Hello Pathfinder community!
I'm a cold-turkey DM with a group of newbie players. We've been playing for months but I wanted to clarify some rules. I had to make up some rules on the spot due to my limited understanding.
Sorry for the upcoming wall of text. I've placed both questions in spoiler tags to reduce clutter. Thank you in advance for any input you have!
Question #1:
Apparently, double attacks only apply if your base attack is +6 or more. My group has been doing it from level 1. However, you can only make a five-step move after spending your turn to attack twice using our rules. The same rules apply for monsters as well.
My understanding was that each character had two "points," so to speak, and could spend them moving, attacking or both. Same rules apply for spells: a standard action spell can be used twice in a turn, but a full-round one requires the whole turn. A monk still gets 1 extra attack compared to the other classes with Flurry of Blows, too.
Is this completely wrong or game breaking?
A dual-wielding character, such as the rogue in our group, gets to hit with both weapons for a single attack. Each weapon has it's own check against the target's AC, so he could miss with one hand and hit with the other. If he uses both of his "points" to double attack, that means four individual checks against the target's AC. Since daggers typically do 1d4, it doesn't seem too crazy.
Question #2:
Perception check for Sample Character
1d20 + perception skill = result vs DC
Let's say it's DC 22. So if his perception was 5, and he got a roll of 19 on the die, it would be:
19 + 5 = 24 vs DC 22
His roll is higher than the DC 22, making it a success.
In our version, though, we do it like this:
1d20 = DC 22 - 5
His perception skill subtracts from the total difficulty. Instead of trying to beat a DC 22, he only has to beat a DC 17 now.
We do it this way for pretty much everything. The only thing that gets a little bit tricky are the fort/ref/will saves, but we've found a reliable method for that. Which way is correct?
Regarding #2:
You add it, not subtract from the DC.
PF is fairly hard to pick up "cold turkey" with no knowledge of 3e. Bravo for the attempt!
Question #1:
Characters typically have a move action and a standard action. They can spend their standard action to perform a move, but not the other way around. They can spend both their move action and their standard action to perform a full-round action.
In order to use more than one attack, a PC or monster needs to use a full-round action.
The main reason only one standard action is allowed per turn is because spellcasters would very quickly be overpowered if they could cast two regular spells in a turn.
Even if this rule-change might not upset the game balance at lower levels, it very likely will be game-breaking within a few levels.
***
Question #2:
The "other" way is the normal one. Due to the amount of bonuses a character can gain to their skill rolls, attack rolls, and other types of rolls, it's usually easier to calculate it that way.
That also means you don't have to use different DCs for each character. Say each character in your group gets to roll Perception in that example. Instead of having to calculate separate DCs for each of them, they simply make their rolls, add their bonuses, and give you their result. Everyone who beats the DC gets the information.
1. Ehhhh..... your best bet is probably to reread the Combat section of the Player's Handbook carefully, then explain the mixup to the group and try to work with the core rules. At this point it might not be a huge deal, but later you're going to run into some unexpected mechanics with feats and such that will likely cause problems. The game isn't really balanced for a two standard action turn. When you get to higher levels, the term "rocket tag" will reach a whole new level.
Just be sure to stress that the bad guys have to play by the rules, too. ; )
2. The first method is technically correct. Mathematically, they're the same. I can't think of any sneaky rules that would alter the two methods' equivalence. That said, most people find it easier to quickly apply bonuses to the die roll than subtract from the target, and getting through die rolls quickly is a good thing.
Thank you for all of your input. I'll definitely make the appropriate changes.
I thought that double attacks might interfere with combat, and I was right. I was thinking of leaving it just because it made battles a bit faster. I need to be change it, though. Thank you again.
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I made this, printed it out onto cardstock, and gave one to each of my players for my current campaign since half of them were either new to Pathfinder or new to tabletop gaming. It's really helped them and it'll likely help you.
Basic gist is you pick a column, pick one action from each box, and execute them in whatever order makes the most tactical benefit for you. I left the boxes blank for the surprise round since they're already printed over on the right.
The most common actions for a particular type of action are underlined near the top. Actions that provoke attacks of opportunity are labeled as such.
Enjoy!
I made this, printed it out onto cardstock, and gave one to each of my players for my current campaign since half of them were either new to Pathfinder or new to tabletop gaming. It's really helped them and it'll likely help you.
Enjoy!
Oh wow, that's awesome! Thank you for posting that. Simple charts like this should be standard for the Pathfinder rulebook. I'm definitely going to use this.
@Ansel: On your chart it says that it's a full-round action to just prepare a splash weapon to be thrown - is this really correct? A full-round action to prepare and then a standard action next round to throw?
@Ansel: On your chart it says that it's a full-round action to just prepare a splash weapon to be thrown - is this really correct? A full-round action to prepare and then a standard action next round to throw?
That should probably be modified to indicate that it's a full-round action to prepare a flask of lamp oil (tear off a strip of fabric from your favorite shirt, uncork the bottle, shove the cloth in, etc.) to be used as a splash weapon.
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/equipment---final/goods-and-services#TOC-Oil
If you had a flask of alchemist's fire, it'd be a move action to retrieve it and a standard to throw; both actions provoke attacks of opportunity.
EDIT: Updated the previously linked document with the described changes.