So, I have an idea for an Aasimar who believes that she is the chosen one of Lissala, considering her bloodline traces back to the goddess. I thank Set for coming up with the racial appearance for that idea, as a side-note! I do not know which campaign I will player her in, but if it is Kingmaker (as me and my pals had planned) or another where she can establish her rules over a nation, she plans to create an empire where she could welcome her blessed ancestor and reinstate her worship properly back on Golarion.
She believes that the seven sins approach of the Runelords is a perversion of the arts of rune magic, and the seven virtues should be reintroduced, since she believes Lissala always was Lawful Neutral (or even Lawful Good)* instead of Lawful Evil. What I wondered was that which option would work best for her, stat and story-wise. Should she be a Cleric of Lissala, a Wizard who studied the ways of her cult among the Cyphermages of Riddleport, or an Oracle of Lissala? I know the least about the third, and I wonder what Mysteries fit the goddess and are worth taking from a game mechanics view.
So basically, which class would work best with the basic stat bonuses of an Aasimar? No alternate bloodline.
If I go Wizard, what school to specialize in? Divination is going to be a restricted school for fluff reasons, but which other one to scrap if I do make her a specialist Wizard?
If I go Cleric, which domains to take? I thought to take Leadership and Thought sub-domains since others didn't seem so good.
If I go Oracle, what mystery would fit the deity and make her useful? I know nothing about building an Oracle.
Apologies for the borderline TL;DR of this thread.
* = Considering that the The Virtues of Rule were generosity, love, humility, temperance, charity, kindness, and zeal, she really doesn't SOUND evil.
One friend suggested Theologian or even Separatist, the latter making sense due to her disagreeing with the current branch of Lissala cultists aka those who believe in sin magic and self-whipping. Where is Guided Hand from and what does it do?
I see, though it would feel kind of odd having a bookish Crusader like that.
Core Rulebook, Ultimate Combat, Ultimate Magic and the Inner Sea World Guide, assuming we go with the DM we had in mind.
Wizard and Oracle aren't options in your opinion? Then again, I know nothing of how to play an Oracle like I said earlier, so whatever.
How good is the Evangelist archetype for the Cleric? I can see her being the Charismatic Leader type as well as the typical support Cleric.
Would I want to play one if we already have a Fighter / Hellknight in the party?
Just saying that the Battle Mystery doesn't seem like one that Lissala would have granted.
I'm sorry if I sound like I'm shooting down your ideas. I'm just kinda stuck to a specific vision of this concept...
Define focus. I'm going to ask the player.
My Fighter/Hellknight idea is:
LN, Two-handed fighter using scythe and sunder.
Possibly Feint if I get my intelligence 13.
I have also thought about taking Exotic weapon profience Net, but I don't know how good that would be since it can be used only against creatures of own size or smaller (it would be kind of more to the RP).
Protuberanssi is the player of the Hellknight in question.
Would Sunder count as a disable tactic? Scythe's got a hard-hitting crit for damage, so I'm not sure what to make of that sentence.
I can see Pathfinder Savant / Arcane Savant as a good Prestige Class option for this character, regardless whether I go Arcane or Divine caster here. Also, I told Protuberanssi about making a thread for this Hellknight. Still wish more people would give their input here. Is everyone asleep over in the US, or is this day somehow keeping them more busy than usual?
Apologies. Hope you can get some rest, bro.
Though isn't such a long lack of sleep really unhealthy?
Anyway, I'm still conflicted of whether to go Wizard, Cleric or Oracle. The confirmed other characters are a Ninja and the Hellknight. Depending on my choice, the fourth player will probably (not 100% sure) either choose an arcane or divine caster so we fill all the needed roles. After reading the Lissala article, I'm starting to like the personality I've been developing for this character. Her OCD antics go to Uncanny Valley level at times.
With the powers of chaos and evil, I revive this thread from its hour-long slumber!!
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Actually, with Spellscar granting Use Magic Device as a class skill, and with the Pathfinder Savant as a possible dip, you could be quite a UMD focused PC.
Are you allowed to take any alternate racial traits, because the +2 to UMD instead of the Daylight ability is nice?
Also, the +1/2 to the oracle's level for the purpose of determining the effects of one revelation Favored Class bonus is nice.
I could always take a trait that grants me Use Magic Device as a class skill, I think.
What alternate racial traits were available for the Aasimar anyway?
And where the hell is everyone else?
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Oracles' mysteries have a link to deities based on the god's domains.
Lissala's domains are : Evil, Knowledge, Law, Nobility, Rune
AFAIK, there is no Mystery based on Aligment, so we are left with Knowledge, Nobility and Rune.
Based on this, I think the Lore mystery is appropriate. Not sure how good it is though. You should check the guide to the Oracle (link in the Guide to the Guides thread).
My DM said Oracle might fit better than Cleric for this character, but I'm still not entirely sure.
Lore is a decent mystery, and it would actually be useful for the party as a whole.
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Well, an Oracle can have any Mystery, no matter their god.
They can worship no god.
The first part is true. The second one is also true if it means that Oracles do not have to worship a god to get their powers. Note however that Oracles are not barred from worshipping a god (or any entity or concept they feel like worshipping).
Still, the Mysteries' description in the APG list Deities as its first item. And it is pretty obvious to me that the Deities listed for a given Mystery have in common a Domain (sometimes several) which is very close to the Mystery in its theme and abilities granted.
Thus they can be useful as a guide for a specific character concept.
...still little input aside from blackblood and raven here.
Ok, the thing about Lissala is, unless your GM is going off their own personal take on her; she was always Lawful Evil.
Which means either a) the seven virtues of rule weren't actually her idea. Or, b) don't mean what we think they mean to Lissala & her worshipers. Of course either possibility has a lot of RP potential, which could be a lot of fun.
Side note: In the original write-up for Rise of the Rune Lords it wasn't the Seven Virtues of Rule that were corrupted into what we now consider the Seven Sins, it was the Seven Rewards of Rule, which were completely different.
It might be a good idea to clarify with your GM where (s)he is going with that.
All that said, I am inclined to agree you are likely to get more mileage out of Oracle than either Cleric or Wizard, and the idea of a Legalist curse Oracle Aasimar who worships Lissala but is actually descended from the real source of the 'Seven Beatific Virtues' in Golarion is pure RP gold.
My only other comment would be that Kingmaker would be almost be a wasted opportunity for the Character unless the GM is willing to do some serious re-tooling since, as-written, there isn't really anything to tie the AP to the themes that character concept would really shine with, with the simple exception of rulership itself & to be painfully honest, the name aside, Kingmaker isn't really about Rulership.
So, you'd suggest saving this character for a Rise of the Runelords / Shattered Star game instead?
Also, where was it said that she was ALWAYS Lawful Evil? I should probably ask James Jacobs about that.
Where was it said that someone else came up with the seven virtues? I'd prefer actual sources for what you are saying...
Point out to your buddy that objects are immune to critical hits. The scythe's nasty multiplier won't do him any good when sundering.
I'll let him know. And apparently Lissala was always evil and the Seven Virtues was the idea of someone else.
As much as I'd enjoy the whole "misled in her beliefs" path for this character, I'll probably revamp her concept entirely.
Just kinda disappointing, since I had such a cool plan for this character if she survived till 20 and Lissala had some good in her.
Now that I think of it, an Aasimar Monk / Paladin / Champion of Irori who believes in the Seven Virtues as a path to perfection sounds very enticing right now.
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That she is "misled in her beliefs" does not mean that your character cannot actually redeem Lissala and make her a LN goddess.
Belief works in mysterious ways after all.
Aka Ask your GM. He just might find this cool and intriguing enough to let you give it a try. I know I would.
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Yep, believers trying to redeem their god is nearly the holy grail of redemption plotlines. If it doesn't work, perhaps this character could shift towards a more fitting deity.
But if it can work....
And hey, there's already precedent for this sort of character with a certain sculptor of a popular line of statuettes! ;)
Considering that my former DM is the only one who gives a damned about Golarion as a setting, my chances of achieving that are slim. He's the same cynical jerk who had every NPC of my first game spit at the face of my CG Cleric of Pelor simply because she was a nice person. I was honestly surprised that when we ran Council of Thieves, Palaveen actually became sort of a Vegeta of the Children of Westcrown instead of going for a backstab and running off. But hey, that just shows that my character DOES have a chance to bring Lissala over to the side of good, as slim a chance as it may be.
And what do you mean with that last sentence, Mikaze? O:
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They all came from an elusive and eccentric sculptor living in Magnimar, who has been studying the monuments of that city to try and understand and emulate some of their benign divine power.
The fact that she's an intersexed polydactyl tiefling is the least surprising thing about her.
The reason she's so secretive is that she's a heretical worshipper of the demon lord Nocticula who believes that her patron is really a fallen Empyreal formerly dedicated to art and midnight who secretly yearns to return to her former state of grace.
The fact that the mainstream cult of Nocticula actively wants her dead hints that there might be some truth hidden in there.
Definitely one of the coolest NPCs to make a recent debut. :)
...wait, which book is this from?
I was supposed to be the Golarion expert!!
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Magnimar, City of Monuments.
The statuettes have shown up in a LOT of APs, to the point that I honestly can't recall them all offhand. Heck, they might actually be in the APs I haven't read because I'm playing in them.
Huh, I should read it again when I get home. I bought it just for the Empyreal Lord entries. Shame on me for missing that.
Will do when I get home and get some other stuff outta the way.
Also, what do you think Mikaze? Should this Aasimar be a Cleric or an Oracle?
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Both have options to make it work, but oracles and their mysteries/curses always seem to be natural fits for those with unconventional beliefs. They also work out nicely if this character develops pantheist leanings rather than dedication to a single deity.(if the Irori thing happens)
Curses easily play into selling the connection and interpretation of that deity as being strained as well.
There's two ways this character can go in her backstory.
Either she believes she can redeem Lissala, and remains a Cleric / Oracle.
Or she becomes disgusted with Lissala and shifts to Irori, starting out as a Paladin instead.