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First, a HUGE CONGRATULATIONS to the Paizo Team. Your commitment to quality is a big part of why this has happened.
Still, I'm pretty skeptical that this is a measure of OVERALL sales (I'm thinking especially about distribution in the big chains), but yes this IS very significant.
Combined with the information gleaned from this RPG rulebook "trade-in" experiment, it would seem that the core group of gamers is possibly having a sea change in the direction of Pathfinder. And it's probably not as important where PF is at right now, versus where the wind is blowing. And the wind is definitely blowing its way.
I actually think that D&D Essentials might grow the overall market and overall interest for tabletop RPGs, which is great. Some of the people who get hooked in by the new Red Box will move on to different types of systems. Now, if Pathfinder can get a successful "recruitment" strategy as well and excite a new younger generation of gamers, then I think we're talking Total Victory. :)
But as for getting the same brand recognition as D&D? That would be a much bigger challenge. I don't see anything short of, say, several years of utterly dominating the market or a Christian fundamentalist backlash that could accomplish that. :)
So...
How will YOU celebrate Paizo's new status?
Developing Lost Cities of Golarion until I pass out.
We're a wild bunch, alright. :)
** spoiler omitted **
Uh...wow.
[blatantsuckup]
Concrabulations one and all.
[/blatantsuckup]
Now go mug SKR for his Goldgoblin crackers!
I picked up a 21 day aged ribeye from a local specialty butcher. It has been suggested that I go with a nice Zinfandel, but I am still mulling it over. I need something that is going to saute well with a mushroom and shallot blend.
Hmmm..
Jason Bulmahn
Lead Designer who likes good food
Sautee with Zin if you must, but for drinking grab a solid Shiraz (French, Oz, whatevs) or a good Chateau-Neuf du Pape. You won't be disappointed with the latter.
I posted this on EN world, but figured people might be interested here as well. For a historical perspective on ICv2's trends:
Fall 2008
1. D&D
2. 40k RPGs (Dark Heresy/Rogue Trader)
3. World of Darkness
4. Shadowrun
5. Pathfinder
Winter 08-09
1. D&D
2. 40k
3. WoD
4. Star Wars
5. Shadowrun
Q2 2009
1. D&D
2. 40k
3. WoD
4. Song of Fire & Ice
5. Shadowrun
Q3 2009
1. D&D
2. Pathfinder
3. WoD
4. SoFI
5. Shadowrun
Q4 2009
1. D&D
2. Pathfinder
3. Warhammer Fantasy
4. 40k
5. WoD
Q1 2010
1. D&D
2. Pathfinder
3. Warhammer FRP
4. 40k
5. Dragon Age
Q2 2010
1. D&D
2. Pathfinder
3. Warhammer
4. Shadowrun
5. 40k
Q3 2010
1. D&D
1. Pathfinder
3. Warhammer
4. 40k
5. Dresden Files
I couldn't find data from their site earlier than that. So Pathfinder has done fairly well since it's core release Q3 09. I didn't realize the new Warhammer Fantasy line has done that well. Shadowrun has been lurking at the bottom, White Wolf has been slowly dying, and Green Ronin makes a splash when they release a new game. Maybe we'll see DC Adventures show up in Q4.
Hmmm..Jason Bulmahn
Lead Designer who likes good food
I had a shot of 21 year scotch on Paizo's behalf. :)
I had a shot of 21 year scotch on Paizo's behalf. :)
Hmmm..Jason Bulmahn
Lead Designer who likes good foodYeah.. I must object to this statement. Mainly because it is not me with the 21 year old scotch.
Jason
Your fault, you guys sort of funded my having this bottle (Glenlivet 21 in specific). ;)
...White Wolf has been slowly dying...Well... White Wolf has been slowly removing themselves from the hobby print market.
I know, it just makes me sad. I enjoyed a lot of the old White Wolf stuff. They were still doing fairly well in '09, but they scaled their releases way back this year.
So Paizo, never sell yourself to an MMO company. ;) At least you are privately owned (right?) and can't be bought out through stocks. It always makes me laugh when someone suggests that if Paizo becomes too much of a threat Wizards will just buy you. Like Lisa would accept any kind of offer they would reasonably give.
Director of Games
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Your fault, you guys sort of funded my having this bottle (Glenlivet 21 in specific). ;)I had a shot of 21 year scotch on Paizo's behalf. :)
Hmmm..Jason Bulmahn
Lead Designer who likes good foodYeah.. I must object to this statement. Mainly because it is not me with the 21 year old scotch.
Jason
I think that means you owe me my "cut".
Jason
I picked up a 21 day aged ribeye from a local specialty butcher. It has been suggested that I go with a nice Zinfandel, but I am still mulling it over. I need something that is going to saute well with a mushroom and shallot blend.
I recommend a good Italian Sangiovese wine.
Fall 2008
1. D&D
2. 40k RPGs (Dark Heresy/Rogue Trader)
3. World of Darkness
4. Shadowrun
5. Pathfinder
I still find this crazy cool since this was just the Pathfinder Beta.
Wait.. you got crackers!?!?!
There were... conditions....
I was young, and needed the calories.
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CEO
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Not to rain on anyone's parade (this is what, the fourth time that phrase is used here? :p), but the way they judged this isn't exactly "scientific" ;p
It was literally them going to a handful of stores and going "So uh, what RPGs are your best sellers?" and attempting to extrapolate widespread conclusions based on the responses.
It may not be scientific, but it jives well with some much more scientific data that we have internally. We will never be able to have 100% transparency about how sales of somebody else's products are going, but we can get some pretty good data that customers don't have access to. And that data tells us that icV2 is pretty much right on. Which is pretty cool, IMHO! :)
-Lisa
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CEO
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Still, I'm pretty skeptical that this is a measure of OVERALL sales (I'm thinking especially about distribution in the big chains), but yes this IS very significant.
We actually have very good data about sales into the "big chains" like Amazon, Barnes and Noble, Borders, etc. through a company called Bookscan which records every single sale through those chains and aggregates them. Believe it or not, we know the sales of RPG products through book stores much more accurately than we do through hobby game stores. Weird, I know. :)
-Lisa
Contributor
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Pinot Noir?So...
How will YOU celebrate Paizo's new status?(I'm undecided, but right now I'm wanting to start out with beer and fried chicken. I'd have to put my books away for that.)
I know that Jason got himself a nice steak he plans to broil tonight with a nice bottle of wine.
-Lisa
I picked up a 21 day aged ribeye from a local specialty butcher. It has been suggested that I go with a nice Zinfandel, but I am still mulling it over. I need something that is going to saute well with a mushroom and shallot blend.
Hmmm..
Jason Bulmahn
Lead Designer who likes good food
Davis Family Zinfandel. '06 if you can get it. '09 if you can't. If you aren't pleased I'll buy you a replacement bottle at Neoncon.
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Contributor
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Sautee with Zin if you must, but for drinking grab a solid Shiraz (French, Oz, whatevs) or a good Chateau-Neuf du Pape. You won't be disappointed with the latter.I picked up a 21 day aged ribeye from a local specialty butcher. It has been suggested that I go with a nice Zinfandel, but I am still mulling it over. I need something that is going to saute well with a mushroom and shallot blend.
Hmmm..
Jason Bulmahn
Lead Designer who likes good food
For a steak with mushroom/shallot? Bah. If a lot of shallots, he'll need the tannins in the zin. Otherwise, a a Petite Syrah. Shiraz indeed sir! Next you'll be touting Chile!
:)
Yup Yup :)
Even if ICv2 happens to be completely off in their analysis because of sample size error (ya, ya, gimme a minute...) the fact that they're reporting this trend is going to influence gamers to check out the game and game stores to carry it more. It's a self-fulfilling prophecy.
While I'm the type who would like to see data and error bars I'm more inclined to believe this data than I normally would be because while I've seen the amount of 4th edition love on 4chan, I've also seen the filesharing.
Congratulations.
In honor of this occasion, I made some alfredo sauce from scratch and cooked some shrimp with some extra virgin olive oil, some lemon juice, and a splash of silver rum for some extra flavor ;)
And then I ate it all :D
Good job Pathfinder!
I recommend a good Italian Sangiovese wine.Isn't that redundant?
I would have picked a Zin with a good steak, but I like the wines that explode in your mouth like pop-rocks and soda.
Yes, but identifying country of origin sometimes helps when walkin' to look at your local wine selection. :P
Well deserved, Paizo! Congratulations!
Congratz People!
For instance, the next World Wide Gaming Day - you know, the even they use to lure people into buying their products by providing them with a demo of it - will apparently require the game box to be purchased in order to run the event (as reported by our local guy in charge of this stuff).Is this a reference to the game stores having to purchase the materials (maps, miniatures and adventures etc) to run the event? If so, I don't see a big issue with that assuming the cost isn't outrageous - shops are basically sharing the cost of supporting an event that will promote sales of WotC in their specific store.
Do Paizo give free materials to game stores (other than posters etc) to promote Pathfinder?
Heh, local game stores just allow the game day in their rooms. The DMs have to provide the materials themselves and the support from WotC gets worse every game day. We've already agreed upon paying an entrance fee about 2$ to cover the costs associated with printing of the character sheets,...
On the other hand we're trying to make the very first local Pathfinder Game Day, which will see me as one of the DMs :D (WotC is otherwise dominant with some White Wolf and locally produced Altar hanging behind the scenes).
I'm actually more happy that I'm wrong and the results are two, honestly :D
Really, as has been stated in EN World, this is a good thing for everyone. I love 4e and I love Pathfinder, and all this means to me is that both the games I love are running strong and that both will no doubt be pulling out all stops to be their most awesome ;)
Feel good story of the year, someone make a movie.
Congratulations. Nicely done. Quality sells. I'm giving myself a 10 minute break from grading papers in celebration :) Uh, you can do the drinking for me :D
Champagne for Paizo !!!
Cheers Paizo! What an incredible result for your efforts! :)
quality sells! :)
Kudos for being tied for first, and looking forward to Paizo passing up the competition.
Excellent Product
Excellent Customer Care
and
Excellent Staff
You have a winning combination.
I think that the best way to celebrate this would be ...
... to go buy some more Paizo products!
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For instance, the next World Wide Gaming Day - you know, the even they use to lure people into buying their products by providing them with a demo of it - will apparently require the game box to be purchased in order to run the event (as reported by our local guy in charge of this stuff).Is this a reference to the game stores having to purchase the materials (maps, miniatures and adventures etc) to run the event? If so, I don't see a big issue with that assuming the cost isn't outrageous - shops are basically sharing the cost of supporting an event that will promote sales of WotC in their specific store.The impression given was that people DMing for the event will have to purchase the box set to run it. It is Gamma World based on 4e, not D&D, and from what I read about it, they are going to try and cash in HARD on Gamma World.
Do Paizo give free materials to game stores (other than posters etc) to promote Pathfinder?I wasn't aware Paizo had any events and if it does, there are none in my area.
Cartigan, while you are correct that the DM needs to be able to buy the game itself. Most stores will buy it for them to run the game for them. At least the game stores in my area have. The main thing is that their is a kit too. The kit provides the adventure itself as well as materials needed to run the game. The players need to purchase two booster packs which I agree with you it is sad that WotC is doing this. While the game stores in my area will not purchase the booster packs for the players, generally this is a non-issue for them though. The DM has nothing to worry about as far as buying the material though so they get it for free to run the game.
Sad that your friends store chooses not to do this for it's DM's though.Now I am not a fan of WotC anymore but at least I like facts and here is a direct quote from http://www.wizards.com/DnD/Event.aspx?x=dnd/4new/event/gameday
"An exclusive 4-hour adventure called Trouble in Freesboro, written by Robert Schwalb, includes an online feature to the game that if accessed during game play can provide the players with a valuable clue. Players purchase 2 D&D Gamma World booster packs and create their own characters when they arrive at a participating location to play. DMs are required to have a copy of the D&D Gamma World Boxed Set and the adventure materials, available prior to the event day in the game day kit, to prepare to run their game.
This implies that the DM needs to buy it but there is a kit too which means that it COULD be included ion the kit which is also implied is provided in there
In addition to a poster map and the adventure, the game day kit also contains 2 different D&D Gamma World cards, available nowhere else, and awarded to players and DMs just for participating!"
This. Is awesome. Congratulations!