On the other hand, OP, as you cite the lack of an Anti-Paladin as being a testament to badfun, may I suggest that the anti-social attributes of an anti-paladin sort of ruin the day of other people and cancel out their fun, so if thats your idea of a good day then perhaps Society (you know, being social and stuff) probably isn't your bag?
Shifty I can see how you might think that. First, I don't like Anti-paladins due to the lack of lay on hands self healing.I just think it's an example of organized play limiting choices,which was thepoint of my original post.Yes being social may or may not be "my bag" you will get no argument there.
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I apologize to those of you who know and love PFS for all the many positives listed in this thread,my opinion hasn't changed so much personally as broadened to see it more as a big picture where the goal is to be as appealing to as many players as possible. Mission accomplished! Do I personally think 20 pt buy is restrictive, perhaps although not as much as before. Do I think 25 should be reasonable? Yes, as it is a choice offered by the Core Rules and opens up more player choices. Am I against joining a PFS game? Certainly not, if one presents itself in my area, I would gladly like a chance to try it. So again thank you to all who contributed to this thread, even the ones who found the original title abusive. For that, I apologize, yet I don't think all these great points might have been offered if the title hadn't grabbed peoples notice.
Venture-Captain, California—San Francisco Bay Area South & West
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Another point: I ran my first home game over 30 years ago. But I've still got things to learn - playing (and judging) at PFS events has taught me a few new wrinkles that I'm applying to my current tabletop campaign.
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Conundrum--Where do you live approx? I can assure you that there is probably a game near to you if you wish to join us for a game or two.
Like I spoke in my letter, we understand your desires for a less restrictive game. But if your wishes are that, then perhaps Pathfinder Society is not for you. But before you knock it, give us a chance to let you make an educated decision. You would be surprised as to what we can do with 20 points.
Conundrum--Where do you live approx? I can assure you that there is probably a game near to you if you wish to join us for a game or two.
Like I spoke in my letter, we understand your desires for a less restrictive game. But if your wishes are that, then perhaps Pathfinder Society is not for you. But before you knock it, give us a chance to let you make an educated decision. You would be surprised as to what we can do with 20 points.
I live in Maine dearest Lady, I haven't heard of any society games up this way, the closest thing would be a game at a hobby shop 45 miles from where I now live :-/.
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I've played PFS for just under 18 months now.
I signed up for it because I wanted a chance to learn the rules that my friends knew so well in preparation for a home game I'd been invited to. They had at least a years experience on me and I wanted to make up some ground fast.
On my first game day, the organiser and my GM were both great people and helped me sort out the nitty gritties of character creation.
The games, Voice in the Void and Deliriums Tangle, were fun and the other players were more than happy to explain any rules or issues that arose throughout play.
This experience is the reason that I play and run PFS games today.
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I started playing PFS to learn the rules as I had just finished a D&D 3.5 campaign and was told Pathfinder was like D&D 3.75. Is society I have the ability to GM or play and learn the rules and finer points with out having the hassle of coming up with a story.
I now run a home game for friends and by starting out in society play I feel comfortable running a game and helping them build and level their characters. Once Summer is over I will be retuning to society play to continue learning the rules and functions of all the classes.
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Mostly I joined because my regular group splintered into fragments due to schedule differences. It doesn't scratch the itch for a long, unified campaign, but it does satisfy my craving for interesting scenes and combats. And I don't have to worry about keeping the same few people together over month after month.
These are all great answers that I can clearly identify with!
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I've heard in many threads the this or that isn't allowed and 95 % or so of the time we're not even talking 3rd party material, so yes when compared to the paizo published material available to what is allowed in PFS yes seems restrictive. Many of the posters here have swayed my view slightly, those who stated their points without resorting to direct attack style statements. Thanks for the enlightenment for those with constructive points! To the rest of you, troll on ;-) I shall revel in the nerdrage a while longer.
Instead of reading threads where people are kvetching about what they can't play, maybe check out the Additional Resources and see all extra the stuff that IS allowed.
Alternate, less helpful answer:
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Also, I get to play an aasimar paladin without level adjustment. :) I haven't had this chance in my normal groups yet.
May I just say I have an envy issue at your good fortune?
Normal groups I am involved with wont accept Aasimar, so PFS is about the only place I'm gonna get to roll with one, but wow those Boons are rare.
I am determined to get one though, by fair means (or foul - I also like playing Sczarni, capice?) of course.
Psst, anyone know a guy who knows a guy who has an Aasimar boon in the basement?
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I feel ya Shifty. PaizoCon didn't have aasimar or tiefling boons available at ALL. I was fortunate one of the players I GMed 'The Midnight Mauler' for had one she didn't want. At first we were going to trade, but I ended up not getting any boons she wanted, and so she just gifted it to me. I was quite happy. Hopefully you'll get as lucky.
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Actually:
End of Eyes of the Ten: lvl 13 and 2xp
after Academy of Secrets: lvl 14 and 2xp
after Tomb of the Iron Medusa: lvl 15 and 2xp
after Race for the Runecarved Key (T12+): lvl 16 and 0xp
after The Moonscar: lvl 17 and 0xp
after Witchwar Legacy: lvl 18 and 0xp
So you can get to lvl 18 after Moonscar comes out.
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That means that you won't see any level 12 and up scenarios in the foreseeable future.The New special will have Level 12+
1) I know of at least two level 15 characters after the Grand Convocation.
2) You can show up to Race for the Runecarved Key with an 18th level character and still be challenged. Promise. >:)
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1) I know of at least two level 15 characters after the Grand Convocation.
2) You can show up to Race for the Runecarved Key with an 18th level character and still be challenged. Promise. >:)
When I think of "scenarios" I don't usually think of the Specials or Grand Convocation(s), which are definitely starting to stretch the level cap boundaries. :)
Honestly, I think it's a good thing to have special events that retired characters can play in.
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That's not quite accurate. Modules are still hard-capped for tier and given that virtually all modules top out at 11, you're still effectively capped at 12. Post 11th level modules top out at 13. But I think we're talking one mod a year tops.2) 12 lvl cap: No longer exists, you can play modules to level 20 (and get credit for it)
Nah, you can go up higher than that.
-Ruby Phoenix Tournament 11th
-Academy of Secrets 12th
-Tomb of the Iron Medusa 14thYou can play a mod +/- 1 from the recommended level so you could feasibly hit 15 or so. Witchwar is 17...maybe if you could hit 16 then you could feasibly hit 17. There's a mid-teen module in the pipes I think.
Well assuming you get through Eyes of Ten, you will be level 13.2, then Academy of Secrets whould put you at 14.2, and Tom of the Iron Medusa at 15.2, then play a Paizo Con or Gen Con special at the 12+ Tier, and you are 16th level, just ripe for Witchwar.
I also thought a level 16 module was due out soon?
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Do we really want to commit to a black and white setting
Actually, we already have. Detect Good/Evil and Law/Chaos. These are not abstract values in the world of Golarion, they are hard concrete facts by which people live. The Gods determine Good and Evil, Law and Chaos. And such things determine where you spend your afterlife. There is no moral gray area. Two different people using detect evil on the same person will get the same result.
It might be different in a home game, but in the "official" Golarion, we are in a black and white setting.
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Do we really want to commit to a black and white settingActually, we already have. Detect Good/Evil and Law/Chaos. These are not abstract values in the world of Golarion, they are hard concrete facts by which people live. The Gods determine Good and Evil, Law and Chaos. And such things determine where you spend your afterlife. There is no moral gray area. Two different people using detect evil on the same person will get the same result.
It might be different in a home game, but in the "official" Golarion, we are in a black and white setting.
So, in all of the thought experiments above, you would kill the drow? Even if they've yet to commit a crime? Maybe a (fanatic?) Lawful Good would feel it's his duty, but otherwise... well, I guess we have quite different moral compasses.
Edit: Either that, or you're saying agents must submit inevitably to circumstance, never being able to rise above it. Well, out goes even the pretense of free will, chances for redemption and/or magnanimity.
Plus, again, orcs are not an option, half-orcs are. Why not the half-drow?
I'm not saying I personally agree with it. I just am stating the fact that in Golarion, Good and Evil are concepts defined by the Gods. We just live with it. And the problem with characters that are the exception to their race in organized play is that they are no longer the exception. Drow are Evil. Says so right there on the tin. You want to be the oddball who tries to be "Good" in drow society? Go for it. But that game isn't Pathfinder Society.
Director of Brand Strategy
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Half-drow do not exist in Golarion, and if there were one or two that did exist (which is incredibly unlikely given that drow are irredeemably evil and not interested in making half-drow—except maybe driders) they'd be the focus of a large story like an AP or a novel or something like that rather than a dime-a-dozen PC concept. While we have half-drow traits in the ARG, that's more for folks using the Pathfinder RPG rules for their own games than for the Pathfinder Campaign Setting specifically.
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I'm not 100% sure this is right, but it's the impression I'm under.
PFS doesn't allow half-drow because half-drow don't exist in Golarion. The ARG has the half drow traits because it's a setting neutral book.
According to this:
Half-drow are subsumed under half-elves. Of course, you'd need the half-drow traits to really be different (otherwise, at most, you'd have a cosmetic half-drow: mechanically, it would be a half-elf).
And we would then have 432,894 Drizzt wannabes as wellLol, I fear that as well... but seriously, just because most people are uncreative doesn't mean that we should stifle other's choices.
Just because it is in the d20PFSRD does not mean it is part of Golarion.
Because you physically cannot have a half-drow in Golarion unless a half-elf turns completely to evil.
If this is the case, what would the offspring resulting from a drow x human mating be? (No one said it had to be consensual, right?)
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Because you physically cannot have a half-drow in Golarion unless a half-elf turns completely to evil.If this is the case, what would the offspring resulting from a drow x human mating be? (No one said it had to be consensual, right?)
You know a developer, Mark Moreland, has indicated that there are no half-drow in Golarion. That the Drow have other evil nefarious plans that don’t include making half-drow. It’s just upthread.
Drow, in Golarion, apparently aren’t into raping human women.
Drow, in Golarion, apparently aren’t into raping human women.
On the other hand, I can imagine humans not being above raping captured drow.