I would like to reiterate that there are several metrics, not only one. And that each metric is only applied when ever a player builds a character that is supposed to achieve a certain level of success within that area. So the aforementioned cleric might not have the normal combat metrics applied to him, but if he wanted to cast spells, then he better have the DCs work out in his favor.
A class can garner utility based on being able to reasonably achieve one or more of these things. He doesn't have to be combat oriented even, but if that's the case they're not off the hook on being able to just sit and do nothing. They have to contribute in some ways, whether it be by buffing, summons, compulsion, or smart applications of skill checks.
2RKO is very much an average case scenario where the PCs do their thing and doesn't take into account things like positioning and maneuverability. However, that just means positioning and maneuverability have have some way to be accounted for elsewhere.
Or it could be that mobility could act as an enhancement to normal Combat metrics, helping decrease the amount of time spent setting up for a full attack, or chasing down a slippery foe.
I don't think the other points are necessarily responsive:
@2 --
I don't think everyone in a party should be expected to take multiple full attacks from a Fire Giant, but that those who choose to wade into melee with said monster should both be able to deal sufficient damage, and not die on the crack-back.
If a character decides not to be in melee, then sure it doesn't have to worry as much about melee survivability, but they've got other things to worry about anyways.
@3 --
Buffs are cool, but also have to applied intelligently. Inspire Courage is great in a group with a large number of combat dudes, but has less utility for groups of casters(Not unreasonable, and could be fun). In fact, only the Magician Subclass for bard has a Bardic Performance that benefits casters, but that replaces Inspire Courage.
Another example is enlarge person. It's not half bad for brawly types who wade into melee, but it hurts ranged combatants by giving them a -2 to hit. And decreases AC by about 2-ish.
How much benefit buffs provide can also be measured, It's as simple as adding up all of the benefits each other character gets to the benefit received by the buffer.
But that leads into a further point, Metrics don't necessarily need to focus on a single dude, they can be applied to a party as a whole, or subsets of the party.
While metrics do have a chance of creating straw-men, it's only when those metrics are improperly applied to characters who never intended to be successful in those areas in the first place that the fallacy can occur.
What's also great is that these metrics are determined by the numbers provided by Paizo directly, either through the monster creation rules, or direct, brute force averaging. Therefore, the metrics can be easily changes if Paizo decides to change the numbers.
=========== Next off.
I don't think direct comparisons are a proper thing to do. The problem with direct class to class comparisons is that it doesn't give people a good idea of what makes something "good enough" to be successful. It also obscures reasonable choices by players by saying that X has a shot of doing it better (even if you already have an 80%+ success rate at doing what you want to do.)
I'll give two examples from the DPR Olympics threads to see if I can hopefully illustrate my point.
I wanna play a summoner who's Eidolon pain-trains everything in its path on a charge. So I take Tarantula's entry from DPR Olympics, and build the dude.
But then my fellow player notices YawarFiesta's Barbarian build, and points me to it saying that it's able to deal an average of three more damage on a charge.
However at this point, does it really matter? Both characters are able to 1HKO CR+5 encounters. Furthermore, does the existence of those massive DPR characters invalidate Zeorthbase's Falchion Fighter build?
Furthermore, direct comparisons between two different classes will always have escape valves that further obscure the issue, such as when people would defend the monk by saying "well, the monk has better saves/AC/stunning fist/etc." as though those made up for not having comparable (not necessarily better) DPR to a fighter or w/e.
While those other things are important and useful, when making direct comparisons on a particular axis - whether it's damage, or DCs or w/e - if those other things don't contribute to what that character is trying to do, then they don't constructively contribute to the discussion.
Very well said
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Stuff
"Do nothing" is completely inaccurate.
Let's say that 25% of the time stunning fist works. That means on the opening round of combat, 25% of the time the monk is able to remove a round from the opponent and do a single attack + flurry before the opponent can counter attack. 25 % of the time the party can use that round with complete safety.
That value is negated in your metric.
A monk can move literally twice as far an equivalent fighter by 4th level, allowing them to engage sooner as well as position more effectively. That 20 feet of movement is often the difference between just being able to get to the enemy and being able to set up flanking position.
That has a value not reflected in your metric.
A monk has no armor check penalties, and a significantly better chance to not only make given save, but also the ability to avoid damage from said save (evasion) at no additional cost.
The value is ignored in your metric.
As to paraphrase you in another context, metrics are cool but have to be applied intelligently. Falcion Fred is nice for one thing, and one thing only. That is the basis of the DPR Olympics. They mostly just hit stuff.
Monks have more than one role. They are able to scout, since they don't have clanky armor, just basically look like commoners, and move fast enough to get away if trouble that is over their head occurs. They engage in melee, using stunning fist as a bonus to their damage which when it works is very, very useful to the party.
Let's look at real combat.
You don't start next to the enemy, so full attack as your baseline isn't realistic. You move into position in the first round of combat, hopefully being able to take a full attack. If your opponent engaged you, you can react to your opponents initial attack. But generally in that case you are dealing with a very strong melee class.
If you want to get to the caster in the back, who do you want: Falcion Fred in plate mail or a monk with more that double his movement, the ability to literally jump over most obstacles, and a stunning attack against the casters low save that takes them out for a round?
None of these are reflected in the metrics, because the metrics don't reflect game play. The DPR Olympics reflect a best case scenario for a specific class, ignoring all other features of the game.
If you play in a 4e style hack and slash meat grinder that is played like the DPR Olympics are run, sure.
But pick an AP and run the classes through each and see how it works in play. I posted an example back awhile ago in this thread for Monks in RoTRL and where they would shine and where they would have problems.
That is how you can examine a class.
The proposed metrics are the equivalent of assessing which car to by based torque when you plan on driving your kids to and from school each day in it. It would be a nice feature, but can you fit a car seat in it is probably a more relevant question.
If you play in a 4e style hack and slash meat grinder that is played like the DPR Olympics are run, sure.
Where on earth did this come from?
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What's the point of being able to 1 hit ko the big enemy when the battle forces you to deal with low hp mooks whle Mr big does his thing at teh back or elsewhere.
How often do you see your powerhouse fighter ploughing through low hit point critters swarming him/her. They feel great for doing so, but effectively hey're tied up doing bugger all while the guy at the back with the big spells or massive damage dealing potential isn't getting hit by your all powerful melee type.
Fighters etc are great, when they can close with their target of choice. I get to watch the fighter in the group roll consistantly 14 or 15 more hp damage than is required to kill the targets I throw at him. That's wasted potential, but regularly happens in games I've seen. Fighter feels powerful, but really just killed a mook.
Their only way to reach full potential is either have their target of choice brought closer, or have their target of choice locked down until they can reach it.
Guess what monks are good at?
They can dictate whom they fight better than almost any melee class.
They can lock down most targets with ease.
They can maneuvre to maximise other melee potential equally as well as a rogue, and if they stun an opponent they are a rogues best friend and even make other melee types smile.
If the combatant tactics have the group at distance being sniped. Monk is in amongst those archers in round 1. Who's gonna shoot when you draw AoO or get pounded next round with full flurry? Given the high saves and potential to build pretty decent AC for a monk, he/she can even survive the round or two needed for the heavy hitters to actually reach the fight.
There are literally hundreds or even thousands of possible combat scenarios that come up in this game. It would be a struggle not to find something for a monk to do in most of them. Look at ToZ's game play experience from earlier. First time he's played the character and the combat was not monk ability friendly but he still saved an important NPC and locked down and opponent. An experienced player taking a complex class and playing it well.
How can you call a class bad when it can do these things and do them consistantly?
You seem to be confused about classes. If you have to go outside the class to make it good, you have a bad class.Truenamer. /argumentItem familiar to boost skill + item with +xx to skill.Taking a feat "Item Familiar" is not going outside the class.
As a Truenamer you need to do everything you can to boost one skill (true speech if I remember correctly away from books at moment). IF memory serves me to effect a monster you need to consistently hit a SKILL roll of 2x the monsters CR. If you focus on it it is not hard. If you want to really focus on one skill (as this class requires) and at level 20 you are not consistently hitting 60+ on that skill.... you are not trying.
Example: 20 (ranks in skill) +3 (class skill) +6 (skill focus) +30 (max competence bonus for an item) gives you a +59 with no stat mods and not using item familiar. Monetary expense was 90k for the one item (ranks ^2)x 100. At 20th level IF you are by virtue of your class forced to focus on one skill, then it is reasonable IMHO to spend 90k on that item... I imagine most 20th level Fighters spend more than that on their weapon.
If you use an Item Familiar (costs another feat) it will go much higher.
And before someone says But you are using a non pathfinder feat.... Well we are talking about a non-pathfinder class so I assume legitimate 3.5 feats should be available.
Not to say you're not right about this, but... are we now starting to compare the truenamer with a monk? 'Cause I have to say... monks are way better than truenamers. Every one I've gamed with agrees that it takes a degree of sadomasochism to actually want to play one.
After all, why would you want to punish yourself that much? What did you do to deserve it? Things are not that bad, we can work it out. Please, just step away from the book; we can talk about it if you want to.
The truenamer was acknowledged by WoTC as being impossible to use just on a class basis. Requiring a skill boosting item to actually be able to hit the routine DC's of a particular class level is like saying that a Wizard MUST have an Int Booster to cast spells.
The truenamer was INCAPABLE of functioning at high levels without a skill booster...it COULD NOT work. They actually included a magical item, something 'of the Silver Tongue', JUST to give the boost to the Truespeaking skill that was required.
You can play a wizard without an Int boosting item. You can't play a Truenamer without a Truespeak booster. It's just not possible.
That's what he means by 'requiring something outside the class.' To a lesser extent, this is true of Melees and enchanted weapons and armor, whereas the monk is less reliant on this (but not totally free). Spellcasters can sub spells for much of this, and thus are more self-contained.
-==Aelryinth
I'd like to hear from people who ACTUALLY PLAYED A MONK (a -Pathfinder- monk, not a 3x monk) (and not just a one nighter, but over a campaign) and regularly felt their character was useless.
I'd like to hear what kind of campaign was being run. I'd like to hear what point buy was being used, what level the party was, etc.
I posted all that for the beta playtest -- except that I only played from levels 5 to 7. Due to time constraints (and the fact that I died every adventure), it was hard to manage a full levels 1-20 campaign, so if that's your minimum expectation, I don't mind failing to meet it.
I'd like to hear from people who ACTUALLY PLAYED A MONK (a -Pathfinder- monk, not a 3x monk) (and not just a one nighter, but over a campaign) and regularly felt their character was useless.
I'd like to hear what kind of campaign was being run. I'd like to hear what point buy was being used, what level the party was, etc.
I can't help you then, since (a) I don't usually feel my monk character is useless, (b) I'm not playing a pure monk (currently a monk 4/sorcerer 1/dragon disciple 2) and (c) our Savage Tide game uses some 3.X material (like Eberron feats & action points, e.g.).
But even assuming (b) and (c) weren't the case, I still think I'd be having fun, although I'd definitely be spending more time unconscious without Mage Armor and Mirror Image at my disposal. It should also be noted that we don't have any super-optimized melee fighters in our party and (usually) only one full spellcaster, so there are fewer people to make me feel small in the pants.
Alex K here.
Just hit level 4 with this monk via PbP. Have been more than contributing my fair share in Legacy of Fire, often against enemies that have boosted stats to compensate for 6 players. Despite that I have almost never failed a grapple roll, I regularily get full attacks off (and hit with attacks with it) and have had some really awesome moments with him.
Despite the only wealth my character has had since the start of the AP isa potion of enlarge person and a brooch of shielding, he full attacks at a comfortable-
+10/+10/+10 (can do this up to 6 times with Ki)
1d8+5+1d6 (elemental fist, can do this 4 times total)
1d8+5
1d8+5
And grappling at +11.
At level 4 with no items contributing to it, my CMD is 25, 27 for grapples.
So lets see and compare my attack and damage to the charts in the bestiary.
Against the CR 4 line-
I hit on a 7+, unbuffed, with any of my attacks in a flurry.
I hit on a 8+ with a normal attack.
If I had WBL, i'd have a belt of strength for-
+11/+11/+11 (can do this up to 6 times with Ki)
1d8+6+1d6 (elemental fist, can do this 4 times total)
1d8+6
1d8+6
I think i've failed perhaps one grapple attempt in the whole AP so far.
I'd like to hear from people who ACTUALLY PLAYED A MONK (a -Pathfinder- monk, not a 3x monk) (and not just a one nighter, but over a campaign) and regularly felt their character was useless.
I'd like to hear what kind of campaign was being run. I'd like to hear what point buy was being used, what level the party was, etc.
I'm playing a monk right now, but he came in after character deaths (I'm on my 3rd one now), so he started at 6th level or so. So far, I've only felt useless when I first picked him up, but that's because I was just getting used to how he was supposed to be played (I hadn't played a monk in a while), plus I was mostly rolling somewhere between 5 and 8 for all my d20 rolls (quite the unlucky streak). The whole group at first just thought my monk sucked, but then after seeing it do better with better tactics and rolls, he's done just fine.
The conclusion we have so far is the overall consensus here: he doesn't quite match the fighter's damage, but his defenses are superior. We're playing Savage Tide PF style, and none of those big beasties have been able to outmaneuver my monk.
I'd like to hear from people who ACTUALLY PLAYED A MONK (a -Pathfinder- monk, not a 3x monk) (and not just a one nighter, but over a campaign) and regularly felt their character was useless.
I'd like to hear what kind of campaign was being run. I'd like to hear what point buy was being used, what level the party was, etc.
1. Saying that only people who've played class X have anything to say about the class gets problematic when there are a whole class of folks who might have had sub-par experiences for one reason or another.
2. I've played a monk from 1 to 6, using 4d6 drop lowest, so his stats were higher than most. I was also allowed 3.5 feats to take, so I went dex based (adding to attack and damage) and took improved grapple, Trip, and combat reflexes. He was both Sacred Mountain and Four Winds subclass
A fun character,and my first one ever, but his performance from session to session was erratic. I once almost died to a regular lion, while nearly obliterating a fire elemental by himself.
I'll respond to Ciretose and Wrath more systematically later, I'm just a little busy now.
People have been saying monks suck since 1e times. If a thread could have been started in the 70's on the subject, I really wonder how many responses it would have by now?
I can understand the sentiment (if not with the way it's being expressed at times). I had a player in my current group (I was not the DM) play a monk from lvls 1-10 and he was pretty disappointed in the results. He had a 25 point buy but he didn't have any stat boosting items by lvl 10. His damage was a joke compared to the straight fighter, and he consistently had trouble hitting, so he gave up and played a cleric.
One thing I did notice, though, is that even his sub-optimal monk wreaked havoc on casters. Encounters with casters ended pretty quickly when he closed with them, and he closed fast. We didn't encounter that many casters, so perhaps he didn't feel he was getting enough of the spotlight. I wonder what he would have been like if he'd discovered maneuvers (he didn't take any feats in them - my group members hardly ever use them).
I'm currently playing a cavalier (who is the primary damage dealer in the party so far) but if he ever dies I've already rolled up a monk. In the current campaign we're all at level 5, and I'm very curious to see how he does. It's all relative of course. The current party includes an Orc Cleric who insists on biting opponents (even the undead) as his primary mode of attack. And yet we still haven't had a TPK (yet)....
What's the point of being able to 1 hit ko the big enemy when the battle forces you to deal with low hp mooks whle Mr big does his thing at teh back or elsewhere.
How often do you see your powerhouse fighter ploughing through low hit point critters swarming him/her. They feel great for doing so, but effectively hey're tied up doing bugger all while the guy at the back with the big spells or massive damage dealing potential isn't getting hit by your all powerful melee type.
Fighters etc are great, when they can close with their target of choice. I get to watch the fighter in the group roll consistantly 14 or 15 more hp damage than is required to kill the targets I throw at him. That's wasted potential, but regularly happens in games I've seen. Fighter feels powerful, but really just killed a mook.
Their only way to reach full potential is either have their target of choice brought closer, or have their target of choice locked down until they can reach it.
Guess what monks are good at?
They can dictate whom they fight better than almost any melee class.
They can lock down most targets with ease.
They can maneuvre to maximise other melee potential equally as well as a rogue, and if they stun an opponent they are a rogues best friend and even make other melee types smile.
If the combatant tactics have the group at distance being sniped. Monk is in amongst those archers in round 1. Who's gonna shoot when you draw AoO or get pounded next round with full flurry? Given the high saves and potential to build pretty decent AC for a monk, he/she can even survive the round or two needed for the heavy hitters to actually reach the fight.
There are literally hundreds or even thousands of possible combat scenarios that come up in this game. It would be a struggle not to find something for a monk to do in most of them. Look at ToZ's game play experience from earlier. First time he's played the character and the combat was not monk ability friendly but he still saved an important NPC and locked down and...
Except every monk in this thread so far cant do things consistantly. If you get that stunning fist off, the rogue smiles, so half the time your dead weight and as soon as you burn through all of your stunning fists your sol. But wait, you can run past people (unlike the fighter) and get to the dangerous guy, well one this assumes you have enough move in one movement to weave through everyone in combat without provoking and two, what is your plan when you get there? You cant kill it before it kills you (one reason why that is an important metric if you plan on running up to something solo) your about to eat a full attack and another next round because literally none of your abilities have a halfway decent shot at working.
How about reaching those archers? Well you can kill one (maybe since you only get one attack the first round) and then the rest turn and eat your low hp for breakfast
Manuverability means nothing if you cant do anything when you get there, it is like the the flash trying to catch superman, he can, but thats it. And all those defenses? Well your hp sucks and things hit you just as easy as you hit them (the posted monks had the same hit chance as the monsters) so if your the last man standing youll be the next one falling. If all that happens to be left is a wizard and your standing right next to him sure you can fight, but you gotta roll a new character anyway because everyone else died and is ready for a new campaign
People have been saying monks suck since 1e times.
Monks did suck in 1E times. :-)
At least low-level ones did: almost the worst possible AC with no benefit from a high Dex score, mediocre damage with no benefit from a high Str score, mediocre THAC0, etc.
"Do nothing" is completely inaccurate.
Let's say that 25% of the time stunning fist works. That means on the opening round of combat, 25% of the time the monk is able to remove a round from the opponent and do a single attack + flurry before the opponent can counter attack. 25 % of the time the party can use that round with complete safety.
That value is negated in your metric.
Yes but you ignore the other 75% of the time where you arent doing anything but barely noticeable damage. That is three rounds out of four where you effectively stunning fisted yourself. You cant just say "i can stunning fist sometimes" and then ignore how bad it is when it isnt that sometimes. Yes more crime does in fact happen during a full moon if you only pay attention to the crime during a full moon.
A monk can move literally twice as far an equivalent fighter by 4th level, allowing them to engage sooner as well as position more effectively. That 20 feet of movement is often the difference between just being able to get to the enemy and being able to set up flanking position.
That has a value not reflected in your metric.
You mean he can run up to something that will beat him in a fight two rounds before the fighter can run in and rape face? I dont see the value. Especially since most fights dont take place in big open fields and 80ft apart which would make this irrelevant most of the time.
A monk has no armor check penalties, and a significantly better chance to not only make given save, but also the ability to avoid damage from said save (evasion) at no additional cost.
The value is ignored in your metric.
Defense is measured in weak points not just a list of your strong ones, yeah against a caster (that isnt also a monster) you will survive longer, against his summoned monster? No your toast. This value wasnt ignored, this value is measured in how strong your weakest point is. You cant call the death star indesructable if it has a gaping hole straight to the core reactor.
As to paraphrase you in another context, metrics are cool but have to be applied intelligently. Falcion Fred is nice for one thing, and one thing only. That is the basis of the DPR Olympics. They mostly just hit stuff.
Monks have more than one role. They are able to scout, since they don't have clanky armor, just basically look like commoners, and move fast enough to get away if trouble that is over their head occurs. They engage in melee, using stunning fist as a bonus to their damage which when it works is very, very useful to the party.
Scouting can be achieved by anyone with an extra 9200 gold (or a party pooled for it, good investment) to get the owl figurine.
Let's look at real combat.
You don't start next to the enemy, so full attack as your baseline isn't realistic. You move into position in the first round of combat, hopefully being able to take a full attack. If your opponent engaged you, you can react to your opponents initial attack. But generally in that case you are dealing with a very strong melee class.
If you want to get to the caster in the back, who do you want: Falcion Fred in plate mail or a monk with more that double his...
If you dont have monk initiative your probably in combat by your turn so yeah full attack. Running up to your enemy (if it is a melee-er) is usually a bad way to start combat. As far as casters go, one combats rarely start so far that dkstance is the reason you cant reach the caster and two your first hit has to count (which we determined has a 50% chance to count) or he backs up and lets something more dangerous occupy you. (Whether it is another combatent or a summoned monster) and you cant handle that.
You seem to be confused about classes. If you have to go outside the class to make it good, you have a bad class.Truenamer. /argumentItem familiar to boost skill + item with +xx to skill.Taking a feat "Item Familiar" is not going outside the class.
As a Truenamer you need to do everything you can to boost one skill (true speech if I remember correctly away from books at moment). IF memory serves me to effect a monster you need to consistently hit a SKILL roll of 2x the monsters CR. If you focus on it it is not hard. If you want to really focus on one skill (as this class requires) and at level 20 you are not consistently hitting 60+ on that skill.... you are not trying.
Example: 20 (ranks in skill) +3 (class skill) +6 (skill focus) +30 (max competence bonus for an item) gives you a +59 with no stat mods and not using item familiar. Monetary expense was 90k for the one item (ranks ^2)x 100. At 20th level IF you are by virtue of your class forced to focus on one skill, then it is reasonable IMHO to spend 90k on that item... I imagine most 20th level Fighters spend more than that on their weapon.
If you use an Item Familiar (costs another feat) it will go much higher.
And before someone says But you are using a non pathfinder feat.... Well we are talking about a non-pathfinder class so I assume legitimate 3.5 feats should be available.
Now for the coup-de-grace on the truenamer:
Even if you regularly made the DC's, it was weak due to the combination of short durations and just overall weak effects. The fact that everything worth taking except solid fog was single target until level 17. Also you can't have two of the same debuff running at the same time. Plus a lot of other junk that just get in the way.
For those interested in actual play experience of the truenamer: http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=114269
In short:
He has taken an odd race, 2 +10 magic items(meaning a significant chunk of his WBL), and used an association from CChamp to become effective, and he's still having issues during play. [. . .] Yeah, he's having fun with it, and it's working out well, but that is in spite of the class, not because of it.
Regarding metrics: An absolute objective metric is undefinable in PF. People are going to have to arbitrarily set particular values to various things. How important is AC? How important is HP? How important is attack bonus? The answers to those are near intractable. Either you arbitrarily set it or you don't know it; even if we enter the "combat vacuum". How much HP do you need to survive monster X? Well that depends on you AC, attack bonus, damage, range / reach, CMB / CMD, saves etc. Now we ask how much AC do you need? The answer is that it depends on everything else. It is workable for any particular stat block. Yet there is still a catch even if you do this massive number crunch. How do we qualify whether something survives? A level 1 commoner could beat a solar real easily. They just have to roll all nat 20's and the solar has to roll all nat 1's. So if we set our standard to capability to "there exists a circumstance that it survives", we end up with the trivial solution. The existence of this case makes the only other objective standard of survivability impossible, which is "there does not exist a circumstance where it does not survive". Taking on any other value is an arbitrary choice; no matter how reasonable the choice is.
I think a lot of the monk hate would go away if fighters had viable unarmed combat skills, but as long as fighters don't have that, we'll have people complaining about the fact that monks make terrible fighters.
In the last monk thread that I remember reading, an unarmed fighter put up comparable numbers to the monk.
I'd like to see what monster a wizard should summon to "toast" an equal-level monk. Or even a monk 2 levels lower.
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I'm out. I'm tired of posting builds (which along with the other decent statblocks posted have been ignored) that clearly meet damage standards for appropiate CR's and arguing with people who continually shift the goalposts and throw up strawmen to rationalise their opinion that monks suck.
I've wasted enough time with this god forsaken thread. Peace out.
I'd like to see what monster a wizard should summon to "toast" an equal-level monk. Or even a monk 2 levels lower.Elementals are a decent choice.
Toast pun or serious answer? I doubt a huge elemental could win against a level 11 monk that's not really badly optimized.
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People have been saying monks suck since 1e times.Monks did suck in 1E times. :-)
At least low-level ones did: almost the worst possible AC with no benefit from a high Dex score, mediocre damage with no benefit from a high Str score, mediocre THAC0, etc.
Oh, I didn't deny it then, either. I still played them anyway. I once played a monk that sucked so bad I got beat by another 1st lvl monk. I was mad at the player for playing another monk (and stealing my thunder?), so we dueled. I lost.
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First, again the monk does actually do damage even if the stun doesn't work. It isn't an either or proposition.
Monk combat is more complex than a standard melee class. The metrics you are using seem to assume you always do the same thing in any given combat.
If it a caster a monk will generally charge and stun. Casters generally have a low fort save and AC (plus you get the +2 for charging), and you can get to it before anyone else. If not charge, you can just move up and hit them much more quickly than anyone else. And you have the best saves and a high touch AC if the caster goes after you. This kind of encounter is your bread and butter.
If it is ranged attack encounter, again charge or move up and either stun or combat maneuver since you can close the gap before anyone else and make those attacks provoke if they don’t move. If you took deflect arrows, so one of those attacks is going to miss. You are particularly good when they are positioned above you and you are able to jump up there.
If it is bigger that medium size melee class you probably aren’t going to be able to stun it or pull off a combat maneuver, and so charging it will just leave you way out ahead of the rest of the party with no friends, and this is full of fail.
So you change your tactics.
If you have a rogue in the party (or just want to help your tank) then you try to figure out how you can get into flanking position. If you have a bunch of casters, you try to block charging lanes so the big guy can’t get to them and attack in the same round, or better yet keep his reach off them so they can cast without AoO. At later levels you may be able to stick and move with spring attack, using the terrain to prevent them being able to charge you, possibly (depending on their movement) meaning they can’t attack you at all while you poke them to death.
Either way you aren’t soloing big baddie if you are playing with any common sense. If you get put in that position and get in trouble you have the movement to withdrawn and get farther away from big baddie than he can get to while you recover/heal yourself. That is mobility.
Similarly if someone else on the battlefield in trouble you have the mobility to be able to go help them better than other classes since you are probably able to cover half the distance on the board normally, and if not you can before you burn a ki point for an extra 20’. This is particularly useful if something comes from behind you to attack the casters after the tanks moved forward.
Mobility is very, very, under rated. My game table is the cover for my regulation sized pool table. Basically put four sheets of plexiglass over gaming paper about 8 feet by 4 feet. We often use all that space for a single encounter, and when that happens you have to get from one side to the other sometimes.
It is the context of the game as it is played that determines if a class is useful, not arbitrary metrics that apply to specific types of encounters for specific classes based on specific assumptions.
If you want to look at how a game is played, you can look at an AP.
Hopefully by this point everyone has run RoTRL so I'll use that and we can discuss it under spoilers. For simplicity of defining a party let’s assume the monk is added to the classic 4 (Wizard, Cleric, Rogue, Fighter) and see how the monk does in each encounter.
I’ll do it a book at a time. So first Burnt offerings, which should run 1-4th level. I’ll skip the side encounters and focus on the main encounters, with the level they should be for each one.
1st encounter is high volume Goblins in three waves. Monk does great here, as he is the only one with multiple attacks at 1st level and for the most part the goblins hit points are equal to the monks minimum damage.
2nd major encounter is at the glassworks and again it is high volume goblins right up the monks alley. Additionally, the touch attacks don’t effect the monk nearly as much as other classes even if you didn’t take deflect arrows to negate the ranged attacks.
3rd major encounter is the catacombs of wrath. You are at least 2nd by this point, so I’ll assume that level. Good saves help against sin spawn, Vargouille, and mutant goblins breath weapon. Not seeing any problems for the monk here.
4th Major combat is the whole Goblin fortress. We are assuming 3rd level here. I’ll consider the 4th encounter to be the top floor. Lots of goblins, so the multiple attacks are helpful. Deflect arrows will come in handy and increased movement will help when navigating the difficult terrain. The druid fight is tough for everyone, given the terrain he can basically walk through.
5th Major combat is the downstairs, looking at 3rd or 4th level at this point. The bugbear and fighter aren’t real issues, and the wizard is monk meat. The monk is in great shape against the tentacle beast considering both high CMD and low fort save. Yeth hounds are tough, but monk seems no better or worse off than anyone else.
6th Major combat is the basement. Shatter not particularly useful against the monk, and again Yeth Hounds are what they are. The barghast is optional, but the monk is better off thanks to still mind. Shadows are touch attack, so monk is better off than most, Giant Hermit Crab is what it is.
I’ll look at the 2nd book when I get home, but that won’t be until late. Feel free to comment where the monk I posted would have problems (or advantages), and when the competitive builds are posted we can discuss where they would excel or run into problems in a given set of encounters that come in this Adventure Path.
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Toast pun or serious answer? I doubt a huge elemental could win against a level 11 monk that's not really badly optimized.
Well, they're immune to stunning, and have DR/-. CMD is pretty high too. AC is low, so the monk shouldn't have as much problem with that. Fire elementals deal damage when hit, but fire resistance is kind of a no-brainer at high levels with how common fire damage is.
My Dude
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My Dude
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Im sorry i was waiting for you to go to level six. Okay so first thing I notice is your hp seems off you should have 9 at first (max d8+1 con) and I have no idea how you got 17 at level two, should be 14 (9+average on d8 so 4.5+ 1 con). Which is concerning.
Next I notice your damage and stun dc are getting progessivly worse, (3+hits to 4 to 7 etc.) And increasing chances to save vs. Stun. Coupled with the lower hp I think you should have your chances of surviving are getting bad.
You have a really bad cmb so no reliance on manuvers.
What are the tactics for this guy? Running around punching things in the back of the head is passable at level one but is dipping into unreliable hit, damage, and saves as you get to two and three. Your thoughts? Can you come back to par in three more levels?
Except every monk in this thread so far cant do things consistantlyI don't know of any character who can do things consistently. Spells have saving throws. Skills have DCs. Attacks have "to hit" rolls.
Consistently = most of the time = more than half. A persistent spell will hit consistently.
Im sorry i was waiting for you to go to level six. Okay so first thing I notice is your hp seems off you should have 9 at first (max d8+1 con) and I have no idea how you got 17 at level two, should be 14 (9+average on d8 so 4.5+ 1 con). Which is concerning.Next I notice your damage and stun dc are getting progessivly worse, (3+hits to 4 to 7 etc.) And increasing chances to save vs. Stun. Coupled with the lower hp I think you should have your chances of surviving are getting bad.
You have a really bad cmb so no reliance on manuvers.
What are the tactics for this guy? Running around punching things in the back of the head is passable at level one but is dipping into unreliable hit, damage, and saves as you get to two and three. Your thoughts? Can you come back to par in three more levels?
I'll advance to 6 in a bit here.
The problem with 2 and 3 is the Monk doesn't get anything better then. Most classes don't combat wise. Not enough gold for a stat item or a +1 weapon or anything, while the monsters get better because they have to be able to withstand a higher attack bonus from the PC and be able to hit higher ACs more reliably.
However, at lvl 4, the Monks US dmg increases to d8s, and they get +1 AC and a Ki pool, which will mostly be used for an extra Flurry hit probably.
My HP was 10 at lvl 1, then adding 7 (half rounded up is the rule we play + Con +favored class HP)
LVL 1: 10
LVL 2: 17
LVL 3: 24
LVL 4: 31
AC: 21 (25)
HP: 31
Saves: +5/+7/+9
CMB: +5
CMD: 24
Init: +3
Unarmed: +7, d8+1
Flurry: +6/+6, d8+1
StunFist: DC 17
Feats: Dodge (Monk), Weapon Finese, Mobility, Combat Reflexes (Monk), Weapon Focus: Unarmed Strike
Skills: Acro +10, Escape +10, Perception +11, Stealth +10
Equipment: Bracers of Armor +1, Headband of Inspired Wisdom +2. 1000 GP
Target CR 4
AC: 17 (hit 55%, Flurry 50%)
HP: 40 (5.5 dmg per hit, dead after 7 hits)
Saves: +7 or +3 (saves 55% or 35%)
Attack: +8 or +6 (hits 40% or 30%; 20%/10% for AoO)
PrimAbility: DC 15 (hits bad save 45%, good 25%)
AC: 23 (27)
HP: 38
Saves: +5/+7/+9
CMB: +8
CMD: 25
Init: +3
Unarmed: +7, d8+1
Flurry: +7/+7, d8+1
StunFist: DC 18
Feats: Dodge (Monk), Weapon Finese, Mobility, Combat Reflexes (Monk), Weapon Focus: Unarmed Strike, Agile Maneuvers
Skills: Acro +11, Escape +11, Perception +12, Stealth +11
Equipment: Bracers of Armor +2, Headband of Inspired Wisdom +2, Ring of Protection +1. 500 GP
Target CR 5
AC: 18 (hit 50%, Flurry 50%)
HP: 55 (5.5 dmg per hit, dead after 10 hits)
Saves: +8 or +4 (saves 55% or 35%)
Attack: +10 or +7 (hits 40% or 25%; 20%/5% for AoO)
PrimAbility: DC 15 (hits bad save 40%, good 20%)
AC: 24 (28)
HP: 45
Saves: +6/+8/+10
CMB: +9
CMD: 27
Init: +3
Unarmed: +8, d8+2
Flurry: +8/+8/+3, d8+2
StunFist: DC 18
Feats: Dodge (Monk), Weapon Finese, Mobility, Combat Reflexes (Monk), Weapon Focus: Unarmed Strike, Agile Maneuvers, Improved Grapple (Monk)
Skills: Acro +12, Escape +12, Perception +13, Stealth +12
Equipment: Bracers of Armor +2, Headband of Inspired Wisdom +2, Ring of Protection +1, Belt of Strength +2, Amulet of Nat Armor +1. 0 GP
Target CR 6
AC: 19 (hit 50%, Flurry 50/25%)
HP: 70 (6.5 dmg per hit, dead after 10ish hits)
Saves: +9 or +5 (saves 60% or 40%)
Attack: +12 or +8 (hits 45% or 25%; 25%/5% for AoO)
PrimAbility: DC 16 (hits bad save 45%, good 25%)
Question: Would using +1 Brass Knuckles cancel out the effect of Weapon Focus Unarmed Strike?
Also, this build cares about Stunning Fist more than I do personally.
I made this thread because I feel like if you're going to play Monk, you have to give up on some class features. I would personally give up on Grappling (against CR = APL baddies) and Stunning Fist things.
Regarding metrics: An absolute objective metric is undefinable in PF. People are going to have to arbitrarily set particular values to various things. How important is AC? How important is HP? How important is attack bonus? The answers to those are near intractable. Either you arbitrarily set it or you don't know it; even if we enter the "combat vacuum". How much HP do you need to survive monster X? Well that depends on you AC, attack bonus, damage, range / reach, CMB / CMD, saves etc. Now we ask how much AC do you need? The answer is that it depends on everything else. It is workable for any particular stat block. Yet there is still a catch even if you do this massive number crunch. How do we qualify whether something survives? A level 1 commoner could beat a solar real easily. They just have to roll all nat 20's and the solar has to roll all nat 1's. So if we set our standard to capability to "there exists a circumstance that it survives", we end up with the trivial solution. The existence of this case makes the only other objective standard of survivability impossible, which is "there does not exist a circumstance where it does not survive". Taking on any other value is an arbitrary choice; no matter how reasonable the choice is.
I have no idea how that lvl 1 Commoner is going to get through DR and regernation 15.
If you're talking about rolling 3 20's in succession resulting in insta-death (a rule I've seen some people employ) then the chance is 0.000125 that the commoner will kill the Solar in any one round.That means the solar has more or less 10,000 rounds before he dies, in which all he has to do is roll a 2+. The chance of the Solar not hitting home in one of those 10,000 rounds is infinitesimally small (like I don't have a calculator on hand that's willing to display the number right now).
But more on metrics: All metrics I have are based on the monster creation rules. The question isn't just, how much "HP/AC/DPR do I need" But how much is needed to not get 1RKO'd by a monster @CR. These numbers are in turn based on the monster creation rules. So you look at the chart, and then base the numbers from there.
There will be some monsters that have higher or lower numbers. For example the average DPR for a monster @ CR 10 is 45. A Fire Giant using a Great Sword deals 54.69, while an Adult White Dragon deals 43.9*. This is of course using a full attack and nothing else, and they're attacking AC 24 (Creature creation AC for CR10).
The numbers aren't based on what other values are in the stat block, that would be strange and self referential, instead they're based an external chart provided by Paizo. Keeps things simple and static.
@Hyperion Sanctum: I thought WF(Unarmed Strike) didn't affect brass knucks. Either way, the bonuses should stack.
@Ciretose: That's a huge table. At least in my experience I've not had that much space to play in.
The AP idea is noble, and one I'm not gonna dismiss immediately. I've never played RoTL, so I can't comment on how "average" the encounters are. (I would like to mention however, that a Two Weapon Fighter will also have two attacks, like the monk).
I'm also not going to deny mobility being useful. I'm currently at a loss as to how to measure it, but I'll work at it and come up with some ideas.
If it does indeed stack (i think it should), the character I built should be much different.
Except every monk in this thread so far cant do things consistantly. If you get that stunning fist off, the rogue smiles, so half the time your dead weight and as soon as you burn through all of your stunning fists your sol. But wait, you can run past people (unlike the fighter) and get to the dangerous guy, well one this assumes you have enough move in one movement to weave through everyone in combat without provoking and two, what is your plan when you get there? You cant kill it before it kills you (one reason why that is an important metric if you plan on running up to something solo) your about to eat a full attack and another next round because literally none of your abilities have a halfway decent shot at working.
That's not entirely true. Remember that my monk was on par with the enemy, being able to win 50% of the time, and that would actually be in his favor since his Initiative should beat the enemy. It should also be noted that I picked the worst case scenarios. The ACs were on the high end for the enemies. The attacks were the best they should be. The damage was the high end for the enemy. And the DC for saves were the best that should be expected from the enemy.
I can rerun the numbers using the low end from the Bestiary. I think the monk I posted would do extremely well.
The biggest problem was with the maneuvers and the only way to address that is for the enemies to not be so big. This is campaign dependent and cannot be addressed with just the math.
Alex K here.
Just hit level 4 with this monk via PbP. Have been more than contributing my fair share in Legacy of Fire, often against enemies that have boosted stats to compensate for 6 players. Despite that I have almost never failed a grapple roll, I regularily get full attacks off (and hit with attacks with it) and have had some really awesome moments with him.
I'd be curious to hear how you feel once you hit, say, level 12.
I'm running LoF with a monk PC right now, and I think relatively the first book's worth of it is pretty favorable for a monk -- but I don't think it lasts. He's not useless, but I think he clearly feels frequently overshadowed by the rest of the party, most of which isn't remotely optimized.
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Consistently = most of the time = more than half. A persistent spell will hit consistently.Except every monk in this thread so far cant do things consistantlyI don't know of any character who can do things consistently. Spells have saving throws. Skills have DCs. Attacks have "to hit" rolls.
Full disclosure I don't allow persistent spell in my games because I think it is broken.
That being said, let's see if your statement is true.
1st, Persistent is a +2 metamagic feat, so you are at least 5th level before you can possibly use it. And then only with 1st level spells, which...well...not that awesome vs 5th level fights. And you would have to designate that for a memorized slot, meaning you have at best 4 a day if you are maxed int and have a bonded item (more on the bonded item later). The monk of course has 5 stunning fists a day at the same level, regardless.
2nd, off the top because it's a +2 level increase, you are using the saves from the spell 2 levels below your max, albeit twice by the use of the feat. So when looking at the saves, you have to keep that in mind.
Now to make it equivalent to the stunning fist, you would have to be able to do it while threatened. I mean, the monk does stunning fist while in melee doing damage, right?
So casting on the defensive is 15 + caster level, meaning about 50/50 if you have a 20 int at 5th level, so that factors in also if you want it to be equivalent.
And of course, if they make the save or fail at casting the wizard does, well, nothing. While with the monk even if they fail the save they could do damage.
And then there is the whole vulnerability of wizards vs monks to attacks.
In other words, the comparison is horribly flawed, and the metric isn't indicative of game setting and therefore not particularly useful as a benchmark.
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@Ciretose: That's a huge table. At least in my experience I've not had that much space to play in.The AP idea is noble, and one I'm not gonna dismiss immediately. I've never played RoTL, so I can't comment on how "average" the encounters are. (I would like to mention however, that a Two Weapon Fighter will also have two attacks, like the monk).
It is, and we love it.
Is there an AP you have played that we could discuss the thought problem in?
Re: Persistent Spell: even at the errata'd price, a lesser rod of it is dirt cheap. (Too cheap, IMHO, but that's a separate conversation.)
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Alex K here.
Just hit level 4 with this monk via PbP. Have been more than contributing my fair share in Legacy of Fire, often against enemies that have boosted stats to compensate for 6 players. Despite that I have almost never failed a grapple roll, I regularily get full attacks off (and hit with attacks with it) and have had some really awesome moments with him.
I'd be curious to hear how you feel once you hit, say, level 12.
I'm running LoF with a monk PC right now, and I think relatively the first book's worth of it is pretty favorable for a monk -- but I don't think it lasts. He's not useless, but I think he clearly feels frequently overshadowed by the rest of the party, most of which isn't remotely optimized.
He'll feel better when he gets spell resistance at 13th. Unless he wants to be primary damage dealer, in which case it is the wrong class to play.
I can see quite a few opportunities in what I assume is "The Impossible Eye."
I mean it isn't great for monks with the elementals being immune to stunning and basically immune to combat maneuvers. But casters will have trouble with the spell resistances and constructs as well.
I can see the monk being immune to the Get of Iblis's poison as a moment to shine. His high touch AC vs the Wraith and the Darnoc will help.
But that book isn't one I would say is one where a monk is that great, although other classes will have problems as well.
What is the party composition?
It is, and we love it.
Is there an AP you have played that we could discuss the thought problem in?
Unfortunately, no. I've not played any AP yet, since many of my GMs either build their own worlds, or converted their old ones from 3.5
I am interested in running an AP one day, and RoTL is definably high on that list, so I won't mind at all a Monk run-down. Especially since I'd like to help any player who really wanted to play a class that might have problems in the AP.
2nd, off the top because it's a +2 level increase, you are using the saves from the spell 2 levels below your max, albeit twice by the use of the feat. So when looking at the saves, you have to keep that in mind.
I've done the math in the persistent vs heighten thread. Persistent is better than heighten except when you expect them to pass the save anyways. Heighten is only better than persistent if they have to roll a 3 or less on the unmetamagicked spell to pass the save. Now heighten has other, more situational uses such as bypassing globe of invulernability or regarding improved counterspell (but not any other form of counterspelling) and 3.5e shenanigans.
Now to make it equivalent to the stunning fist, you would have to be able to do it while threatened. I mean, the monk does stunning fist while in melee doing damage, right?
Since when are full casters in melee?
And of course, if they make the save or fail at casting the wizard does, well, nothing. While with the monk even if they fail the save they could do damage.
You don't play casters much do you? Look at the gems from their list. Stinking cloud (you still got a cloud blocking LoE), Glitterdust (still outline invisible creatures), Grease (still slows movement), Web (LoE again). This is just off top of my head.
1st, Persistent is a +2 metamagic feat, so you are at least 5th level before you can possibly use it. And then only with 1st level spells, which...well...not that awesome vs 5th level fights. And you would have to designate that for a memorized slot, meaning you have at best 4 a day if you are maxed int and have a bonded item (more on the bonded item later). The monk of course has 5 stunning fists a day at the same level, regardless.
Grease, Ear-piercing Scream, Bungle. Don't forget the perennial favorite Silent Image.
In other words, the comparison is horribly flawed, and the metric isn't indicative of game setting and therefore not particularly useful as a benchmark.
Read my earlier post regarding metrics. Or better yet, come up with a reasonable metric to judge the monk by. Throughout the thread, none of the monk defenders put up any metric to judge it by. All I have seen is constant shifting of the goalposts.
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Wait, why is this? The monk stunning fists in melee because he has to- I don't see why that means the wizard is required to also be in melee, unless the spell is touch. Couldn't you just as easily say that the monk has to stunning fist at range (which may or may not be possible, I don't know) since the wizard can cast at range?Now to make it equivalent to the stunning fist, you would have to be able to do it while threatened. I mean, the monk does stunning fist while in melee doing damage, right?
So casting on the defensive is 15 + caster level, meaning about 50/50 if you have a 20 int at 5th level, so that factors in also if you want it to be equivalent.
The wizard isn't required to go into melee. But if the Wizard is in melee this would be the expectation.
The monk is being required by the metric to always close in and trade shots. That isn't what a well played monk would do in a given situation.
Using the DPR example, let's say 10th level fighter Falcion Fred can do enough damage in a round to kill a monk outright. Does he beat the monk?
Not a well played monk, who has spring attack and realizes that with his +30 to movement combined with having no movement penalties from armor that he can spring attack, take a swing at Falchion Fred, and then end up outside of Falcion Fred's charge range.
Now if the 10th level monk is fighting Wizard Willie, he's going to stun and grapple and close...because that is the way to deal with Wizard Willie.
In both cases, I wouldn't see the monk as over matched, and one could argue he would have the advantage in both cases.
The metrics being used assume on strategy, because they are based on one strategy. Falcion Fred is going to close to do maximum damage quickly to end an opponent. He will be in trouble if he can't close quickly.
Wizard Willie is going to keep distance to avoid having the AoO, and will be in trouble in melee.
The monk decides which way to handle things based on circumstances. He doesn't do as much damage as Falcion Fred, or neutralize opponents effectiveness as well as a wizard. But he can do both, depending on what is going to be most effective at the time.
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You don't play casters much do you? Look at the gems from their list. Stinking cloud (you still got a cloud blocking LoE), Glitterdust (still outline invisible creatures), Grease (still slows movement), Web (LoE again). This is just off top of my head.
Glitterdust now allows a save per round, and only lasts a round per level. Grease is a DC 10 Acrobatics check...which against 5th level characters isn't impressive. Web is a standard action for an escape artist check against the save DC of a first level spell.
All have been nerfed in Pathfinder, and all are about as effective as a stunning fist, without doing any damage and occupying your highest level spell slot instead of a much more useful 3rd level spell.
Create a Wizard build and we can discuss and compare.
So I’m going for a different monk here. I won’t have stunning fist since I am going with weapon master. I am going to use a quarterstaff. I don’t know how to account for the Perfect Strike ability. So long as I am able to keep my DPR up without out, I think we can assume that I would be even better with it. I also am going to break down the DPR into Single Attack and Flurry. The reason is because the monk may spend some time moving and might only get one attack that round. I don’t know what that would do for the DPR but again, so long as I can keep it high, everything should work out fine. I used the Elite Array. I think that the classes should be functional on at a minimum 15 point buy so that’s what I’m shooting for. I also am taking a few Combat Maneuvers but the primary purpose is to boost my CMD. CMB boosting is secondary for this build. Against some creatures, it will be handy. Against others, he’s not worried.
It is also important to keep in mind that I chose the worst case for the monk. The opponent deals the most damage for its attacks, has the highest attack bonus, and is using its best ability that requires a DC. So these are the worst the monk is expected to do, not the average or best.
Also, I did not spend all my wealth at each level. There are things I can still buy, such as ranged weapons and potions. Keep in mind that the number of rounds the monk or the enemy can win is rounded to the next highest whole number of rounds. 2.01 and 2.99 both round up to 3.
Once again, I will post all 20 levels, 5 per post.
Stick Fighter Monk
Level 1
GURNVOS
LN Medium Humanoid (Human)
Init +5; Senses Perception +7
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DEFENSE
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AC 15, touch 15, flat-footed 13. . (+1 Dex, +1 dodge)
hp 13 (1d8+4)
Fort +3, Ref +4, Will +6
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OFFENSE
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Spd 30 ft.
Melee Quarterstaff FoB +1/+1 +2 (1d6+3/20/x2)
Special Attacks Flurry of Blows +1/+1 BAB +1
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STATISTICS
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Str 15, Dex 13, Con 12, Int 10, Wis 16, Cha 8
Base Atk +0; CMB +3 (+2 Grappling); CMD 17
Feats Dodge, Improved Initiative, Improved Unarmed Strike, Monk Weapon Proficiencies, Perfect Strike (2d20) (1/day), Toughness +3
Traits Deft Dodger, Indomitable Faith
Skills Acrobatics +5, Climb +6, Escape Artist +5, Perception +7, Stealth +5
Languages Common
SQ AC Bonus +3, Unarmed Strike (1d6)
Combat Gear Quarterstaff FoB +1/+1;
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TRACKED RESOURCES
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Perfect Strike (2d20) (1/day) - 0/1
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SPECIAL ABILITIES
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AC Bonus +3 The Monk adds his Wisdom bonus to AC and CMD, more at higher levels.
Flurry of Blows +1/+1 BAB +1 (Ex) Make Flurry of Blows attack as a full action.
Improved Unarmed Strike Unarmed strikes don't cause attacks of opportunity, and can be lethal.
Perfect Strike (2d20) (1/day) Roll 2d20 for an attack with a Monk weapon and use the higher as your attack roll, the next as your critical confirmation.
Unarmed Strike (1d6) The Monk does lethal damage with his unarmed strikes.
DPR
Single Attack: 5.12
Flurry: 8.66
Target Numbers:
HP: 15
AC: 12
High Attack Bonus: 2
High Damage: 7
Primary Ability DC: 12
Good Save: 3
Monk can take out opponent in 2-3 rounds.
Opponent can take out monk in 4+ rounds.
To avoid opponent’s primary ability that requires a save against monk’s lowest save: 55%
Level 2
LN Medium Humanoid (Human)
Init +5; Senses Perception +8
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DEFENSE
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AC 15, touch 15, flat-footed 13. . (+1 Dex, +1 dodge)
hp 20 (2d8+5)
Fort +4, Ref +5, Will +7
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OFFENSE
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Spd 30 ft.
Melee Masterwork Quarterstaff FoB +4/+4 +5 (1d6+3/20/x2)
Special Attacks Flurry of Blows +4/+4 BAB +1
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STATISTICS
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Str 15, Dex 13, Con 12, Int 10, Wis 16, Cha 8
Base Atk +1; CMB +4 (+3 Grappling); CMD 18
Feats Combat Reflexes (2 AoO/round), Dodge, Improved Initiative, Improved Unarmed Strike, Monk Weapon Proficiencies, Perfect Strike (2d20) (2/day), Toughness +3, Weapon Focus: Quarterstaff
Traits Deft Dodger, Indomitable Faith
Skills Acrobatics +6, Climb +7, Escape Artist +6, Perception +8, Stealth +6
Languages Common
SQ AC Bonus +3, Unarmed Strike (1d6)
Combat Gear Masterwork Quarterstaff FoB +4/+4;
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TRACKED RESOURCES
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Perfect Strike (2d20) (2/day) - 0/2
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SPECIAL ABILITIES
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AC Bonus +3 The Monk adds his Wisdom bonus to AC and CMD, more at higher levels.
Combat Reflexes (2 AoO/round) You may make up to 2 attacks of apportunity per round, and may make them while flat-footed.
Flurry of Blows +4/+4 BAB +1 (Ex) Make Flurry of Blows attack as a full action.
Improved Unarmed Strike Unarmed strikes don't cause attacks of opportunity, and can be lethal.
Perfect Strike (2d20) (2/day) Roll 2d20 for an attack with a Monk weapon and use the higher as your attack roll, the next as your critical confirmation.
Unarmed Strike (1d6) The Monk does lethal damage with his unarmed strikes.
DPR:
Single Attack: 5.51
Flurry: 9.45
Target Numbers:
HP: 20
AC: 14
High Attack Bonus: 4
High Damage: 10
Primary Ability DC: 13
Good Save: 4
Monk can take out opponent in 3-4 rounds.
Opponent can take out monk in 4+ rounds.
To avoid opponent’s primary ability that requires a save against monk’s lowest save: 60%
Level 3
LN Medium Humanoid (Human)
Init +5; Senses Perception +9
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DEFENSE
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AC 15, touch 15, flat-footed 13. . (+1 Dex, +1 dodge)
hp 27 (3d8+6)
Fort +7, Ref +6, Will +8
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OFFENSE
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Spd 40 ft.
Melee Masterwork Quarterstaff +6 (1d6+3/20/x2)
Special Attacks Flurry of Blows +3/+3 BAB +1
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STATISTICS
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Str 15, Dex 13, Con 12, Int 10, Wis 16, Cha 8
Base Atk +2; CMB +5; CMD 19
Feats Combat Reflexes (2 AoO/round), Dodge, Great Fortitude, Improved Initiative, Improved Unarmed Strike, Monk Weapon Proficiencies, Perfect Strike (2d20) (3/day), Toughness +3, Weapon Focus: Quarterstaff
Traits Deft Dodger, Indomitable Faith
Skills Acrobatics +7, Climb +8, Escape Artist +7, Perception +9, Stealth +7
Languages Common
SQ AC Bonus +3, Fast Movement (+10'), Maneuver Training (Ex), Still Mind (Ex), Unarmed Strike (1d6)
Combat Gear Masterwork Quarterstaff; Other Gear Cloak of Resistance, +1
--------------------
TRACKED RESOURCES
--------------------
Perfect Strike (2d20) (3/day) - 0/3
--------------------
SPECIAL ABILITIES
--------------------
AC Bonus +3 The Monk adds his Wisdom bonus to AC and CMD, more at higher levels.
Combat Reflexes (2 AoO/round) You may make up to 2 attacks of apportunity per round, and may make them while flat-footed.
Fast Movement (+10') The Monk adds 10 or more feet to his base speed.
Flurry of Blows +3/+3 BAB +1 (Ex) Make Flurry of Blows attack as a full action.
Improved Unarmed Strike Unarmed strikes don't cause attacks of opportunity, and can be lethal.
Maneuver Training (Ex) CMB = other BABs + Monk level
Perfect Strike (2d20) (3/day) Roll 2d20 for an attack with a Monk weapon and use the higher as your attack roll, the next as your critical confirmation.
Still Mind (Ex) +2 to saves against enchantment spells and effects.
Unarmed Strike (1d6) The Monk does lethal damage with his unarmed strikes.
DPR:
Single Attack: 8.51
Flurry: 14.18
Target Numbers:
HP: 30
AC: 15
High Attack Bonus: 6
High Damage: 13
Primary Ability DC: 14
Good Save: 5
Monk can take out opponent in 3-4 rounds.
Opponent can take out monk in 4+ rounds.
To avoid opponent’s primary ability that requires a save against monk’s lowest save: 60%
Level 4
LN Medium Humanoid (Human)
Init +5; Senses Perception +10
--------------------
DEFENSE
--------------------
AC 16, touch 16, flat-footed 14. . (+1 Dex, +1 dodge)
hp 35 (4d8+8)
Fort +6, Ref +7, Will +9
--------------------
OFFENSE
--------------------
Spd 40 ft.
Melee +1 Quarterstaff FoB +5/+5/+5 +6 (1d6+11/20/x2)
Special Attacks Flurry of Blows +5/+5/+5 BAB +1, Ki Strike, Magic
--------------------
STATISTICS
--------------------
Str 16, Dex 13, Con 12, Int 10, Wis 16, Cha 8
Base Atk +3; CMB +7; CMD 22
Feats Combat Reflexes (2 AoO/round), Dodge, Improved Initiative, Improved Unarmed Strike, Monk Weapon Proficiencies, Perfect Strike (2d20) (4/day), Power Attack -2/+4, Toughness +4, Weapon Focus: Quarterstaff
Traits Deft Dodger, Indomitable Faith
Skills Acrobatics +8, Climb +10, Escape Artist +8, Perception +10, Stealth +8
Languages Common
SQ AC Bonus +4, Fast Movement (+10'), Ki Defense (Su), Ki Pool (Su), Maneuver Training (Ex), Slow Fall 20' (Ex), Still Mind (Ex), Unarmed Strike (1d8)
Combat Gear +1 Quarterstaff FoB +5/+5/+5; Other Gear Cloak of Resistance, +1
--------------------
TRACKED RESOURCES
--------------------
Ki Pool (Su) - 0/5
Perfect Strike (2d20) (4/day) - 0/4
--------------------
SPECIAL ABILITIES
--------------------
AC Bonus +4 The Monk adds his Wisdom bonus to AC and CMD, more at higher levels.
Combat Reflexes (2 AoO/round) You may make up to 2 attacks of apportunity per round, and may make them while flat-footed.
Fast Movement (+10') The Monk adds 10 or more feet to his base speed.
Flurry of Blows +5/+5/+5 BAB +1 (Ex) Make Flurry of Blows attack as a full action.
Improved Unarmed Strike Unarmed strikes don't cause attacks of opportunity, and can be lethal.
Ki Defense (Su) A monk can spend 1 point from his ki pool to give himself a +4 dodge bonus to AC for 1 round.
Ki Pool (Su) You have a ki pool equal to 1/2 your monk level + your WIS modifier.
Ki Strike, Magic (Su) At 4th level, ki strike allows a monk's unarmed attacks to be treated as magic weapons for the purpose of overcoming damage reduction.
Maneuver Training (Ex) CMB = other BABs + Monk level
Perfect Strike (2d20) (4/day) Roll 2d20 for an attack with a Monk weapon and use the higher as your attack roll, the next as your critical confirmation.
Power Attack -2/+4 You can subtract from your attack roll to add to your damage.
Slow Fall 20' (Ex) Treat a fall as shorter than normal if within arm's reach of a wall.
Still Mind (Ex) +2 to saves against enchantment spells and effects.
Unarmed Strike (1d8) The Monk does lethal damage with his unarmed strikes.
DPR
Single Attack: 8.37
Flurry: 13.70
Target Numbers:
HP: 40
AC: 17
High Attack Bonus: 8
High Damage: 16
Primary Ability DC: 15
Good Save: 7
Monk can take out opponent in 3-5 rounds.
Opponent can take out monk in 4+ rounds.
To avoid opponent’s primary ability that requires a save against monk’s lowest save: 60%
Level 5
LN Medium Humanoid (Human)
Init +5; Senses Perception +11
--------------------
DEFENSE
--------------------
AC 18, touch 17, flat-footed 16. . (+1 Dex, +1 natural, +1 deflection, +1 dodge)
hp 43 (5d8+10)
Fort +8, Ref +7, Will +9
Immune disease
--------------------
OFFENSE
--------------------
Spd 40 ft.
Melee +1 Quarterstaff FoB +6/+6/+6 +6 (1d6+11/20/x2)
Special Attacks Flurry of Blows +6/+6/+6 BAB +2, Ki Strike, Magic
--------------------
STATISTICS
--------------------
Str 16, Dex 13, Con 12, Int 10, Wis 16, Cha 8
Base Atk +3; CMB +8; CMD 23
Feats Combat Reflexes (2 AoO/round), Dodge, Great Fortitude, Improved Initiative, Improved Unarmed Strike, Monk Weapon Proficiencies, Perfect Strike (2d20) (5/day), Power Attack -2/+4, Toughness +5, Weapon Focus: Quarterstaff
Traits Deft Dodger, Indomitable Faith
Skills Acrobatics +9, Climb +11, Escape Artist +9, Perception +11, Stealth +9
Languages Common
SQ AC Bonus +4, Fast Movement (+10'), High Jump (+5) (Ex), Ki Defense (Su), Ki Pool (Su), Maneuver Training (Ex), Purity of Body (Ex), Slow Fall 20' (Ex), Still Mind (Ex), Unarmed Strike (1d8)
Combat Gear +1 Quarterstaff FoB +6/+6/+6; Other Gear Amulet of Natural Armor +1, Cloak of Resistance, +1, Ring of Protection, +1
--------------------
TRACKED RESOURCES
--------------------
Ki Pool (Su) - 0/5
Perfect Strike (2d20) (5/day) - 0/5
--------------------
SPECIAL ABILITIES
--------------------
AC Bonus +4 The Monk adds his Wisdom bonus to AC and CMD, more at higher levels.
Combat Reflexes (2 AoO/round) You may make up to 2 attacks of apportunity per round, and may make them while flat-footed.
Fast Movement (+10') The Monk adds 10 or more feet to his base speed.
Flurry of Blows +6/+6/+6 BAB +2 (Ex) Make Flurry of Blows attack as a full action.
High Jump (+5) (Ex) +5 to Acrobatics checks made to jump.
Immunity to Disease You are immune to diseases.
Improved Unarmed Strike Unarmed strikes don't cause attacks of opportunity, and can be lethal.
Ki Defense (Su) A monk can spend 1 point from his ki pool to give himself a +4 dodge bonus to AC for 1 round.
Ki Pool (Su) You have a ki pool equal to 1/2 your monk level + your WIS modifier.
Ki Strike, Magic (Su) At 4th level, ki strike allows a monk's unarmed attacks to be treated as magic weapons for the purpose of overcoming damage reduction.
Maneuver Training (Ex) CMB = other BABs + Monk level
Perfect Strike (2d20) (5/day) Roll 2d20 for an attack with a Monk weapon and use the higher as your attack roll, the next as your critical confirmation.
Power Attack -2/+4 You can subtract from your attack roll to add to your damage.
Purity of Body (Ex) At 5th level, a monk gains immunity to all diseases, including supernatural and magical diseases.
Slow Fall 20' (Ex) Treat a fall as shorter than normal if within arm's reach of a wall.
Still Mind (Ex) +2 to saves against enchantment spells and effects.
Unarmed Strike (1d8) The Monk does lethal damage with his unarmed strikes.
DPR:
Single Attack: 9.77
Flurry: 16.28
Target Numbers:
HP: 55
AC: 18
High Attack Bonus: 10
High Damage: 20
Primary Ability DC: 15
Good Save: 8
Monk can take out opponent in 4-6 rounds.
Opponent can take out monk in 4+ rounds.
To avoid opponent’s primary ability that requires a save against monk’s lowest save: 65%
ok, this is my "screw stunning fist, acrobatic, Spring Attacking Monk Man"
LVL 6
Monk of the Four Winds Archtype
AC: 23 (27, Mobility)
HP: 51
Str 13, Dex 21, Con 14, Int 8, Wis 14, Cha 6
Saves: +7/+10/+7
Init: +9
Unarmed: +10, d8+1
Flurry: +10/+10/+5, d8+1
Elemental Fist: 6/day
Feats: Dodge (Monk), Weapon Finese, Mobility, Combat Reflexes (Monk), Weapon Focus: Unarmed Strike, Improved Initiative
Skills: Acro +14, Perception +11, Stealth +14
Equipment: Bracers of Armor +2, Belt of Dex +2, Amulet of Nat Armor +2. 0 GP
Target CR 6
AC: 19 (hit 60%, Flurry 60/35%)
HP: 70 (5.5 dmg per hit, dead after 12ish hits)
Attack: +12 or +8 (hits 50% or 30%; 25%/5% for AoO)
PrimAbility: DC 16 (hits bad save 40%, good 25%)
Level 6
LN Medium Humanoid (Human)
Init +5; Senses Perception +12
--------------------
DEFENSE
--------------------
AC 20, touch 17, flat-footed 18. . (+2 armor, +1 Dex, +1 natural, +1 deflection, +1 dodge)
hp 51 (6d8+12)
Fort +9, Ref +8, Will +10
Immune disease
--------------------
OFFENSE
--------------------
Spd 50 ft.
Melee +1 Quarterstaff FoB +7/+7/+7/+2 +7 (1d6+13/20/x2)
Special Attacks Flurry of Blows +7/+7/+7/+2 BAB +2, Ki Strike, Magic
--------------------
STATISTICS
--------------------
Str 16, Dex 13, Con 12, Int 10, Wis 16, Cha 8
Base Atk +4; CMB +9 (+11 Grappling); CMD 24 (26 vs. Grapple)
Feats Combat Reflexes (2 AoO/round), Dodge, Great Fortitude, Improved Grapple, Improved Initiative, Improved Unarmed Strike, Monk Weapon Proficiencies, Perfect Strike (2d20) (6/day), Power Attack -2/+4, Toughness +6, Weapon Focus: Quarterstaff, Weapon Specialization: Quarterstaff
Traits Deft Dodger, Indomitable Faith
Skills Acrobatics +10, Climb +12, Escape Artist +10, Perception +12, Stealth +10
Languages Common
SQ AC Bonus +4, Fast Movement (+20'), High Jump (+6) (Ex), Ki Defense (Su), Ki Pool (Su), Maneuver Training (Ex), Purity of Body (Ex), Slow Fall 30' (Ex), Still Mind (Ex), Unarmed Strike (1d8)
Combat Gear +1 Quarterstaff FoB +7/+7/+7/+2; Other Gear Amulet of Natural Armor +1, Bracers of Armor, +2, Cloak of Resistance, +1, Ring of Protection, +1
--------------------
TRACKED RESOURCES
--------------------
Ki Pool (Su) - 0/6
Perfect Strike (2d20) (6/day) - 0/6
--------------------
SPECIAL ABILITIES
--------------------
AC Bonus +4 The Monk adds his Wisdom bonus to AC and CMD, more at higher levels.
Combat Reflexes (2 AoO/round) You may make up to 2 attacks of apportunity per round, and may make them while flat-footed.
Fast Movement (+20') The Monk adds 10 or more feet to his base speed.
Flurry of Blows +7/+7/+7/+2 BAB +2 (Ex) Make Flurry of Blows attack as a full action.
High Jump (+6) (Ex) +6 to Acrobatics checks made to jump.
Immunity to Disease You are immune to diseases.
Improved Grapple You grapple at +2, with no attacks of opportunity allowed.
Improved Unarmed Strike Unarmed strikes don't cause attacks of opportunity, and can be lethal.
Ki Defense (Su) A monk can spend 1 point from his ki pool to give himself a +4 dodge bonus to AC for 1 round.
Ki Pool (Su) You have a ki pool equal to 1/2 your monk level + your WIS modifier.
Ki Strike, Magic (Su) At 4th level, ki strike allows a monk's unarmed attacks to be treated as magic weapons for the purpose of overcoming damage reduction.
Maneuver Training (Ex) CMB = other BABs + Monk level
Perfect Strike (2d20) (6/day) Roll 2d20 for an attack with a Monk weapon and use the higher as your attack roll, the next as your critical confirmation.
Power Attack -2/+4 You can subtract from your attack roll to add to your damage.
Purity of Body (Ex) At 5th level, a monk gains immunity to all diseases, including supernatural and magical diseases.
Slow Fall 30' (Ex) Treat a fall as shorter than normal if within arm's reach of a wall.
Still Mind (Ex) +2 to saves against enchantment spells and effects.
Unarmed Strike (1d8) The Monk does lethal damage with his unarmed strikes.
DPR:
Single Attack: 11.94
Flurry: 25.73
Target Numbers:
HP: 70
AC: 19
High Attack Bonus: 12
High Damage: 25
Primary Ability DC: 16
Good Save: 9
Monk can take out opponent in 3-6 rounds.
Opponent can take out monk in 4+ rounds.
To avoid opponent’s primary ability that requires a save against monk’s lowest save: 65%
Level 7
LN Medium Humanoid (Human)
Init +5; Senses Perception +13
--------------------
DEFENSE
--------------------
AC 21, touch 18, flat-footed 19. . (+2 armor, +1 Dex, +1 natural, +2 deflection, +1 dodge)
hp 59 (7d8+14)
Fort +9, Ref +8, Will +10
Immune disease
--------------------
OFFENSE
--------------------
Spd 50 ft.
Melee +1 Quarterstaff FoB +8/+8/+8/+3 +8 (1d6+13/20/x2)
Special Attacks Flurry of Blows +8/+8/+8/+3 BAB +2, Ki Strike, Magic
--------------------
STATISTICS
--------------------
Str 16, Dex 13, Con 12, Int 10, Wis 16, Cha 8
Base Atk +5; CMB +10 (+12 Grappling); CMD 26 (28 vs. Grapple)
Feats Combat Reflexes (2 AoO/round), Dodge, Great Fortitude, Improved Grapple, Improved Initiative, Improved Unarmed Strike, Monk Weapon Proficiencies, Perfect Strike (2d20) (7/day), Power Attack -2/+4, Spider Step (15'), Toughness +7, Weapon Focus: Quarterstaff, Weapon Specialization: Quarterstaff
Traits Deft Dodger, Indomitable Faith
Skills Acrobatics +11, Climb +12, Escape Artist +11, Knowledge: Religion +4, Perception +13, Stealth +11
Languages Common
SQ AC Bonus +4, Fast Movement (+20'), High Jump (+7) (Ex), Ki Defense (Su), Ki Pool (Su), Maneuver Training (Ex), Purity of Body (Ex), Slow Fall 30' (Ex), Still Mind (Ex), Unarmed Strike (1d8), Wholeness of Body (7 HP/use) (Su)
Combat Gear +1 Quarterstaff FoB +8/+8/+8/+3; Other Gear Amulet of Natural Armor +1, Bracers of Armor, +2, Cloak of Resistance, +1, Ring of Protection, +2
--------------------
TRACKED RESOURCES
--------------------
Ki Pool (Su) - 0/6
Perfect Strike (2d20) (7/day) - 0/7
--------------------
SPECIAL ABILITIES
--------------------
AC Bonus +4 The Monk adds his Wisdom bonus to AC and CMD, more at higher levels.
Combat Reflexes (2 AoO/round) You may make up to 2 attacks of apportunity per round, and may make them while flat-footed.
Fast Movement (+20') The Monk adds 10 or more feet to his base speed.
Flurry of Blows +8/+8/+8/+3 BAB +2 (Ex) Make Flurry of Blows attack as a full action.
High Jump (+7) (Ex) +7 to Acrobatics checks made to jump.
Immunity to Disease You are immune to diseases.
Improved Grapple You grapple at +2, with no attacks of opportunity allowed.
Improved Unarmed Strike Unarmed strikes don't cause attacks of opportunity, and can be lethal.
Ki Defense (Su) A monk can spend 1 point from his ki pool to give himself a +4 dodge bonus to AC for 1 round.
Ki Pool (Su) You have a ki pool equal to 1/2 your monk level + your WIS modifier.
Ki Strike, Magic (Su) At 4th level, ki strike allows a monk's unarmed attacks to be treated as magic weapons for the purpose of overcoming damage reduction.
Maneuver Training (Ex) CMB = other BABs + Monk level
Perfect Strike (2d20) (7/day) Roll 2d20 for an attack with a Monk weapon and use the higher as your attack roll, the next as your critical confirmation.
Power Attack -2/+4 You can subtract from your attack roll to add to your damage.
Purity of Body (Ex) At 5th level, a monk gains immunity to all diseases, including supernatural and magical diseases.
Slow Fall 30' (Ex) Treat a fall as shorter than normal if within arm's reach of a wall.
Spider Step (15') Walk half your slow fall distance across walls, ceilings, ropes, branches, water, etc. as a move action.
Still Mind (Ex) +2 to saves against enchantment spells and effects.
Unarmed Strike (1d8) The Monk does lethal damage with his unarmed strikes.
Wholeness of Body (7 HP/use) (Su) Self-heal monk level in damage for 2 Ki points.
DPR:
Single Attack: 11.03
Flurry: 22.97
Target Numbers:
HP: 85
AC: 20
High Attack Bonus: 13
High Damage: 30
Primary Ability DC: 17
Good Save: 10
Monk can take out opponent in 4-8 rounds.
Opponent can take out monk in 4+ rounds.
To avoid opponent’s primary ability that requires a save against monk’s lowest save: 60%
Level 8
LN Medium Humanoid (Human)
Init +6; Senses Perception +14
--------------------
DEFENSE
--------------------
AC 23, touch 20, flat-footed 20. . (+2 armor, +2 Dex, +1 natural, +2 deflection, +1 dodge)
hp 67 (8d8+16)
Fort +10, Ref +10, Will +11
Immune disease
--------------------
OFFENSE
--------------------
Spd 50 ft.
Melee +2 Quarterstaff FoB +9/+9/+9/+4/+4 +9/+4 (1d6+17/20/x2)
Special Attacks Flurry of Blows +9/+9/+9/+4/+4 BAB +2, Ki Strike, Magic
--------------------
STATISTICS
--------------------
Str 16, Dex 14, Con 12, Int 10, Wis 16, Cha 8
Base Atk +6; CMB +11 (+13 Grappling); CMD 29 (31 vs. Grapple)
Feats Combat Reflexes (3 AoO/round), Dodge, Great Fortitude, Improved Grapple, Improved Initiative, Improved Unarmed Strike, Monk Weapon Proficiencies, Perfect Strike (2d20) (8/day), Power Attack -3/+6, Spider Step (20'), Toughness +8, Weapon Focus: Quarterstaff, Weapon Specialization: Quarterstaff
Traits Deft Dodger, Indomitable Faith
Skills Acrobatics +13, Climb +12, Escape Artist +13, Knowledge: Religion +5, Perception +14, Stealth +13
Languages Common
SQ AC Bonus +5, Fast Movement (+20'), High Jump (+8) (Ex), Ki Defense (Su), Ki Pool (Su), Maneuver Training (Ex), Purity of Body (Ex), Slow Fall 40' (Ex), Still Mind (Ex), Unarmed Strike (1d10), Wholeness of Body (8 HP/use) (Su)
Combat Gear +2 Quarterstaff FoB +9/+9/+9/+4/+4; Other Gear Amulet of Natural Armor +1, Bracers of Armor, +2, Cloak of Resistance, +1, Ring of Protection, +2
--------------------
TRACKED RESOURCES
--------------------
Ki Pool (Su) - 0/7
Perfect Strike (2d20) (8/day) - 0/8
--------------------
SPECIAL ABILITIES
--------------------
AC Bonus +5 The Monk adds his Wisdom bonus to AC and CMD, more at higher levels.
Combat Reflexes (3 AoO/round) You may make up to 3 attacks of apportunity per round, and may make them while flat-footed.
Fast Movement (+20') The Monk adds 10 or more feet to his base speed.
Flurry of Blows +9/+9/+9/+4/+4 BAB +2 (Ex) Make Flurry of Blows attack as a full action.
High Jump (+8) (Ex) +8 to Acrobatics checks made to jump.
Immunity to Disease You are immune to diseases.
Improved Grapple You grapple at +2, with no attacks of opportunity allowed.
Improved Unarmed Strike Unarmed strikes don't cause attacks of opportunity, and can be lethal.
Ki Defense (Su) A monk can spend 1 point from his ki pool to give himself a +4 dodge bonus to AC for 1 round.
Ki Pool (Su) You have a ki pool equal to 1/2 your monk level + your WIS modifier.
Ki Strike, Magic (Su) At 4th level, ki strike allows a monk's unarmed attacks to be treated as magic weapons for the purpose of overcoming damage reduction.
Maneuver Training (Ex) CMB = other BABs + Monk level
Perfect Strike (2d20) (8/day) Roll 2d20 for an attack with a Monk weapon and use the higher as your attack roll, the next as your critical confirmation.
Power Attack -3/+6 You can subtract from your attack roll to add to your damage.
Purity of Body (Ex) At 5th level, a monk gains immunity to all diseases, including supernatural and magical diseases.
Slow Fall 40' (Ex) Treat a fall as shorter than normal if within arm's reach of a wall.
Spider Step (20') Walk half your slow fall distance across walls, ceilings, ropes, branches, water, etc. as a move action.
Still Mind (Ex) +2 to saves against enchantment spells and effects.
Unarmed Strike (1d10) The Monk does lethal damage with his unarmed strikes.
Wholeness of Body (8 HP/use) (Su) Self-heal monk level in damage for 2 Ki points.
DPR:
Single Attack: 13.55
Flurry: 33.86
Target Numbers:
HP: 100
AC: 21
High Attack Bonus: 15
High Damage: 35
Primary Ability DC: 18
Good Save: 11
Monk can take out opponent in 3-8 rounds.
Opponent can take out monk in 3 rounds.
To avoid opponent’s primary ability that requires a save against monk’s lowest save: 60%
Level 9
LN Medium Humanoid (Human)
Init +6; Senses Perception +16
--------------------
DEFENSE
--------------------
AC 25, touch 21, flat-footed 22. . (+3 armor, +2 Dex, +1 natural, +2 deflection, +1 dodge)
hp 75 (9d8+18)
Fort +10, Ref +10, Will +12
Defensive Abilities Evasion; Immune disease
--------------------
OFFENSE
--------------------
Spd 60 ft.
Melee +2 Quarterstaff FoB +11/+11/+11/+6/+6 +10/+5 (1d6+19/20/x2)
Special Attacks Flurry of Blows +11/+11/+11/+6/+6 BAB +3, Ki Strike, Magic
--------------------
STATISTICS
--------------------
Str 16/18, Dex 14, Con 12, Int 10, Wis 16/18, Cha 8
Base Atk +6; CMB +13 (+15 Grappling); CMD 31 (33 vs. Grapple)
Feats Combat Reflexes (3 AoO/round), Dodge, Great Fortitude, Improved Grapple, Improved Initiative, Improved Unarmed Strike, Monk Weapon Proficiencies, Perfect Strike (2d20) (9/day), Power Attack -3/+6, Spider Step (20'), Toughness +9, Vital Strike, Weapon Focus: Quarterstaff, Weapon Specialization: Quarterstaff
Traits Deft Dodger, Indomitable Faith
Skills Acrobatics +14, Climb +13, Escape Artist +14, Knowledge: Religion +6, Perception +16, Stealth +14
Languages Common
SQ AC Bonus +6, Fast Movement (+30'), High Jump (+9) (Ex), Ki Defense (Su), Ki Pool (Su), Maneuver Training (Ex), Purity of Body (Ex), Slow Fall 40' (Ex), Still Mind (Ex), Unarmed Strike (1d10), Wholeness of Body (9 HP/use) (Su)
Combat Gear +2 Quarterstaff FoB +11/+11/+11/+6/+6; Other Gear Amulet of Natural Armor +1, Belt of Giant Strength, +2, Bracers of Armor, +3, Cloak of Resistance, +1, Headband of Inspired Wisdom, +2, Ring of Protection, +2
--------------------
TRACKED RESOURCES
--------------------
Ki Pool (Su) - 0/8
Perfect Strike (2d20) (9/day) - 0/9
--------------------
SPECIAL ABILITIES
--------------------
AC Bonus +6 The Monk adds his Wisdom bonus to AC and CMD, more at higher levels.
Combat Reflexes (3 AoO/round) You may make up to 3 attacks of apportunity per round, and may make them while flat-footed.
Evasion (Ex) If you succeed at a Reflex save for half damage, you take none instead.
Fast Movement (+30') The Monk adds 10 or more feet to his base speed.
Flurry of Blows +11/+11/+11/+6/+6 BAB +3 (Ex) Make Flurry of Blows attack as a full action.
High Jump (+9) (Ex) +9 to Acrobatics checks made to jump.
Immunity to Disease You are immune to diseases.
Improved Grapple You grapple at +2, with no attacks of opportunity allowed.
Improved Unarmed Strike Unarmed strikes don't cause attacks of opportunity, and can be lethal.
Ki Defense (Su) A monk can spend 1 point from his ki pool to give himself a +4 dodge bonus to AC for 1 round.
Ki Pool (Su) You have a ki pool equal to 1/2 your monk level + your WIS modifier.
Ki Strike, Magic (Su) At 4th level, ki strike allows a monk's unarmed attacks to be treated as magic weapons for the purpose of overcoming damage reduction.
Maneuver Training (Ex) CMB = other BABs + Monk level
Perfect Strike (2d20) (9/day) Roll 2d20 for an attack with a Monk weapon and use the higher as your attack roll, the next as your critical confirmation.
Power Attack -3/+6 You can subtract from your attack roll to add to your damage.
Purity of Body (Ex) At 5th level, a monk gains immunity to all diseases, including supernatural and magical diseases.
Slow Fall 40' (Ex) Treat a fall as shorter than normal if within arm's reach of a wall.
Spider Step (20') Walk half your slow fall distance across walls, ceilings, ropes, branches, water, etc. as a move action.
Still Mind (Ex) +2 to saves against enchantment spells and effects.
Unarmed Strike (1d10) The Monk does lethal damage with his unarmed strikes.
Vital Strike Standard action: x2 weapon damage dice.
Wholeness of Body (9 HP/use) (Su) Self-heal monk level in damage for 2 Ki points.
DPR:
Single Attack: 16.91
Flurry: 37.01
Target Numbers:
HP: 115
AC: 23
High Attack Bonus: 17
High Damage: 40
Primary Ability DC: 18
Good Save: 12
Monk can take out opponent in 3-7rounds.
Opponent can take out monk in 3 rounds.
To avoid opponent’s primary ability that requires a save against monk’s lowest save: 65%
Level 10
LN Medium Humanoid (Human)
Init +6; Senses Perception +17
--------------------
DEFENSE
--------------------
AC 23, touch 21, flat-footed 20. . (+2 Dex, +2 natural, +2 deflection, +1 dodge)
hp 83 (10d8+20)
Fort +13, Ref +13, Will +15
Defensive Abilities Evasion; Immune disease
--------------------
OFFENSE
--------------------
Spd 60 ft.
Melee +2 Quarterstaff FoB +13/+13/+13/+8/+8 +12/+7 (1d6+20/19-20/x2)
Special Attacks Flurry of Blows +13/+13/+13/+8/+8 BAB +3, Ki Strike, Lawful, Ki Strike, Magic
--------------------
STATISTICS
--------------------
Str 16/20, Dex 14, Con 12, Int 10, Wis 16/18, Cha 8
Base Atk +7; CMB +15 (+17 Grappling); CMD 33 (35 vs. Grapple)
Feats Combat Reflexes (3 AoO/round), Dodge, Great Fortitude, Improved Critical: Quarterstaff, Improved Grapple, Improved Initiative, Improved Unarmed Strike, Monk Weapon Proficiencies, Perfect Strike (3d20) (10/day), Power Attack -3/+6, Spider Step (25'), Toughness +10, Vital Strike, Weapon Focus: Quarterstaff, Weapon Specialization: Quarterstaff
Traits Deft Dodger, Indomitable Faith
Skills Acrobatics +15, Climb +14, Escape Artist +15, Knowledge: Religion +7, Perception +17, Stealth +15
Languages Common
SQ AC Bonus +6, Fast Movement (+30'), High Jump (+10) (Ex), Ki Defense (Su), Ki Pool (Su), Maneuver Training (Ex), Purity of Body (Ex), Slow Fall 50' (Ex), Still Mind (Ex), Unarmed Strike (1d10), Wholeness of Body (10 HP/use) (Su)
Combat Gear +2 Quarterstaff FoB +13/+13/+13/+8/+8; Other Gear Amulet of Natural Armor +2, Belt of Giant Strength, +4, Cloak of Resistance, +3, Headband of Inspired Wisdom, +2, Ring of Protection, +2
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TRACKED RESOURCES
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Ki Pool (Su) - 0/9
Perfect Strike (3d20) (10/day) - 0/10
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SPECIAL ABILITIES
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AC Bonus +6 The Monk adds his Wisdom bonus to AC and CMD, more at higher levels.
Combat Reflexes (3 AoO/round) You may make up to 3 attacks of apportunity per round, and may make them while flat-footed.
Evasion (Ex) If you succeed at a Reflex save for half damage, you take none instead.
Fast Movement (+30') The Monk adds 10 or more feet to his base speed.
Flurry of Blows +13/+13/+13/+8/+8 BAB +3 (Ex) Make Flurry of Blows attack as a full action.
High Jump (+10) (Ex) +10 to Acrobatics checks made to jump.
Immunity to Disease You are immune to diseases.
Improved Grapple You grapple at +2, with no attacks of opportunity allowed.
Improved Unarmed Strike Unarmed strikes don't cause attacks of opportunity, and can be lethal.
Ki Defense (Su) A monk can spend 1 point from his ki pool to give himself a +4 dodge bonus to AC for 1 round.
Ki Pool (Su) You have a ki pool equal to 1/2 your monk level + your WIS modifier.
Ki Strike, Lawful (Su) At 10th level, a monk's unarmed attacks are also treated as lawful weapons for the purpose of overcoming damage reduction.
Ki Strike, Magic (Su) At 4th level, ki strike allows a monk's unarmed attacks to be treated as magic weapons for the purpose of overcoming damage reduction.
Maneuver Training (Ex) CMB = other BABs + Monk level
Perfect Strike (3d20) (10/day) Roll 3d20 for an attack with a Monk weapon and use the higher as your attack roll, the next as your critical confirmation.
Power Attack -3/+6 You can subtract from your attack roll to add to your damage.
Purity of Body (Ex) At 5th level, a monk gains immunity to all diseases, including supernatural and magical diseases.
Slow Fall 50' (Ex) Treat a fall as shorter than normal if within arm's reach of a wall.
Spider Step (25') Walk half your slow fall distance across walls, ceilings, ropes, branches, water, etc. as a move action.
Still Mind (Ex) +2 to saves against enchantment spells and effects.
Unarmed Strike (1d10) The Monk does lethal damage with his unarmed strikes.
Vital Strike Standard action: x2 weapon damage dice.
Wholeness of Body (10 HP/use) (Su) Self-heal monk level in damage for 2 Ki points.
DPR:
Single Attack: 19.79
Flurry: 45.82
Target Numbers:
HP: 130
AC: 24
High Attack Bonus: 18
High Damage: 45
Primary Ability DC: 19
Good Save: 13
Monk can take out opponent in 3-7 rounds.
Opponent can take out monk in 3+ rounds.
To avoid opponent’s primary ability that requires a save against monk’s lowest save: 75%