For one thing most of the minor hexes seem to be pretty unimpressive.I agree that a lot of them aren't worth taking, but you'll only end up picking 5 (more with the Extra Hex feat, if you like) and there are at least 5 good ones on the list. I like these:
- Slumber - First, there's no HD limit on this. High save DC, great for taking out anyone at low levels, or minions at higher levels. Also, having a free sleep power available for handling NPCs you have to eliminate but don't want to kill is really handy.
- Healing - Turns into a Cure Moderate at 5th level. Usable once per day per target, reducing the number of spell slots you need to take up with healing spells.
- Flight - True flight at level 5, for 5 minutes per day, which will cover all of your combat time most likely.
- Evil Eye - Always works for at least one round, even if they make the save. You can stack different penalties on a single enemy.
- Fortune & Misfortune - Both last 2 rounds starting at level 8, making your action economy better.
- Cackle - Use this to extend Fortune on the entire party, or Misfortune on the enemy.
Also, hexes are slicker than spells:
- Never runs out, so you're never completely out of mojo.
- Standard action - leaves your move action to fly or cackle, and your swift action for a quickened spell.
- Does not provoke an attack of opportunity.
- The save to resist a hex is equal to 10 + 1/2 the witch’s level + the witch’s Intelligence modifier - which is as high as or higher than the highest level spell you could cast.
- No verbal, somatic, or material components! It's like you always have a handful of spells memorized with Silent Spell & Still Spell for free.
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Slumber, as has been mentioned, is very strong -- I (perhaps to other party members chagrin) deliberately didn't take it as it can be too powerful.
Repeated evil eyes stack, so long as they inflict different penalties. And although they overlap the same effect an be applied repeatedly against a single target.
Healing can only be used 1/person/day but is not only a valuable extra bit of healing (how many parties ever regret having an extra 4-6 CMW/day), it means you can freely give away healing to any passing NPC (town just fought off a tribe of wild goblins leaving dozens of dogs & townsfolk gravely injured? Don't bother interupting the cleric of Sarenrae while she's sunbathing, just form an orderly queue in front of my 1st level witch...).
Cackle's great advantage comes from it only requiring a move action.
Cauldron is just a free feat (+skill bonuses) nothing more.
I dont see how cackle allows you to give the fortune to your entire party? How does that work?
Round 1:
Round 2:
etc.
And how do you stack different penalties on a single enemy since evil eye only works on the same target once a day? Its not like you can keep using it on the same guy to...
Evil Eye (Su): The witch can cause doubt to creep into the mind of a foe within 30 feet that she can see. The target takes a –2 penalty on one of the following (witch’s choice): AC, ability checks, attack rolls, saving throws, or skill checks. This hex lasts for a number of rounds equal to 3 + the witch’s Intelligence modifier. A Will save reduces this to just 1 round. This is a mind-affecting effect. At 8th level the penalty increases to –4.
There's nothing that says you can only use it once per day per target.
But whats the benefit of extending the fortune? They can only use the re-roll once per day right?
Fortune (Su): The witch can grant a creature within 30 feet a bit of good luck for 1 round. The target can call upon this good luck once per round, allowing him to reroll any ability check, attack roll, saving throw, or skill check, taking the better result. He must decide to use this ability before the first roll is made. At 8th level and 16th level, the duration of this hex is extended by 1 round. Once a creature has benefited from the fortune hex, it cannot benefit from it again for 24 hours.
Hmm. It says "The target can call upon this good luck once per round", which implies that it can be used multiple rounds, but it also says "Once a creature has benefited from the fortune hex, it cannot benefit from it again for 24 hours." It depends on whether you interpret "benefit" to mean "rerolling a check", or meaning "having the hex applied to you". Either way, extending it lets you use the reroll in a later round than the one it was cast in, which is useful say as a pre-combat buff (especially since you need to spend 1 round per party member you're Fortuning).
In Kingmaker, the DM asked me to retire my witch character because she was utterly dominating combat in many of the adventures. The no HD limit on sleep and the sky high save DC, plus the Evil Eye, Cackle, Misfortune, Cackle, Save or Die combo meant just about anything that was not immune to mind effects went down quickly. Throw in Fly on demand plus a decent spell selection and she was a power house to be feared.
Any suggestions on feats/patron/spell selection then?
Because Hexes are your most powerful class feature, try to pick up the feat Extra Hex. It's wonderful.
Any suggestions on feats/patron/spell selection then?
Here are the patrons, for discussion.
4th cat’s grace
6th haste
8th freedom of movement
10th polymorph
12th cat’s grace (mass)
14th ethereal jaunt
16th animal shapes
18th shapechange
4th speak with animals
6th dominate animal
8th summon nature’s ally IV
10th animal growth
12th antilife shell
14th beast shape IV
16th animal shapes
18th summon nature’s ally IX
4th invisibility
6th blink
8th confusion
10th passwall
12th programmed image
14th invisibility (mass)
16th scintillating pattern
18th time stop
4th flaming sphere
6th fireball
8th wall of ice
10th flame strike
12th freezing sphere
14th vortex*
16th fire storm
18th meteor swarm
4th bear’s endurance
6th protection from energy
8th spell immunity
10th spell resistance
12th bear’s endurance (mass)
14th restoration (greater)
16th iron body
18th miracle
4th command undead
6th contagion
8th animate dead
10th giant vermin
12th create undead
14th control undead
16th create greater undead
18th energy drain
4th darkness
6th deeper darkness
8th shadow conjuration
10th shadow evocation
12th shadow walk
14th shadow conjuration (greater)
16th shadow evocation (greater)
18th shades
4th bull’s strength
6th greater magic weapon
8th divine power
10th righteous might
12th bull’s strength (mass)
14th giant form I
16th giant form II
18th shapechange
4th bear’s endurance
6th beast shape I
8th beast shape II
10th beast shape III
12th form of the dragon I
14th form of the dragon II
16th form of the dragon III
18th shapechange
4th mirror image
6th major image
8th phantasmal killer
10th mirage arcana
12th mislead
14th reverse gravity
16th screen
18th time stop
4th slipstream*
6th water breathing
8th control water
10th geyser*
12th elemental body III (water only)
14th elemental body IV (water only)
16th seamantle*
18th tsunami*
4th owl’s wisdom
6th magic vestment
8th globe of invulnerability (lesser)
10th dream
12th globe of invulnerability (greater)
14th spell turning
16th protection from spells
18th mage’s disjunction
Agility gives you Haste, which never gets old.
Elements gives you direct damage spells.
Shadow gives the most flexibility.
Strength & Transformation are good for buffing your familiar, if you're interested in sending it into combat.
Agility: Haste, Freedom of Movement, Polymorph, and shapechange are all nice spells.
Deception: Invisibility, Blink, and passwall are all nice, while time stop is always great.
Endurance: Protection from energy is nice, since you are completely lacking energy protection on your spell list, spell immunity can be very helpful to a party, as can be spell resistance. Greater Restoration is a great spell to have available, as is miracle.
Plague is misnamed -- it should be "undead patron" -- if you want to play the necromancer you can do so very well with the plague patron.
If you are at all interested in personally getting in the fray (and why would you be?) Strength is a great patron -- divine favor is a great spell, greater magic weapon, giant form 1&2 give regeneration, and the combination of righteous might with transformation is absolutely staggering on the "I hit things" front. Divine power isn't bad either.
Wisdom: Nice combination of defensive spells -- mage's disjunction is powerful too.
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Any suggestions on feats/patron/spell selection then?
The witch is a versatile character, with a strong selection of battlefield control, buffing, and utility abilities/spells. They get decent healing capability, as well.
Hexes are the witch's bread and butter; as SLAs with unlimited uses (apart from the "one attempt per target per day" on many of them), they can be used as desired without the need to conserve them. Useful hexes are: Cackle (extend the effect of many "one round" hexes), Cauldron (a feat plus a skill bonus), Evil Eye (lasts one round even on a successful save, can be extended with Cackle), Flight (feather fall at will (equivalent to a 4,400 gp magic item) and skill bonuses plus levitate once per day and several minutes of fly as you gain levels), Fortune (a nice buff for allies, can be extended with Cackle), Healing (extra healing is never a bad thing, improves at 5th level), Misfortune (can be very nasty, especially in combination with Evil Eye; can be extended with Cackle), Slumber (can readily disable many single opponents and also scales (no HD limit*, DC improves with level); nasty in combination with Evil Eye and/or Misfortune), and Ward (a simple, long-lasting buff that's easily renewed). Extra Hex is a good feat choice, even for Cauldron.
*- some GMs may house rule this to HD equal or less than the witch's level; also, since sleep is an Enchantment [compulsion], the effect is blocked/suppressed by protection from or magic circle against chaos/evil/good/law.
Generally, spell selection will be similar to a wizard of equal level (with some additions and subtractions). The witch has some of the best battlefield control spells, so I'd recommend picking up several area effect ones (using hexes to disable single targets). Spectral hand is extremely useful with a variety of touch spells (touch of fatigue, etc., as well as many cures and buffs); as are the various summon monster spells during the middle levels. Patron choice is useful for expanding available buffs (Agility, Endurance, Wisdom) or providing focus to the spell selection. Animals is great if you want to focus on summoning and augmenting animals. Deception is good for buffing sneaky types and/or avoiding hazards. Elements adds some direct damage options to the witch's sparse selection (yes, you can have a decent blaster witch and use your hexes for battlefield control/disabling). Plague is a good choice for the necromancer witch archetype (or even an undead hunter). Shadow can be even better than Deception for a sneaky, deceiver witch. Strength is good for witches that want to self-buff (eldritch knight?). Transformation is great for a shapehifting witch. Trickery has a good mix of defense, offense, and utility spells. Water can be very powerful/useful in costal/ship-borne campaigns.
EDIT: I'd written that arcane trickster might be a possibility for a sneaky witch, but the witch lacks mage hand.
Whats so good about the shadow conjuration spells? I mean, if the target suceeds in the save, its wasted right?
The main thing people usually talk about in favor of the shadow X spells is versatility at casting time -- you don't need to know when you prepare it if you're going to need fireball or lightning bolt (for shadow evocation), you can decide when casting.
(Although, yes, the shadow spells do have some drawbacks, too.)
Whats so good about the shadow conjuration spells? I mean, if the target suceeds in the save, its wasted right?
The main thing people usually talk about in favor of the shadow X spells is versatility at casting time -- you don't need to know when you prepare it if you're going to need fireball or lightning bolt (for shadow evocation), you can decide when casting.
(Although, yes, the shadow spells do have some drawbacks, too.)
I think in many cases shadow conjuration spells actually have a shorter casting time than the conjuration that they are simulating. So instead of having to spend a full action (or longer) on summoning a creature or casting a major creation spell, you can use Shadow Conjuration or Greater Shadow Conjuration while still being able to fly around the battlefield.
...as SLAs with unlimited uses...
Hexes are supernatural -- they are better than SLA's in almost every way.
Spectral hand is extremely useful with a variety of touch spells (touch of fatigue, etc., as well as many cures and buffs);
Silly question here, but you can use Spectral Hand in conjunction with the various Inflict spells, right?
I was thinking of taking a bat for a familiar.
Did you pick it for flavor reasons to fit a theme? The +3 bonus to Fly skill checks has good synergy with the Flight hex, but if you're going for a particular theme, then that can help you pick the patron and/or hexes.
For hexes...how do they function really? For example lets say i use evil eye. Does the target know somehow that i am targetting him with evil eye? If the target is sleeping can i just stand there silently and keep using evil eye over and over?
They normally function as supernatural abilities (Core Rulebook, pg. 221). Some GMs may house rule many of them as spell-like abilities (also pg. 221), instead (which means they are affected by dispel magic and spell resistance, can be disrupted, etc.). Many of them, Evil Eye included, have a limitation of "Whether or not the save is successful, a creature cannot be the target of this hex again for 1 day."
Spectral hand is extremely useful with a variety of touch spells (touch of fatigue, etc., as well as many cures and buffs);Silly question here, but you can use Spectral Hand in conjunction with the various Inflict spells, right?
Yes. However keep an eye on your touch spell rules.
Also I like the pseudo-dragon for a familiar -- it has a 5 foot reach with its tail -- meaning it can hide in your square and deliver touch attacks for you if something closes on your position. I also like the advantages of blindsense and telepathy that the pseudo-dragon enjoys.
Many of them, Evil Eye included, have a limitation of "Whether or not the save is successful, a creature cannot be the target of this hex again for 1 day."
Evil eye does not have that statement attached to it.
...as SLAs with unlimited uses...Hexes are supernatural -- they are better than SLA's in almost every way.
Yes, I was being sloppy with my terms. However, some GMs do house rule them as SLAs (whether this is a good or bad house rule can be a discussion in and of itself).
Spectral hand is extremely useful with a variety of touch spells (touch of fatigue, etc., as well as many cures and buffs);Silly question here, but you can use Spectral Hand in conjunction with the various Inflict spells, right?
Core Rulebook, pg. 346: "A ghostly hand shaped from your life force materializes and moves as you desire, allowing you to deliver low level, touch range spells at a distance... For as long as the spell lasts, any touch range spell of 4th level or lower that you can cast can be delivered by the spectral hand." (emphasis mine)
Many of them, Evil Eye included, have a limitation of "Whether or not the save is successful, a creature cannot be the target of this hex again for 1 day."Evil eye does not have that statement attached to it.
<sigh>
I was looking at the wrong hex.
So, to answer the original question, a witch can stand silently using the Evil Eye hex over and over on a sleeping target. However, because of the short duration (3 + Int mod rounds), it's not very useful to do so. However, the greater hex Nightmares would be a good choice for this tactic.
No biggie, I have it happen a lot too -- I just want to be sure we keep things clear for people so they don't get confused on how things work (there is enough confusion with the APG as is).
the Supergenius Games supplement "Advanced Options: Witches Hexes" has a lot of really nice hexes that add to the diversity of capability of Witches. So much so, I'm considering one very carefully as a cohort for my Rogue.
For example, gaing the ability to make various Combat Maneuvers based off Int and Witch level to simulate bad luck (tripping on your own boot straps = Trip) or unleashing the forces of entropy on a target (Sunder) as a hex, from a range, is not just useful, its creepy and in keeping with the "theme" of Witchery (add in Cat's Eyes, Medusa's hair, and Scuttle for wall-crawling, and you can go totally Exorcist on someone)
Assuming your DM allows it (and honestly, SGG have a very good track record for making well-thought-out material that is not unbalancing) the stuff in that pdf is, ironically, worth its weight in gold...
It all comes down to how you feel about debuffing and SoD effects. If you like SoD effects and weakening your enemies for the party then the witch is your baby. The witch class has plenty of such effects and the means of making sure they stick.
A witch is also a great support caster -- you do have "I end you spells" and when these work it is great. But the vast majority of your spells are more useful at gathering information or setting the enemy up (or breaking them down).
If you have a wizard and a cleric in the party a witch is a great third caster -- you can cover both bases as needed, while having plenty of "trouble spot" spells to clear out bigger issues that they might not have the spells for the day to handle.
The witch is also a great summoner class as well.
It all comes down to how you feel about debuffing and SoD effects. If you like SoD effects and weakening your enemies for the party then the witch is your baby. The witch class has plenty of such effects and the means of making sure they stick.
A witch is also a great support caster -- you do have "I end you spells" and when these work it is great. But the vast majority of your spells are more useful at gathering information or setting the enemy up (or breaking them down).
I think this is probably correct.
I remember reading the Witch the first time and thinking it was broken because it had virtually all of the Wizard spells I typically use, plus hexes, plus some good Cleric spells. But that's my style of play and it's not everybody's.
(Granted, it's missing specialization benefits and arcane bond.)
the spells you want to use in combat are battlefield control or buff spells.
Both of which are the witch's weakpoints. You get spells from both the cleric and wizard lists, yes. But you mostly get the -wrong- spells from those lists, in terms of battlefield effectiveness.
<eye roll>
Spells like enlarge person, ray of enfeeblement, sleep, glitterdust, hold person, web, dispel magic, heroism, ray of exhaustion, stinking cloud, black tentacles, etc. are just horrible in battlefield effectiveness... Granted, most of the buffs that are exclusive to the cleric list depend on the patron you choose.
Oh, do you have a link to the official site for this?
Paizo sells it, as well as a number of other Supergenius Games supplements. I highly recommend them to anyone who can use 3rd party stuff.
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the Supergenius Games supplement "Advanced Options: Witches Hexes" has a lot of really nice hexes that add to the diversity of capability of Witches. So much so, I'm considering one very carefully as a cohort for my Rogue.Oh, do you have a link to the official site for this?
You can find it for sale here on Paizo's store.
If no one else has offered some feat/spell suggestions by tomorrow when I have more time to think about it. I will post some then.
And as for Ill Omen, it's great for a first-level spell, but it has a fairly limited effect at lower levels: forcing one target to reroll one d20 roll and take the worse one. This is actually weaker than misfortune, which applies to all d20 rolls in its duration, and misfortune won't use up a memorization slot.As well, it's mind-affecting, and at level 4 against anything that isn't mind-immune you'll want to evil eye/slumber, or just slumber if you're confident in your save DC. Ill Omen gives you a minor advantage, competing abilities from witch at the same level give you a KO'd enemy.
Yeah Ill Omen is worth more later when it affects more rolls and you can quicken it before you drop a hex on them (or other spell) -- that way it uses your swift action leaving your standard to lay on the spell/ability that you actually want to connect with.
Part of the fraility of the witch is that it is fort and ref saves as well. A cloak of resistence +1 would be a good magic item choice. Might consider a ring of protection for armor class. you may want to consider a 1st level pearl of power to get another 1st level spell another time per day. They should get to use it they are a prepared caster and came out after the core rulebook.
Improved initiative will be a good feat for a witch as it allows you to evil eye or slumber someone before they go. You also may want some scrolls.