But will most door knobs?
But will most door knobs?
Weigh less than 5 pounds? i should hope so.
Turn and pull/push as if with one hand. Most doors will take less than 5lbs of effort to open unless they're big stone doors (also beyond the ability of open/close) or designed to be closed or locked (also beyond open/close).
Can you summon him in mid-air to drop on some poor bastard? Yes. The environment supports him. The material does not.
Incorrect.
A creature or object brought into being or transported to your location by a conjuration spell cannot appear inside another creature or object, nor can it appear floating in an empty space. It must arrive in an open location on a surface capable of supporting it.
The rules state this explicitly. You cannot drop meat-bombs via summon spells.
Hmmmm....there are ways of getting around that rule, I suppose. The key is that just because you summon it on a flat, empty, stable space does not mean it has to stay there.
The most obvious is just to summon it on the cliff and dump if over yourself...but that is the lame way. Anyway to create temporary platforms that disappear? Preferably something with a short duration that one could time to disappear immediately after successfully summoning a creature.
Yes. I guess that makes the person I was replying to correct, for the wrong reasons.
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Hmmmm....there are ways of getting around that rule, I suppose. The key is that just because you summon it on a flat, empty, stable space does not mean it has to stay there.
The most obvious is just to summon it on the cliff and dump if over yourself...but that is the lame way. Anyway to create temporary platforms that disappear? Preferably something with a short duration that one could time to disappear immediately after successfully summoning a creature.
Forcecage? ^______^
Blistering Invective for one, to get on topic with the op. Love the flavor and with my high intimidate bonus this spell delivers kicks to me that many don't. I also like the pit line of spells for obvious reasons, summon monster 4+ great stuff.
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A spell that has recently become the favorite of my Rakshasa-blooded Sorcerer is Ghost Sound.
Combine a ridiculously high Bluff skill, a spell with no verbal components that can be cast an unlimited number of times a day, and a Bloodline Arcana which causes missed Spellcraft checks to mis-identify the spell as any other spell you choose and you can bamboozle your opponents into thinking you're doing just about anything.
A spell that has recently become the favorite of my Rakshasa-blooded Sorcerer is Ghost Sound.
Combine a ridiculously high Bluff skill, a spell with no verbal components that can be cast an unlimited number of times a day, and a Bloodline Arcana which causes missed Spellcraft checks to mis-identify the spell as any other spell you choose and you can bamboozle your opponents into thinking you're doing just about anything.
I love that. have them think you are casting a level 9 spell so they crap themselves.
doesn't matter how much force the door needs The target can not weigh more than 5 pounds.
Mage Hand
School transmutation; Level bard 0, sorcerer/wizard 0
Casting Time 1 standard action
Components V, S
Range close (25 ft. + 5 ft./2 levels)
Target one nonmagical, unattended object weighing up to 5 lbs.
Duration concentration
Saving Throw none; Spell Resistance no
doesn't matter how much force the door needs The target can not weigh more than 5 pounds.
Mage Hand
School transmutation; Level bard 0, sorcerer/wizard 0
Casting Time 1 standard action
Components V, S
Range close (25 ft. + 5 ft./2 levels)
Target one nonmagical, unattended object weighing up to 5 lbs.
Duration concentration
Saving Throw none; Spell Resistance no
Ok, I'm targeting the doorknob.
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I do like mage hand for moving disarmed weapons (most one-handed and other light weapons) away from an enemy's square.
BUT WHY DO THAT WHEN YOUR MAD MONKEYS CAN JUST DESTROY THE WEAPON MWAH HA HA HA
Magic jar. Pretty much makes you immortal and can grant you all sorts of cool abilities.
targeting the knob is at the decision of the DM. Since it part of the door. So that may not work at every table. That would be like saying I am going to disable that lock by turing the tumbler inside of it.
As a side not when I dm I rarely use door knobs since they were not invented until the 1800s. Unless the scenario says they are there.
targeting the knob is at the decision of the DM. Since it part of the door. So that may not work at every table. That would be like saying I am going to disable that lock by turing the tumbler inside of it.
You can't walk up and turn tumblers in a lock without resistance. That analogy isn't related to the topic at all.
Edit: or knotted rope or whatever is serving as a pull for the door.
You can peak in a lock and see the tumbler. If you look at locks the tumblers off little resistence. The keys would break if they did. Unless it is a complex lock, you would be able to peak in and look at it. Heck if it is too dakr cast light in the lock and then mage hand the tumbler.
Heck you target pieces of an object. You could shred a rope targeting one thread at a time, unscrew screws(it is less than 5 pounds of force holding them in usually), destroy any machine that uses small parts.
Finlanderboy, if you can pick a lock with a single barehand with no problem then you're a better man than I.
It is not a single hand thats flaots arouns. It is a magical force that lets you manipulate an object that weighs less than 5 pounts. the spell never says your hand has to fit in the spot or that you need space of your hands to do things. I am abusing the loose ruling you gave the spell that I never would.
if you could move a door knob, why not a tumbler in a lock? Both can be visible. Both in their bare essentials are under 5 pounds. I am providing you logic of why you could not use it to open doors.
Findlanderboy,you and I disagree. I think you're very off base and not open to interpretation other than your own. Hence I've stopped trying to reason with you. Also, this conversation is off topic.
Just let it go, dude. We're not going to agree.
It is not a single hand thats flaots arouns. It is a magical force that lets you manipulate an object that weighs less than 5 pounts. the spell never says your hand has to fit in the spot or that you need space of your hands to do things. I am abusing the loose ruling you gave the spell that I never would.
if you could move a door knob, why not a tumbler in a lock? Both can be visible. Both in their bare essentials are under 5 pounds. I am providing you logic of why you could not use it to open doors.
No, what you are providing is logic of why it COULD be used to open doors, and why it could even be used to unlock them.
Though without ranks in Disable Device I'd say the Wizard would be outright confused by the inner workings of the door and not able to do anything with it.
It is not a single hand thats flaots arouns. It is a magical force that lets you manipulate an object that weighs less than 5 pounts. the spell never says your hand has to fit in the spot or that you need space of your hands to do things. I am abusing the loose ruling you gave the spell that I never would.
if you could move a door knob, why not a tumbler in a lock? Both can be visible. Both in their bare essentials are under 5 pounds. I am providing you logic of why you could not use it to open doors.
No, what you are providing is logic of why it COULD be used to open doors, and why it could even be used to unlock them.
Though without ranks in Disable Device I'd say the Wizard would be outright confused by the inner workings of the door and not able to do anything with it.
Also it's the key ability of the Arcane Trickster PRC not something a level 1 Mage Could be able to accomplish.
I do not think any caster should be able to do that with mage hand. The definition is too loose. I would consider a construst like a door to be all part of the same thing. Thus a doorknob part of the door. Not a seperate targetable piece.
So if cast invisbility on the door the door knobs and hinge brackets and such stay visible? Or does that spell understand?
What about Feather Fall/Fly + Dim door + Already summoned monster? You make a monster dim door it up. You don't go down but that badger sure will.
Can you summon him in mid-air to drop on some poor bastard? Yes. The environment supports him. The material does not.
Incorrect.
A creature or object brought into being or transported to your location by a conjuration spell cannot appear inside another creature or object, nor can it appear floating in an empty space. It must arrive in an open location on a surface capable of supporting it.
The rules state this explicitly. You cannot drop meat-bombs via summon spells.
That works fine, assuming you can tell your summons not to resist your magic instead of tearing off to eat the face of your nearest enemy. What you can't do is immediately summon meat-bombs.
Yes there are ways to create meat bombs. No one doubts that. But summon monster alone does nto do it. As much as I would love to create a meat bomb.
I need to find a way to make a PFS mad meat bomber....
These creatures don't need land to survive on their own.
"Land, sea, and air" are not environments. Birds don't live in the "air" environment. They may live in a jungle, or forest, or tundra and then fly THROUGH the air to get around, but their environment is not "in the air".
<later....>
Yes. I guess that makes the person I was replying to correct, for the wrong reasons.
Not necessarily. My argument was that "Land, sea, and air" are all part of the environment these creatures live in. A fish can no more breath air, then a horse can breath water. A bird can fly and walk in it's environment where a horse can only walk.
Just imagine a horse in an all air environment. Apart from the amusing imaginary of legs-a-kickin-goin-nowhere-horse, the fact remains it wasn't meant to be there, and couldn't function that way for very long. Just as a fish out of water couldn't function for long either.
It's all a moot point with the rules quote Turin provided, but I think that just solidifies that the intent was that "land, sea, and air" are part of that "environment".
As a side note: I also just realized that when a summon dies, they go back to their plane where they heals up and can be summoned again in 24 hours. It would be a cruel existence to be pulled out of your realm only to fall instantly to your death, and then every 24 hours wait for it to happen all over again :)
Yes there are ways to create meat bombs. No one doubts that. But summon monster alone does nto do it. As much as I would love to create a meat bomb.
I need to find a way to make a PFS mad meat bomber....
We should expect a 3pp to produce a meat-bomber base class any week now ... ;)
Blistering Invective for one, to get on topic with the op. Love the flavor and with my high intimidate bonus this spell delivers kicks to me that many don't. I also like the pit line of spells for obvious reasons, summon monster 4+ great stuff.
+1 on Blistering Invective. Something about cussing up a storm so vitriolic that those who hear it will burst into flames just speaks to me :)
Prying Eyes.. little orbs of scouting awesomeness. (also, for some reason every-time I cast it i burst into private eyes by hall and oates)
Telekinetic Charge.. Add reach spell and freak out your friends.
I was going to say liberating command until I realized it doesn't work for you personally. Still good for a that little extra boost for a high escape artist friend. Also its immediate action so it doesn't cost you much.
Put Anticipate Peril in a wand to use before you go into battle for a nice little bonus to initiative. Not really worth a spell slot though.
There's that "Implant Bomb" Feat...
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Grace. Every cleric and paladin should always have it prepared.
Gallant Inspiration. Immediate action to retroactively add 2d4 to an attack roll that just missed. Doesn't stack with the bard's Inspire Courage, but should still increase that perform bonus the vast majority of the time. Even better if you happen to be the type of bard who doesn't use Inspire Courage.
One thing I've always wanted to do is get a bunch of masterwork weapons, shrink them permanently, and store them in a Handy Haversack. Bam, a weapon for every occasion!
That works fine, assuming you can tell your summons not to resist your magic instead of tearing off to eat the face of your nearest enemy. What you can't do is immediately summon meat-bombs.What about Feather Fall/Fly + Dim door + Already summoned monster? You make a monster dim door it up. You don't go down but that badger sure will.
Can you summon him in mid-air to drop on some poor bastard? Yes. The environment supports him. The material does not.
Incorrect.
A creature or object brought into being or transported to your location by a conjuration spell cannot appear inside another creature or object, nor can it appear floating in an empty space. It must arrive in an open location on a surface capable of supporting it.
The rules state this explicitly. You cannot drop meat-bombs via summon spells.
I am happy with this though. If I could IMMEDIATELY summon meat bombs, I would abuse it immediately and ruin the fun. After the first dozen times, it is just another type of damage roll. But if you have to actively work to make it happen, running stealth checks and hoping their perception checks do not cut you off, you start to build up anticipation. Once you actually pull off the drop, that anticipation makes it GLORIOUS!
Sift (0), Bard/InquisitorSearching larger areas fast and without getting dirty is just great and its infinite. No DM interpretation or fiddling required.
I don't know what others concentration checks are like but its impossible to get spells of when grappled by anything that actually grapples so best to avoid the grapple checks by searching those ominous pits, pools and piles of detritus from range..
+1 for Sift. My inquisitor used it to search the bottom of a pit I sure as hell wasn't going into. He used it again to examine a room behind a locked iron bar portcullis.
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Spark, 'cause at 1 gp a pop for tindertwigs, I'm not smoking anything.
On the issue of mage hand vs locks. Old simple locks are actually really hard to open quite often. When you take the mechanical advantage the shaft of the key provides I believe you well over 5 pounds of force even for a Victorian era house key. I live in such a house and the old keys are almost as strong as a screwdriver and require more force to turn (enough to break a screw at the very least). Heck my 10 year old modern lock requires more than 5 pounds of force to open. And yes, I broke at least 2 keys on it (and it took more than 5 pounds to do that even though modern keys are weak junk it seems).
My favorite spell? Reverse gravity. As a player I've used it to take brutes out of the fight while the archer picks them apart. As a GM I've used them as magical traps (jump across a gap, actually its a reverse gravity area and the spikes are on the ceiling and the pit is an illusion hiding the handholds to get across), 1 way up elevators, and mancannon launchers for the air support wing of a castle. I've also kill 1 PC by dismissing the spell.
On the issue of mage hand vs locks. Old simple locks are actually really hard to open quite often. When you take the mechanical advantage the shaft of the key provides I believe you well over 5 pounds of force even for a Victorian era house key. I live in such a house and the old keys are almost as strong as a screwdriver and require more force to turn (enough to break a screw at the very least). Heck my 10 year old modern lock requires more than 5 pounds of force to open. And yes, I broke at least 2 keys on it (and it took more than 5 pounds to do that even though modern keys are weak junk it seems).
My favorite spell? Reverse gravity. As a player I've used it to take brutes out of the fight while the archer picks them apart. As a GM I've used them as magical traps (jump across a gap, actually its a reverse gravity area and the spikes are on the ceiling and the pit is an illusion hiding the handholds to get across), 1 way up elevators, and mancannon launchers for the air support wing of a castle. I've also kill 1 PC by dismissing the spell.
I started the made hand/door conversation. I was only saying you could open a non locked non bared door with Mage hand. Basically if you could open a door using a knob (or equivalent)with a single hand and little to no resistance you should be able to push/pull that same door open with magehand.
If a door is locked/bared/jammed/etc Mage hand would not work. For
That matter open/close wouldn't work in many of those cases either.
Only arcane tricksters can unlock a door with something similar to Mage hand.
I started the made hand/door conversation. I was only saying you could open a non locked non bared door with Mage hand. Basically if you could open a door using a knob (or equivalent)with a single hand and little to no resistance you should be able to push/pull that same door open with magehand.
Apparently, you see the spell as exerting roughly 5 lbs of force (approximately 25 Newton, IIRC). I see it as gently manipulating about 2 bottles worth of stuff, generating 0 Newtons, 'cause magic ain't physics, and the spell is all or nothing.
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Burning hands because I really hate swarms.Elemental Aura, because PFS loves swarms. (My magus carries a couple in scroll form)
Speaking of spellcasters and swarms and PFS, I'm reminded of a funny incident.
We were playing a 7 player table in tier 8-9 of a 5-9 PFS adventure. I had my level 6 controller sorcerer who doesn't do direct damage. He doesn't even own a weapon, or have a single direct damage spell. His offensive spells are things like Haste, Glitterdust, and Grease.
So we run up against some swarms, and my sorcerer pulls out alchemist's fire, when everyone figured I'd have Burning Hands or something.
The funniest part? None of the other 6 characters at the table had any acid or alchemist's fire, so I was the only one. Luckily, one of them had a necklace of fireballs, and a couple had flasks oil and the spark cantrip, or we would have had to run from the encounter for lack of firepower. Two alch fires just aren't enough against the type of swarms you see at tier 8-9.
Apparently, you see the spell as exerting roughly 5 lbs of force (approximately 25 Newton, IIRC). I see it as gently manipulating about 2 bottles worth of stuff, generating 0 Newtons, 'cause magic ain't physics, and the spell is all or nothing.
I started the made hand/door conversation. I was only saying you could open a non locked non bared door with Mage hand. Basically if you could open a door using a knob (or equivalent)with a single hand and little to no resistance you should be able to push/pull that same door open with magehand.
Essentially, yes. It's semantics but hardly game breaking or even particularly noteworthy. Frankly,I'm a little surprised that some feel so strongly about it.
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Two alch fires just aren't enough against the type of swarms you see at tier 8-9.
The last swarm I encountered was army ants. The DM decided to withhold the the fact that ants were still clinging to the players after they left the swarm, since nobody made the knowledge check. He just started assigning damage each round without any explanation as to source.
Elemental Aura is my response. Continuing damage as an emanation.
I'm unreasonable fond of SM II, because Elementals. Earth Gliding earth elementals, Air elementals just messing everybody up, Lightning Elementals charging guys in metal armor for +20 to trip or disarm (even with a GM who reads the bonuses as replacements, it's still +15), Mud Elementals using Entrap, Magma Elementals because lightning fires in the middle of the enemy fortification is just great, Ice elementals... the smoke elemental is missing.