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I am pleased to see that we share our vision on how worshipping evil deities or entities work. If you are successful at it you get a reward in the afterlife. If you fail you get a form of punishment. It is not a straight "be evil, be punished in the afterlife". Otherwise in a universe where you actually know that there is a afterlife the number of people doing evil things would be way lower than what we see in Golarion or most fantasy universes.
It's also the way things work if you worship a neutral or good or chaotic or lawful deity.
Excel, and you are rewarded. Fail, and you are punished. Whether or not you succeed or not is decided by Pharasma.
What about Hell, though? Isn't hell a torment for...well, everyone? Even if they are successful, in order to even become a devil, much less rise up to new heights, they'd suffer years of torment to transform. Thank you for answering, it cleared up a lot
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What about Hell, though? Isn't hell a torment for...well, everyone? Even if they are successful, in order to even become a devil, much less rise up to new heights, they'd suffer years of torment to transform. Thank you for answering, it cleared up a lot
Hell can be a torment for anyone, but is not a torment for everyone.
In fact, if you fail at being a worshiper of a good deity or a lawful deity or any deity, you could well end up being punished in Hell. It varies, depending on a lot of circumstances.
And remember... it's not just souls from Golarion that we're talking about—it's the souls of all creatures in the universe (aka the Material Plane) and beyond. There could well be entire worlds out there that are nothing more than "farms" for souls to go to Hell, for example.
What about Hell, though? Isn't hell a torment for...well, everyone? Even if they are successful, in order to even become a devil, much less rise up to new heights, they'd suffer years of torment to transform. Thank you for answering, it cleared up a lotHell can be a torment for anyone, but is not a torment for everyone.
In fact, if you fail at being a worshiper of a good deity or a lawful deity or any deity, you could well end up being punished in Hell. It varies, depending on a lot of circumstances.
And remember... it's not just souls from Golarion that we're talking about—it's the souls of all creatures in the universe (aka the Material Plane) and beyond. There could well be entire worlds out there that are nothing more than "farms" for souls to go to Hell, for example.
Is it possible for a mortal to go to Pharasma's Court and come back? Can you plane shift there? Would she then decide to judge you negatively if you did go there?
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Is it possible for a mortal to go to Pharasma's Court and come back? Can you plane shift there? Would she then decide to judge you negatively if you did go there?
Pharasma's Court is in the Boneyard—the Boneyard is the Neutrally-aligned outer plane. You can visit it as easily as you can visit any outer plane, and can visit Pharasma's Court as easily as you can visit any deity's realm on an outer plane.
Pharasma does not judge folks negatively if they visit her realm, or even if they cause trouble there. After all... if you worship, say, Zyphus or one of the Horsemen or Urgathoa and spend your life doing things her religion hates, and even go to the Boneyard and cause problems... when you die and are judged, she'll judge you fairly. If you upheld your faith's beliefs well, you might end up in a favored position among the Horsemen or Zyphus or Urgathoa or whatever.
The same cannot be said of her followers or of psychopomps who might meet you along the way, and who might take significant steps to prevent your death from allowing you to escape punishment...
Fascinating. Can the souls there talk to others? Could mortals use the standard magic to converse with them?
I really wish my Trial of the Beast book wasn't 20 miles away, or else I'd be reading about her right now :(
So to my understanding, unless you excel at worshiping your good aligned god, Pharasma will punish you, possibly send you to hell? Does that mean the commoners of the realms get punished in the afterlife because they couldn't do some great deed in the name of their god, or convert large numbers of people to their religion or some other such act that would count as 'excelling' in their worship?
What happens to those people that worship more than one god? It's always kind of struck me as odd that in a polythestic setting, everyone only worships one god. I've always done my best to counteract that, like with my current wizard that is a scholar and item enchanter, worships aspects of Irori, Torag, and Nethys, but also reveres nature and worships Gozreh.
[Edit] It occurs to me that the Pathfinder religions kind of sound like the Greek religions. Heroes went to Elysium, villians/sinner went to Tartarus, but everyone else spent eternity in Purgatory doing... nothing.
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Fascinating. Can the souls there talk to others? Could mortals use the standard magic to converse with them?
They can.
Mortals don't need magic to converse with souls in line waiting to be judged... but they might need magic to pick out which one of the countless souls in line is the one they're looking for.
I was thinking in terms of a spellcaster going there just to *learn* everything they could from the souls, especially those from planets those of Golarion have barely even heard of. The magic I was referring to was mostly Comprehend Languages :)
That's really cool.
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So to my understanding, unless you excel at worshiping your good aligned god, Pharasma will punish you, possibly send you to hell? Does that mean the commoners of the realms get punished in the afterlife because they couldn't do some great deed in the name of their god, or convert large numbers of people to their religion or some other such act that would count as 'excelling' in their worship?
What happens to those people that worship more than one god? It's always kind of struck me as odd that in a polythestic setting, everyone only worships one god. I've always done my best to counteract that, like with my current wizard that is a scholar and item enchanter, worships aspects of Irori, Torag, and Nethys, but also reveres nature and worships Gozreh.
[Edit] It occurs to me that the Pathfinder religions kind of sound like the Greek religions. Heroes went to Elysium, villians/sinner went to Tartarus, but everyone else spent eternity in Purgatory doing... nothing.
No... if you don't excel but don't fail, you don't get sent on to be punished. You merely get sent on to your appropriate plane to become a petitioner, as normal.
There's essentially 3 fates (but even then, that's a gross oversimplification)...
Excel: You are granted a great reward in the afterlife, such as being granted a role in your deity's court, or transformation into a powerful outsider.
Normal: You are sent on to the appropriate plane to become a petitioner. In time, you may become an outsider. You may not. You may end up getting killed. You may not.
Fail: You are sent on to an appropriate punishment. This might last forever. It might be temporary, followed by a time of "purgatory" where you might be able to escape. You might even be rescued by allies who follow your soul and rescue it from its fate.
If you worship more than one god, Pharasma makes the call as to where you end up going. That usually means that she looks at your personality and accomplishments and all that and makes a judgement as to what region on what outer plane your soul would most likely deserve to go to. If you have a character who worships Irori, Torag, Nethys, and Gozreh, and then you die, Pharasma would look at your accomplishments during your life, your personality, and how you present yourself before her when you're being judged. You might end up going to one of those deity's realms, you might go to a different deity's realm, you might go to a non-deity outer planar region, you might end up being reincarnated, you might end up going to Hell, and so on.
NOTE: When I say "Pharasma decides," that's code for "The GM gets to decide."
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If I get the gist of it, Pharasma will judge how "true to yourself" you are and then and you to a proper reward/punishment.
That could change if you have made some kind of compact with an outer planar entity. Even if you are NG, if you have made a pact with a devil, selling your soul for some kind of boon, even for the best reason possible and even if you have prevented the devil from twisting that to evil ends, you sill end in the devil hands, not to the destination meant for a NG soul.
Right?
Speaking of pacts in which you sell your soul, what happen if you die, you are judged by Pharasma and your soul is sent to Hell, so fulfilling your pact, and then your friends come and rescue you? The bargain has been completed and so the next time you die your soul go to his proper reward/punishment? Or the pact is reactivated when you get back on Golarion?
If I get the gist of it, Pharasma will judge how "true to yourself" you are and then and you to a proper reward/punishment.
That could change if you have made some kind of compact with an outer planar entity. Even if you are NG, if you have made a pact with a devil, selling your soul for some kind of boon, even for the best reason possible and even if you have prevented the devil from twisting that to evil ends, you sill end in the devil hands, not to the destination meant for a NG soul.
Right?Speaking of pacts in which you sell your soul, what happen if you die, you are judged by Pharasma and your soul is sent to Hell, so fulfilling your pact, and then your friends come and rescue you? The bargain has been completed and so the next time you die your soul go to his proper reward/punishment? Or the pact is reactivated when you get back on Golarion?
You might want to check out the contract devil monster listing in B3 (I think). It's quite insightful on all these questions. I'll hush now and defer to J.J.
So would it be more common on Golarion for individuals to worship one god, or do they leave offerings/sacrifice/pray to multiple gods based on their need at the time and that gods sphere of influence? For example leave an offering to Adabar before an important meeting, then later that week one for Pharasma after a friend passed away etc.
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If I get the gist of it, Pharasma will judge how "true to yourself" you are and then and you to a proper reward/punishment.
That could change if you have made some kind of compact with an outer planar entity. Even if you are NG, if you have made a pact with a devil, selling your soul for some kind of boon, even for the best reason possible and even if you have prevented the devil from twisting that to evil ends, you sill end in the devil hands, not to the destination meant for a NG soul.
Right?Speaking of pacts in which you sell your soul, what happen if you die, you are judged by Pharasma and your soul is sent to Hell, so fulfilling your pact, and then your friends come and rescue you? The bargain has been completed and so the next time you die your soul go to his proper reward/punishment? Or the pact is reactivated when you get back on Golarion?
True to yourself, true to your fate, true to your beliefs...
And with a heavy dose of "humans don't get the process anyway because they're not gods, and so some of the choices she makes might seem arbitrary or even cruel to humans."
If your friends come and rescue you after you've been judged, Hell will be more pissed off at you than Pharasma... who will herself not approve of your bold act.
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So would it be more common on Golarion for individuals to worship one god, or do they leave offerings/sacrifice/pray to multiple gods based on their need at the time and that gods sphere of influence? For example leave an offering to Adabar before an important meeting, then later that week one for Pharasma after a friend passed away etc.
Whether or not worshiping one deity versus multiple deities is more common depends entirely and significantly on the region you're talking about.
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I noticed you stated that demon worshipers who do well at their demon worshiping (who are chaotic evil monsters their whole lives) become demons upon death.
Do any other of the alignments have an "auto-advancement" like that?
All of them do.
It's very very very very rare for that type of auto-advancement to happen, regardless of alignment.
1)What class(or classes) Old-mage Jatembe and his 10 magic warriors were?
2)Will Blood of Angels have info on the Aasimar of Tianjing?
3)I know James Sutter worked on Distant Worlds but did he design any of the races/monsters from the book? if so does he work on any of the monsters from the Innersea Bestiary?
4)What movies have seen lately? Did you like any of them?
5)If and when you guys do more books dealing with the planes of existant(outer, inner, material, etc.) what has been errated or changed from the older sources?
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1)What class(or classes) Old-mage Jatembe and his 10 magic warriors were?
2)Will Blood of Angels have info on the Aasimar of Tianjing?
3)I know James Sutter worked on Distant Worlds but did he design any of the races/monsters from the book? if so does he work on any of the monsters from the Innersea Bestiary?
4)What movies have seen lately? Did you like any of them?
5)If and when you guys do more books dealing with the planes of existant(outer, inner, material, etc.) what has been errated or changed from the older sources?
1) Old Mage Jatembe was a wizard, as revealed in Inner Sea Magic (although we accidentally left the "G" off his "NG" alignment, alas...). We haven't said anything more about his ten magic warriors.
2) Some info, yes.
3) James Sutter wrote all of "Distant Worlds." He's also writing some monsters in the Inner Sea Bestiary (he's on the author list for that book, after all...).
4) Lately I've seen 3 Seattle International Film Festival movies...
- John Dies at the End Pretty good, plus the director, Don "Phantasm/Beastmaster/Bubba Ho Tep" Coscarelli was there to do a Q&A session.
- Thale: An absolutely awesome Norwegian movie about... Spoiler:...two guys hired to clean up a dead body in the woods and while on the job find a huldra kept prisoner in a creepy underground bunker!
- V/H/S: A found-footage anthology movie, which does something that few anthology movies do—all five stories plus the wraparound story were VERY good! The six shorts were about... Spoiler:A zombie, a succubus, a serial killer, weird forest spirits/aliens, body horror/ghosts (filmed entirely on Skype!!!!), and a demonic haunted house.
Chernobyl Diaries: Pretty fun! Very moody and spooky.
And a few movies courtesy of Netflix...
- A Lonely Place to Die: Quite good. A bunch of mountaineers/hikers in remote Scotland come across a rusty pipe sticking out of the ground, from which they can hear a child crying for help in a strange language...
- Antarctic Journal: South Korean film about a group of explorers making an expedition to the Pole of Inaccessibility on Antarctica... and the closer they get, the weirder things start happening. Kind of slow at spots but periodically spooky, hampered by WRETCHED subtitles.
- Crimson Rivers: French; Cool serial killer type movie starring Jean Reno.
- Pontypool: BRILLIANT movie! The less you know about this one, the better. It's a low budget horror movie that's absolutely creepy and innovative.
- The Tunnel: Australian; cool found footage movie about journalists investigating abandoned tunnels under Sydney. Spoiler:There might just be a morlock type critter down there.
- The Innkeepers: Really effective slow-burn haunted hotel movie.
5) Until we do more books about the other planes, nothing has changed. In fact, nothing is likely to change in any significant or even noticeable way... apart from being more detailed the more books we do on the subject.
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John Dies at the End? How was that, if you've read the book was it faithful?
I'm about halfway through the book.
Now... keep in mind some things:
1) The book is about 3 times the size of the movie's screenplay.
2) The movie is pretty low-budget.
That said, the movie seems really rather faithful to the book. The bulk of the movie is actually a pretty faithful adaptation of the first 3rd of the book, in fact—it's very heavily weighted toward what happens before...
There is a question regarding Phantom Steed. The question revolves around whether it is a spell with a couple specific vulnerabilities or if it is a creature.
The three current viewpoints are:
A) Phantom Steed is a spell-effect with hitpoints but can only be targeted by attacks that are specifically described in the spell description (ie: attacks against AC).
B) Phantom Steed is a spell-effect with hitpoints but can be targeted by any attack that damages hitpoints (including area attacks). If hit by an area attack it automatically fails it's save.
C) Phantom Steed creates a creature with hitpoints and thus suffers any attacks (including area attacks) that a creature can suffer.
Any advice would be appreciated as always.
- Gauss
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There is a question regarding Phantom Steed. The question revolves around whether it is a spell with a couple specific vulnerabilities or if it is a creature.
The three current viewpoints are:
A) Phantom Steed is a spell-effect with hitpoints but can only be targeted by attacks that are specifically described in the spell description (ie: attacks against AC).
B) Phantom Steed is a spell-effect with hitpoints but can be targeted by any attack that damages hitpoints (including area attacks). If hit by an area attack it automatically fails it's save.
C) Phantom Steed creates a creature with hitpoints and thus suffers any attacks (including area attacks) that a creature can suffer.
Any advice would be appreciated as always.
- Gauss
The answer is B.
Sorcerer is supposed to be rarer than wizard and oracle rarer that cleric. Is there a general estimate of the ratio of these classes to each other and the overall population?
Oracle: Cleric
Sorcerer: Wizard
Druid: Other divine classes
Witch: Other arcane classes.
And any other bits you you know about the rarity of Magi and Summoners would be good to. Thanks.
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So would it be more common on Golarion for individuals to worship one god, or do they leave offerings/sacrifice/pray to multiple gods based on their need at the time and that gods sphere of influence? For example leave an offering to Adabar before an important meeting, then later that week one for Pharasma after a friend passed away etc.Whether or not worshiping one deity versus multiple deities is more common depends entirely and significantly on the region you're talking about.
It´s very common to worship the Orishas around where i live, so i could say that i live in a modern pantheistic society. People recognize everyone from the pantheon as important and as having a important task, so you can pray to any of them their help in their fields (or to evil gods to have mercy) but you have a "godfather" god who look after you. If you could choose your zodiac sign, it would function very similar to how some people treat their patron god.
There is this sort of divine relationship in Golarion ? There is any Orishas mythos influence on Golarion ? African mythology is so rich, but so underrepresented in RPGs.|
Creative Director
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Sorcerer is supposed to be rarer than wizard and oracle rarer that cleric. Is there a general estimate of the ratio of these classes to each other and the overall population?
Oracle: Cleric
Sorcerer: Wizard
Druid: Other divine classes
Witch: Other arcane classes.And any other bits you you know about the rarity of Magi and Summoners would be good to. Thanks.
I'm not sure where you might get the idea that sorcerers are supposed to be rarer than wizards or that oracles are supposed to be rarer than clerics. Both of those depend heavily on the exact region you're talking about.
Which goes for ALL classes, really.
Summoners and gunslingers are really the only two classes that would be considered to be rare in most every region, although gunslingers are a bit more common in the Mana Wastes. Summoners USED to be more common in Sarkoris... but then the Worldwound happened, and now summoners are rare everywhere.
Note that "class rarity" has no effect whatsoever on PC choices. It only really has an effect on our printed adventures and what classes NPCs have in those adventures, so it's not something anyone else other than Paizo developers ever really has to worry about.
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It´s very common to worship the Orishas around where i live, so i could say that i live in a modern pantheistic society. People recognize everyone from the pantheon as important and as having a important task, so you can pray to any of them their help in their fields (or to evil gods to have mercy) but you have a "godfather" god who look after you. If you could choose your zodiac sign, it would function very similar to how some people treat their patron god.
There is this sort of divine relationship in Golarion ? There is any Orishas mythos influence on Golarion ? African mythology is so rich, but so underrepresented in RPGs.
I'm sure there are divine relationships like that in Golarion. We've actually drawn upon African mythology quite a lot for APs like Serpent's Skull... but I've never heard of Orishas so that's likely why you've not seen much like that in Golarion.
Speaking of pacts in which you sell your soul, what happen if you die, you are judged by Pharasma and your soul is sent to Hell, so fulfilling your pact, and then your friends come and rescue you?
Your party members will die horribly one by one. First to the giant behirs, then to the coup-de-graces, then by the rhemmoraz. Two groups will die trying to get Mephistopholes' truename only to instead awaken the demon-lord himself, whose aspect (the BBEG) was acting in his stead.
At least, that was my campaign. Take it from me. So not worth it. :P
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I'm sure there are divine relationships like that in Golarion. We've actually drawn upon African mythology quite a lot for APs like Serpent's Skull... but I've never heard of Orishas so that's likely why you've not seen much like that in Golarion.It´s very common to worship the Orishas around where i live, so i could say that i live in a modern pantheistic society. People recognize everyone from the pantheon as important and as having a important task, so you can pray to any of them their help in their fields (or to evil gods to have mercy) but you have a "godfather" god who look after you. If you could choose your zodiac sign, it would function very similar to how some people treat their patron god.
There is this sort of divine relationship in Golarion ? There is any Orishas mythos influence on Golarion ? African mythology is so rich, but so underrepresented in RPGs.
What James is mentioning is the Wendo, who are described in PF #39 (Path of Juju), and are Golarion's equivalent to the Orishas. Orishas, or Orixas, have some overlap with the Loa/Lwa of Haiti and Louisiana. All these are Afro-Caribbean gods who possess their followers. Are you in South Florida?
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Mr. Jacobs,
Is there any plan to add any feats to the two weapon fighting feat tree such as Oversized Two Weapon fighting or Improved Two weapon Defence from 3.5 ? I was wondering as I hoped to get more options(for classes such as the paladin)other than the increased number of attacks from the other feats in the tree.
Thanks for any input.
Jim
No plans that I'm aware of. That style of fighting, despite the fact that we have an iconc who fights with an oversized weapon, is actually pretty incendiary when it comes to feedback—it makes folks angry.
I remember there were some things from the great beyond book and some other older books and articles that was said to have changed. An example would be you do not like "time elementals" and do not want to have them even though it is the Great Beyond book. This what I ment about changes and erata dealing with this book. I know there were more things then this but I can't remember off the top of my head.
Are there any changes to these older books and articles you can think of that has been changes? wether the changes are monsters/characters/items/places that no longer exist, how the planes function, etc.
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I'm sure there are divine relationships like that in Golarion. We've actually drawn upon African mythology quite a lot for APs like Serpent's Skull... but I've never heard of Orishas so that's likely why you've not seen much like that in Golarion.
Please then, if you have the time, do know a bit more about them. Yoruba myhtology is near as rich and interesting as greek mythology and combine very much with the Oracle and Witch classes if someday you have to create more content for southern Garund.
And do you know about the Guarani culture ? It has nice element to compose eventual southern Arcadia civilizations and also have a lot o material researched from Brazil on the net.
I'm sure there are divine relationships like that in Golarion. We've actually drawn upon African mythology quite a lot for APs like Serpent's Skull... but I've never heard of Orishas so that's likely why you've not seen much like that in Golarion.Please then, if you have the time, do know a bit more about them. Yoruba myhtology is near as rich and interesting as greek mythology and combine very much with the Oracle and Witch classes if someday you have to create more content for southern Garund.
And do you know about the Guarani culture ? It has nice element to compose eventual southern Arcadia civilizations and also have a lot o material researched from Brazil on the net.
Here here on that. I loved what they did with Tian Xia and I cannot wait for the eventual Arcadian Gazetteer. I personally hope to see some of the Taino people's mythology and culture represented a bit in addition to the larger Mesoamerican and North/South American civilizations. I know my grandfather, a native from Puerto Rico, used to tell me all kind of stories that had been passed down through generations about several of the spirits and gods that my ancestors believed in.
I do have a question Mr. Jacobs. I know for Tian Xia, you guys came up with several player races for the setting. Have you guys considered doing the same for Arcadia and if so, what would base them on?
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Is waiting in line to be judged by Pharasma like the movie Defending Your Life?
I haven't seen that movie, but no. The word "comedy" would not be used to described waiting in the Boneyard.
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I remember there were some things from the great beyond book and some other older books and articles that was said to have changed. An example would be you do not like "time elementals" and do not want to have them even though it is the Great Beyond book. This what I ment about changes and erata dealing with this book. I know there were more things then this but I can't remember off the top of my head.
Are there any changes to these older books and articles you can think of that has been changes? wether the changes are monsters/characters/items/places that no longer exist, how the planes function, etc.
There's a difference between actively changing something and simply not talking about a subject anymore. There's plenty about Golarion that we won't be talking about in the future that we've mentioned in the past—that doesn't mean that content is gone if you want it in your game, nor does it mean it's been "errataed" out.
The thing I object to about time elementals is merely their name. I'm something of a purist when it comes to elementals—I really pushed hard to not include the four variant elementals (lightning, magma, mud, smoke) from Bestiary 2, because I feel that they not only dilute the four classic elementals, but because they're kind of boring concepts. The time elemental as statted up in 1st edition D&D and more recently in the Tome of Horrors DOES exist in the Great Beyond, but the next time we talk about it, it'll be called something else.
In any case... There have been changes but I'd rather not dwell on them because when I change things for the world, it's because of good reasons (such as the old version was an easter egg of copyrighted material that could have got us sued, or such as the old version was simply a fundamentally bad idea that sneaked into print), and I would rather they fade into obscurity rather than continue to be talked about.
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So in Golarion its possible for a caster to teleport into a plane and talk to a god? Like talking to Shelyn or Asmodeus?
No, because teleport does not allow a spellcaster to cross from one plane to another.
You could, in theory, use plane shift or gate to achieve that goal... but deities have the power to redirect such approaches, so you'd only be able to talk to a deity like this if the deity wants to talk to you. In most cases they'd prefer you to use commune.
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Here here on that. I loved what they did with Tian Xia and I cannot wait for the eventual Arcadian Gazetteer. I personally hope to see some of the Taino people's mythology and culture represented a bit in addition to the larger Mesoamerican and North/South American civilizations. I know my grandfather, a native from Puerto Rico, used to tell me all kind of stories that had been passed down through generations about several of the spirits and gods that my ancestors believed in.I do have a question Mr. Jacobs. I know for Tian Xia, you guys came up with several player races for the setting. Have you guys considered doing the same for Arcadia and if so, what would base them on?
I suspect that more details on some of those cultures being translated into Golarion will need to wait for us to do more work on Southern Garund or on Arcadia. So it'll be while.
But when we do, we WILL be adding more new races drawn from the mythologies of those cultures.
1. Can an Witch Cackle (Su) underwater?
2. What about with 25-feet of Stone and Earth between you? Basically do you need line-of-effect?
3. Does the target of your cackle need to be able to hear you? (E.g. you or your target inside a Silence)
I heard you on the Know Direction podcast...its awesome to put a voice to your messageboard avatar.
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1. Can an Witch Cackle (Su) underwater?
** spoiler omitted **
2. What about with 25-feet of Stone and Earth between you? Basically do you need line-of-effect?
3. Does the target of your cackle need to be able to hear you? (E.g. you or your target inside a Silence)
I heard you on the Know Direction podcast...its awesome to put a voice to your messageboard avatar.
1) Yes.
2) You need line of effect for pretty much everything. I can't think of an exception, really.
3) Technically, no, but making cackle something that requires hearing does make a lot of sense.
I think Scrying spells aren't intended to need line of effect.
James I know I asked this question months back but now with Shattered Star on the horizon, can you please tell me if there will be at least one Rune Giant in Shattered Star. You see I will be getting multiple Rune Giant minis and would love to use them in multiple APs.
I think Scrying spells aren't intended to need line of effect.
Also the teleport spells.