Just wanted to clarify a couple rules
These would apply to both rage and defensive stance although not nessecaily a viable build
in both cases after ending the effects you are fatigued. if you enter again while fatigued you become immune to fatigue during and then leave exhausted.
Then you have Oracle level 5 with lame curse that makes you immune to fatigue.
Oracle 15 immune to exhaustion
Horizon Walker 1 Desert , immune to exhaustion (becomes fatigued)
Horizon walker 3 Desert , immune to fatigue
So
If your immune to fatigue then when you end your rage/defense then you are not fatigued and can then re-enter the very next round no penalty.
in the case barbarian this means you can end rage after your attack each round to not suffer the AC peanlty
in the case of defense you can move between defenses removing the main downside.
Horizon Walker I immune to exhaustion bur not fatigue
so if you end rage/defense your fatigued, then re-enter no longer fatigued, then end your exhausted but that gets reduced to fatigue so you can the re-enter and once again immune to fatigue and then abck out again.
so either way by jumping in an out of rage/defense each round you can either avoid the dowsides of the effect or you can avoid the downsides and be fatigued for 2 rounds at the end.
Correct ?
Disclaimer: IANARL -- I am not a rules lawyer. These are mostly my opinions, based on the overall concepts and rules of Pathfinder.
I think that the rounds of a specific debuff/condition that you bring on yourself via actions like jumping in and out of rage should be cumulative/serial and not concurrent/parallel. This is in contrast to the explicit rule about multiple instances of a single debuff/condition bestowed on another creature, which states that their durations DO overlap and expire in parallel, while the effect is applied only once (non-stacking).
I also think the effect of the debuff should be delayed, not extinguished by the temporary "immunity" bestowed by the rage/defense.
So in the case you've described, the Horizon Walker would enter rage/defense at the beginning of his turn, perform his actions, then end rage/defense which triggers 2 rounds of fatigue. His turn in the initiative comes around again and he enters rage/defense again, delaying but not extinguishing the 2 rounds of fatigue. He accumulates 2 rounds of what would be exhaustion, but the Horizon Walker ability converts it to fatigue, so when he leaves rage/defense after his 2nd round, he has 4 rounds of fatigue "debt". Short of a magical ability/spell that specifically removes the fatigue/exhaustion debuff, I feel there should not be any way to exploit this as a loophole and avoid paying the debt.
I'd agree with fatigue debt idea
Would you agree that immunity to fatigue (not exhuastion) negates the penalty all together ? Or since your causing it ,having it overide your own immunity ?
No, he becomes immune, period. the local terrain has no effect.
==Aelryinth
as a side note Horizin Walker 3 is sufficent to get immunity to fatigue and exhuastion. and resist fire 10 as an extra
Oh, does the Horizon Walker immunity to fatigue only work while he's IN the desert? In that case, he'd accumulate the debt while in the desert and if he leaves that terrain during the same day, the debt would catch up and take effect.
And there would be no "debt" anyway. The duration of the fatigue or exhaustion rolls down normally, immune or not.
Doesn't the idea of opting into and then out of rage/defensive stance within a round seem hokey? I'd suggest only allowing one or the other in a given round to close this loophole.
Of course, I rage one round, wail away, deal with the AC issues before my next attack, and then wail away a second round only to end the rage before the end of that round. Basically, you could still do it every other round.
Ugh.
Disclaimer: IANARL -- I am not a rules lawyer. These are mostly my opinions, based on the overall concepts and rules of Pathfinder.
Under the description of the Rage class ability, I believe it says you cannot enter rage while fatigued/exhausted. So as soon as you leave rage, you can't re-enter for 2 x (# rage rounds) unless you have some magic or ability that removes the fatigue/exhaustion entirely. I don't know about defensive stance.
On a general note, I think that the rounds of a specific debuff/condition that you bring on yourself via your own decisions and actions should be cumulative/serial and not concurrent/parallel. This is in contrast to the explicit rule about multiple instances of a single debuff/condition bestowed on another creature, which states that their durations DO overlap and expire in parallel, while the effect is applied only once (non-stacking).
I also think that debuff rounds should be delayed, not extinguished, by temporary "immunity".
So in the case you've described, the Horizon Walker would enter rage at the beginning of his turn, perform his actions, then end rage which triggers 2 rounds of fatigue. His turn in the initiative comes around again and he can't enter rage/defense again because he's fatigued.
But assuming something suppresses or delays the fatigue, he rages again, accumulating 2 rounds of what would be exhaustion, but the Horizon Walker ability converts it to fatigue, so when he leaves rage after his 2nd round, he has 4 rounds of fatigue "debt". Short of a magical ability/spell that specifically removes the fatigue/exhaustion debuff, I feel there should not be any way to exploit this as a loophole and avoid paying the debt.
I would have to say that if you have a way in witch you are immune to fatigue. Then you can go out of rage then re-rage right afterwards. But you will come out of the rage as if you were exhausted.
Because even though you are immune to fatigue you are just ignoring the effects and can still be exhausted as if you did something when you were fatigued and now you are pushed down to exhaustion for doing something that causes fatigue while you are already fatigued.