Seeing as how this book should be coming out sometime this year, i was wondering what other people were hoping to see included (other than the obvious monk or rogue variant Ninja or the fighter/cavalier variant Samurai). personally, i never cared too much for oriental type themes, but they are ok.
im hoping for a cane sword. and thats about it.
im hoping that no new gods (or at least not that many) make it in, seeing as how we have plenty and we shouldve heard about these gods previously, since Tian Xia will be set in Golarion (and i hope that it still will be on Golarion. i hate changing settings just to get oriental flavor).
what would you like to see in this book? please keep the samurai/ninja posts to a minimum. at this point, i think those two are a no brainer.
im hoping for a cane sword. and thats about it.
this is in the apg
this is in the apg
im hoping for a cane sword. and thats about it.
thanks. havent had much time to look at that book for the player side of things. been too busy planning the campaign.
RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32
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what would you like to see in this book? please keep the samurai/ninja posts to a minimum. at this point, i think those two are a no brainer.
Those are coming out in the new Ultimate Combat and are posted in playtest.
I want some new monsters, a couple archetypes, maybe some sorcerer bloodlines and cavalier orders, new materials for weapons/shields, more alchemical stuff. I want alot in other words...
I'm hoping to see some Chinese inspired archetypes and monsters.
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I'd +1 you, but my sensibilities say no to such banal acts. *harrumph*
Seriously though, I hope Paizo gives the three so far announced parts of Tian equal treatment when it comes to book content. I like Japan and recognize its popularity for what is is, but my major interests lie with cross-culture pollination and human networks. Culture, commerce, language, that human friction that happens when you cross distances.
With that said, Minkai is interesting and all, but what I'd like to see is more Crown of the World stuff and especially the Mongolia and mainland China equivalents treated with the same Paizo magic we've come to expect for all of their products. If we assume that Minkai is the very tip of the Tian sub-continent then it would be two other parts that Avistan has had the most contact with, right? Back in Campaign Setting I recall that there was a trading post featured where the Mammoth Lords, Linnorm Kings and Tian cultures freely mingled, since it was the only safe way through the Crown of the World. That is awesome stuff!
I don't know about you guys, but this is exactly my kind of roleplaying material. I love Kaer Maga and Absalom for their multiculturalism and hope we see similar tendencies and tropes in the Tian book as well.
Oh and please, somebody wrote treatments for all of the major Golarion gods for Tian as well. Especially if you treat the local visions of the old pantheon as just as valid interpretations as the Avistani and Garundi ones of them are. Going by that, the gods don't even have to retain their usual, western genders. Erastil as an icon of familial virtue, the good mother figure? Shelyn as a god of tact and physical beauty? Hell yes.
Just my two, three cents.
Oh and please, somebody wrote treatments for all of the major Golarion gods for Tian as well. Especially if you treat the local visions of the old pantheon as just as valid interpretations as the Avistani and Garundi ones of them are. Going by that, the gods don't even have to retain their usual, western genders. Erastil as an icon of familial virtue, the good mother figure? Shelyn as a god of tact and physical beauty? Hell yes.
+1
I also agree on the multicultural treatment. Avatar: The Last Airbender did an excellent job of this. (For the love of all that is holy do not watch the live-action adaptation for reference; that movie is a travesty.) I look forward to Tian Xia, and I trust that Paizo will do it justice.
I am sure they will do a great job. Looking over the original campaign setting book they put out I trust they will give treatment to all the cultures rather than focusing exclusively on one. I think once we see the updated campaign setting we will have a better idea what to expect.
So far we know of the Tian-La, Tian-Shu, Tian-Sing, Tian-Min, and the Tian-Dan. I suspect they will break each culture up and give it a 2 to 4 page spread. They will incorporate the different races also, making slight changes or maybe surprising with a swap of one of the races with the tengu. What will follow will likely be 4 page spreads of different countries, each catering to a specific playstyle (liking incorporating not only different cultures but also the same culture at different time periods like the 1st ed. oriental adventures did). The 2nd half will expand on the religions of the region, various organizations for players to interact with, a history section, some crunch, a flora and fauna section, languages, technology, calendars and holidays, trade, and finally weather and climate.
For crunch they will like keep it at the same level as the new inner sea campaign setting is so we will know that to expect.
The bestiary 3 will likely me the main place for oriental monsters, just as ultimate combat will be the place for the classes of samurai and ninja. I just hope the bestiary 3 has room to Indian, American, Russian, Persian, and Arabian monsters also.
I am actually happy that ultimate combat is going to be a Gen con release so that they can let this book slip a little if need be to make sure it will be the best it can be.
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Hmm, interesting.
Now, I wonder if one of those ethnicities is an Indochinese one. Or perhaps an East China Sea analogue.Or any of the ones that don't feature too much in our Sinocentric(okay, that might be Japan nowadays) popular culture vision of the continent. For instance, Filippino mythology is so intricate that no doubt there is, and will be, some spillover into Golarion too.
The food! gotta love that Tian Xia cooking. Also arent there five types of Tian people? Namely Tian-Dan, Tian-La, Tian-Min, Tian-Sing and Tian-Shu.
What id like to see is a few different religious views: ancestor worship, animistic nature worship and kami. These deserve some mention as well :)
Happily, I have no expectations for this product.
I'm just looking forward to seeing what Paizo does with it.
i wanna see Ninjas!!!
and Samurai!!
ooh and Ninjas!! lots of NINJAZ!!!
ok, srsly tho: as much of the various mythologies as possible, with their own Pathfinderization.
Tian Xia factions, ala the faction guide though perhaps this can be its own book?? to give each faction the same love as the Inner Sea ones.
Not sure if this should be in Ultimate Combat with spillover into Tian Xia, but a good focus on the different military strategies. While I know the land wont be identical to Asia, I hope that the way the land help shaped the way the various countries waged war isn't lost.
For example, Japan's mighty navy, The Viet Cong, the Horselords, etc.
Hmm, interesting.
Now, I wonder if one of those ethnicities is an Indochinese one. Or perhaps an East China Sea analogue.Or any of the ones that don't feature too much in our Sinocentric(okay, that might be Japan nowadays) popular culture vision of the continent. For instance, Filippino mythology is so intricate that no doubt there is, and will be, some spillover into Golarion too.
The Tian Sing names on p.32 of the old Campaign Setting include Indonesian examples, while the Tian Dan include Vietnamese.
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The Tian Sing names on p.32 of the old Campaign Setting include Indonesian examples, while the Tian Dan include Vietnamese.Hmm, interesting.
Now, I wonder if one of those ethnicities is an Indochinese one. Or perhaps an East China Sea analogue.Or any of the ones that don't feature too much in our Sinocentric(okay, that might be Japan nowadays) popular culture vision of the continent. For instance, Filippino mythology is so intricate that no doubt there is, and will be, some spillover into Golarion too.
Thanks for the info. I missed that.
RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8
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I'd live to see a page of 'a day in a life' for a commoner in each region, to give us the culture and 'vibe' for the region. Kind of like the Day in the life in WotC's "Races of..." books
Something like this, but written much better:
Li won Kim wakes up slightly before dawn. She slips into her coarse woolen garments and carefully pulls the blankets back over the straw pallet. Walking the short distance into the common room, she puts an iron pot on the fire to bring the water for breakfast to a boil. While the water is heating, she lights a stick of incense in front of the statuettes of her ancestors, and the icon of the Judge of the Dead.
Once the water comes to a boil, she mixes in the rice and vegetables for the returning watchmen. By the time the night herders return, she has set 5 plates and has their meal on them. One plate has no one there because the food will be offered to the house spirits for protection. Another is cushion is empty as well, Li Won Sun did not make it through the night, having fallen when the spider-wolves attacked the herd. Li Won Kim quietly says a prayer for her uncle, asking the Judge to be merciful in her judgement. She gently kneads her husband’s shoulders as he eats, she knows he will sleep soundly while she cleans the remains of the meal away, and starts stitching the rents in the padded armor they wear at night.
According to the "ask James Jacobs" in off-topic Forum there won´t be a Tian-Xia Hardcover World Guide along the lines of the Inner Sea Guide...
Quote "All of which is my way of saying that we are not going to do a hardcover Tian Xia book this year. Something like that is just not possible.
That doesn't mean we won't do a bunch of other Tian Xia products though. Spreading the Tian Xia information out among our various lines (Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Modules, Player's Companion, etc.) would be a manageable way to get a lot of information out about the region without destroying our schedule and sanity by throwing an extra hardcover onto things."
I am thinking we will get either a 64 or possibly even a 128 page Campaign Setting book and a Players Guide to Tian Xia for sure.
I was hoping the Tian Xia book would be a at least couple hundred pages long. I do not care if it a hard cover book though.
Creative Director
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I was hoping the Tian Xia book would be a at least couple hundred pages long. I do not care if it a hard cover book though.
A couple hundred pages in one book is not gonna happen.
A couple hundred pages spread out over SEVERAL books though? Very VERY likely. (Of course, the various topics would be relatively compartmentalized—no "cliffhangers" between products implying that if you want to finish the book you're reading, you have to buy a second book.)
So the Tian Xia book is going to be in the 64-96 page range or maybe less?
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Creative Director
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So the Tian Xia book is going to be in the 64-96 page range or maybe less?
As I've pointed out in similar threads... our first version of Golarion/The Inner Sea was the 64 page Gazetteer.
As for the size and scope of a hypothetical Tian-Xia book... ask me again in a few months. ;-)
I would expect a 64 page book in the Setting line and a 32 page book in the Player Companion line, plus articles in the Jade Regent AP.
If we are getting new player races, I would expect them to be in the companion line.
I would love to see a Oni blooded type planetouched race like the aasimars and Tieflings. Yes good looking woman with ivory horns and green hair wearing a tigerskin bikini.
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Creative Director
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I would love to see a Oni blooded type planetouched race like the aasimars and Tieflings. Yes good looking woman with ivory horns and green hair wearing a tigerskin bikini.
They already exist. They're just tieflings. See Pathfinder #25 for rules on how tieflings descended from different fiends (be they devils, demons, qlippoth, rakshasa, oni, or whatever) are statted up.
so are we not going to be getting a hardcover book for Tian Xia similar to the inner sea world guide? cause thats what i thought was supposed to be on the schedule for this year (originally in august 11 but with the repeated push back of the inner sea guide, im not surprised if this gets pushed back too).
set backs are unexpected, but i would rather have a good quality book than something rushed to be released.
but i would love to see the other continents have their own world guide. even if it is only about 100 pages, due to that i have never seen a company release their world and cover all of the continents on it. i would love for Paizo to be ground breaking in this endevour.
I would expect a 64 page book in the Setting line and a 32 page book in the Player Companion line, plus articles in the Jade Regent AP.
If we are getting new player races, I would expect them to be in the companion line.
The presumed 64 page book is probably going to be a Tian Xia Gazetteer. I hope stuff like the "Hong Kong" city of Goka and Nagajor are included...
Perhaps we´ll get a full Tian Xia hard cover someday in the future, when enough fluff has accumulated and Jade Regent sales were good enough.
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Creative Director
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so are we not going to be getting a hardcover book for Tian Xia similar to the inner sea world guide? cause thats what i thought was supposed to be on the schedule for this year (originally in august 11 but with the repeated push back of the inner sea guide, im not surprised if this gets pushed back too).
set backs are unexpected, but i would rather have a good quality book than something rushed to be released.
but i would love to see the other continents have their own world guide. even if it is only about 100 pages, due to that i have never seen a company release their world and cover all of the continents on it. i would love for Paizo to be ground breaking in this endevour.
We haven't announced ANY Tian-Xia products yet, apart from the Jade Regent adventure path and the presence of a ninja and samurai in Ultimate Combat. There's been a lot of speculation and internet prediction on various threads so far, mostly based on the fact that we'll probably support the Jade Regent AP with support books (a good bet) and that by using the phrase "world guide" for our reprinted/revised campaign setting that that means we'll do OTHER world guides in the future.
We have not announced any other world guides yet. We can't really have setbacks with products we haven't announced yet. At least... not PUBLIC ones! We're trying not to bite off more than we can chew with this project. Creating a 320 page hardcover book for the Inner Sea region took a HECK of a lot of resources and time. And that's on TOP of us already having a 256 page hardcover and 3 years of experience working on that world. A big hardcover book about Tian-Xia would not only be biting off more than we could chew, it'd be cooking an elephant for dinner. It's too much, too soon.
In any event, when we DO announce what's planned for Tian-Xia, there'll be a product page and lots of chatter about it on these boards, I predict. It won't be in a hardcover format though, just to manage expectations a bit.
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Does this mean you wont be introducing new player races? (Since none of the current books lines seem all that suitable for them.)Absolutely not. We'll be introducing new player races.
Any idea which of the book lines you would be doing that in and over how many books? (I'm thinking it would all either be in one book or in a few X's of Golarion companion books)
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Creative Director
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Any idea which of the book lines you would be doing that in and over how many books? (I'm thinking it would all either be in one book or in a few X's of Golarion companion books)Does this mean you wont be introducing new player races? (Since none of the current books lines seem all that suitable for them.)Absolutely not. We'll be introducing new player races.
Yup. I have a VERY good idea of what lines and how many books... as in they're already on our internal schedule. It's not the right time to announce what they are, though.
As I am playing a tengu monk from Tian Xia in my group's Kingmaker game, I'd like to see tengu given some importance, even if the campaign will likely be over by the time any Tian Xia material comes out!
Also, I want to see a Pathfinder version of Monkey, since his nature is irrepressible.
We definitely need the hentacle monster template!
We definitely need the hentacle monster template!
rofl!
Any idea which of the book lines you would be doing that in and over how many books? (I'm thinking it would all either be in one book or in a few X's of Golarion companion books)Yup. I have a VERY good idea of what lines and how many books... as in they're already on our internal schedule. It's not the right time to announce what they are, though.
That's Paizo speak for come to PaizoCon to hear the announcements!
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Creative Director
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That's Paizo speak for come to PaizoCon to hear the announcements!Any idea which of the book lines you would be doing that in and over how many books? (I'm thinking it would all either be in one book or in a few X's of Golarion companion books)Yup. I have a VERY good idea of what lines and how many books... as in they're already on our internal schedule. It's not the right time to announce what they are, though.
Yup! Or perhaps more accurately... wait a few months and we'll see what gets announced before Paizocon, even.
Now a 32-page "Tian Xia Primer" companion would be nice to go with the Jade Regent. But I really hope Paizo takes the time to make a full-blown campaign setting hardcover for 2012.
We haven't announced ANY Tian-Xia products yet, apart from the Jade Regent adventure path and the presence of a ninja and samurai in Ultimate Combat.
We have not announced any other world guides yet. We can't really have setbacks with products we haven't announced yet. At least... not PUBLIC ones! We're trying not to bite off more than we can chew with this project. Creating a 320 page hardcover book for the Inner Sea region took a HECK of a lot of resources and time. And that's on TOP of us already having a 256 page hardcover and 3 years of experience working on that world. A big hardcover book about Tian-Xia would not only be biting off more than we could chew, it'd be cooking an elephant for dinner. It's too much, too soon.
Slightly off topic I know, but...
Has a "world book" or "guide book" been considered for Casmaron? Or Azlant? I'm not trying to be demanding, but I'd be more interested in the Casmaron guide. It would seem to be more closely tied to the main Inner Sea region, already partially spilling over (i.e. Qadira).
Just some food for thought...
DogBone
We haven't announced ANY Tian-Xia products yet, apart from the Jade Regent adventure path and the presence of a ninja and samurai in Ultimate Combat.
We have not announced any other world guides yet. We can't really have setbacks with products we haven't announced yet. At least... not PUBLIC ones! We're trying not to bite off more than we can chew with this project. Creating a 320 page hardcover book for the Inner Sea region took a HECK of a lot of resources and time. And that's on TOP of us already having a 256 page hardcover and 3 years of experience working on that world. A big hardcover book about Tian-Xia would not only be biting off more than we could chew, it'd be cooking an elephant for dinner. It's too much, too soon.
Slightly off topic I know, but...
Has a "world book" or "guide book" been considered for Casmaron? Or Azlant? I'm not trying to be demanding, but I'd be more interested in the Casmaron guide. It would seem to be more closely tied to the main Inner Sea region, already partially spilling over (i.e. Qadira).
Just some food for thought...DogBone
In my perfect world, Paizo puts out a hardback for each continent. But this isn't my perfect world, so I would at least like to see a chronicles book ranging from 62 to 100 pages for each continent. Id really love to see Casmaron, but id like to see modern day Azlant more.
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RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8
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In my perfect world, Paizo puts out a hardback for each continent. But this isn't my perfect world, so I would at least like to see a chronicles book ranging from 62 to 100 pages for each continent. Id really love to see Casmaron, but id like to see modern day Azlant more.
*Hands Fnipernackle scuba gear.*
In my perfect world, Paizo puts out a hardback for each continent. But this isn't my perfect world, so I would at least like to see a chronicles book ranging from 62 to 100 pages for each continent. Id really love to see Casmaron, but id like to see modern day Azlant more.*Hands Fnipernackle scuba gear.*
Guess I better get that underwater campaign guide huh?
But there are tiny pieces of land left. And fighting a bunch of mordant spire elves in the ruins of Azlant spells "Pirates of the Caribbean meets PF" to me.
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Creative Director
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Has a "world book" or "guide book" been considered for Casmaron? Or Azlant? I'm not trying to be demanding, but I'd be more interested in the Casmaron guide. It would seem to be more closely tied to the main Inner Sea region, already partially spilling over (i.e. Qadira).
Just some food for thought...DogBone
ALL of our other continents have been and will continue to be considered as book subjects. And in the meantime, we'll tackle parts of them in Pathfinder APs now and then, like how we detailed Iobaria (the northwest corner of Casmaron) in Pathfinder #33.
But actually full-fledged world books, be they 64 pages or more, are not going to happen super often. Our primary focus for the foreseeable future will remain the Inner Sea region.
So cards on the table: Paizo would have liked to release a hardcover world-guide to coincide with the release of Jade Regent - but the realities of making such a product on schedule are too much. Or is something else at play here?
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Creative Director
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So cards on the table: Paizo would have liked to release a hardcover world-guide to coincide with the release of Jade Regent - but the realities of making such a product on schedule are too much. Or is something else at play here?
That's pretty much exactly it.
Creating an entire world is INCREDIBLY complicated. Even more so if you're also working on a lot of other equally complicated projects simultaneously, such as other hardcovers like Ultimate Magic, adventure paths, or basic games, to name three things we've all got going on at the same time right now.
We simply do not have the resources or time to do justice to a big hardcover of Tian-Xia at this time. We DO have the resources and time to spread Tian-Xia content out over several different books.