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Jeff Erwin wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:
Alex Smith 908 wrote:
Are some of nyarlathotep's avatars low enough in power level to be statted? Specifically I was wondering about the Bloody Tongue.
Absolutely... although a lot of the avatars gamers are familiar with aren't ones we can stat up, since they were invented for the Call of Cthulhu RPG. We'd have to get special permission and a license to stat them up... which isn't impossible. We've done this before, with things like the dark young of Shub-Niggurath, but we can't make those rules open content... so we kinda shy away from doing that too much. We could certainly make up new avatars for him, but that's kinda missing the point as well. There's not as much nostalgic weight to that type of creation.
Wouldn't he have some unique avatars specific to Golarion?

How do we know that JJ isn't one such avatar? 0.o

Paizo Employee Creative Director

Alex Smith 908 wrote:
The Howler in the Dark was originally published by Derleth but functioned as the basis for Chaosium's God of the Bloody Tongue. That being said I have no idea of the copyright status of it.

Derleth's work is, as far as I can tell, not quite yet in the public domain. He passed away in 1971 or 1972.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

Zhangar wrote:

Kostchtchie's artwork shows him wearing a cage as a sort of necklace.

Is anyone in particular supposed to be in that cage?

I have my own ideas on it, but curious as to whether there's a canon explanation.

No canon explanation. It's just jewelry. Given his size, though, he could probably fit a kid or a halfling in there...

Paizo Employee Creative Director

Jeff Erwin wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:
Alex Smith 908 wrote:
Are some of nyarlathotep's avatars low enough in power level to be statted? Specifically I was wondering about the Bloody Tongue.
Absolutely... although a lot of the avatars gamers are familiar with aren't ones we can stat up, since they were invented for the Call of Cthulhu RPG. We'd have to get special permission and a license to stat them up... which isn't impossible. We've done this before, with things like the dark young of Shub-Niggurath, but we can't make those rules open content... so we kinda shy away from doing that too much. We could certainly make up new avatars for him, but that's kinda missing the point as well. There's not as much nostalgic weight to that type of creation.
Wouldn't he have some unique avatars specific to Golarion?

For sure! But as I said, they'd be freshly invented for Golarion, and as such, wouldn't have the gravitas or nostalgia or tradition that those invented by Lovecraft or Bloch or King or any of the other numerous writers who'd written about him would have. In any event, if we DID ever do something with Nyarlathotep, it would likely be with one of the two aspects of him we HAVE covered in print so far.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

Tels wrote:
Jeff Erwin wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:
Alex Smith 908 wrote:
Are some of nyarlathotep's avatars low enough in power level to be statted? Specifically I was wondering about the Bloody Tongue.
Absolutely... although a lot of the avatars gamers are familiar with aren't ones we can stat up, since they were invented for the Call of Cthulhu RPG. We'd have to get special permission and a license to stat them up... which isn't impossible. We've done this before, with things like the dark young of Shub-Niggurath, but we can't make those rules open content... so we kinda shy away from doing that too much. We could certainly make up new avatars for him, but that's kinda missing the point as well. There's not as much nostalgic weight to that type of creation.
Wouldn't he have some unique avatars specific to Golarion?
How do we know that JJ isn't one such avatar? 0.o

That's the thing.

You wouldn't know.


James the feat ''fiendish heritage'' that appears in Pathfinder Adventure Path #25: The Bastards of Erebus (Council of Thieves 1 of 6) was used has a requirement to have access the Variant Tiefling Heritages and Variant Tiefling Abilities but then 3 years later on (april 2012) ''blood of fiends'' comes out adding the variant heritages again but without using the fiendish heritage feat requirements.

Was this ommitted in purpose to make it equal with the up coming book ''blood of angels'' which have the same variant rules for Aasimars with no 'heritage feat' requirements ?


James Jacobs wrote:
Tels wrote:
Jeff Erwin wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:
Alex Smith 908 wrote:
Are some of nyarlathotep's avatars low enough in power level to be statted? Specifically I was wondering about the Bloody Tongue.
Absolutely... although a lot of the avatars gamers are familiar with aren't ones we can stat up, since they were invented for the Call of Cthulhu RPG. We'd have to get special permission and a license to stat them up... which isn't impossible. We've done this before, with things like the dark young of Shub-Niggurath, but we can't make those rules open content... so we kinda shy away from doing that too much. We could certainly make up new avatars for him, but that's kinda missing the point as well. There's not as much nostalgic weight to that type of creation.
Wouldn't he have some unique avatars specific to Golarion?
How do we know that JJ isn't one such avatar? 0.o

That's the thing.

You wouldn't know.

Would you even know if you were an avatar if he didn't want you to know?

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Have you heard of this piece The Litany of Earth by Ruthana Emrys It's a free novelette at Tor.com. The premise is basically this. alerted to the existence of Cthulu cults, the United States (and other governments begin a wholesale deportation of cultists and their families to concentration camps, similar to the ones that Japanese-Americans were interred in at about the same time. (this may be a reflection of the Innsmouth story as the main character apparently once lived there.)

The Litany of Earth
RUTHANNA EMRYS
illustration by ALLEN WILLIAMS
The state took Aphra away from Innsmouth. They took her history, her home, her family, her god. They tried to take the sea. Now, years later, when she is just beginning to rebuild a life, an agent of that government intrudes on her life again, with an offer she wishes she could refuse. “The Litany of Earth” is a dark fantasy story inspired by the Lovecraft mythos.

This novelette was acquired and edited for Tor.com by acquiring editor Carl Engle-Laird.

Silver Crusade

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

Hey, what Inner Sea nation's army would have soldiers that most closely resemble Rome's legions? You know, short sword and heavy wooden shield combo with a few javelins and lorica segmentata armor?

And on an unrelated note, what AP would you say deals most closely with themes related to time? Of things like inevitability and wanting to erase the past but being unable to do so? I was listening to this song and the chorus got me wondering:

"Forlorn faces running from the cold regret,
Empty spaces something that I can't forget.
All I wanted was to wish the past away,
but time's the cruelest ruler that we all obey."


1 person marked this as a favorite.
James Jacobs wrote:
FingPat is so handsome and witty. Also he can do no wrong.

Why did you, James Jacobs, post this, I'm so confused. I've never even met you.

RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

FingPat wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:
FingPat is so handsome and witty. Also he can do no wrong.
Why did you, James Jacobs, post this, I'm so confused. I've never even met you.

James, what kind of person creates fake posts about themselves and then favorites said post?

Paizo Employee Creative Director

Jose Suarez 916 wrote:

James the feat ''fiendish heritage'' that appears in Pathfinder Adventure Path #25: The Bastards of Erebus (Council of Thieves 1 of 6) was used has a requirement to have access the Variant Tiefling Heritages and Variant Tiefling Abilities but then 3 years later on (april 2012) ''blood of fiends'' comes out adding the variant heritages again but without using the fiendish heritage feat requirements.

Was this ommitted in purpose to make it equal with the up coming book ''blood of angels'' which have the same variant rules for Aasimars with no 'heritage feat' requirements ?

Yes. That, and we decided we didn't want to keep that feat.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

Tels wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:
Tels wrote:
Jeff Erwin wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:
Alex Smith 908 wrote:
Are some of nyarlathotep's avatars low enough in power level to be statted? Specifically I was wondering about the Bloody Tongue.
Absolutely... although a lot of the avatars gamers are familiar with aren't ones we can stat up, since they were invented for the Call of Cthulhu RPG. We'd have to get special permission and a license to stat them up... which isn't impossible. We've done this before, with things like the dark young of Shub-Niggurath, but we can't make those rules open content... so we kinda shy away from doing that too much. We could certainly make up new avatars for him, but that's kinda missing the point as well. There's not as much nostalgic weight to that type of creation.
Wouldn't he have some unique avatars specific to Golarion?
How do we know that JJ isn't one such avatar? 0.o

That's the thing.

You wouldn't know.

Would you even know if you were an avatar if he didn't want you to know?

I would know, yes.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

LazarX wrote:

Have you heard of this piece The Litany of Earth by Ruthana Emrys It's a free novelette at Tor.com. The premise is basically this. alerted to the existence of Cthulu cults, the United States (and other governments begin a wholesale deportation of cultists and their families to concentration camps, similar to the ones that Japanese-Americans were interred in at about the same time. (this may be a reflection of the Innsmouth story as the main character apparently once lived there.)

The Litany of Earth
RUTHANNA EMRYS
illustration by ALLEN WILLIAMS
The state took Aphra away from Innsmouth. They took her history, her home, her family, her god. They tried to take the sea. Now, years later, when she is just beginning to rebuild a life, an agent of that government intrudes on her life again, with an offer she wishes she could refuse. “The Litany of Earth” is a dark fantasy story inspired by the Lovecraft mythos.

This novelette was acquired and edited for Tor.com by acquiring editor Carl Engle-Laird.

I haven't heard of it.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

Kilrex wrote:
FingPat wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:
FingPat is so handsome and witty. Also he can do no wrong.
Why did you, James Jacobs, post this, I'm so confused. I've never even met you.
James, what kind of person creates fake posts about themselves and then favorites said post?

That's an excellent question, and one I can't really answer without making assumptions...

Paizo Employee Creative Director

Archpaladin Zousha wrote:

Hey, what Inner Sea nation's army would have soldiers that most closely resemble Rome's legions? You know, short sword and heavy wooden shield combo with a few javelins and lorica segmentata armor?

And on an unrelated note, what AP would you say deals most closely with themes related to time? Of things like inevitability and wanting to erase the past but being unable to do so? I was listening to this song and the chorus got me wondering:

"Forlorn faces running from the cold regret,
Empty spaces something that I can't forget.
All I wanted was to wish the past away,
but time's the cruelest ruler that we all obey."

Ancient Taldor, I suppose. Especially when Taldor was a much larger nation. There's not a direct correlation, but you could fake it by being Taldan I suppose.

You seem to have a lot of questions about how to build real-world historical characters in Golarion, and that's just not something you're going to be able to find perfect answers to. We take inspiration from numerous real-world historical eras, but we deliberately change things around so that you can't really play a "perfect Roman" in Golarion and not be out of place. You'd need to play a game set in Rome for that.

We don't really do much of time themes, but I guess Second Darkness is the one that does so the most.


I have a question related to my current character set in the pathfinder setting.

Its a "concept" cleric of the Blood ( war subdomain ) and Undead ( Death subdomain )who is also of Aasimar blood to add to the mix. ( Note that i am true neutral )

So my question is how the Golarion world would approach her view on a more neutral version of necromancy which is more in the line of calling apon spirits to animate skeletons. I expect it would be a lot of people that is still skeptical to this kind of magic, but would there be any factions who would be insterested or supportive of this type of "gentle necromancy" or if there is even canon elements of the Golarion universe that might convey this?

Just a question that have been poking at me that i feel that necromancy doesnt *need* to be evil in all cases, so would it be possible to have a expansion on magic that fill in more in variations of magic types/styles?


As a query on how you would run the "Immortal" mythic ability (the one that allows you to come back after 24 hours), when resurrecting would you say that you come back to life in the exact spot where you died? Or would it be in a safe location somewhere, such as a stronghold, temple, demiplane home or similar? For example, if a character with the Sanctum ability were killed, would you allow them to go through their resurrection inside their sanctum?

To add this to a query on Golarion and its afterlife, how does this ability interact with the idea of dying and going to be judged by Pharasma? Do you just never make it to judgement by the time you resurrect? Or do you hang in a limbo for 24 hours before resurrecting without ever joining the line in the first place?


Mr. James Jacobs,

Regarding Treerazor. He was a demon lord until his banishment which means he had mythic power. How ticked off would he be if someone took his the power that was stripped from him to propel themselves up the demonic latter? Additionally what would he do to find that person and what would he do to the person assuming he was able to give his wrath upon them?

Contributor

Dear James Jacobs,

How long before a hug becomes awkward?


When you say that the 4 alien races in "People of the Stars" will get about two pages each, you mean about two pages of both fluff and crunch, correct?

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
James Jacobs wrote:
LazarX wrote:

Have you heard of this piece The Litany of Earth by Ruthana Emrys It's a free novelette at Tor.com. The premise is basically this. alerted to the existence of Cthulu cults, the United States (and other governments begin a wholesale deportation of cultists and their families to concentration camps, similar to the ones that Japanese-Americans were interred in at about the same time. (this may be a reflection of the Innsmouth story as the main character apparently once lived there.)

The Litany of Earth
RUTHANNA EMRYS
illustration by ALLEN WILLIAMS
The state took Aphra away from Innsmouth. They took her history, her home, her family, her god. They tried to take the sea. Now, years later, when she is just beginning to rebuild a life, an agent of that government intrudes on her life again, with an offer she wishes she could refuse. “The Litany of Earth” is a dark fantasy story inspired by the Lovecraft mythos.

This novelette was acquired and edited for Tor.com by acquiring editor Carl Engle-Laird.

I haven't heard of it.

I highly recommend it.. It's a short free read at the link and as far as I can tell, it's a very original look at the world of the Mythos. The U.S. government closes down Miskatonic University, rounds up everyone they can catch that's associated with the Mythos beings, and subjects them to atrocities to find out all they can. This character is dealing with the aftermath when a Fed agent comes into her life.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

Dracoknight wrote:

I have a question related to my current character set in the pathfinder setting.

Its a "concept" cleric of the Blood ( war subdomain ) and Undead ( Death subdomain )who is also of Aasimar blood to add to the mix. ( Note that i am true neutral )

So my question is how the Golarion world would approach her view on a more neutral version of necromancy which is more in the line of calling apon spirits to animate skeletons. I expect it would be a lot of people that is still skeptical to this kind of magic, but would there be any factions who would be insterested or supportive of this type of "gentle necromancy" or if there is even canon elements of the Golarion universe that might convey this?

Just a question that have been poking at me that i feel that necromancy doesnt *need* to be evil in all cases, so would it be possible to have a expansion on magic that fill in more in variations of magic types/styles?

Well... first off, clerics in Golarion have to worship a deity, so right off you're already in homebrew/houserule territory. That said, there's nothing in Pathfinder that says "necromancers must be evil." Sure... there are plenty of necromancy spells that are evil and have the Evil descriptor... but if you want to play a non-evil necromancer-type character, the easiest method to go about it is to just avoid casting the spells with the Evil descriptor. Which more or less means you won't be creating undead.

Taking the Undead subdomain more or less locks you in to being evil, since so many of the spells in that subdomain are evil. So if you want to houserule that away, go for it... but that takes you further away from Golarion's expectations, and by extension, the expectations we have when we create products and adventures for Golarion.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

Alleran wrote:

As a query on how you would run the "Immortal" mythic ability (the one that allows you to come back after 24 hours), when resurrecting would you say that you come back to life in the exact spot where you died? Or would it be in a safe location somewhere, such as a stronghold, temple, demiplane home or similar? For example, if a character with the Sanctum ability were killed, would you allow them to go through their resurrection inside their sanctum?

To add this to a query on Golarion and its afterlife, how does this ability interact with the idea of dying and going to be judged by Pharasma? Do you just never make it to judgement by the time you resurrect? Or do you hang in a limbo for 24 hours before resurrecting without ever joining the line in the first place?

I would run the Immortal ability by having you resurrect where your body was if your body still existed, or by having you resurrect somewhere close to your character, such as a sanctum or home or church or the like if your body wasn't destroyed. Coming back to life is a huge advantage, but there should still be disadvantages; coming back to life in an environment where you might immediately die again should be a significant peril. AKA, don't die floating in deep space or at the heart of a volcano!

When a character gains this ability, that's basically Pharasma granting the immortal character a special "opt out" card. When you die, you go into the soul stream and then instead of going to the Boneyard, you cycle immediately back into the Material Plane and resurrect. Time is meaningless to a soul, in any event, so there's no perception of 24 hours passing to the soul, really.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

The NPC wrote:

Mr. James Jacobs,

Regarding Treerazor. He was a demon lord until his banishment which means he had mythic power. How ticked off would he be if someone took his the power that was stripped from him to propel themselves up the demonic latter? Additionally what would he do to find that person and what would he do to the person assuming he was able to give his wrath upon them?

First off... it's Treerazer, with an "e," not an "o." ;-)

He would be VERY ticked off. That said, the mythic power he lost (which isn't REAL mythic power so much as it is "mythic-identical" power) was most likely absorbed by Cyth-V'sug when Treerazer was banished. If he found someone who had that power stolen from him... he'd extract the power by any means necessary and at the very least painfully kill that person.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

Alexander Augunas wrote:

Dear James Jacobs,

How long before a hug becomes awkward?

Depends entirely on who's hugging you.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

1 person marked this as a favorite.
Dragon78 wrote:
When you say that the 4 alien races in "People of the Stars" will get about two pages each, you mean about two pages of both fluff and crunch, correct?

You know how we organize our Player's Companions these days, yes? That we generally give a single topic 2 pages of text with a single illustration to show it off? That's what each of the four races will get in People of the Stars, but there'll be other things in the book that will apply as well. I don't recall the exact split of flavor and rules (I hate the term "fluff" for flavor; feels dismissive and disrespectful to me) for each of them.


James Jacobs wrote:

Well... first off, clerics in Golarion have to worship a deity, so right off you're already in homebrew/houserule territory.

Erm... just a bit on that, isnt the Clerics in Pathfinder also made with the sense of "concept clerics" or alignments and/or even elemental domain clerics?

Or as the wording goes: "If a cleric is not devoted to a particular deity, she still selects two domains to represent her spiritual inclinations and abilities (subject to GM approval). The restriction on alignment domains still applies."

Pretty much the rest of my set-up is in the homebrew/houserule, but the case of a "concept" cleric is more or less buildt into the system.

I guess those type of clerics are more in the line of "Shamans" or "Elders" in the setting of Golarion or something similar, even if that goes into the "Druid" or "Oracle" territory you could basically have a "Ancenstor worship" or something...

Anyho, i see your point that a Cleric kind of needs to be tied up to a divine powersource to gain their abilities, i just try to figure out what the Paizo team have in mind to have clerics of "lesser" deities or sources?


I am not saying I don't like having fluff/flavor with my crunch/game mechanics, I just wanted to make sure that when you said two pages then you meant two pages for both not just one or the other. I am happy to get both especially for the Lashunta and Kasatha.

1)Will the people of the stars explain what you can and can't do with having four arms for the Kasatha? If not will we get such info anywhere else?

2)Who wrote each race article for those four alien races?

3)Would it be safe assume that the android is your favorite of the races in the people of the stars?

4)Would you ever allow someone to play as a Kasatha?

5)What race mentioned in Distant Worlds, that hasn't been stated up, do find the most interesting?

6)What products for pathfinder that you wrote/worked on do you feel the most pride in how they turned out?

7)What are your top 5 favorite planets/moons in the Golarion solar system(not including Golarion)?

Paizo Employee Creative Director

Dracoknight wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:

Well... first off, clerics in Golarion have to worship a deity, so right off you're already in homebrew/houserule territory.

Erm... just a bit on that, isnt the Clerics in Pathfinder also made with the sense of "concept clerics" or alignments and/or even elemental domain clerics?

Or as the wording goes: "If a cleric is not devoted to a particular deity, she still selects two domains to represent her spiritual inclinations and abilities (subject to GM approval). The restriction on alignment domains still applies."

Pretty much the rest of my set-up is in the homebrew/houserule, but the case of a "concept" cleric is more or less buildt into the system.

I guess those type of clerics are more in the line of "Shamans" or "Elders" in the setting of Golarion or something similar, even if that goes into the "Druid" or "Oracle" territory you could basically have a "Ancenstor worship" or something...

Anyho, i see your point that a Cleric kind of needs to be tied up to a divine powersource to gain their abilities, i just try to figure out what the Paizo team have in mind to have clerics of "lesser" deities or sources?

That's an (unfortunate) disconnect between the core (world-neutral) Pathfinder rulebook and the Pathfinder campaign setting. In the Pathfinder campaign setting of Golarion, all clerics must worship deities. Divine spellcasters who don't worship deities but instead worship pantheons or philosophies or the like are covered by oracles.

A deity or demigods power doesn't impact a cleric's power really at all, in any place. A cleric of the most powerful deity can become just as powerful as the least powerful demigod.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

1 person marked this as a favorite.
Dragon78 wrote:

I am not saying I don't like having fluff/flavor with my crunch/game mechanics, I just wanted to make sure that when you said two pages then you meant two pages for both not just one or the other. I am happy to get both especially for the Lashunta and Kasatha.

1)Will the people of the stars explain what you can and can't do with having four arms for the Kasatha? If not will we get such info anywhere else?

2)Who wrote each race article for those four alien races?

3)Would it be safe assume that the android is your favorite of the races in the people of the stars?

4)Would you ever allow someone to play as a Kasatha?

5)What race mentioned in Distant Worlds, that hasn't been stated up, do find the most interesting?

6)What products for pathfinder that you wrote/worked on do you feel the most pride in how they turned out?

7)What are your top 5 favorite planets/moons in the Golarion solar system(not including Golarion)?

1) I don't know. The fact that kasatha have four arms, though,gives them a HUGE advantage over other zero HD races... an advantage I feel makes them not appropriate for PCs at all.

2) I don't know.

3) Nope. It IS the only one of the four I designed though.

4) Not unless the entire party played kasathas and that was the whole point of the campaign.

5) Not sure off the top of my head. I'm not that familiar with Distant Worlds' content to remember anything in particular we haven't already discussed. Maybe the Ilee? Not sure if that's what their name was...

6) Hmmmm. Probably Burnt Offerings & Sandpoint.

7) Aucturn, Castrovel, Akiton, Eox, and Golarion's moon.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
James Jacobs wrote:
Coming back to life is a huge advantage, but there should still be disadvantages; coming back to life in an environment where you might immediately die again should be a significant peril. AKA, don't die floating in deep space or at the heart of a volcano!

Or as what happened to Jack Harkness; being buried alive by your rather irate brother. He spent the next 1200 years in a continuous state of alternating resurrection and suffocation. The only reason he was found was that someone buried a tracer with a very long battery life.

Sometimes the little things are quite enough.


The Ilee are the "race" on Apostae, are they the ones you mean? Though stating them up would be tough.

So what is your favorite of the four alien races in people of the stars if not androids?


James Jacobs wrote:


That's an (unfortunate) disconnect between the core (world-neutral) Pathfinder rulebook and the Pathfinder campaign setting. In the Pathfinder campaign setting of Golarion, all clerics must worship deities. Divine spellcasters who don't worship deities but instead worship pantheons or philosophies or the like are covered by oracles.

A deity or demigods power doesn't impact a cleric's power really at all, in any place. A cleric of the most powerful deity can become just as powerful as the least powerful demigod.

While i dont mind the neutral state of the Rule book, i personally think in a world as big as Golarion would have a space for the odd "Cleric-but-not" kind, but thats the whole homebrew territory again, but i guess for now my deity will remain "unknown" or "Urgathoa" which have both the war and the death domain. I dunno i try to make a True Neutral that kind of fit the previous concept of "Neutral usage of necromancy" but i guess i cant get away by using any "canon" material, so i am just left off to the homebrew.

As a final parting question tho: If a worshipper of a deity is philosophically vaining away from a deity, would or could another deity or a servant of such deity pick up this character and yet not reveal its true indentity? ( In my case would be a ex-Urgothoa that slowly vain away from the evil of Urgotha and rather go into the territory of Pharasma and the cleric just takes the divine gift as "the spirits guide me" type of deal ) or is that mostly in the highly unlikely situations or even impossible due to how the faith system work?

So with that, thank you for answering my questions even tho i still think the divinities are a bit "solid" considering that deities for the most part doesnt care.


Dracoknight wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:


That's an (unfortunate) disconnect between the core (world-neutral) Pathfinder rulebook and the Pathfinder campaign setting. In the Pathfinder campaign setting of Golarion, all clerics must worship deities. Divine spellcasters who don't worship deities but instead worship pantheons or philosophies or the like are covered by oracles.

A deity or demigods power doesn't impact a cleric's power really at all, in any place. A cleric of the most powerful deity can become just as powerful as the least powerful demigod.

While i dont mind the neutral state of the Rule book, i personally think in a world as big as Golarion would have a space for the odd "Cleric-but-not" kind, but thats the whole homebrew territory again, but i guess for now my deity will remain "unknown" or "Urgathoa" which have both the war and the death domain. I dunno i try to make a True Neutral that kind of fit the previous concept of "Neutral usage of necromancy" but i guess i cant get away by using any "canon" material, so i am just left off to the homebrew.

As a final parting question tho: If a worshipper of a deity is philosophically vaining away from a deity, would or could another deity or a servant of such deity pick up this character and yet not reveal its true indentity? ( In my case would be a ex-Urgothoa that slowly vain away from the evil of Urgotha and rather go into the territory of Pharasma and the cleric just takes the divine gift as "the spirits guide me" type of deal ) or is that mostly in the highly unlikely situations or even impossible due to how the faith system work?

So with that, thank you for answering my questions even tho i still think the divinities are a bit "solid" considering that deities for the most part doesnt care.

I'm not James Jacobs but... Achaekek, Zyphus, Sekhmet, Nergal, and Fumeiyoshi all have the Death and War domains as well.


Tels wrote:


I'm not James Jacobs but... Achaekek, Zyphus, Sekhmet,...

Ahh, i were just looking into the ones from the core book, so this would help me out a bit.

Thanks mate!


Pathfinder Companion, Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber
Dracoknight wrote:
i personally think in a world as big as Golarion would have a space for the odd "Cleric-but-not" kind

I believe that is what the oracle does in non-home-brew.

James, what is your favorite doughnut from Voodoo Doughnuts and have you ever been to the independent bookstore right near their Seattle location?

Paizo Employee Creative Director

Dragon78 wrote:

The Ilee are the "race" on Apostae, are they the ones you mean? Though stating them up would be tough.

So what is your favorite of the four alien races in people of the stars if not androids?

The ilee are right. They're interesting. Note that when you ask me about races to stat up, I don't consider "statting up as PC options/zero HD race" to be a limiter. The ilee would DEFINITELY be monsters with HD and would not be PC appropriate.

Of the other races, the kasatha are probably my favorite, I guess. But lashunta are cool too. The kasathas more as a monster race, and the lashunta as a PC race.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

Dracoknight wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:


That's an (unfortunate) disconnect between the core (world-neutral) Pathfinder rulebook and the Pathfinder campaign setting. In the Pathfinder campaign setting of Golarion, all clerics must worship deities. Divine spellcasters who don't worship deities but instead worship pantheons or philosophies or the like are covered by oracles.

A deity or demigods power doesn't impact a cleric's power really at all, in any place. A cleric of the most powerful deity can become just as powerful as the least powerful demigod.

While i dont mind the neutral state of the Rule book, i personally think in a world as big as Golarion would have a space for the odd "Cleric-but-not" kind, but thats the whole homebrew territory again, but i guess for now my deity will remain "unknown" or "Urgathoa" which have both the war and the death domain. I dunno i try to make a True Neutral that kind of fit the previous concept of "Neutral usage of necromancy" but i guess i cant get away by using any "canon" material, so i am just left off to the homebrew.

As a final parting question tho: If a worshipper of a deity is philosophically vaining away from a deity, would or could another deity or a servant of such deity pick up this character and yet not reveal its true indentity? ( In my case would be a ex-Urgothoa that slowly vain away from the evil of Urgotha and rather go into the territory of Pharasma and the cleric just takes the divine gift as "the spirits guide me" type of deal ) or is that mostly in the highly unlikely situations or even impossible due to how the faith system work?

So with that, thank you for answering my questions even tho i still think the divinities are a bit "solid" considering that deities for the most part doesnt care.

The idea of a deity "poaching" a worshiper is one that folks seem to be particularly interested in. Not sure why. I suppose it's possible, but that's a slippery slope. Players don't always react well to the GM telling them that what they thought was true about their character is not true... you have to know your players well and know their temperament and acceptance of GM tinkering before you do that.

As for deities not caring... that's true for a couple of deities, mostly the Outer Gods like Azathoth and Yog-Sothoth, but the VAST MAJORITY of deities actually DO care about their worshipers.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

chavamana wrote:
Dracoknight wrote:
i personally think in a world as big as Golarion would have a space for the odd "Cleric-but-not" kind

I believe that is what the oracle does in non-home-brew.

James, what is your favorite doughnut from Voodoo Doughnuts and have you ever been to the independent bookstore right near their Seattle location?

The bavarian creme is really good, but the bacon maple bar is the reason to go there.

And if you mean Powell's World of Books... then absolutely!


Well I kind of figured the Ilee would be a monster race with racial HD but it doesn't make them any easier to stat up since they can very so much in there form and probably abilities as well. It would be like the build rules for animated objects but for living creatures.

Silver Crusade

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber
James Jacobs wrote:
Archpaladin Zousha wrote:

Hey, what Inner Sea nation's army would have soldiers that most closely resemble Rome's legions? You know, short sword and heavy wooden shield combo with a few javelins and lorica segmentata armor?

And on an unrelated note, what AP would you say deals most closely with themes related to time? Of things like inevitability and wanting to erase the past but being unable to do so? I was listening to this song and the chorus got me wondering:

"Forlorn faces running from the cold regret,
Empty spaces something that I can't forget.
All I wanted was to wish the past away,
but time's the cruelest ruler that we all obey."

Ancient Taldor, I suppose. Especially when Taldor was a much larger nation. There's not a direct correlation, but you could fake it by being Taldan I suppose.

You seem to have a lot of questions about how to build real-world historical characters in Golarion, and that's just not something you're going to be able to find perfect answers to. We take inspiration from numerous real-world historical eras, but we deliberately change things around so that you can't really play a "perfect Roman" in Golarion and not be out of place. You'd need to play a game set in Rome for that.

We don't really do much of time themes, but I guess Second Darkness is the one that does so the most.

But real world historical figures are what inspire me. I find fantasy novel characters feel very "generic" to base characters on. They all have the same trappings. The same robes, the same kinds of armor, the same kinds of weapons. Going off real world stuff looks and feels a lot more unique. What do I do?


With mythic spell focus it can makethe target roll twice and take the lowest save, how does that work with rerolls?


James Jacobs wrote:

The idea of a deity "poaching" a worshiper is one that folks seem to be particularly interested in. Not sure why. I suppose it's possible, but that's a slippery slope. Players don't always react well to the GM telling them...

Interesting character flavor i guess or a way for a character to silently change a deity and that the GM and the player have to collerbrate how to work this out, in my situation i am just not sure what deity that fits. Even tho despite the evil descriptor Urgothoa is one of the gods that cherish the ones that respect death in some aspect, even tho the worshipper not neccesary relish in the glutton part of her, she is certianly the "lesser evil" of the evils if i read the material from the deity books correctly.

On the other hand, it could be a interesting NPC plot that a powerful cleric have been corrupted and "poached" by a deity or a lesser force that mimmick that of a cleric for its own good, an example might be a overzealous Cleric of X that is so into the agenda of his god that the methods doesnt matter and thus slowly vain away from the philosophy and then picked up by something less...friendly.

If a GM plan to do a similar thing to players without a warning before the game starts that it actually can happen i would say thats kinda unfair on the players part, maybe it would be a plotpoint or just locations that such connections could be intercepted ( in the case of altars of philosophical similar deities ) or corrupted ( in the case of altars of hostile deities )

Those are the ideas i manage to get out of the topic for now, "poaching" wasnt a word that i orginally thought of when i was thinking of this, but it would make a whole lot more sense that evil deities would attempt to "poach" powerful allies to themselves or corrupt the champions of other deities due to the reason they care. So if anything knowing that the deities care about their worshippers actually opens more possibilities than it closes.

Well, that was quite the ramble, hope that i might have hit an idea of interest for you JJ or anyone else reading.


Starfinder Superscriber
chavamana wrote:
Dracoknight wrote:
i personally think in a world as big as Golarion would have a space for the odd "Cleric-but-not" kind

I believe that is what the oracle does in non-home-brew.

James, what is your favorite doughnut from Voodoo Doughnuts and have you ever been to the independent bookstore right near their Seattle location?

Sorry to butt in here, but WHERE IN SEATTLE is this hidden!? Must know!

Sczarni

If a mage (or arcane-duelist bard) takes a quarterstaff as his bonded item, can he enchant it as a stave?


Hi James, I was wondering if you could solve a little conundrum for me. There are two conflicting rules for Alter self.

One is the spell itself.

The other is listed under Polymorph under Transmutation in the magic section.

For clarification purposes, does Alter self if I want to say, turn into a lizard folk grant me +5 Natural Armor, the +2 for polymorphing into a medium creature, the swim speed, and the natural attacks?

Or does Alter self only grant me +2 Strength and a Swim speed? (As polymorph spells state, I would also technically gain the ability to breathe underwater while swimming, but Lizardfolk only have hold breath, so would I gain that instead? this is to the above as well)

EDIT/PS: I'm sorry if this was already asked. There are a LOT of posts in this thread, many about Alter self and I haven't found this particular question broached with clarity!

EDIT 2: I'm not asking you to pick one or the other. I'm more looking for the RIGHT answer, what was intended and should be gleaned from it. There are a lot of rules monkeys on these forums and at every gaming table.


Archpaladin Zousha wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:
Archpaladin Zousha wrote:

Hey, what Inner Sea nation's army would have soldiers that most closely resemble Rome's legions? You know, short sword and heavy wooden shield combo with a few javelins and lorica segmentata armor?

And on an unrelated note, what AP would you say deals most closely with themes related to time? Of things like inevitability and wanting to erase the past but being unable to do so? I was listening to this song and the chorus got me wondering:

"Forlorn faces running from the cold regret,
Empty spaces something that I can't forget.
All I wanted was to wish the past away,
but time's the cruelest ruler that we all obey."

Ancient Taldor, I suppose. Especially when Taldor was a much larger nation. There's not a direct correlation, but you could fake it by being Taldan I suppose.

You seem to have a lot of questions about how to build real-world historical characters in Golarion, and that's just not something you're going to be able to find perfect answers to. We take inspiration from numerous real-world historical eras, but we deliberately change things around so that you can't really play a "perfect Roman" in Golarion and not be out of place. You'd need to play a game set in Rome for that.

We don't really do much of time themes, but I guess Second Darkness is the one that does so the most.

But real world historical figures are what inspire me. I find fantasy novel characters feel very "generic" to base characters on. They all have the same trappings. The same robes, the same kinds of armor, the same kinds of weapons. Going off real world stuff looks and feels a lot more unique. What do I do?

Don't sweat it, IMO. Your character was never going to be a perfect analogue anyway, right? Just come as close as you can, then add whatever extra flavor seems appropriate.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Archpaladin Zousha wrote:


But real world historical figures are what inspire me. I find fantasy novel characters feel very "generic" to base characters on. They all have the same trappings. The same robes, the same kinds of armor, the same kinds of weapons. Going off real world stuff looks and feels a lot more unique. What do I do?

Maybe your problem is in the lack of diversity in your fantasy reading. To me, the characters of Mercedes Lackey, Ursula LeGuin, J.R.R. Tolkien, and Tracy and Hickman all look and dress very different from each other. Try to ignore the illustrations of the front covers, that pool tends to be more narrow.

Silver Crusade

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber
LazarX wrote:
Archpaladin Zousha wrote:


But real world historical figures are what inspire me. I find fantasy novel characters feel very "generic" to base characters on. They all have the same trappings. The same robes, the same kinds of armor, the same kinds of weapons. Going off real world stuff looks and feels a lot more unique. What do I do?
Maybe your problem is in the lack of diversity in your fantasy reading. To me, the characters of Mercedes Lackey, Ursula LeGuin, J.R.R. Tolkien, and Tracy and Hickman all look and dress very different from each other. Try to ignore the illustrations of the front covers, that pool tends to be more narrow.

I haven't read a proper fantasy novel in months! I've been too busy with Total War: Rome II and juggling three jobs and sleep.

Do elves sleep in Golarion? I heard a rumor that that was true.

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