Fetish material for sure, even when not-nude. Yep, can't take paizo's catfolk decision seriously. Such a bad move.Fortunately, you don't have to. Because, obviously, the catfolk were not created for you.
We put catfolk into the Bestiary for pretty much one reason—because they were far and above the MOST requested zero HD race on these boards. The fact that there are cat people in the Elder Scrolls, or cat people in various other incarnations of D&D, is nothing more than other companies reacting to the same simple fact that, whether or not any one person likes the idea of a cat humanoid race... it IS a very popular one.
If you don't like catfolk, they're easy enough to ignore in games you run.
Doesn't mean it was a bad idea to put them into the Bestiary, though.
Can I hug you?
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Quick, someone go to the Homebrew "Sick of Humans" thread and tell them they got their wish. There shall be no humans ever, any more. From now on it's Thrikreen or bust!So we can only play as a race that someone didn't make a porn about...dang I hate half-orcs;)Don't worry, half-orcs are banned too.
BAD NEWS
(/tg/ had a field day with that one)
The problem with catfolk, is that it is so firmly (choose another word) established as fetish material prior to paizo taking it on board and making it a new race. Now they could make this a joke and run with it, by giving the catfolk the special ability "yiff".
If they want to borrow from popular fetishes, that is fine then, but I want my Goatse men. I want it as canon tomorrow!
Again, you're choosing to ignore the vast amount of mainstream, non-furry, non-fetish examples of feline humanoids out there, that existed long before the furry fandom. Not to mention ignoring the fact that Furry is not a fetish, except to a specfic subset of the fandom. Just like, oh, halflings are not a fetish, except for those who have a thing for hairy feet. If such a player goes on and on about their hairy feet, then yes its an issue. If not, who cares?
I guess Paizo should omit mention of furniture too, huh 3.5L?
Or Balloons, rope, feet, arm pits, wings, etc.
You'd have to erase most of reality to avoid it entirely, as I like to say: Humanity wants to have sex with everything, I've even got a speech, that I'm not about to share here because it's somewhat vulgar.
Wait...what?
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While I have been some what antagonistic of Blastoguy's position I think I understand is fear. He wants the rp and subject matter of the game he is running not to go in certain directions. He is willing to say that some stories such as Redwall though are animals are done in a manner he likes. He because of established PF lore believes the rp directions one can play a ratfolk or a kitsune are less precarious than catfolk he points to some stereo types that exist and points to the fact that absent of depth in lore the places a player will pull from involve rp he does not appretiate, or approve of.
Now to me this is an opportunity to develop my own culture. Give the cats a place in the world and lay the tracks for the player in a way that as DM I would appretiate. If I did not have the time for this I would let the player come up with and add some guidence.
If either of these failed I would search for a treatment of catfolk, or felines that I liked that struck the tone I wanted.
Wait...what?
Think of something. Someone, somewhere, has a fetish for it, and there is probably porn of it.
Quick, someone go to the Homebrew "Sick of Humans" thread and tell them they got their wish. There shall be no humans ever, any more. From now on it's Thrikreen or bust!
BAD NEWS
(/tg/ had a field day with that one)
POR QUE!?!
not sure what /tg/ stands for, but I forgot that just the mere mention will create porn of it. Gaming is over folks, go home.
Furniture was furniture first, before furniture porn. I don't buy zappo's theory, that drawn feline humanoids came before the furry-fetish at all.
The mention of halflings and orcs misses the point. They were in fantasy before they were in fetish-fantasies. For the catfolk, they were in fetish-fantasies long before paizo picked them up. Furry fandom is around, there is huge amounts on the net, and yet paizo brings them in? Hence my request above.
Weapon fetishes, magic fetishes, fight fetish, adventuring fetish, paper fetish, Internet fetish, computer fetish, word fetish, dinosaurs fetish, ponctuation fetish, number fetish, money fetish, etc fetish...
Creative Director
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Hmmm... The name probably should have done it, but I'm now filing 3.5 Loyalist's posts under "It's a Trap."
I would file it under "insincere use of the word 'sincerely,'" but since we're devolving into internet memes, the first option makes more sense.
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Furniture was furniture first, before furniture porn. I don't buy zappo's theory, that drawn feline humanoids came before the furry-fetish at all.
So they had furry-fetishes in ancient Egypt?
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Quick, someone go to the Homebrew "Sick of Humans" thread and tell them they got their wish. There shall be no humans ever, any more. From now on it's Thrikreen or bust!BAD NEWS
(/tg/ had a field day with that one)
POR QUE!?!
not sure what /tg/ stands for, but I forgot that just the mere mention will create porn of it. Gaming is over folks, go home.
Traditional Games imageboard. They're actually romantics at heart.
http://1d4chan.org/images/4/43/Thri-kreen_and_bard.png
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It's amazing to me that there are people throwing around the argument that there were no anthropomorphized cat-people in ancient times.
The notion is not only insane, but shows a willful ignorance in this day and age.
The "google search" defense doesn't pan out, either. I just did a a google-image search for "cat people" with safe-search turned off.
Wow... no porn. Who woulda thunk it?
"anthropomorphic" turns up a dirty picture... a suggestive piece by Salvadore Dahli on the first page. There are a couple of sexually suggestive pics other than that, but they have nothing to do with animals.
"anthropomorphic cat" turns up a couple of "iffy" drawings but nothing sexually explicit.
Seriously, I think that the objections come from a source of ignorance.. and prejudice in assuming how people who like "people with animal heads stuck on" races (that attitude in-and-of-itself ludicrous when you play a game with "people with pointy ears, several forms of achondroplasia, and piggy faces" and THAT'S ok).
Intolerance pre-judging isn't right in any form. I really don't care about what the DM in charge of his game does, but the way that people who are in a minority group that has to fight bad stereotypes do the same thing to another group of people shows a complete lack of self-awareness.
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Furniture was furniture first, before furniture porn. I don't buy zappo's theory, that drawn feline humanoids came before the furry-fetish at all.
The mention of halflings and orcs misses the point. They were in fantasy before they were in fetish-fantasies. For the catfolk, they were in fetish-fantasies long before paizo picked them up. Furry fandom is around, there is huge amounts on the net, and yet paizo brings them in? Hence my request above.
Oh, look,.....a 19th century illustration by Gustav Dore totally proving your point regarding fetish predating fantasy wrong.
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I guess Paizo should omit mention of furniture too, huh 3.5L?
wtf
You can probably find others on this site, though most of them were ancient gods.
While I have been some what antagonistic of Blastoguy's position I think I understand is fear. He wants the rp and subject matter of the game he is running not to go in certain directions. He is willing to say that some stories such as Redwall though are animals are done in a manner he likes. He because of established PF lore believes the rp directions one can play a ratfolk or a kitsune are less precarious than catfolk he points to some stereo types that exist and points to the fact that absent of depth in lore the places a player will pull from involve rp he does not appretiate, or approve of.
Now to me this is an opportunity to develop my own culture. Give the cats a place in the world and lay the tracks for the player in a way that as DM I would appretiate. If I did not have the time for this I would let the player come up with and add some guidence.
If either of these failed I would search for a treatment of catfolk, or felines that I liked that struck the tone I wanted.
Well the good news is, if golarion continues to contain more catfolk, and the dm follows the setting changes, and the players dislike this, then they can just head around and exterminate all the catfolk they find!
Skyrim for the Nords!
Who hasn't done the above in regards to elves? One of the best games I ever played in had elven genocide. I played a warmage war criminal! His lord called a truce, but old scarface (acid orb to cheek in training) wouldn't back down. Left his own side to continue the war. Even did the Metal Gear thing of getting captured and escaping from jail (plenty fo shout spells) to wreak more havoc.
So its not so bad in game, kill them all. It is just more weird, and now they will pop up in the art and the setting and cause discomfort for probably a large number of players and dms. That isn't bad right?
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Who hasn't done the above in regards to elves?
Me.
So its not so bad in game, kill them all. It is just more weird, and now they will pop up in the art and the setting and cause discomfort for probably a large number of players and dms. That isn't bad right?
Not at all. If they don't like it, they don't have to buy it.
Furniture was furniture first, before furniture porn. I don't buy zappo's theory, that drawn feline humanoids came before the furry-fetish at all.So they had furry-fetishes in ancient Egypt?
I would think so. Incest was also incredibly common.
Who hasn't done the above in regards to elves?Me.
Try it if you dare (not furry, the elf genocide game).
Great for beer and pretzel short games.Why in Golarion it would really work with a party of Razmiranian raiders.
Who hasn't done the above in regards to elves?Me.
Me. I do, however, plan to have elves commit genocide against each other at one point in my campaign setting.
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well I was gonna use this as more evidence against 3.5 Loyalist, but "genociding elves yadda yadda" prolly means obvious troll is obvious, so.......nonetheless cool picture.......
Who hasn't done the above in regards to elves?Me.
I've never done any form of genocide outside of a few video games, usually it's because I'm just defending myself. Bastion is my latest genocide game. Anklegators were nearly extinct BEFORE Queen Anne stole that shard, now there's only the one I keep around as a pet, the rest of them are smeared all over my hammer.
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I'm also going to say I'm a fan of the art too, I like the art Carolina Eade has been doing for Pathfinder (I might like her other work but I haven't come across it).
Been a fan since she first showed up(along with Andrew Hou, Eric Belisle, Eva Wildemann, too many Paizo artists to list...). A lot of her work is featured in Cult of the Ebon Destroyers, a bit in Faiths of Purity IIRC, four portraits in Rival Guide, and a bit of Ultimtae Combat and Inner Sea Magic.
Me. I do, however, plan to have elves commit genocide against each other at one point in my campaign setting.Who hasn't done the above in regards to elves?Me..
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Which one, you have like one hundred of them?
Thyressa. It won't happen in our current adventure, and it probably won't happen in Cromora, but it'll happen, and it'll be caused by rising tensions over modernization.
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I removed some posts. Grow up, people.
Also, flag it and move on.
Just for 3.5 Loyalist: According to Google Catfolk, under that name even, appeared in Races of the Wild and the Miniatures Handbook.
I'd be surprised if there weren't feline humanoids in earlier versions as well, but I don't have any evidence. Other than the Rakshasa of course.
Yep, miniatures handbook page 56. The female catfolk is crouched and presenting her rear to the viewer with the blank dead eyes of a rape victim. No joke. Check it.
Rakshashas are good examples, and go way back, but rakshashas aren't exactly catfolk. There is the reverse paws, the robes, attire or armour and they are also presented far less sexually than catfolk and other general furry material. Rakshasha: more nobles, proud wizards, villains. Catfolk: more sex objects that present themselves.
So why do we need more of this in Golarion again? Is it for the giant dex boost? We have the raks, they have long been in dnd, why add the fetish weirdness? Why put in this new race and try to spread them around?
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I'm going to watch Josie and the Pussycats.
but I'll be back.
I removed some posts. Grow up, people.
Also, flag it and move on.
Disgraceful. It was a well put together letter and everything. I take it you don't highly appreciate satire of paizo?
Disgraceful. It was a well put together letter and everything. I take it you don't highly appreciate satire of paizo?I removed some posts. Grow up, people.
Also, flag it and move on.
I dunno. What do you think?
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I found it was not the characters who were rather shallow and flighty, but the players who were both flakey and a bit self-absorbed. They were nice enough people, but I think the notion of a cat person attracts a certain kind of player of the variety that does not have a lot of stick-to-itiveness. Or much concentration.I'm just glad you pointed out that they were both female; up until that point I thought you were a chauvinist or something...
The truth is they were both female, and I have never had a male player ask to be a catfolk. That is the simple truth of the situation and carries no opinion as to whether female or male players are better. Perhaps I give out too much information, maybe even less relevant information, but I don't consider giving the full story to be chauvinist. I do, however, consider your response reactionary, and in my experience, reactionary people are themselves most often guilty of the thing to which they accuse others.
And for your information, I have more than 50% female players in my games, and I respect each of them highly. Hell, I even live in fear of one of them. I was raised by a mother and a handful of aunts with no major male in the picture for years. I worship and respect women of all stripes. Most of my bosses have been women.
It has been hinted that I am a chauvinist exactly one time in my entire life. And you are the guilty - and wrong - party.
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Furniture was furniture first, before furniture porn. I don't buy zappo's theory, that drawn feline humanoids came before the furry-fetish at all.So they had furry-fetishes in ancient Egypt?
Lets see.. shape-shifting god battles, posthumous fertilization with a severed member, Gods getting into drinking contests, incest .. they probably added the furries for a bit of normalcy.
Hmmm... The name probably should have done it, but I'm now filing 3.5 Loyalist's posts under "It's a Trap."
I would file it under "insincere use of the word 'sincerely,'" but since we're devolving into internet memes, the first option makes more sense.
You dispatched your flunkies to delete my posts, but I still put the question, why did you add or approve catfolk? What was the intent?
I found it was not the characters who were rather shallow and flighty, but the players who were both flakey and a bit self-absorbed. They were nice enough people, but I think the notion of a cat person attracts a certain kind of player of the variety that does not have a lot of stick-to-itiveness. Or much concentration.I'm just glad you pointed out that they were both female; up until that point I thought you were a chauvinist or something...The truth is they were both female, and I have never had a male player ask to be a catfolk. That is the simple truth of the situation and carries no opinion as to whether female or male players are better. Perhaps I give out too much information, maybe even less relevant information, but I don't consider giving the full story to be chauvinist. I do, however, consider your response reactionary, and in my experience, reactionary people are themselves most often guilty of the thing to which they accuse others.
And for your information, I have more than 50% female players in my games, and I respect each of them highly. Hell, I even live in fear of one of them. I was raised by a mother and a handful of aunts with no major male in the picture for years. I worship and respect women of all stripes. Most of my bosses have been women.
It has been hinted that I am a chauvinist exactly one time in my entire life. And you are the guilty - and wrong - party.
Damn straight Bruunwald, damn straight.
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You dispatched your flunkies to delete my posts, but I still put the question, why did you add or approve catfolk? What was the intent?Hmmm... The name probably should have done it, but I'm now filing 3.5 Loyalist's posts under "It's a Trap."
I would file it under "insincere use of the word 'sincerely,'" but since we're devolving into internet memes, the first option makes more sense.
That was asked and answered: it was a very popular request. Paizo does not build the game only for you.
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You know, I've never played a catfolk, didn't really care one way or the other. But now... now, I want to play one. It'll just be ranger or barbarian build of some sort.
There won't ever be any yiffing or fetishism going on. But the "potential" to do so will always be there.
Always. be. there.
Lurking. Waiting.
The idea that at least one specific someone somewhere is having Fredric Wertham-conniptions because I might be "playing an RPG/having fun wrong"... that's too tantalizing to resist.
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@Dudemeister: you can't possibly convince him of that. James has explained his actions, not that he needed to, it's not like he owes us anything. The fact that he's even participating in this... whatever this is... is laudable.