Nidalap
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Random ideas for holy champions of various alignments;
LG - Paladin, Paragon
NG - Champion, Guardian, Hero, Defender
CG - Crusader, Vindicator, Avenger
LN - Arbiter, Stalwart
N - ?
CN - Libertine?
LE - Conqueror, Tyrant, Despot, Martinet
NE - Villain, Blackguard, Knave, Malefactor, Caitiff
CE - Reaver, Mauler
Neutral Paladin - The Watcher, Blade of the Concord, The Concordant Knight, That Nonpartisan Fellow in Armour
or how about The Swiss Guard ;P
DEATHKNIGHT!
*ducks for cover*
Thats a template from Monster Manual II, wich goes back to previous editions, so them where the one who copy the idea, nothing wrong with the idea.
Humbly,
Yawar
PSD: I like the idea of martial lich of sorts.
How about "dread knight" if you're really not vibing on the "anti-paladin" title?
or antimony, in French antimoine meaning "anti-monk".
Therefore antimony is the new chaotic monk class...
Akiros Ismort, if my GM has his way.
I actually vote for it remaining as it is, for all its worth. Sure, there's all sorts of adjectives you can come up with for someone who would feel compelled to beat a pretty maiden's face in till all her teeth were decorating his gauntlet, and then make wee in the town well just for scuz, but that should be something earned in game and not by title alone.
The great thing is, class names are (for the most part) not in-character. So feel free to name them whatever you want in your world.
Fallen Ones
Dark Order
Abyssal Champions
League of Evil Paladins
etc...
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Funny you brought this up. My friend in our current game complains about the title all the time. He prefers Dark Knight. I don't like that cause it reminds me of Batman and the Anti-Paladin is not Bat Man. He says that theorectically he and a paladin should explode if they engaged in combat. I thought that would be sweet. He didn't see the humor.
I like Anti-Paladin but if you must change it consider the following.
Death Knight (Don't worry. You are CE. When you die Demogorgon or Orcus will bring you back as the real deal. :) )
Knight of Sorrow
Knight of Despair
Plague Bearer
Dread Knight
Dark Lord
Warlock ( the term warlock does mean oathbreaker. Perfect for the paladin gone bad.)
Blackguard (Pronounced Blaggard. It just means peasant but was used in an insulting way by members of the noble class to insult each other. I think it is still considered an offensive term in England.)
Years ago there has been an article in Dragon about Paladins of different alignments complete with names.
One of them was the Paramander which was extremely powerful.
I however are perfectly happy with the anti-paladin, but I would have made a go for anit-paladin, but only because that types easier ;)
Baby-Punching Killin' Machine.Eh, that sounds more like a Prestige Class. ;)
But an AWESOME one though!
If you gotta change it..
How about Defiler?
I happen to like my name, thank you.
Random ideas for holy champions of various alignments;
LG - Paladin, Paragon
NG - Champion, Guardian, Hero, Defender
CG - Crusader, Vindicator, Avenger
LN - Arbiter, Stalwart
N - ?
CN - Libertine?
LE - Conqueror, Tyrant, Despot, Martinet
NE - Villain, Blackguard, Knave, Malefactor, Caitiff
CE - Reaver, Mauler
N - Own worst Enemy, or Sits on the side line eating popcorn watching the show cheering for both sides?
Anti-paladin is fine for me. I liked indeed the Blackguard too.
I would not use Black Knight because I see a Black Knight more like a western version of the UC Ronin.
In my setting antipaladin are LE, indeed. It seems more fitting to me.
I really think you're wrong about that. I don't remember the term 'antipaladin' in Fiend Folio. In fact, as memory serves, the githyanki were from the plane of Limbo, making a class which is inherently CE unlikely.
Actually he is right. It is there on page 43 where it breaks down their typical class makeup where it says:
'... and there is a form of anti-paladin class - the Knight'
He says that theorectically he and a paladin should explode if they engaged in combat. I thought that would be sweet. He didn't see the humor.
Don't they though? I mean each one is probably going to smite the other, that tends to get messy fast...
YAAR, I believe we should rename all Antipaladins to be 'Skippy'.
"Oh fresh Necromancy! Just what i needed." Puts necromancers in a basket
1) Nice necro. As in, I'm glad someone necro'd it, or I'd have entirely missed the thread.
2) Githyanki knights had "all of the powers and abilities of a human paladin except these are turned towards evil." (That's an exact quote, complete with dubious punctuation.) In 3e, they were fighters with blackguard levels.
Also, githzerai were originally CN.
3) I like some of the alternate names suggested, especially abyssal champion, reaver, and warlock. As for blackguards, I'd just like to see the p-class adapted.
4) We're still missing the LE and CG "corners," as it were.
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Neutral Paladin -> Fighter ... maybe Ranger
It's not like any of his abilities would work. Smite Thing I Don't Like, Friendly Handshake and Aura of Nothing just don't seem to have that same zing!
"Anti-Paladin" is just too goofy and anachronistic a name to fit in a medieval fantasy. What would be better to call them?
How about Paladin?
Redefine Paladin to mean a knight of a given god.
Redefine Paladin to mean a knight of a given god.
The Arcanis campaign setting for 3.x had the paladin broken up into "Holy Champions" of various alignments, each having the abilities tweaked to represent their chosen god(dess).
Redefine Paladin to mean a knight of a given god.
We have that class already. It is called a cleric.
We have that class already. It is called a cleric.
Except paladin is synonymous with knight and cleric is not.
We have that class already. It is called a cleric.Except paladin is synonymous with knight and cleric is not.
They are Knights {or can be anyhow} but are not all warriors of a god, even if they are the code must come first and always. Clerics are the military arm of their faith. Paladins however are not.
Meh. Clerics never inspired that knightly image to me.
Depends from the cleric IMHO. Say, in Greyhawk, Hextor and Heironeus clerics, definitively.
Meh. Clerics never inspired that knightly image to me.
Maybe not but that is the role clerics were created to fill. The get Med BAB, armor and weapon training, the class is built around the idea of not only will you be in combat, but you can hold your own.
They are the Knights Templar, the order of Hospitalizes given spells. The paladin was created to be a champion of good, the cleric was made to be a soldier for his god.
It seems perfectly fine to me to just call them all paladin and let the details get sorted out on a case by case basis when you find out what values they serve. Clerics have been getting by fine that way for a while now.
You clearly missed the part where I was teasing seeker. :)Meh. Clerics never inspired that knightly image to me.Depends from the cleric IMHO. Say, in Greyhawk, Hextor and Heironeus clerics, definitively.
Sadly, I don't always get it. Luckily, I've the excuse of the language :P
Meh. Clerics never inspired that knightly image to me.
I think that depends on the cleric.
Meh. Clerics never inspired that knightly image to me.Maybe not but that is the role clerics were created to fill. The get Med BAB, armor and weapon training, the class is built around the idea of not only will you be in combat, but you can hold your own.
They are the Knights Templar, the order of Hospitalizes given spells. The paladin was created to be a champion of good, the cleric was made to be a soldier for his god.
By your logic, Lancelot was a cleric.
By your logic, Lancelot was a cleric.
Not my logic, The Knights Templar and the order of Hospitalizes, were the inspirations behind the cleric class from day one. The class was always meant to be a "holy warrior" type.
The paladin on the other hand isn't just any old holy warrior of a God. He is meant to be the shinning example.
i tend to agree clerics are like priests with divine spells and paladins are knights of said god in fact
"paladin" literally means historically the paladins were knights of renown good
The paladin was created to be a champion of good, the cleric was made to be a soldier for his god.
In D&D, Paladins were created as a class that virtually no one would ever get to play. What were the odds of rolling stats that high in exactly the right spots?
i tend to agree clerics are like priests with divine spells
And military training you mean :) I do agree if clerics are not holy warriors they should loose the weapons, armor, BAb and HD.
The paladin was created to be a champion of good, the cleric was made to be a soldier for his god.In D&D, Paladins were created as a class that virtually no one would ever get to play. What were the odds of rolling stats that high in exactly the right spots?
That was kinda the point, Paladins are rare, even now days they are not what you would call common. But clerics, well clerics are everywhere it seems.{something I do not really agree with, but eh}
The Cleric described:
AD&D 1st Edition PHB — "This class of character bears a certain resemblance to religious orders of knighthood of medieval times."
AD&D 2nd Edition PHB — "The cleric class is similar to certain religious orders of knighthood of the Middle Ages: the Teutonic Knights, the Knights Templars, and Hospitalers. These orders combined military and religious training with a code of protection and service. Members were trained as knights and devoted themselves to the service of the church. These orders were frequently found on the outer edges of the Christian world, either on the fringe of the wilderness or in war-torn lands. Archbishop Turpin (of The Song of Roland) is an example of such a cleric. Similar orders can also be found in other lands, such as the sohei of Japan."
See, those are the very things I were thinking about. TY for posting that.
I vote to subtract the 'anti' from the name and just call it a Paladin. Good Paladin's have class features that fit the archetype of being a champion of righteousness while evil paladin's have antithetical versions of those powers that fit being a champion of tyranny. We don't pretend that there is enough difference between the positive energy channeling clerics and the negative energy ones to call them different classes why should we do so for the anti-paladin. It isn't all that different.
On a side note, am I the only one who pictures General Kael from the movie 'Willow' when he thinks of this class? Sure, his class may have been fighter, but no character comes to mind who fits the theme as well as he does.
On a side note, am I the only one who pictures General Kael from the movie 'Willow' when he thinks of this class? Sure, his class may have been fighter, but no character comes to mind who fits the theme as well as he does.
<- Angry at Netflix for not having the movie Willow. :@
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On a side note, am I the only one who pictures General Kael from the movie 'Willow' when he thinks of this class? Sure, his class may have been fighter, but no character comes to mind who fits the theme as well as he does.<- Angry at Netflix for not having the movie Willow. :@
Kael wasnt too evil. He was loyal and disciplined. When I think of Anti Pallys, I think of Kurgen, Katana, Kane (Highlander movies).