If I can shamelessly swipe a thread idea from Super Genius....
I was toying around with the possibility of adapting the Pathfinder rules to an original science-fiction setting (reminiscent of Star Frontiers -- the whole late-70s/early-80s classic space opera kinda vibe). The question, of course, is whether there would be any interest in such a thing.
To be clear-- this would be a rulebook with an included setting. Using it as a toolbox to run your own settings (ala d20 Future) wouldn't be the main focus, but could be adapted by any reasonable clever GM. The focus would be on presenting a solid SF game, based on the Pathfinder iteration of the rules, tailored to the specific feel I mentioned above.
So whaddaya think -- worth pursuing?
Interest? Sure. But I worry about the multiple proliferation of different kinds of toolkits when there hasn't been a base standard for said PF Modern/Sci-Fi in place. Being one of the louder voices, it was my thought that someone would tackle that to set a base standard and then other 3PPs can work off of that and add their own tweaks for their own campaign setting.
Before Owen/Hyrum spoke up, I actually named dropped you guys back then about throwing a collective hat in. Personally, I'd love to see multiple 3PP collaborators so as to spread the ideas and costs about to make it a reality. *shrug* But that's me. :)
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If I can shamelessly swipe a thread idea from Super Genius....
So whaddaya think -- worth pursuing?
If the setting had a compelling hook and, to be honest with myself, good visuals, I'd buy it. For me, the setting is more important than the rules, and late 70s/early 80s SF is within my range of interest, but not near the core without knowing more detail. Star Frontiers/Space Opera might strike my fancy, but it's a broad genre, and not all of it is to my taste.
Even more important to me are some good scenarios and the likelihood of continued published scenarios. I'm probably an anomaly, but for me scenarios > setting > rules.
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1. We're in the OGL business, swiping is the norm. And, that was FAR from the most shameless swipe I've seen. :D
2. Heck, -I'd- be interested.
3. If our P20 Modern book gets funded, we'll be happy to work with any 3pp who wants to be compatible with us. OTOH, it might be better for fans if talented designers (including GMS) each do their own take. That increases the pool of good OGL ideas, and I suspect everything would remain compatible enough for cross-game use anyway. You'd just have more base systems to choose to use as your core rules, then add whatever modules you wanted from the works of others.
Besides, publishers rarely want to be dependent on each other...
Gareth, I'm so interested that I've already been working on one for my use ;) Any chance that you're looking for help? ;)
I'd love to see a space opera game compatible with Pathfinder (rather than D20 Modern/Future) and reminiscent of Star Frontiers. It would also be great if it was streamlined (like the soon-to-be ended Star Wars: Saga Edition line), had robust support, and provided enough generic rules for character/alien/vehicle/world creation so that Game Masters could adapt it for other science fiction settings (like DragonStar or Trek) and homebrews.
For me, the setting is more important than the rules,
here, here. I completely agree and to me, Star Frontiers had just that. It was a lot of fun and I had some good times with that game way back when
Frankly, I think WoTC made a mistake going with Gamma World as a new setting/game instead of Star Frontiers
Most definitely interested.
If I can shamelessly swipe a thread idea from Super Genius....
I was toying around with the possibility of adapting the Pathfinder rules to an original science-fiction setting (reminiscent of Star Frontiers -- the whole late-70s/early-80s classic space opera kinda vibe). The question, of course, is whether there would be any interest in such a thing.
To be clear-- this would be a rulebook with an included setting. Using it as a toolbox to run your own settings (ala d20 Future) wouldn't be the main focus, but could be adapted by any reasonable clever GM. The focus would be on presenting a solid SF game, based on the Pathfinder iteration of the rules, tailored to the specific feel I mentioned above.
So whaddaya think -- worth pursuing?
Potentially interested (it's rather likely, though). I'd need a little more detail on the setting.
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I am interested.
But so much hangs on the setting that will flavor the mechanics.
Look at the light year differences of how you (or at least I) play these games:
- Star Frontiers (IMHO still the best Space Opera themed game ever!)
- Dark Heresy/ogue Trader
- Traveller
So, if you propose Grim and Gritty, I am out, I have that with WH 40k.
If you propose the "realistic" far future, I am out, I have that with Traveller.
But if you propose somthing like the Star Frontiers setting -a sandbox open enough for almost everything- I am in.
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Personally i would love to see a d20 futures game using some of pathfinders idea's.
Of course how interested i would be would depend on the type of setting it supports in the end. Me personally I like hard scifi games. So i am curious what your ideas for it are so far, I mean beyond the Star Frontiers reference.
Well, based on "thread activity" as an indicator, the answer to the question posed in the title appears to be:
"Not Much."
:D
I think it has to do with the timing, Gareth. Perhaps if you gave it some of the LPJ hype machine and give us a taste of your concept, it may cause the thread to move a bit more.
EDIT: And whatever happened to the Fell Beasts series that was supposed to be coming out weekly or every other week? It seemed to have stopped at only three releases.
If I can shamelessly swipe a thread idea from Super Genius....
I was toying around with the possibility of adapting the Pathfinder rules to an original science-fiction setting (reminiscent of Star Frontiers -- the whole late-70s/early-80s classic space opera kinda vibe). The question, of course, is whether there would be any interest in such a thing.
There is interest in this over at The Piazza, where someone has started up a thread called [Adamant] Pathfinder Sci Fi Game in their Pathfinder forum. That is how I found out about this thread.
You may want to hunt around in case other forums are discussing this too.
To be clear-- this would be a rulebook with an included setting. Using it as a toolbox to run your own settings (ala d20 Future) wouldn't be the main focus, but could be adapted by any reasonable clever GM. The focus would be on presenting a solid SF game, based on the Pathfinder iteration of the rules, tailored to the specific feel I mentioned above.
So whaddaya think -- worth pursuing?
I think this is worth pursuing, but I think a lot of love needs to be put into this if you are going to "nail it".
I never played Star Frontiers or Gamma World or any of those games. But my roleplaying group did once do an experimental game using d20 Modern and d20 Future as a "toolbox" for a game set in our bespoke Virtual Eclipse Science Fiction universe.
I've got to say that, while we were very excited about the idea, I found d20 Modern to be a very unsatisfying system. I was hoping for D&D Modern, but the game was very soulless as far as I was concerned.
If you are going to do "Pathfinder RPG in Science Fiction Space", I think you really need to do something that is far more compatible than WotC's effort. Ideally, people should be able to use all Pathfinder RPG sourcebooks with your game without needing to do any conversions.
I think that every system is useless without a setting, so it is good that you want to make a setting too. But I would be pessimistic about the ability to fit both a setting and a toolbox into one book. I suppose that WotC's Oriental Adventures is a model of how this could work, but with Paizo themselves making a RPG book and a campaign setting book, that would seem to be a more attractive long term objective to me.
One thing about space games, is that a GM needs to add planets. I'm a fan of Spelljammer (TSR's fantasy space D&D setting) and there is constantly talk in the Spelljammer community about how other campaign worlds could be pulled into the setting (as places for a ship to visit).
During the 3e era Dragonstar came out and did something a bit similar to what you are thinking of doing (although it was more of a fantasy thing) and I think the fact that it was not a one-shot is proof that this concept has legs.
But again, Dragonstar was unsatisfying, because its closed nature (i.e. the fact that it had PI) meant that we did not get a host of crossover Dragonstar products to connect that game to other games.
If you were going to make a game, I would want to know that it was probable that other publishers would share your system. And if you were going to make a campaign setting, I would want to know that I could "dock" other Pathfinder compatible settings onto your own campaign setting.
I think that your biggest rival would be Traveller (which now has an SRD-like document that allows other people to make compatible games). I think that you would need to do that sort of thing. If I was going to have another crack at bringing Virtual Eclipse to the RPG table, I would want to have a toolbox that I could access easily. And if your system is less open that Traveller, it would be much harder to use than that system. Online SRD-like documents (like the Pathfinder Resource Document) allow people to link to things from forums and emails, as well as allowing people to reprint rules, with house rules integrated into them.
I think you should talk to Battlefield Press, Inc, about their forthcoming Crystal Spheres line. They are trying to make a line of space settings that can be used with a variety of different systems (including both science fiction and fantasy). I think that Jonathan M. Thompson might be able to tweak his stuff, so that it would also work as solar systems that people in your sci-fi setting could visit. Or perhaps you could work together to make a conversion document (if one is needed).
I was very excited by this idea, when I saw it over at The Piazza. But as a Spelljammer fan, my initial thought was: are we going to get a "Pathfinder in Space SRD" out of this? With just one book, I'm not sure you could afford to make provision for the rules needed to allow fantasy fans to explore the planets of Golarion's planetary system. But if this was something that could expand, then maybe, one day, there could be a Space 1889-like game or even a Spelljammer-like game.
I do think that a Pathfinder Science Fiction game would be a great thing to do. But, if you are going to go for this, please please please make it 100 percent compatible with the fantasy game (rather than a Pathfinder-ised d20 Future) and please please please (even if you don't have space for it in the core product) build this in such a way that it could be used for fantasy Pathfinder space games.
3. If our P20 Modern book gets funded, we'll be happy to work with any 3pp who wants to be compatible with us. OTOH, it might be better for fans if talented designers (including GMS) each do their own take. That increases the pool of good OGL ideas, and I suspect everything would remain compatible enough for cross-game use anyway. You'd just have more base systems to choose to use as your core rules, then add whatever modules you wanted from the works of others.
Besides, publishers rarely want to be dependent on each other...
Same comment goes to you. Please make this more integrated with the main Pathfinder rules, than d20 Modern was with D&D. I would want to be able to mix and match things without having to do any converting.
By all means create new classes, but if I want to run a modern game with gods, I want to be able to drop clerics in and use the main Pathfinder rules.
For me, the setting is more important than the rules,here, here. I completely agree and to me, Star Frontiers had just that. It was a lot of fun and I had some good times with that game way back when
I think that settings are vital. One of the reasons I've never really liked d20 Modern was that it never felt like a setting. There was some stuff, but it was on the level of the sort of Greyhawk-lite thing that was going on in core D&D. And with no grognoid-products to fall back on (like Greyhawk had) the setting just seemed totally two dimensional.
Like I said before, I think I would like to see a goal of separate rules and setting (although maybe a combined product would be a necessary stepping stone).
And I think that if this setting was pulled out (into a separate product) Adamant should do a similar thing to what has been done with Freeport and make a Traveller-compatible book. (And this is an "as well" thing - not an "instead of" thing.)
I think there would be a lot of people interested in either half of this project. It would be good to be able to support both things separately, like Green Ronin have done.
Frankly, I think WoTC made a mistake going with Gamma World as a new setting/game instead of Star Frontiers
Couldn't WotC do both (i.e. Star Frontiers next year)?
I think the problem with a sci-fi game is in setting-dependence. if we could get a good generic scifi system, that would be awesome, but a specific setting does a lot to limit itself, especially if its not a major IP already.
I would want both things. A generic toolbox and a universe that comes with a set of planets (or a set of solar systems) and a set of organisations that live in that universe.
I am interested.
But so much hangs on the setting that will flavor the mechanics.Look at the light year differences of how you (or at least I) play these games:
- Star Frontiers (IMHO still the best Space Opera themed game ever!)
- Dark Heresy/ogue Trader
- TravellerSo, if you propose Grim and Gritty, I am out, I have that with WH 40k.
If you propose the "realistic" far future, I am out, I have that with Traveller.
But if you propose somthing like the Star Frontiers setting -a sandbox open enough for almost everything- I am in.
I agree that science fiction is far to big a thing for one book that does everything.
But suppose this started off with a Star Frontiers setting (that was sandbox like), but then (if it sold enough) went on to have a second Traveller-like campaign setting, a third Dark Heresy/Rogue Trader-like campaign setting, a fourth Spelljammer/Dragonstar-like setting and so on.
This could potentially go in dozens of directions (like the D&D campaign settings did) and (if there is an SRD that publishers and fans embrace) build a future where science fiction games are more compatible than they are now.
I think it has to do with the timing, Gareth. Perhaps if you gave it some of the LPJ hype machine and give us a taste of your concept, it may cause the thread to move a bit more.
I would second that request. I think that science fiction gaming is a really big area and that it has never really had a single system that could bring together all the possible types of sci-fi. I think that Traveller comes very close to that, but it is not quite as flexible as the WotC SRD is.
Well, based on "thread activity" as an indicator, the answer to the question posed in the title appears to be:
"Not Much."
:D
Well, I'm interested and I was interested in a similar proposal from Sinister Adventures.
I'd certainly like a d20 Sci Fi game based on the Modern/Future SRD. I would like it to be reasonably backwards compatible to d20 Modern as Pathfinder is to D&D3.5.
As for the setting, I think it shounds spot on. In fact, I think I mentioned in the Pathfinder Modern thread that I thought that a Star Frontiers style setting would work well for an implied default.
Jim.
So i have a question (Assuming anyone is still reading this thread) But you originally proposed a Pathfinder future game. Now personally i would like one that does not have magic (psionics ok, im a little weird that way.) I have been mulling over and working on a [pathfinder future game. I was just curious if anything else has been done with this?
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Our Necropunk setting is scifi and the core system modifications (skill swaps, tech levels, zero-g combat, etc) would probably work for any scifi game you were looking to put together. If someone wanted to use those core rules as a basis for a more generic scifi game, there could chose a worse place to start I think.
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Well, based on "thread activity" as an indicator, the answer to the question posed in the title appears to be:
"Not Much."
:D
Well, I'm interested and I was interested in a similar proposal from Sinister Adventures...
Jim.
Now that it's been mentioned, I've still got all the material from that, formerly Sinister, space opera-exploration sandbox-horror setting. Copyright is mine. Even have some commissioned art.
I pull it out and tinker every now and then, so the writing is about 70-80% done. Feel free to contact me if you ever have an interest...
Just saying...
I have mixed feelings myself. I mean, I loved Star Frontiers, but I got it in the mid 80s and I had been growing up with the late 70's, early 80's sci-fi shows. I do like that sort of setting, my group of friends made up several of our own settings along that sort of vibe. If this is all that I would get from it, I MIGHT get stuff to mine for ideas or tor transplant into a different game system.
However, I did not like Modern d20 or Future d20. This is where my hesitation comes in. I would much prefer a system that is based on Pathfinder and not those other two (in my opinion) failed systems. Even the first edition of d20 Star Wars was a lot more playable than either of those baseline toolkits.
So echoing the others on the list, the game mechanics framework is a serious concern. Apparently some people love the Modern and Future toolkits, maybe even a lot of people. In many cases the classes could just be archetypes or modifications to existing classes.
The gun rules could use some revision, though. :)
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Wasn't Warlords of the Apocalypse in fact bought from Adamant?
WotA was originally a project from Adamant, and they ran into various problems with it. Super Genius Games acquired it from Adamant, and I began working on it for an overhaul and expansion, and to meet what I thought a sci-fi/modern Pathfinder expansion needed.
When I left SGG, I took WotA with me to rogue Genius games. It's going to take me a bit to finish handling RGG paperwork and set-up, but getting back to serious work on WotA is near the top of my to-do list.
My intention is to create an apocalyptic rules set that is 100% Pathfinder compatible.
Depends.
A Traveler/Space Opera type RPG with lots of detail, but still generic enough to run any type of campaign (SW, ST, B5, BS, etc)? BRING IT ON!
Something along the lines of Spelljammer, with absolutely no adherence to hard science and just some piss-poor 'space fantasy', then NO.
I would also definitely be interested in a near-future, post-apocalypse ruleset as well.
I am a big fan of Darwin's World. Its only flaw in my opinion is that it was based on the d20 Modern, which meant that it was not worth playing from the get-go.
As I mentioned above, the d20 Star Wars was good, and my group switched over to the revised edition as soon as it was published (we were not that annoyed to buy it again).
I would love for a Pathfinder sci-fi system that allowed me to play both of those. As mentioned, some companies have already started publishing sci-fi for Pathfinder. Little Red Goblin Games, EN Publishing, and Space Potato Productions. I am sorry if I missed someone, but those are the three that I can think of that have products that I own.
Tripod Machine decided to test this concept, and we had a successful Kickstarter for Conquest of the Universe, a space opera setting. It is currently under development; I plan to have a playtest packet done soonish.
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Our Necropunk setting is scifi and the core system modifications (skill swaps, tech levels, zero-g combat, etc) would probably work for any scifi game you were looking to put together. If someone wanted to use those core rules as a basis for a more generic scifi game, there could chose a worse place to start I think.
dont forget the new social combat rules. I know at least one guy who bought it just for that.
I am shocked in this age of KICKSTARTER and revivals that the Powers that Be have not tried to revive STAR FRONTIERS... or Alternity
Wow -- holy thread necromancy!
Just as an update to this nearly 4-year old thread: We're actually considering pursuing this. It would not be a generic rules set, but rather a branded setting, as I stated.
The setting (working title: "Void Lords") would be a mix of late-70s/early-80s classic space opera feel with Spelljammer-esque "fantasy in space" races and such -- making it more applicable to Pathfinder players.
It would not be as gonzo "giant-hamsters and sailing-vessels in space" as Spelljammer, but neither would it be "Grimdark Chaos Elves vs Quasi-Fascist Space Paladins" like Warhammer 40K.
The setting would be an homage to space fantasies of my childhood and adolescence in the 70s/80s , but with Pathfinder races as alien species, and magic (treated in this setting as something akin to The Force ).
When I start working on a project, I use Pinterest to assemble a collection of visual inspirations -- if you're curious you can check out the Void Lords Pinterest board here: http://www.pinterest.com/gmskarka/space-fantasy/
I have actually recently published a Pathfinder Compatible scifi /fantasy sourcebook.
However, being a new publisher coming out of nowhere, I have not been able to get any reviews yet. Does anyone in this thread know who might be willing to review my book?
Excellent, thanks. Someone else recommended that just now. =) I will now commence working up the courage.
I'm just planning to wait on the content from Numeria, and then adjust as needed.
-Ben.
Since this seems to be a good place to ask questions... Would people prefer (if Psionics were in a SciFi game) The new Psionics created by Dreamscarred Press or an original formula?? Granted classes will be original creations, but still...
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Whether or not a new system was devised, I would use Dreamscarred's version regardless.
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I am down for good future rules. d20 Future & Apocalypse had some good stuff in it. I just used core classes for a setting I ran for almost a year. But true PF friendly setting would be great.
RPG Superstar 2008 Top 32, 2011 Top 16
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I'd like to see whatever setting is developed for a Pathfinder based SF game to have a flavor that is compatible with what we know about aliens, spaceships, and the solar system of Golarion. Of course the actual solar system couldn't be used, but in terms of the technologies that exist, it would be great to have something that worked with the crashed ship in Numeria, and used the monsters that are open content that are identified as aliens.
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I never liked the way D20 Modern was set up but I really liked the supplements for D20 Future, Apocalypse, Past and Cyberscape settings. I wanted to marry all those together for a massive Star*Drive campaign but it was too much work. I would love to have a PF supplement that addresses how to handle the elements of SF with the PF rules. I hope the Iron Gods AP opens this can of worms and gives us an idea of where to go. I fear that Piazo will take the "a laser pistol is just a wand of scorching ray" route that completely short changes the awesome technology of science fiction. I don't want full blown tech manuals and layouts like BattleTech. Just a good selection of gear from various tech levels from early Info Age to Far Future that is easily modifiable. Throw in some pointers on how to run a SF campaign with the various SF genres and you've got my money!
SM
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I'd like somethingD20 sci-fi that left the choice of different flavors of sci-fi to the DM.
I'd like clear cut, but different and still 'feels D20' rules for power armor, mecha, space fighters and capital vessels.
I'd like options for hard science (pivot turns and such) and science fantasy (x-wings fly like aerodynamic bodies, even though there's no air or gravity, etc.) in the combat rules.
I'm not saying no fluff, or even no campaign setting info, I'm just saying in order for a book to be of use to me at my table, it has to have all of those options in order for me to be on-board.
I don't like going between different books by a bunch of publishers (and rules) just because I want bits and pieces of different flavors of sci-fi in my games.
One solid ruleset. Please.
It also has to be 100% compatible with existing PF.
What if I want to run a dragonstar-like game? When the dudes in space armor descend on the locals with magic armor and weapons, I don't want to have to finagle much to get it to work.