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I'm interested in making a hybrid Monk/Magus. My current plan to present to the GM is simple:
Start with a base Magus.
Remove Martial Weapon Proficiency. In place of that, give the Monk Unarmed Damage progession with Improved Unarmed Strike (no flurry).
Remove all Armor Proficiencies and casting while armored abilities. Give the Monk AC bonus, only utilize Intelligence instead of Wisdom.
Spellstrike and Spell Combat only works with Monk Weapons or Unarmed attacks.
Those would pretty much be the changes I'm currently looking at. The problem is I'm not sure if there are balance issues I'm missing at present. One concern I have is maybe making the Monk AC Bonus an Armor Bonus in this case to prevent stacking with Mage Armor (though not sure it's that big of a deal or not).
Any suggestions/recommendations?
The mage armor isn't a big deal. a Monk by level 20 has a crappy Ac compared to other front liners whom can use +5 heavy armors for big numbers. I think with mage armor you might pull about even except you wont have access to other magical armor benefits like additional powers from enchants.
Soo a lv 20 monk magus +5 from monk levels + 6 with a 22 Int (Assuming no int bonus from race) (Or 28 with a Boosting item) int and +5 from mage armor Gets a 26 AC. Not counting dexterity or other AC boosters.
Looking at the lv 20 armored magus we get +9 from plate armor +5 from enhancement bonus on said armor. +5 from deflection bonus on mage armor. for a 29 ac without dexterity or other ac boosting things.
Looking at the lv 20 armored magus we get +9 from plate armor +5 from enhancement bonus on said armor. +5 from deflection bonus on mage armor. for a 29 ac without dexterity or other ac boosting things.
Mage armor isn't a deflection bonus and doesn't stack with armor.
I don't doubt it, Maxximilius. I'd like see how that's done, if you wouldn't mind.
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I don't doubt it, Maxximilius. I'd like see how that's done, if you wouldn't mind.
CONSERVATIVE NUMBERS?
+6 dex mod, + 7 wis mod, +1 dodge, +2 class, +1 belt o the monk, +4 bracers of armor, + 3 ring of protection, amulet of natural armor +3 + 10 is 37. combat expertise could net a few more.
some archtypes can get more.
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I'm interested in making a hybrid Monk/Magus. My current plan to present to the GM is simple:
Start with a base Magus.
Remove Martial Weapon Proficiency. In place of that, give the Monk Unarmed Damage progession with Improved Unarmed Strike (no flurry).
Remove all Armor Proficiencies and casting while armored abilities. Give the Monk AC bonus, only utilize Intelligence instead of Wisdom.
Spellstrike and Spell Combat only works with Monk Weapons or Unarmed attacks.
Those would pretty much be the changes I'm currently looking at. The problem is I'm not sure if there are balance issues I'm missing at present. One concern I have is maybe making the Monk AC Bonus an Armor Bonus in this case to prevent stacking with Mage Armor (though not sure it's that big of a deal or not).
Any suggestions/recommendations?
look at the kensai archtype for a starting point
i'd say just use kensai blackblade, allowing any monk weapon or unarmed strike to be used.
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Easy. Level 20 PB, reasonable optimization, normal lvl 13 equipment ; qinggong archetype, Crane Style user.
+6 Belt/+6 Headband, Monk's robes, +4 bracers of armor, +1 Agile amulet of mighty fists :
Base:
8
17
14
10
16
10
With +6 Dex belt, +6 Wis headband, +3 points from leveling :
8
26
14
10
22
10
AC : 10 + 10(Wis+Monk) + 8(Dex) + 4(Armor)
= 32/28/24.
Now the fun begins.
Use Barkskin from level 4 qinggong : +5 to AC.
Use Crane Style : +4 to AC.
Spend a Ki point as a swift action : +4 to AC for 1 round.
AC : 10 + 10(Wis+Monk) + 8(Dex) + 4(Armor) + 5(Nat) + 8(Dodge)
= 45/36/29.
EDIT : Oh yes, forgot the ring of protection, and the possibility for a specific monk to stack a +2 shield bonus from Snapping Turtle style. Also, some buffs giving sacred bonuses. It could reach 50 I guess. That's more AC than a CR 25 Tarrasque.
well thanks for the optimization lesson but none of this helps Xzaral out much.
There was one thing that really should have.
Someone made this already. It's called a Kensai.
Monk AC. Crazy stuff.
@Xzaral: Seems fine to me. A magus can't cast mage armor unless they grab the spell blending arcana. So, keep that in mind when you build your character and present it to your DM.
I'm interested in making a hybrid Monk/Magus. My current plan to present to the GM is simple:
Start with a base Magus.
Remove Martial Weapon Proficiency. In place of that, give the Monk Unarmed Damage progession with Improved Unarmed Strike (no flurry).
Remove all Armor Proficiencies and casting while armored abilities. Give the Monk AC bonus, only utilize Intelligence instead of Wisdom.
Spellstrike and Spell Combat only works with Monk Weapons or Unarmed attacks.
Those would pretty much be the changes I'm currently looking at. The problem is I'm not sure if there are balance issues I'm missing at present. One concern I have is maybe making the Monk AC Bonus an Armor Bonus in this case to prevent stacking with Mage Armor (though not sure it's that big of a deal or not).
Any suggestions/recommendations?
The Kensai is more focused on perfect single strikes, while a monk is capable of many attacks.
And the Shield spell / Spell Shield arcana is a Magus' best friend. Mage armor is just silly.
For your Archetype:
Diminished spellcasting?
I think Arcane Pool would need some tweaking, making it more like the monk's ki pool (extra unarmed attack; bonus to speed; dodge bonus to AC). Perhaps add a feature that allows the Magus to enhance both fists with same bonus for extra points (or simply say that the enhancement bonus applies to all unarmed/monk weapon attacks for 1 minute).
I would give them some ability that grants them at least one extra unarmed attack per round (give Two-Weapon feat for free at 1st level, perhaps, but only have it apply to unarmed attack/monk weapons).
Perhaps swap out some Magus features for a couple of key Monk features (slow fall, still mind, and purity of body, etc).
Just some constructive thoughts.
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First thank you on the responses!
The Kensai is an interesting take, but I do unarmed strikes work with spellcombat, spellstrike and all it's other abilities with it? And while I can match part of the flavor with it, would an Unarmed Kensai be able to compete with other classes? (flavor is great, but if mechanically it fails, then it's no fun for the party).
Trying to be a little clearer with my goal, I'm trying to hit the flavor of a character I've tried to make a couple other times but can't seem to get quite right. It blends unarmed combat with spellcasting, which as I understand the base magus cannot do. Previous tries have used:
3.x Enlightened Fist
Gestalt Sorcerer/Monk
Both types just couldn't compete due to needing so many ability scores to do anything.
Diminished Spellcasting for additional monk abilities wouldn't be a bad trade off, I'll look at comparing them.
As far as the extra attack, I didn't give Flurry as it still had Spell Combat. Or is the tradeoff not worth it?
I'll try putting together a test archtype with some additional monk influences.
Made this a while back, might save you some time if you like it:
It can't flurry, but flurry and spellcombat are mutually exclusive anyway.
Flak, that's pretty cool! Seems like a real good fit for Xzaral's unarmed magus.
The only complaint I'm seeing is everything is still wis based instead of Int based, and I like skills. Of course that's part of the tradeoff. Gonna mess with that for abit. I think it'll work.
I think you could just swap INT & WIS and make no other changes and it wouldn't be unbalanced. Skill ranks vs. Will save & Perception. Seems fine to me.