I want Body Bludgeon at 10th.
My daughter put the enlarge spell on her armor (like fly on celestial armor) usable 4/day @ 2nd level caster. That gave her 2 minutes of enlarge (easily lasting through all combats - only once @ 11th level did we go more than 20 rounds). It was cheap enough, costing just over 1000gp (I cant remember the total cost, but it was well under 2k.)
It was quite helpful and it would definitely be a godsend to this build.