In an already existing campaign, we often run into the issue of bringing in new players.
If bring new players in at the average party level. The existing players feel this is unfair as they had to earn their levels. Also, I've had new players complain they don't feel a connection to their characters if they are artificially advanced to a higher level.
If you make new players start at level 1, then their survivability odds are low. Making them stay in the back and avoid combat until they get enough XP to level up is long and dull.
Suggestions?
I bring them in at the current party level. At one point in time I use to bring them in 1 level lower. Any lower than that hurts survivability, and it is harder for a GM to create encounters.
I don't see how not starting at level 1 makes you feel less connected so I can't comment on that. Whether I create a level 1 or level 10 character the dedication is the same for me.
As for earning levels I can see that argument, but if you bring in weaker party members it decreases the chance for the group's success, and "if one of us is stronger then all of us are stronger" is how I look at it.
If the GM is expected to make the fights easier because the new guys are a lower level then he is handing out XP and nobody is really earning all of their XP/levels anyway.
Let your players know that when you bring them in at a level above 1, it gives a great chance for them to have a more in-depth back story to reflect their level of power. So you're a level 4 Rogue.. talk about the store robberies you've done, the stealth jobs you've succeeded in.. The time you got caught, but talked your way out of prison! Level 1 characters can't have that many "cool" stories.
Let your players know that when you bring them in at a level above 1, it gives a great chance for them to have a more in-depth back story to reflect their level of power. So you're a level 4 Rogue.. talk about the store robberies you've done, the stealth jobs you've succeeded in.. The time you got caught, but talked your way out of prison! Level 1 characters can't have that many "cool" stories.
Exactly. They can make up stories about how they got to some of their more expensive equipment, like magic items and such things or can have accumulated some fame (or infamy) already. Things like that. If you're willing to write on your backstory you can create a relatable and fun character at a higher level.
As has been said before, the moment a player character goes too far from party average level, they will become useless and/or very fragile in combat encounters, unless the encounter is made for a lower level, in which case the rest of the party will just breeze through it and it'll become too easy for them.
Lastly with the current XP system lower-level players will never truly catch up with the party unless they go soloing while the rest just kicks back and gets drunk or something.
One or two levels below party maximum (with minimum XP for that level) is probably a good guideline. For consistency, existing players whose characters lag too far below the highest level party member should be leveled up by the same guideline so as to keep all party members competitive and survivable. It then becomes a point of pride for players who were there from the beginning to show up often enough that they are never awarded those bonus levels.
We play at our friendly local game store, and though we are running a full Paizo adventure path, new players join every module.
Bringing in the new characters at one level below the maximum character level in the party works best. Being less powerful than the average party member means that the new character does not have as drastic an effect on the party dynamic as a full-power character. If the party has a mixture of two levels, the new characters start at minimum experience for their level. If the party shared one level before the newbies arrived, the new characters start at middle experience for their level or even close to leveling up.
When half or more of the party is at maximum party level, we award extra experience point, usually about 10%, to the characters who are behind a level. It is nice to have game sessions in which every character is at the same level, before the most experienced character breaks through to a new maximum character level. It also helps the players who missed a few gaming sessions to keep up in level.
The existing players feel this is unfair as they had to earn their levels.Are you sure they would actually care? Are they there to have fun and play a game or are they just spending time leveling up a piece of paper? I would hope the former.
Yes they did. I tried to bring a new guy in at their level and 3 of 4 players said they felt it was unfair. The new people should "earn their stripes" they said.
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It doesn't matter what level they are introduced at, I kill off their characters in the first session. It sets their expectation for the campaign and they form a bond with my existing players. Nothing cements a friendship like having a common enemy.
After I'm done the player can sweep up his torn up character sheet and paste it back together and the party can sell his items to raise him from the dead or he can bring a character in at the same level as the rest of the players.
Ask for a detailed background for their characters and let them enter at the party level. Maybe you can give them less gold, but not by much, something like -10% from the current PC with less gold.
I keep all my players at the same level, it is just too much of a headache for pcs to be at varied levels in terms of managing and creating interesting encounters. I would explain to the other players that it is perfectly fair for the new character to come in at the same level, so they can effectively contribute to the group, and that if they prefer we can restart everyone from level 1 instead, but that they will all be at the same level in the party.
As for the new player I would tell them to treat it as a first level character. You have a background and now you are deleloping the character in play as normal. Even at level 1 the characters had a life prior to the start of the game, if you just treat it that way, you should connect fine to the character.
The fairness argument is fairly ridiculous. This game is a STORY meant to be shared with your friends whenever you can manage to get together. Whether it be once a week or once every month or two. You continue to play because it is FUN. And life happens, people have to stop playing, and others who find that they now have time to play, for whatever reason. If there is anything in the mechanics that is preventing someone from having fun it needs to be adjusted. Having a level 1 tagging along with a party of level 11's will (in 99% of cases) diminish someone's fun, and thus needs to be changed. (sure there might be a few who would love the RP challenge, but i don't know anyone who would even agree to roll a character in that situation.)
This is PnP, you tend to play infrequently. This is not WoW.... let me me repeat that for your players NOT WoW. You don't have to spend countless tedious hours over months grinding out levels in order to have a night of gaming with your friends. In fact, it is precisely this reason that i gave up MMOs, if my friends have already been playing for a year there is no real way for me to game with them unless i can sink a good chunk of my life into the game. (this is not to say some MMO's don't have ways of mitigating it, but with PnP its easy...)
Just my take, sorry if it was ranty.
Never do the “first level” thing.
One level behind is OK, no more than that.
Another way is to ditch eps altogether. Everyone levels at the same time, as the story unfolds, after so many encounters.
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Not uncommon complaints by your new players, but not practical. Lower level PCs means they'll contribute less (in skills, combat) but earn the same XP, and that's no fun for anyone when you've got dead weight or don't feel like you're a part of the team. It's a good way to isolate the lower-level players and drive them away.
Your players should remember it's all about having a good time; it's not a competition.
Kolokotroni stated it perfectly for me on how to treat that "lack of connection" feeling. Purely a fiction if one uses imagination.
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I allow a player's first character to come in at a level equal to the average party level. If they loose a character (death, retirement, etc), the next character is one level lower than the average.
i also give some experience bonuses or minor rewards to players who provide a good back story, role play well, use creative solutions, forward the story, or take risks that pay off. This means that players do have an opportunity to catch up.