Eldritch knight: you can get the telekinetic spells (telekinesis, obviously, and all the ex-bigby's hand spells). For the weapon get a brilliant energy weapon (or, if you want to cut stuff in addition to people, a keen flaming adamantine weapon).
... For the weapon get a brilliant energy weapon (or, if you want to cut stuff in addition to people, a keen flaming adamantine weapon).
The classic SUN SWORD
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Yeah, but that first level should be cleric to maximize effectiveness.I am actually thinking cleric of Irori. Get channel smite and guided hand feats. Consider the wisdom of the flesh trait.just a straight cleric?? you could use one level of cleric and gain entrance to crusaders flurry and go into monk. the thing i like about monks is they mimic the force ability and operate without armor.
first level cleric expedites entry into the force portion of things. but really is 4 levels of paladin not useful?? you get fear immunity disease immunity cha to saves martial weapon profficiency, the detect spell like abilities, lay on hands plus one mercy (now the barbarian loves you since you can remove his fatigue) and solid bab progression and oh yeah SMITE EVIL 2x per day.
if im looking at a long term character 16 levels of monk will be enough to make me a force master and those first 4 levels of paladin are going to make me much happier with my saves. if u use a guided weapon your stat priority goes to wisdom>charisma>dexterity>con>int>str.if you only plan on making it to mid levels then sure stick to a quick cleric dip or even an oracle dip take the channel revelation and then go monk for quick force. one of the monks greatest abilities is maneuver training. so a pally monk gets full bab for maneuvers and flurry of blows, where as a cleric monk or oracle monk gets full bab-1.
if were talking optimized with a 25 point buy i see a human like this at level 1
STR: 10 DEX: 13 CON: 14 INT: 13 WIS: 17(human 2 points) CHA: 15.
at level 4 increase wisdom to 18 at level 8 cha to 16, at 12 dex to 14.
its easy to start play with a +2 item of dex cha and wis for the low price of 12k for the three items putting your primary stats at
wis 20, cha 18, dex 16 by level 12. thast plus 4 to all saves, plus 5 to att and damage, a nice ki pool for extra attacks and force effects, and enough dex to warrant combat reflexes. also your ac by level 12 can easily be (5 wisdom, 3 dex, 2 monk, 4 ki power barkskin=24) not a bad ac for a guy with no armor. and your flurry of blows with a +1 guided scimitar is at (5 wisdom, 6 monk flurry bonus, 1 guided, 1 weapon focus=23/23/18/18) and another attack at 23 if you spend 1 ki point.each attack dealing 1d6+5(wis)+1(enhancement) with a 15-20 crit chance so out of your 4 attacks assuming one crits= 45 dpr. if none crit 36 dpr.
i will point out that this requires a few feats
crusaders flurry, improved critical scimitar, weapon focus scimitar.
but even by level 12 that leaves you all your monk bonus feats wide open and 4 of your 7 feats open (assuming starting human) id suggest for flavor the panther style feats (3) trip feats (2) combat expertise (for greater trip)
when all this is said and done you open up your flurry with an improved trip (you get the ao so you dont lose any dpr) but your foe then takes a -4 to ac vs your 4 attacks and they are prone yeah.
Hrmph.
I may be alone in this, but I don't think Jedi have any place in a fantasy RPG. I don't think any of the attempts to bend magic into Force powers are even moderately-good matches... the whole THING is going to be a limping patchwork.
And nothing really simulates a lightsaber.
There are multiple systems available for playing Jedi. Pathfinder isn't one of them.
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And nothing really simulates a lightsaber.
It's pretty easy to conceptualize:
(new magic item)
Aura strong transmutation; CL 13th
Slot none; Price 91,000 gp; Weight 3 lbs
Description
A rod of disintegration is an intricate device approximately ten inches long which upon activation generates a cylindrical blade of magical energy four feet long. It causes damage in melee as per disintegrate; targets receive a Fortitude saving throw as per disintegrate.
A rod of disintegration is a 5' exotic weapon in the heavy blades group; it has no critical-threat range, and its damage is not subject to modification by ability scores, feats, class abilities, magic, or other effects.
Construction Requirements
Craft Rod, Craft Magic Arms and Armor, disintegrate; Cost 45,500 gp
= = = =
(Cost rationalization: an unlimited/use-activated CL13 rod costs 182,000; I cut that in half due to limitation of melee. Given the ability to meet out 5d6 to 13d6 with a single hit, I didn't see any rationale to reduce it further.)
I would further expand that without exotic weapon proficiency, there is a 20% chance that one could accidentally hit themselves with the blade. Even with Exotic weapon, such care needs to be taken with the weapon that only 1 attack per round can be made. Otherwise the wielder can have multiple melee touch attacks that deal between 5d6 and 13d6 points of damage depending on a DC 19 Fortitude save for each hit.
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I would further expand that without exotic weapon proficiency, there is a 20% chance that one could accidentally hit themselves with the blade. Even with Exotic weapon, such care needs to be taken with the weapon that only 1 attack per round can be made. Otherwise the wielder can have multiple melee touch attacks that deal between 5d6 and 13d6 points of damage depending on a DC 19 Fortitude save for each hit.
So?
13d6 averages 45.5, which is about what an optimized melee build can achieve per hit around 10th or 12th. The rod merely permits a non-optimized build a means of similar damage, albeit at a very expensive price. The no-additional-damage stricture reins in the potential for abuse (i.e., munchkins claiming 26d6 via Vital Strike, etc). It does 13d6 or 5d6 (save) regardless of what your strength is, how many buffs you have, Challenge or Smite or anything else. It does exactly what it does, and nothing else. (You can't even sneak-attack with it, because that's an adjustment to damage.)
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IMO a druid "without wildshape" variant would fill in the Jedi "Consular" role quite nicely too.
Jedi seek to bring balance to the force, so are Druids "bring balance to the world"
From a mechanical point of view the following spells could interpret as lightsabers
Shillelagh (or however it is spelled) /Druid 1, can count as a OP saberstaff
Flame Blade /Druid 2, is the spell version for lightsaber. Light, elegant deals fire damage and it is immaterial.
I would further expand that without exotic weapon proficiency, there is a 20% chance that one could accidentally hit themselves with the blade. Even with Exotic weapon, such care needs to be taken with the weapon that only 1 attack per round can be made. Otherwise the wielder can have multiple melee touch attacks that deal between 5d6 and 13d6 points of damage depending on a DC 19 Fortitude save for each hit.So?
13d6 averages 45.5, which is about what an optimized melee build can achieve per hit around 10th or 12th. The rod merely permits a non-optimized build a means of similar damage, albeit at a very expensive price. The no-additional-damage stricture reins in the potential for abuse (i.e., munchkins claiming 26d6 via Vital Strike, etc). It does 13d6 or 5d6 (save) regardless of what your strength is, how many buffs you have, Challenge or Smite or anything else. It does exactly what it does, and nothing else. (You can't even sneak-attack with it, because that's an adjustment to damage.)
Think about the bolded part. Now, take an non-optimized build, hell, even a bad melee class like a wizard. Now give him a weapon that allows him to deal, lets call it 46, points of damage on a hit on average. Keep in mind, he can have multiple hits, and each hit is a touch attack. Any class, regardless of bonus to hit, would now be viable damage dealers in melee as they can bypass a large part of most defenses. Hell, he can just as easily use the lightsaber to sunder the guys gear to devastating effect.
Remember, Disintigrate is deals untyped damage, meaning it's magical in nature. It overcomes DR and Hardness. Hell, because you're not actually casting a spell, it overcmes SR too just like the flaming ability on a weapon overcomes SR. So now you've got a weapon that strikes against touch AC, overcomes all DR and Hardness, ignores SR, and can easily destroy all your gear, or destroy you.
With that in mind, my previous post still stands. Granted, I know this item is largely a joke and will never see the light of day, but it's sometimes the best ideas start off as jokes.
remember jedi have no verbal or somatic components in there force powers.Im going to disagree with the somatic bit. Most instances of ""Force push" are acompanyed by a hand gesture. And remember this gem:
Qui-gon: Credits WILL do fine.
Watto: NO, They won't! What do you think you are, some kind of Jedi, WAVING your hand around like that?
Every one of Vader's force powers was accompanied by rhythmic, heavy breathing... not a traditional vocal component, but still...
Also, every time we see a Jedi use Suggestion, they seem to need to say the suggestion out loud to the recipient, also a vocal component.
Yoda is the only force user in the original trilogy that didn't need a somatic component when using telekinesis. Even Obi-wan needed to use a somatic when manipulating a small lever.
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Think about the bolded part. Now, take an non-optimized build, hell, even a bad melee class like a wizard. Now give him a weapon that allows him to deal, lets call it 46, points of damage on a hit on average. Keep in mind, he can have multiple hits, and each hit is a touch attack. Any class, regardless of bonus to hit, would now be viable damage dealers in melee as they can bypass a large part of most defenses
At 91,000gp, the rod is nearly the cost of a +5 weapon -- it's an amazing tool, but it won't make you insanely good at something you're not already trending in the direction of; and there are a lot of other options available with that kind of money.
Taking the wizard example you provide, if we stipulate that he's not optimized for melee, I'll assume he has neither Weapon Finesse nor EWP:RoD, and has a lousy (probably negative) STR score. In other words, making strength-based melee touch-attacks at a further -4 non-proficiency penalty is a really lousy deal compared to casting an Empowered ranged touch-attack spell, and leaves his squishy heinie standing right adjacent to the drooling BBEM.
The rod is also a static weapon -- it never gets any better, and it can't be upgraded. By the time you're 20th, every NPC's kid-sister's niece will beat the fort-save, you'll have long since relegated the thing to the bottom strata of your haversack.
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Think about the bolded part. Now, take an non-optimized build, hell, even a bad melee class like a wizard. Now give him a weapon that allows him to deal, lets call it 46, points of damage on a hit on average. Keep in mind, he can have multiple hits, and each hit is a touch attack. Any class, regardless of bonus to hit, would now be viable damage dealers in melee as they can bypass a large part of most defensesAt 91,000gp, the rod is nearly the cost of a +5 weapon -- it's an amazing tool, but it won't make you insanely good at something you're not already trending in the direction of; and there are a lot of other options available with that kind of money.
Taking the wizard example you provide, if we stipulate that he's not optimized for melee, I'll assume he has neither Weapon Finesse nor EWP:RoD, and has a lousy (probably negative) STR score. In other words, making strength-based melee touch-attacks at a further -4 non-proficiency penalty is a really lousy deal compared to casting an Empowered ranged touch-attack spell, and leaves his squishy heinie standing right adjacent to the drooling BBEM.
The rod is also a static weapon -- it never gets any better, and it can't be upgraded. By the time you're 20th, every NPC's kid-sister's niece will beat the fort-save, you'll have long since relegated the thing to the bottom strata of your haversack.
i like the idea of this rod honestly. requiring a feat to adequately use it means that it wont become an item everyone has to carry. also taking into account that the higher level you become that 19 STATIC fort save will become easier and easier to make. so when this sees melee combat around level 12 every fighter paladin barbarian and the like will take 5d6 average 15 damage per hit. agreed it should hit almost every single time. so at level 12 if you are hasted thats 60 damage a round. give a level 12 character a plus 5 weapon and haste even non optimized a fighter will have weapon specialization, a barbarian will have rage these both equate to 2 additional damage per attack with a one handed weapon. barbarian or a fighter weilding a keen +4 scimitar (just a for instance) with an 18 base strength and a +4 item (22 str) attacking 4 times in one round (hasted) with a 25% chance to crit will average
3 dmg for weapon and 8 for strength and feats and 4 damage for enhancement thats 15 damage per hit. now one of those can crit so thats a 30 damage hit. now give the same barb of fighter a falchion. same general idea on stats and feats4 dmg average per hit, 11 (fighter) 12(barbarian) from strength or feats, and 4 for enhancement for 19 (fighter) 20 (barbarian) per hit and double that for one of those 4 attacks on average for 38 to 40 from one hit.
now also take into consideration that the biggest brutes with the most hp often times have the beset fort saves and lower than average armor. now enter power attack
at level 12 -4 to attack to add +8 or +12 per hit. this makes the lightsabre seem limp in comparison to a piece of metal that didnt even require a feat to use.
one more thing to consider, magic meet magic. dispel greater dispel, dysjunction, antimagic field, high level creature specifically immune to disintigrate (yeah not common but possible)
and in closing is there a single character in the game that would think a good use of a full roudn action was doing 30d6 damage in melee was a good use of there time. and thats hasted.
now if you could find a way to craft that rod at later levels and apply metamgic feats to it. like highten spell maximize or empower now your talking. id actually think that owuld make for a very interesting character. though id require they make there own lightsabre. make them take a special craft feat for it (craft lightsabre should be mandatory imho) and allow them to enhance this as time went on. maybe it starts out as a searing ray sabre or hell a ray of frost sabre. and eventually becomes a maximized empowered hightened by 5 disintigrate sabre. of course youd have to find some kind of cap as to what level it could be raised to but that really gives it a jedi feel.
again i see a monk with this feat and ability very closely resembling the foot soldier jedi we see in moveis and cartoons.
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a quick idea for the feats.
feat type general item creation
name craft lightsabre
requirements level 5
description
you can craft a lightsabre as a magical item the cost each lightsabre is based off the price of a similar rod though there are restrictions and modifications to this. first the spell put into the rod must do hit point damage no stat damage or other effects. second the spell must have a range of touch, ranged touch, or target. no spells that affect an area. the rod is a manual activation item and is activated as a free action. it is treated as a melee weapon with 5' reach. the costs are modified depending on the spell being used by it. a spell with a range further than touch has its crafting price reduced by half where all spells with a range of touch cost the full amount. the spell stored in the lightsabre can be improved with metamagic feats. u must posses the metamagic feat to imbue the lightsabre. the minimum caster level of a spell in your lightsabre may never exceed your caster level. the dc of the spell in the lightsabre is always consider minimum unless affected by highten spell or another metamagic feat.
Rules for using a lightsabre:
a lightsabre is a melee weapon. it is capable of critcal strike at 20x2. just like a ray or touch spell the lightsabre may be the subject of weapon focus or weapon specialization spells. also if the wielder of the weapon possess any feats that raise a spells dc they may apply those if the spell falls into that category. if the wielder has an ability to add metamgic feats to a rod or triggered magic device these may also be used with the lightsabre. every lightsabre is considered to be of masterwork quality.
feat type combat
exotic weapon profficiency lightsabre
requirements craft lightsabre
you no longer take a -4 penalty while wielding a lightsabre.
feat type general creation
craft weapon crystal
requirements level 11, craft lightsabre.
you can modfiy a lightsabre to use additional spells in the form of crystals. each crystal is crafted with the same cost and limitations of a lightsabre. removing a crystal is a standard action attaching a new crystal is a move action.
benefit: your lightsabre can now utilize a variety of spells though still limited to one at a time.
normal; your lightsabre has only one spell.
feats that may be applied to a lightsabre
imrpoved critcal would give it a crit range of 19-20 and only at a *2
this would only be useful if the spell being used is capable of a critical strike.
weapon focus would grant a +1 to hit
greater weapon focus would grant an additional +1 to hit
weapon specialization would grant +2 damage
greater weapon specialization would grant +2 more damage
the hilt of a lightsabre is a weapon. though it produces a spell used as a blade it is still a weapon.. and therefore could be enhanced magically. though no precision based damage or additional damage from stats can be applied. enhancements like returning distance and base enhancements are recommended.
additional rules on lightsabres
lightsabres may not be used to deliver sneak attacks or other precision based damage (unless the spell specifically says that it can be or in the case of an ability that allows you to add sneak attack dice to a spell effect such as the arcane trickster) they are not subject to power attack or deadly aim (when thrown) and cannot be used with any other weapon feat other than those listed above.
combat maneuvers and light sabres.
light sabres are weapons crafted of pure energy they can be used to sunder but do not have the physical density required to perform trips, disarms, dirty tricks, grapples, bullrush, overruns, tramples, or reposition manuevers.
new feats for lightsabres only
name: One with your blade.effect: you may now use a mental stat modifier in place of the minimum casting stat to determine the spell save dc of the spell from your sabre.
rapid loading: you may now exchange the crystal in your sabre with another as a move action so long as the replacement crystal is easily obtainable (i.e. in a pocket or in hand not in a bag of holding or hidden on your body)
Boomerang toss: requires dex 13, effect: you may throw your lightsabre and have it strike an opponent within 30 feet and return to you in the same round.
well thast all i cam up with feel free to nit pick or add thansk
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could maybe reduce the level of the feats to 3 for craft lightsabre and 7 craft crystal. maybe even 5 for crystal.
and i got the feats backwards the exotic weapon proff should be a requirement for craft lightsabre not the other way around.
and in the case of a spell with multiple rays or targets only one ray or missile would be imbued into the rod not damage from all. (see magus spell strike ability as my reference)