|
I like it so far. A few questions, though. Why use a chakram? And, assuming a level 20 end game, how much alchemist would you say should be used for this version of Mist Assassin? My gut says four; you get two discoveries, 2nd level infusions, and 2d6 sneak attack.
Four levels of Alchemist should be sufficient. The original build assumed a progression of Oracle-Oracle-Rogue, leading to eventually 6 levels of Rogue, but it also focused more on getting extra Sneak Attack and Rogue tricks. Part of the combat of this build would have to be different. Oracle 16/Alchemist 4 should be fine.
The Rogue build focused more on extra Stealth and on things like Combat Trick to get extra feats (Two-Weapon Fighting). The idea was to TWF and QD with chakrams to maximize the number of sneak attacks. The chakrams were chosen for a combination of higher damage output with a thrown weapon and coolness factor. You could easily replace them with javelins and spears.
That might be the thing to do with the Vivisectionist version: Choose Adaptability (Stealth) instead of Ancestral Arms (Chakram), and rely on longspears and javelins. You want to maintain the range to the target so that you won't be perceived; without it, you potentially lose sneak attack.
One question is what would you like to do about TWF? You can TWF with javelins just as easily as with chakrams. But if you're not planning on TWF, then you might be able to save on Quick Draw as well--depends on how much throwing you end up doing.
One other note I'm thinking about is damage. At level 5 you'll be fine, but this is a debuffer-striker build, so you'll want to build damage output quickly. Strength extracts are helpful, as are poisons. Hmm, perhaps drop Dex by 1 point, and increase Strength by 2?
ETA: I don't have UC so I have no idea what the answer is, but would an Oracle/Ninja be a good solution here?
Is your DM allowing any books outside of pathfinder? I have millions of Ideas and want to narrow it down for you.
Is your DM allowing any books outside of pathfinder? I have millions of Ideas and want to narrow it down for you.
The DM *might* be open to outside material, on a case by case basis. Feel free to throw some ideas my way regardless. Worse case, he says no. :)
Is your DM allowing any books outside of pathfinder? I have millions of Ideas and want to narrow it down for you.The DM *might* be open to outside material, on a case by case basis. Feel free to throw some ideas my way regardless. Worse case, he says no. :)
*pops knuckles* this is my specialty lol
in my history 313 class you should see my notebook, its one page lecture notes, followed by a character, repeating of course over like 30 pages of just ideas and stats for feats and crap that i remember.What KIND of character are you looking towards? Dammage(range/melee)/tank/healer?
Few Ideas for you.
Spellcaster who tries to hide his casting abilities from the rest of the group. Silent Spell, Still Spell, cast aroud corners or while stealthed. This requires a high stealth and bluff. Also, you should probably take some melee or ranged weapon abilities. Or, if you prefer, just a melee oriented Wizard/Elderitch Knight.
Rogue "Murderer" who is addicted to killing women. If successfully played, this character could achieve some interesting "OMG" moments in the game when he gets caught.
Have you ever played a Bard? I'm just saying... so many people have never played Bards.
I've always wanted to create a character that makesthese. I would enchant their teeth and let them soak in poisons.
Have you ever considered playing with your characters age... so much so that it changes your stats in either direction?
|
Had this happen once when my characters would die every game (Cthulhu GM running Pathfinder.. great story teller but we all died a lot!) I literally made Paul Bunyan. Babe wandered away at night, next morning I went to find him and through some magical woodsy magic I ended up in the GM's home brew world. It was actually quite fun until Paul died that game, and the GM loved the character concept.Are you from Minnesota by any chance?
Nope, Wisconsin.
I think a kobold monk named "la lagartija con el miedo" the lizard with out fear he should take level of paladin to be truly fearles, dip a few levels in ranger for the favored enemy, of human or if your a total monster giants.
|
ETA: I don't have UC so I have no idea what the answer is, but would an Oracle/Ninja be a good solution here?
Ninja and oracle can be a good combination because they both benefit from high charisma. You give up evasion but there are some really good ninja tricks. Climbing and pressure points come to mind for a build like this. Though vivisectionists mutagens can be tough to beat.
Lately I have been fascinated with using combat maneuvers in fun ways.
Currently I'm liking the Cleric of Besmara (The pirate Queen, goddess of ship wrecks) She is an equal opportunity goddess in that she is famous of raiding both heaven and hell. She is Chaotic Neutral and has a strong ties to pirating but she sounds like a fun god to worship. Since she is neutral you can go either positive or negative channeling which is nice or versatile channeling. I think a cleric of her could be a lot of fun if the personality is suiting to you.
She has the Oceans sub-domain which I think is fun.
Surge (Su): As a standard action, you can cause a mighty wave to appear that pushes or pulls a single creature. Make a combat maneuver check against the target, using your cleric level + your Wisdom modifier as your CMB. If successful, you may pull or push the creature as if using the bull rush or drag combat maneuver. You can use this ability a number of times per day equal to 3 + your Wisdom modifier.
So if you can swing it you could take a 13 strength (or 11 strength plus a belt +2) take power attack, improved bull rush and eventually greater bull rush to make your surge even better. Or Improved drag etc or both! Getting the Greater versions allows the movement to provoke AoOs which is huge when you have a few friends with combat reflexes.
Also she has some other great sub-domains & domains. Deception, Storms, Tactics and protean. All of which are some of my favorites.
Now if The Queen of Pirates isn't your thing there is always Gozreh.
He is a major neutral god of balance with nature. I think he could be boring if you focused too much on being neutral. But you could go all super hard core Darwin survival of the fittest attitude. That could be fun. Any he also has the oceans domain for surge but he additionally gets the Wind sub-domain of air. Which is also very intriguing to me.
Wind Blast (Su): As a standard action, you can unleash a blast of air in a 30-foot line. Make a combat maneuver check against each creature in the line, using your caster level as your base attack bonus and your Wisdom modifier in place of your Strength modifier. Treat the results as a bull rush attempt. You can use this ability a number of times per day equal to 3 + your Wisdom modifier.
You can knock people all over the place with this combo and have a blast doing it. Now it is unclear with this power if improved bullrush would help but if it does it makes a great combo. It will likely be up to your DM.
a goblin paladin who hates other goblins because deep inside he heates himself for selling out to the ways of man, and deep inside he longs to burn stuff down .
the most unusual/cool characters I've played with recently is a gravewalker/vivisectionist arcane trickster childlike halfling... just looks like a kid with a doll .. but is very effective w/in 30'. Spell storing returning dagger which she uses for things like disfiguring touch.
a ninja who pretends to be a farmer,
a bard who is named after the best 70's music artist you can think of
1. Neil The Diamond
2. Sir Tom Of Jones
3. Captian rod stewart
4. Yanni
5. David the hasselhof
A monk who takes every type of vow possible who is a ki pool master, but
who secretly longs ot be a wizard, but is a closet homosexual but instead of men he likes elves, but instead of elves only male drow elves. he has a secret desire to become an elf, with what ever means possible. but he vehemently denies any elf love. ohh he chopped off his own hands to put on adamantine hands for better Dr but was fooled and they are copper painted silver and attract all sorts of electrical damage.
as far as names go, there are three that you can play with a fancy pants anything that will be sure to put awe into the other pcs....
1. Sir Roderick Pons Von Fontlebottom, The Magnificent Bastard
2. Juan Sánchez Villa-Lobos Ramírez
3. Warren Q. Stabbington III. Esquire
2 bards, bill s pretson esquire and ted theoadore logan,
who are awful bards who want to star a bard troupe called, Wyld Unicorn
2. a thief who is awful at a stealing but just wants to dance he secretly enters dance competitions at night and then says the prize money is the "loot he stole" he keeps apparently stealing 1st place dance contest medals.
I think a kobold monk named "la lagartija con el miedo" the lizard with out fear he should take level of paladin to be truly fearles, dip a few levels in ranger for the favored enemy, of human or if your a total monster giants.
La lagartija sin temor
otherwise you have one of those ironic names that doesnt define you,
like tiny to the 7 foot tall halforc
I think a kobold monk named "la lagartija con el miedo" the lizard with out fear he should take level of paladin to be truly fearles, dip a few levels in ranger for the favored enemy, of human or if your a total monster giants.
La lagartija sin temor
otherwise you have one of those ironic names that doesnt define you,
like tiny to the 7 foot tall halforc
the kobold doesnt speak spanish very well or if he does he uses google translate as a 1st level spell and fails
on a more serious note, if your dm is open to outside materials i have several ideas for you.
brute fighter with a scythe, worshiping the daemon lord(horseman) death.
wields a scythe. at 5th level you can get yourself 18-20(x5) crits. then look into Book of Vile Darkness for Disciple of Dispatr, you tripple your threat range, not stacking with keen but stacking with improved crit. so when you do get improved crit and the class, your looking at.....6-20(x5)
if your dm is allowing outside sources of course. Miniatures handbook enchantment called maiming(+1) increases your x5 to 1d10 for the crit modifier. over the course of 10 hits if you rolled a different number on each modifier 1-10 you end up with an overall modifier of 60 instead of 50 average, with the possibility of going up to 100.
My ideas pale in comparison, but I've always wanted to play a Kobold Sorcerer/Dragon Disciple.
who....secretly love dragons, and dancing and hates paladins
a armless monk who fights and eats with his feet
the most unusual/cool characters I've played with recently is a gravewalker/vivisectionist arcane trickster childlike halfling... just looks like a kid with a doll .. but is very effective w/in 30'. Spell storing returning dagger which she uses for things like disfiguring touch.
That's just creepy. O_o
But would the prestige class advance your infusion progression? Or was it house-ruled?
on a more serious note, if your dm is open to outside materials i have several ideas for you.
brute fighter with a scythe, worshiping the daemon lord(horseman) death.
wields a scythe. at 5th level you can get yourself 18-20(x5) crits. then look into Book of Vile Darkness for Disciple of Dispatr, you tripple your threat range, not stacking with keen but stacking with improved crit. so when you do get improved crit and the class, your looking at.....6-20(x5)
if your dm is allowing outside sources of course. Miniatures handbook enchantment called maiming(+1) increases your x5 to 1d10 for the crit modifier. over the course of 10 hits if you rolled a different number on each modifier 1-10 you end up with an overall modifier of 60 instead of 50 average, with the possibility of going up to 100.
That's neat. But sadly, my DM hates evil characters (or those allied with evil).
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
a lvl1 warrior who is from earth forced to fight in a strange magical land the whole time he needs to find a power source capable of powering his magical handheld "blackberry time traveling device"
the most unusual/cool characters I've played with recently is a gravewalker/vivisectionist arcane trickster childlike halfling... just looks like a kid with a doll .. but is very effective w/in 30'. Spell storing returning dagger which she uses for things like disfiguring touch.That's just creepy. O_o
But would the prestige class advance your infusion progression? Or was it house-ruled?
it would advance witch spell progression... and btw you would have to burn a magic trait on "two worlds magic" to get mage hand for the trickster pre-req..
Not that i was being any less serious before, but a wizard/monk would be pretty cool a shirtless fist missle throwing bad arse
That's neat. But sadly, my DM hates evil characters (or those allied with evil).on a more serious note, if your dm is open to outside materials i have several ideas for you.
brute fighter with a scythe, worshiping the daemon lord(horseman) death.
wields a scythe. at 5th level you can get yourself 18-20(x5) crits. then look into Book of Vile Darkness for Disciple of Dispatr, you tripple your threat range, not stacking with keen but stacking with improved crit. so when you do get improved crit and the class, your looking at.....6-20(x5)
if your dm is allowing outside sources of course. Miniatures handbook enchantment called maiming(+1) increases your x5 to 1d10 for the crit modifier. over the course of 10 hits if you rolled a different number on each modifier 1-10 you end up with an overall modifier of 60 instead of 50 average, with the possibility of going up to 100.
ok,we can work with that too(one of my dm's instakills our pcs if we turn evil) it would help narrow stuff down if you had any kind of general idea.
a funny but amazing concept i had once was to take all the thrown weapon feats with a fighter and take like improvised weapon mastery and use a sack of bricks or doorknobs or some other awkward item as his primary weapon source. mix ninja/monk instead and throw gold coins as Shurikens ext.
it would advance witch spell progression... and btw you would have to burn a magic trait on "two worlds magic" to get mage hand for the trickster pre-req..the most unusual/cool characters I've played with recently is a gravewalker/vivisectionist arcane trickster childlike halfling... just looks like a kid with a doll .. but is very effective w/in 30'. Spell storing returning dagger which she uses for things like disfiguring touch.That's just creepy. O_o
But would the prestige class advance your infusion progression? Or was it house-ruled?
Out of curiosity, how well does that build play out? Seeing as Arcane Trickster won't increase the DC's of your hexes, it seems like you would lose more than you can.
Not saying it isn't an interesting concept, of course.
|
a halfling barbarian wardog lance charger/cavalier
I made one of these a few weeks ago, and the synergies are awesome:
Braggart Knight halfling who can actually back up his big talk (15,14,12,12,12,12 array pre-racial):
STR-13 (all bumps)
DEX+16 (wears scale, then upgrades to mithral breastplate)
CON:12
INT:12
WIS:12
CHA+14
Traits: Berserker of the Society, Dangerously Curious
01 barb1 move+10, Raging Vitality
02 barb2 Reckless Abandon, Uncanny Dodge
03 cava1 Order of the Cockatrice, Boon Companion
04 cava2 STR>14, Dazzling Display (as a standard action!)
05 b3/c3 Mounted Combat
(mix barb3rd/4th and rest cavalier)
Most players assume cavaliers multiclass better with paladins -- actually they're much better as barbarians because they're isn't a single class thing a cavalier does which requires concentration on social skills in combat other than the flavor text of them sacrificing armor-class -- which synergies well with dumping it anyway as a barbarian, and not caring if you're mounted with a reach weapon and getting AoOs. At 4th, a STR:18 raging halfling is getting a +3 (from CHA) Dazzling Display Intimidate checks against all opponents within 30' as a standard action -- and in the surprise round due to Uncanny Dodge...yikes!....and then he gets an even bigger bonus than normal versus them if they become shaken.
Alignment: CN, but pretends to be LN or even LG; doesn't care if Bluff attempts fail, and soon conveniently forgets said failures ever happened.
Mount: Wolf, which he claims is just a big, friendly riding dog: "He likes blueberry muffins -- but watch your hands!"
|
|
Consider some single class awesomeness:
Half Orc Monk (Hungry Ghost Monk, Monk of the Sacred Mountain, Master of many styles) Snapping Turtle Style & Tiger Style w/ Improved Grapple and Power Attack (when eligible).
Elf (Or half) Ranger (Falconer, Skrimisher) specializing in teamwork feats with animal companion.
Gun Mage Human Wizard with Arcane (Bond Weapon- Pistol), Exotic Wpn Prof. Amateur Gunslinger and other feats that can be used for Gun and ranged spells both
Nope, Wisconsin.Had this happen once when my characters would die every game (Cthulhu GM running Pathfinder.. great story teller but we all died a lot!) I literally made Paul Bunyan. Babe wandered away at night, next morning I went to find him and through some magical woodsy magic I ended up in the GM's home brew world. It was actually quite fun until Paul died that game, and the GM loved the character concept.Are you from Minnesota by any chance?
Just wondered because paul bunyan is from minnesota. :P
it would advance witch spell progression... and btw you would have to burn a magic trait on "two worlds magic" to get mage hand for the trickster pre-req..the most unusual/cool characters I've played with recently is a gravewalker/vivisectionist arcane trickster childlike halfling... just looks like a kid with a doll .. but is very effective w/in 30'. Spell storing returning dagger which she uses for things like disfiguring touch.That's just creepy. O_o
But would the prestige class advance your infusion progression? Or was it house-ruled?
Out of curiosity, how well does that build play out? Seeing as Arcane Trickster won't increase the DC's of your hexes, it seems like you would lose more than you can.
Not saying it isn't an interesting concept, of course.
You're right... she doesn't have hexes that require a save .. flight and disguise (to appear as children of different races when scouting so she gets a jump on them for seeming harmless)
My random idea: Goblin Cavalier/Samurai with a wolf mount. The worg-riding goblin is kind of already a trope, but not one you see played much. And the extra baggage that comes along with having an order and edicts to follow would be fun if a little silly to combine with a monstrous background. Plus Wolves are small enough that you could ride them into most dungeons, so you could probably get a little more use out of the mount than the typical human horseman.
Monk/Bard of the god of Knowledge Irori. Or Cleric of Irori with the Knowledge Domain.
For character background you could go Shoanti and have come off the Talenta plains to Riddleport to see what the civilized people are doing and ended up in the gladiatorial pits where you were trained as a fighting monk. You took to the teachings of Irori and also to that of a bard and became a real showman. You still are much a Shoanti (native American) but are quite an Eastern Monk.
Conversely you could be a Jeggare from the House Jeggare of the City of Korvosa and be a minor Noble. You are distantly related to the Jeggares of Cheliax but don't have any real connection to them. You start out with Aristocrat level 1. And you have 4 levels of whatever you want after that.
So you could be Aristocrat 2, Fighter 3, or Aristocrat 1, Bard 4 etc...
That is right I am Andvari Jeggare the 2nd and you shall address me as Sir.
|
|
These are some interesting ideas, but I think we dont want to get to far out there. The GM still has final authority and then the character still has to deal with the reprecussions of being. Its a hard sell when the Steampunk Powered Cybernetic Ninja Pirate Zombie Gunslinger riding a T-rex is getting the same love and respect as the Paladin. The character should be just interesting enough for the player to enjoy, but not so much that it disrupts the world.
|
|
I think a guy could make a viable Weather-bonded Druid/Not-Familliar-bonded Illusionist/Mystic Theruge work if you focused the spells on buffs, battlefield control and illusion spells.
The character could end up being a lot like Merlin as portrayed in the Excalibur movie - weaving mists, confounding with illusions, bending nature to his will, minor healing and whatnot. The downside of Mystic Theruge is the loss of high-level spells but if you focused on spells with long innate durations (entangle, silent image, obscuring mist, web, soften earth and stone) and were happy playing a supporting and non-direct damaging role, it could be viable in the right hands.
A homunculus alchemist/necromancer that affixis those rings that explode to his humonculi before sending them into combat. Also they should carry you on a throne whenever possible.
These are some interesting ideas, but I think we dont want to get to far out there. The GM still has final authority and then the character still has to deal with the reprecussions of being. Its a hard sell when the Steampunk Powered Cybernetic Ninja Pirate Zombie Gunslinger riding a T-rex is getting the same love and respect as the Paladin. The character should be just interesting enough for the player to enjoy, but not so much that it disrupts the world.
most of the suggestions are just crazy role playing options,
in fact i may be the rogue with a secret love of dance and a hatred for burglary my self next game.
the op has never said whoa! fellas slow down with the kobold ninja war forged druid crazy stuff.
he has been mostly ignoring the crazy suggestions like any sane reasonable player would.
I just like the crazy ideas, it could lead to something beautiful lilke deekins? form nwn 1 & 2
though i do hope he picks my goblin paladin of self loathing.
EDIT: speaking of that any body know the stats for playing a goblin?
I like it so far. A few questions, though. Why use a chakram? And, assuming a level 20 end game, how much alchemist would you say should be used for this version of Mist Assassin? My gut says four; you get two discoveries, 2nd level infusions, and 2d6 sneak attack.Four levels of Alchemist should be sufficient. The original build assumed a progression of Oracle-Oracle-Rogue, leading to eventually 6 levels of Rogue, but it also focused more on getting extra Sneak Attack and Rogue tricks. Part of the combat of this build would have to be different. Oracle 16/Alchemist 4 should be fine.
The Rogue build focused more on extra Stealth and on things like Combat Trick to get extra feats (Two-Weapon Fighting). The idea was to TWF and QD with chakrams to maximize the number of sneak attacks. The chakrams were chosen for a combination of higher damage output with a thrown weapon and coolness factor. You could easily replace them with javelins and spears.
That might be the thing to do with the Vivisectionist version: Choose Adaptability (Stealth) instead of Ancestral Arms (Chakram), and rely on longspears and javelins. You want to maintain the range to the target so that you won't be perceived; without it, you potentially lose sneak attack.
One question is what would you like to do about TWF? You can TWF with javelins just as easily as with chakrams. But if you're not planning on TWF, then you might be able to save on Quick Draw as well--depends on how much throwing you end up doing.
One other note I'm thinking about is damage. At level 5 you'll be fine, but this is a debuffer-striker build, so you'll want to build damage output quickly. Strength extracts are helpful, as are poisons. Hmm, perhaps drop Dex by 1 point, and increase Strength by 2?
ETA: I don't have UC so I have no idea what the answer is, but would an Oracle/Ninja be a good solution here?
The 2-2-1 progression is interesting. Four or six level of alchemist work; my instincts are usually to restrict caster level lost as much as possible. But seeing as this build isn't based solely one caster levels, I should try and push past that.
The great thing about the alchemist levels is that they offer alternative methods of achieving sneak attacks; having invisibility extracts and potions will help to keep the DM on his toes when it comes to predictability.
An alternative to TWF is using the Feral Mutagen; two claws and a bite at you base attack bonus would be gnarly. And if you still want TWF, get the alchemist discovery that gives you extra arms. That way, you could TWF with a two-handed weapon and a one handed weapon without any extra penalties to attack.
|
|
The 2-2-1 progression is interesting. Four or six level of alchemist work; my instincts are usually to restrict caster level lost as much as possible. But seeing as this build isn't based solely one caster levels, I should try and push past that.The great thing about the alchemist levels is that they offer alternative methods of achieving sneak attacks; having invisibility extracts and potions will help to keep the DM on his toes when it comes to predictability.
An alternative to TWF is using the Feral Mutagen; two claws and a bite at you base attack bonus would be gnarly. And if you still want TWF, get the alchemist discovery that gives you extra arms. That way, you could TWF with a two-handed weapon and a one handed weapon without any extra penalties to attack.
The Feral Mutagen would require you to be within 5' for it to work; you won't be effectively invisible anymore, so the sneak attack isn't guaranteed. Definitely wait for the Invisibility extract at Alc 4 before going the Feral route; it could be your second Discovery, then.
Alc 4 gets you two Discoveries, Throw Anything, poison use, poison resistance +2, and Swift Alchemy.
Alc 5 ups sneak attack to 3d6 and poison resistance to +4.
Alc 6 gets you an additional Discovery and Swift Poisoning.
Alc 7 gets you 4d6 sneak attack and 3rd level extracts.
You're right that caster level is less important. Your Oracle levels focus on buffs and no-save debuffs like Obscuring Mist and Silence. In fact, if you start with and keep your CHA at 16, then you could go Oracle 12/Alchemist 8, have a BAB equal to any 3/4 class, max out at 6th level Oracle spells, have four revelations and four discoveries, 4d6 sneak attack, and 3rd level extracts. Int 13 and Cha 16 is all you need, giving you all the points you need for your physical stats. The build is more physical in nature, anyway, that might be the way to do it.
This is one of those examples I call "You aren't the party spellcaster, but that's becuase you aren't the party spellcaster." Maxing out your spell capability isn't the goal of the build, it's to harness spellcasting into your schtick, which is shutting down senses and assassination.
most of the suggestions are just crazy role playing options,
in fact i may be the rogue with a secret love of dance and a hatred for burglary my self next game.
the op has never said whoa! fellas slow down with the kobold ninja war forged druid crazy stuff.
he has been mostly ignoring the crazy suggestions like any sane reasonable player would.
I just like the crazy ideas, it could lead to something beautiful lilke deekins? form nwn 1 & 2
though i do hope he picks my goblin paladin of self loathing.
EDIT: speaking of that any body know the stats for playing a goblin?
Lol, don't be too sure. You never know when some of the crazier ideas might actually be useful. Comedic games do happen on occasion, after all.
A homunculus alchemist/necromancer that affixis those rings that explode to his humonculi before sending them into combat. Also they should carry you on a throne whenever possible.
I like it, but it seems awfully expensive, and having the homunculi act as suicide bombers seems rather wasteful.