I haven't been able to find any threads on the subject so does anyone know if they plan to make books focused on individual classes like they have done for many of the races? Hopefully not like the god awful books WoC has put out, but the small cheap ones like the races of Golarion.
As of now no. The closest you will get are the Ultimate Magic and Ultimate Power( I think this is a forthcoming book anyway) books. One aimed at melee types, and the other at magic users. Those two combined with the APG should be enough for most people.
Chief Technical Officer
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I haven't been able to find any threads on the subject so does anyone know if they plan to make books focused on individual classes like they have done for many of the races? Hopefully not like the god awful books WoC has put out, but the small cheap ones like the races of Golarion.
We are considering classes as themes for future Pathfinder Player Companions...
Cool, will be waiting on the Cleric, Druid, and Ranger books then :)
Cool thanks. I don't so much want them for new feats or rules as I do for inspiration for characters. I was hoping for something reminiscent of the AD&D class books. Thanks again.
I really did like the second edition class books. (not the way they were bound, but the content) Just reading about the different kits, gave me so many good ideas. Bard was my favorite, but the Palidin one opened my eyes to a class, that until then, I would not even consider to play. So books strong on fluff would appeal to me.
We are considering classes as themes for future Pathfinder Player Companions...
I think something like this would be great, a small book/pdf for each class with a few archetype ideas, maybe some specialized equipment, mundane and magical, and a few feats perhaps. Possibly one or two solid PrCs if you are inspired to do so. Might I suggest addressing some of the Stealth issues on the forums for the Rogue/Ranger book if it ever comes to pass?
*sigh* So much for avoiding rules bloat...
*sigh* So much for avoiding rules bloat...
Don't panic yet.
There is plenty of "fluff" information that can be given for each of the classes, that would be both very helpful and very rules lite.
Such as:
*sigh* So much for avoiding rules bloat...Don't panic yet.
There is plenty of "fluff" information that can be given for each of the classes, that would be both very helpful and very rules lite.
Such as:
A "more in depth" discussion of the class and its role in both Society and in a Player Party.
How is the class represented by each Player Character race? (The APG has some of this, but the subject could be handled in a lot more detail).
What role does the class play (and how is it recolored) for different nations/regions of Golarion (in addition to above)? i.e., The Cavalier Orders are almost certainly different in Qadira then in Lastwall.
Class specific traits would not be amiss.
And then, how about an expanded background and full stats for the existing Iconic Character for the class?
If it's a fluffy Golarion guide to classes, then that's fine and dandy. I won't buy it (I don't run my games in Golarion) but I certainly won't object to their fleshing out their campaign world and hope it would be useful and worthwhile to all those who do play in Golarion.
If it's a bucket of yet more overwhelming classes, feats, and archetypes, and traits, and spells and prestige classes and partridges in pear trees... well, just won't be interested still, and will be less likely to participate in this community if suggested builds and rules discussions start to incorporate these things as "the norm". That was the hardest thing for me in 3.5, as I largely used core only with a few specific add-ons as needed, and it was very hard to get advice or review rules issues when everyone assumed you owned and memorized every mechanic in every splat book in existence and half of the advice I got was thus useless to me. Still, I got by then and will get by now; just... I guess I was just a little frustrated at the idea to see Pathfinder potentially go in the power creep direction 3.5 took. At the same time, the reason 3.5 took that direction is because those books sold and sold well, so as long as there are gamers waving money around demanding such things, it would be foolish for a profit driven company to ignore it. So I'll just be over here clinging to my core rules+APG and seeing what happens next. I may well be jumping the gun and will wait and see.
If it's a fluffy Golarion guide to classes, then that's fine and dandy. I won't buy it (I don't run my games in Golarion) but I certainly won't object to their fleshing out their campaign world and hope it would be useful and worthwhile to all those who do play in Golarion.
If it's a bucket of yet more overwhelming classes, feats, and archetypes, and traits, and spells and prestige classes and partridges in pear trees... well, just won't be interested still, and will be less likely to participate in this community if suggested builds and rules discussions start to incorporate these things as "the norm". That was the hardest thing for me in 3.5, as I largely used core only with a few specific add-ons as needed, and it was very hard to get advice or review rules issues when everyone assumed you owned and memorized every mechanic in every splat book in existence and half of the advice I got was thus useless to me. Still, I got by then and will get by now; just... I guess I was just a little frustrated at the idea to see Pathfinder potentially go in the power creep direction 3.5 took. At the same time, the reason 3.5 took that direction is because those books sold and sold well, so as long as there are gamers waving money around demanding such things, it would be foolish for a profit driven company to ignore it. So I'll just be over here clinging to my core rules+APG and seeing what happens next. I may well be jumping the gun and will wait and see.
I also hope that you are "jumping the gun" on this, and that Paizo does not start down the dark path of game breaking "splat books".
Actually to be honest I really don't care about this stuff:
I think something like this would be great, a small book/pdf for each class with a few archetype ideas, maybe some specialized equipment, mundane and magical, and a few feats perhaps. Possibly one or two solid PrCs if you are inspired to do so.
This here is my main concern:
Might I suggest addressing some of the Stealth issues on the forums for the Rogue/Ranger book if it ever comes to pass?
When i say class books... what i do not want is ""Fluff"".
I want new rules and game mechanics for letting players play their characters in new and exciting ways. I really like the 2nd ed player class books and enjoyed them both a player and as DM.
I hated many of the early 3rd player class books, because they were nothing BUT Fluff. As DM or player i can create my own fluff, i want good rule system, to make for a enjoyable game.
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When i say class books... what i do not want is ""Fluff"".
Vic mention "Companions" which are Paizo's player-friendly, setting-focused 32-page books. They probably run about half-and-half between fluff and crunch. The fluff is focused on how the subject fits into Golarion, while the crunch usually takes the form of a few feats, a few traits, some spells (if applicable), some items (magic and mundane), and a prestige class. I could also see a class book containing a new archetype or 3.
I doubt you'll see a book in the companion line that's dedicated to new mechanics that support the core RPG. That just isn't what they've been in the past.
-Skeld
EDIT: I should preface everything I say with qualifiers such as: "in the past," "my guess is," "take with a grain of salt," and "I really have no idea what I'm talking about."
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Chief Technical Officer
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When i say class books... what i do not want is ""Fluff"".Vic mention "Companions" which are Paizo's player-friendly, setting-focused 32-page books. They probably run about half-and-half between fluff and crunch. The fluff is focused on how the subject fits into Golarion, while the crunch usually takes the form of a few feats, a few traits, some spells (if applicable), some items (magic and mundane), and a prestige class. I could also see a class book containing a new archetype or 3.
I doubt you'll see a book in the companion line that's dedicated to new mechanics that support the core RPG. That just isn't what they've been in the past.
-Skeld
EDIT: I should preface everything I say with qualifiers such as: "in the past," "my guess is," "take with a grain of salt," and "I really have no idea what I'm talking about."
You're pretty much right on target here.
Whatever you think about books like Pathfinder Player Companion: Orcs of Golarion—that's what you'll probably think about books like Pathfinder Player Companion: Rangers. Same formula, different topic.
When i say class books... what i do not want is ""Fluff"".Vic mention "Companions" which are Paizo's player-friendly, setting-focused 32-page books. They probably run about half-and-half between fluff and crunch. The fluff is focused on how the subject fits into Golarion, while the crunch usually takes the form of a few feats, a few traits, some spells (if applicable), some items (magic and mundane), and a prestige class. I could also see a class book containing a new archetype or 3.
I doubt you'll see a book in the companion line that's dedicated to new mechanics that support the core RPG. That just isn't what they've been in the past.
-Skeld
EDIT: I should preface everything I say with qualifiers such as: "in the past," "my guess is," "take with a grain of salt," and "I really have no idea what I'm talking about."
You're pretty much right on target here.
Whatever you think about books like Pathfinder Player Companion: Orcs of Golarion—that's what you'll probably think about books like Pathfinder Player Companion: Rangers. Same formula, different topic.
yippie!!! cool beans!!! Personally, I love Golarion. Our group had a big discussion over using it or not. We have been playing RPG's almost 30 years now and we have done home brew and various company created. But with the very well written source material and switching to the Pathfinder ruleset, Golarion won hands down. No regrets so far and actually much kudos.
Kudos, Paizo, kudos.
sorry but not into Golarion.
I really do like making my own worlds, and what i look for is good, stable, fun, rule system that i can use for building my own worlds.
Right now that means Pathfinder PHB & Bestiary.
What i am looking for in future is Class books that give inserting and fun game system that let players play fun classes in a slightly different way.
Much like the 2nd ed books did for Rogues, ranger, fighters, wizards, etc.
I look at Golarion, much the way i look at Forgotten Realms, Dark Sun, Raven Loft, Spell Jammers, etc. A fun, new world to explore, but not the world that i will base All my world around.
If the Core Pathfinder is only going to be based around one world, please tell me now, so i can go looking for a World Neutral system... for building my own worlds with.
Right now that means Pathfinder PHB & Bestiary.
What i am looking for in future is Class books that give inserting and fun game system that let players play fun classes in a slightly different way.
Sounds like the Advanced Player's Guide to me. Have you checked it out? Multiple "substitution" powers and abilities to switch in and out for all the core classes.
Sounds like the Advanced Player's Guide to me. Have you checked it out? Multiple "substitution" powers and abilities to switch in and out for all the core classes.Right now that means Pathfinder PHB & Bestiary.
What i am looking for in future is Class books that give inserting and fun game system that let players play fun classes in a slightly different way.
Yes i own that, cool ideas.
If the Core Pathfinder is only going to be based around one world, please tell me now, so i can go looking for a World Neutral system... for building my own worlds with.
The Player Companion and Campaign Setting (Chronicles) products are tied to Golarion, just like the Modules and Adventure Paths.
The Core Pathfinder RPG products are setting-neutral (currently, Pathfinder Core Rulebook, Bestiary, Advanced Player's Guide, GameMastery Guide). They will presumably be setting-neutral also in the future, with products such as Bestiary 2 and Ultimate Magic.
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Chief Technical Officer
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If the Core Pathfinder is only going to be based around one world, please tell me now, so i can go looking for a World Neutral system... for building my own worlds with.The Player Companion and Campaign Setting (Chronicles) products are tied to Golarion, just like the Modules and Adventure Paths.
The Core Pathfinder RPG products are setting-neutral (currently, Pathfinder Core Rulebook, Bestiary, Advanced Player's Guide, GameMastery Guide). They will presumably be setting-neutral also in the future, with products such as Bestiary 2 and Ultimate Magic.
Yep—the Pathfinder Roleplaying Game line is and will remain setting-neutral.
All of our other Pathfinder lines are designed for use with our Pathfinder campaign setting, but you'll find they're also generally easy to adjust for use with most fantasy campaigns.
If the Core Pathfinder is only going to be based around one world, please tell me now, so i can go looking for a World Neutral system... for building my own worlds with.The Player Companion and Campaign Setting (Chronicles) products are tied to Golarion, just like the Modules and Adventure Paths.
The Core Pathfinder RPG products are setting-neutral (currently, Pathfinder Core Rulebook, Bestiary, Advanced Player's Guide, GameMastery Guide). They will presumably be setting-neutral also in the future, with products such as Bestiary 2 and Ultimate Magic.
Yep—the Pathfinder Roleplaying Game line is and will remain setting-neutral.
All of our other Pathfinder lines are designed for use with our Pathfinder campaign setting, but you'll find they're also generally easy to adjust for use with most fantasy campaigns.
Im sorry and am clearly very late here. But I have found that the books for races are exclusive to Golarion. Pathfinder in itself made changes to gnomes and halflings that make them exclusive. Changing them basically Kender and gomes mischievous mini elves. I'm not complaining just pointing out that it would be great to see more truly neutral products for us who LOVE PFRPG but not (Chronicles). I adored the TSR books on races. They generically covered races from Greyhawk to Athis (Dark Sun). Told who they were, how they typically lived, etc. as well as put rules in that could transfer into any and all games. I also found that the TSR class books were similar. Paizo has huge shoes to fill from TSR and has done a FANTASTIC job doing so! Thanks!
We are considering classes as themes for future Pathfinder Player Companions...
Whatever you think about books like Pathfinder Player Companion: Orcs of Golarion—that's what you'll probably think about books like Pathfinder Player Companion: Rangers. Same formula, different topic.
Is this sort of thing still being considered?
I'm not complaining just pointing out that it would be great to see more truly neutral products for us who LOVE PFRPG but not (Chronicles). I adored the TSR books on races. They generically covered races from Greyhawk to Athis (Dark Sun). Told who they were, how they typically lived, etc. as well as put rules in that could transfer into any and all games. I also found that the TSR class books were similar. Paizo has huge shoes to fill from TSR and has done a FANTASTIC job doing so! Thanks!
How can a setting-neutral book describe anything typical about a race? That's exactly what varies from setting to setting. In one setting, dwarves might be mutated humans who grew shorter and tougher from being trapped underground for thousands of years, while in another they could be the degenerate form of stone golems that gained sentience tens of thousands of years ago, and in a third they might be highly claustrophobic as a race and would never dream of living underground. All three could use the same mechanics, but the flavor (and any feats/abilities to enhance that flavor) would be vastly different.
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We are considering classes as themes for future Pathfinder Player Companions...Whatever you think about books like Pathfinder Player Companion: Orcs of Golarion—that's what you'll probably think about books like Pathfinder Player Companion: Rangers. Same formula, different topic.Is this sort of thing still being considered?
Some settings may have dwarves as mutated humans. But again that is not the standard or neutral. But also if you look at AD&D's Halfling Handbook it covered Athasian halflings. Feral halflings that cannibalized people. So there is no reason not to cover several types of subraces. For another example. The complete book of dwarves covered Hill, Deep, Duergar, Mountain and Sundered dwarves. Sundered dwarves were specific to Krynn but they were presented as being for anywhere that had dwarves for friendly introduction to ALL campaigns.
I don't see too much trouble with adapting the current race books to other settings. I have the tiefling and Aasimar books, and honestly a good chunk of either of those books is generic enough flavor that it could be used in any setting with those races.
Some settings may have dwarves as mutated humans. But again that is not the standard or neutral. But also if you look at AD&D's Halfling Handbook it covered Athasian halflings. Feral halflings that cannibalized people. So there is no reason not to cover several types of subraces. For another example. The complete book of dwarves covered Hill, Deep, Duergar, Mountain and Sundered dwarves. Sundered dwarves were specific to Krynn but they were presented as being for anywhere that had dwarves for friendly introduction to ALL campaigns.
Of course, TSR actually published several campaign settings so it made sense for them to cover the kinds of halflings or dwarves included in all of them. Paizo only publishes Golarion. Why spend time making up generic sub-races for non-existent campaign settings? It's the job of homebrew GMs to decide the history and character of the races in their own settings, and Paizo doesn't own the IP to "Pathfinderize" races from other settings.