Ok,
This has come up and I am confused on the answer, in the past I have allowed you to take a five foot step as long as that is ALL of your movement, even if you have made a standard attack. I have a player who is saying that you can only make a five foot step if you commit to a FULL ROUND action.
The scene was an archer who had been rushed by a player, the archer on his initiative took a five foot step back and fired at the player. WE consulted the rules and after a bit of discussion I started to believe what he was saying. NOW though I am questioning it again and would love the help of the Pathfinder community to help me out here.
Thanks in advance...
Ok,
This has come up and I am confused on the answer, in the past I have allowed you to take a five foot step as long as that is ALL of your movement, even if you have made a standard attack. I have a player who is saying that you can only make a five foot step if you commit to a FULL ROUND action.
The scene was an archer who had been rushed by a player, the archer on his initiative took a five foot step back and fired at the player. WE consulted the rules and after a bit of discussion I started to believe what he was saying. NOW though I am questioning it again and would love the help of the Pathfinder community to help me out here.
Thanks in advance...
He is correct. You can take a 5 foot step any time on your turn as long as you have not already moved
If you are making a full attack action you can even take one in between attacks.
Unless they changed it from 3.5 to pathfinder (I dont think they did). you can take a 5ft step during any round that you didnt actually move. Even if you used a move action such as drawing a weapon so long as you didn't actually move. So for example if you draw your sword (move action) and attack (standard action) you can still take a 5ft step before or after.
Thanks so much, I appreciate everyone answering so quickly!
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Yeah, as long as you don't take any other 'movement'. Attacks are definitely fine (5 foot step and Point Blank Shot are an archer's saving grace in melee).
As long as what you are fighting does not have the "Step Up" Feat. Played a Barbarian with both Step up and the "No Escape" rage power. was a great fun combo.
So for example if you draw your sword (move action) and attack (standard action) you can still take a 5ft step before or after.Of course, if your BAB is at least +1 then you can draw your sword while moving...
"If you have a base attack bonus of +1 or higher, you can
combine one of these actions with a regular move. If youhave the Two-Weapon Fighting feat, you can draw two light
or one-handed weapons in the time it would normally take
you to draw one."
most people with common sense do take a regular move to be the move that uses a move action and not a 5 foot step.
The tricky thing, though, is when you take your 5-foot step first. If all you do after that is a standard action, the rules say you're pretty much rooted to that spot. That is, you cannot take a 5-foot step in the same round in which you have moved; ergo, you cannot move in the same round in which you have taken a 5-foot step.
My players always hated this. In their minds, they could shift over a little, do something cool, and then hightail it; it always rankled them that the rules forced them to be sitting ducks when they got through.
(slightly different topic)
Considering the archer who wants to back up and fire or the wizard who wants to get off a spell in combat, if they elect to take a 5-foot step to avoid someone's AoO, they cannot thereafter move, allowing their foe to take a 5-foot step and wail on them with a full-attack action. It often is a poor trade. If, however they elect to actually move their speed, they provoke an AoO (which may cause the wizard's spell to fail). Of course, they can "withdraw" but that means foregoing the attack or spell... It's a tough spot to be in no matter what.
Question answered so I won't do it again. Just wanted to agree that Step Up is frikkin' awesome. Took it for my PF pally playing in a Red Hand of Doom conversion. Enemy spellcasters *hate* it...so does my GM I think, because she has to remember that her guys don't know that my guy can do that.
M
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The tricky thing, though, is when you take your 5-foot step first. If all you do after that is a standard action, the rules say you're pretty much rooted to that spot. That is, you cannot take a 5-foot step in the same round in which you have moved; ergo, you cannot move in the same round in which you have taken a 5-foot step.
My players always hated this. In their minds, they could shift over a little, do something cool, and then hightail it; it always rankled them that the rules forced them to be sitting ducks when they got through.(slightly different topic)
Considering the archer who wants to back up and fire or the wizard who wants to get off a spell in combat, if they elect to take a 5-foot step to avoid someone's AoO, they cannot thereafter move, allowing their foe to take a 5-foot step and wail on them with a full-attack action. It often is a poor trade. If, however they elect to actually move their speed, they provoke an AoO (which may cause the wizard's spell to fail). Of course, they can "withdraw" but that means foregoing the attack or spell... It's a tough spot to be in no matter what.
The "can't move if you already used 5' step" rule is obviously to prevent abuse, but can be thought of as "this movement is actually taking a good portion of the round, but is a slow non-obvious advance" if it bothers you that much.
The "I move a little, shoot, then move more" would be shot on the run coupled with an acrobatics check, but still possible. Ducking away from combat quickly enough to get away, but still participating in it AND doing so without leaving yourself open SHOULD take some effort. If you just want to get away, then use a full withdrawal (full-round, lets you do a double move, first square of movement doesn't provoke).As for the second bit, a wizard can do a move, take the AoO, then cast without failure (as long as they're still up). The attack has to occur DURING the spell casting to have a chance to interrupt it. The archer/wizard can trade attack/spell for attack by doing this if they have acrobatics (move at half speed, which is still more than 5 ft forcing the opponent to use a move action). Sure, acrobatics is not a guarantee, but if you invest in it heavily it can be pretty close. Being an archer/wizard this situation should be an exception, not the rule, so having an imperfect defense against it is expected.
If you look under Actions in the Combat Section of the book you will see the Move heading. That's where it say what you can do with a 5' step.
Here it is from the PRD
"If you move no actual distance in a round (commonly because you have swapped your move action for one or more equivalent actions), you can take one 5-foot step either before, during, or after the action."
Here it is from the PRD
"If you move no actual distance in a round (commonly because you have swapped your move action for one or more equivalent actions), you can take one 5-foot step either before, during, or after the action."
In other words, this means you can, in a turn (that is not a full-round attack) take 1 (one) Move Equivalent Action, 1 (one) Standard Action, 1 (one) Swift Action, and then a 5-Foot Step. Also any free actions that you wish to use.
In other words, this means you can, in a turn (that is not a full-round attack) take 1 (one) Move Equivalent Action, 1 (one) Standard Action, 1 (one) Swift Action, and then a 5-Foot Step. Also any free actions that you wish to use.Here it is from the PRD
"If you move no actual distance in a round (commonly because you have swapped your move action for one or more equivalent actions), you can take one 5-foot step either before, during, or after the action."
Just to clarify:
"and then a 5-Foot Step" makes it sound like it has to be last, which is not the case at all; it can be taken any time in the round.
Also, you could take (two) Move Equivalent Actions if you take (zero) Standard Actions.