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Q: What are the feats that will work with Spell Perfection?
I've searched the boards and found snippets of insight but nary an official response from a developer. I'm hoping to collect all knowledge re: Spell Perfection in one thread...
These are questions you should bring to the rules boards so that folks can hit the FAQ button.
The description says “if you have other feats which allow you to apply a set numerical bonus to any aspect of this spell (such as Spell Focus, Spell Penetration, Weapon Focus [ray], and so on), double the bonus granted by that feat when applied to this spell.” The uncertainty is with the definitions of:
● set
● numerical
● bonus
● any aspect
Can these terms be defined with respect to Spell Perfection?
Q: What are the other feats that will work with Spell Perfection? From various threads it looks like the contenders are:
● Augment Summoning: +4 → +8 STR/CON [Spell Perfection would only apply to one specific Summon Monster spell.]
● Bloodmage Initiate: +1 DC → +2 DC [same effect as Spell Focus, which is specifically mentioned as allowed]
● Elemental Focus: +1 → +2 DC [same effect as Spell Focus, which is specifically mentioned as allowed]
● Mage's (Varisian) Tattoo: +1 → +2 CL [similar effect as Spell Focus, which is specifically mentioned as allowed]
● Spell Focus: +1 DC → +2 DC [allowed]
● Spell Focus, Greater: +1 DC → +2 DC [lessor version allowed]
● Spell Penetration: +2 → +4 [allowed]
● Spell Penetration, Greater: +2 → +4 [lessor version allowed]
● Spell Specialization: +2 → +4 CL [similar effect as Spell Focus, which is specifically mentioned as allowed]
● Superior Summoning: +1 → +2 # of creatures
● Tenacious Transmutation: +2/+1 → +4 CL vs Dispel/+2 rounds Duration
● Weapon Focus (ray): +1 ATK → +2 ATK [ allowed]
● Weapon Focus, Greater [ray]: +1 ATK → +2 ATK [lessor version allowed]
● Weapon Specialization (ray): +2 → +4 DAM [similar effect as Weapon Focus, which is specifically mentioned as allowed]
● Weapon Specialization, Greater (ray): +2 → +4 DAM [similar effect as Weapon Focus, which is specifically mentioned as allowed]
● Witch Knife: +1 → +2 DC [same effect as Spell Focus, which is specifically mentioned as allowed]
Metamagic: separated because of speculation they may not be allowed at all (except for the initial, free, metamagic):
● Burning Spell: +x2 → +x4 spell LVL DAM
● Empower Spell: 50% → 100% DAM
● Enlarge Spell: x2 → x4 Range
● Extend Spell: x2 → x4 Duration
● Focused Spell: +2 → +4 DC vs one target
● Heighten Spell: +X → +2*X DC
● Intensified Spell: +5 → +10 LVL cap
● Piercing Spell: +5 → +10 SR
● Tenebrous Spell: +1 → +2 CL/DC
● Widen Spell: x2 → x4 Area
I am still looking into this, and this is a totally unrelated issue really, but of note..
I am not sure that Spell Perfection and Heighten Spell work together in any way. Spell Perfection prevents a spell from having its level increased by a metamagic feat, and that is really all that Heighten Spell does. Without the level increase, Heighten Spell does not do anything.
Still investigating..
I don't have a problem with Spell Perfection as a whole. I do have a problem with using it with Heighten Spell. Its kinda ridiculous.
Looking into it..
How does this spell combine with other metamagic feats and using higher-level slots for lower-level spells?]Heighten Spell is worded poorly and can be confusing. It lets you use a higher-level spell slot for a spell, treating the spell as if it were naturally a higher level spell than the standard version. Unlike Still Spell, which always adds +1 to the level of the spell slot used for a spell, Heighten Spell lets you decide increase a spell's level anywhere from +1 to +9, using a spell slot that is that many spell levels higher than the normal spell.
The language implies that the heightened spell uses whatever spell level is used to prepare or cast it, but the rules text was inherited from 3.5 and doesn't take into account (1) the normal rule allowing you to prepare a spell with a higher-level spell slot, and (2) combining it with other metamagic feats.
For (1), having Heighten Spell doesn't mean any spell you cast with a higher-level slot is automatically heightened; you still have to make the decision to prepare or cast the spell an normal or heightened.
If you are a non-spontaneous caster (such as a cleric or wizard) who wants to prepare a lower-level spell in a higher-level slot, there is no reason not to use Heighten Spell on that spell (it doesn't cost you any extra time or any other game "currency").
If you are a spontaneous caster, heightening a spell when using a higher-level spell slot still increases the casting time, just like any other use of metamagic, so you have to weigh the benefits of either
• casting it normally using the higher-level slot
vs.
• increasing the casting time to cast it as a heightened spell and treat the spell as the level of the spell slot you're using.
Example A 10th-level sorcerer could cast fireball using a 3rd-, 4th-, or 5th-level spell slot, it would only be a standard action casting time, would count as a 3rd-level spell, and have a DC of 13 + Charisma bonus. If she had Heighten Spell and wanted to heighten it using a 4th- or 5th-level spell slot, it would have a full-round action casting time, but would count as a 4th- or 5th-level spell and have a DC of 14 + Cha bonus (for a 4th-level spell) or 15 + Cha bonus (for a 5th-level slot).For (2), you can't apply Heighten Spell to a spell at no cost:[/B] any increase to the effective spell level of the spell must be tracked and paid for by using a higher-level spell slot, above and beyond any other spell level increases from the other metamagic feats.
Example:[/B] A 15th-level wizard has Quicken Spell. If he prepares a quickened fireball, that requires a 7th-level spell slot (fireball 3rd level + quicken 4 levels). The spell's DC is still 13 + his Int bonus because it's still just a 3rd-level spell, even though it's in a 7th-level spell slot. If he also has Heighten Spell, the spell is not automatically heightened; it still counts as a 3rd-level spell and has the DC of a 3rd-level spell. If he wants to increase the quickened fireball's effective level with Heighten Spell, he needs to use an even higher level spell slot than the adjusted spell level from the Quicken Spell feat. Increasing the fireball's effective spell level by +1 (from 3rd to 4th) requires using a spell slot +1 level higher (in this case, an 8th-level spell slot instead of a 7th-level slot); increasing the fireball's effective spell level by +2 (from 3rd to 5th) requires using a spell slot +2 levels higher (in this case, a 9th-level spell slot instead of a 7th-level slot).Another way to look at (2) it is to add Heighten Spell first, then other metamagic feats. Continuing the above example, you'd first heighten the fireball to a 4th-level spell, then quicken it, which requires an 8th-level spell slot (fireball 4th level + quicken 4 levels). Or first heighten the fireball to a 5th-level spell, then quicken it, which requires a 9th-level spell slot (fireball 5th level + quicken 4 levels).
(Heighten Spell is a weak metamagic feat and has limited utility when combined with other metamagic feats.)
I agree that Heighten Spell should not be compatible with Spell Perfection, because it doesn't provide a numerical bonus as such, and I'm happy with the reasoning that the cost of Heighten spell is inherently irreducible.
Widen Spell might be *3 instead of *4 because of the doubling rules?
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I agree that Heighten Spell should not be compatible with Spell Perfection, because it doesn't provide a numerical bonus as such, and I'm happy with the reasoning that the cost of Heighten spell is inherently irreducible.
Widen Spell might be *3 instead of *4 because of the doubling rules?
I think Jason Bulmahn's past comments indicate Heighten can't be used for the free metamagic feat but it should still be able to be applied (at cost) to the spell. In that case it would be a set numerical bonus (i.e., +X DC) - wouldn't it?
I think you're correct on the doubling rules (my bad).
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Q: What are the feats that will work with Spell Perfection?
I've searched the boards and found snippets of insight but nary an official response from a developer. I'm hoping to collect all knowledge re: Spell Perfection in one thread...
** spoiler omitted **
The description says “if you have other feats which allow you to apply a set numerical bonus to any aspect of this spell (such as Spell Focus, Spell Penetration, Weapon Focus [ray], and so on), double the bonus granted by that feat when applied to this spell.” The uncertainty is with the definitions of:
● set
● numerical
● bonus
● any aspectCan these terms be defined with respect to Spell Perfection?
Q: What are the other feats that will work with Spell Perfection? From various threads it looks like the contenders are:
** spoiler omitted **...
A set numerical bonus is a +x to some aspect of the spell where X is an integer. So most of the metamagic feats you list are not affected by spell perfection.
Basically, Focused and Tenebrous Spell are, the rest no. At first glance, you would thing Intesified Spell would work, but the bonus is not actually set, its a range of 1-5 depending on your level, so spell perfection doesnt apply. Piercing Spell doesnt apply because it is a penalty on the target rather than a bonus to the caster. All the rest are generally of the form of X*Y, so they are not affected.
Regarding Intensified Spell, you are incorrect:
Intensified Spell (Metamagic)
Your spells can go beyond several normal limitations.Benefit: An intensified spell increases the maximum number of damage dice by 5 levels. You must actually have sufficient caster levels to surpass the maximum in order to benefit from this feat. No other variables of the spell are affected, and spells that inflict damage that is not modified by caster level are not affected by this feat. An intensified spell uses up a spell slot one level higher than the spell's actual level.
That looks awful lot like a specific number.
Spell Perfection on it would change that line to:An intensified spell increases the maximum number of damage dice by 10 levels.
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A set numerical bonus is a +x to some aspect of the spell where X is an integer.
That's one way to read it. Mathematically, x2 is also a set numerical bonus. If a developer would clarify if this is addition only (versus addition/multiplication) that would help.
At first glance, you would thing Intesified Spell would work, but the bonus is not actually set, its a range of 1-5 depending on your level, so spell perfection doesnt apply.
I disagree. +5 is a "set numerical bonus" - even if you can't fully use it.
Piercing Spell doesnt apply because it is a penalty on the target rather than a bonus to the caster.
I see your point - and it's been presented multiple times in other threads. This is where "any aspect of this spell" has to be clarified. Piercing Spell changes an aspect of the spell, expressed in terms of the target's SR. (Or, at least that's one way to look at it without a Developer clarification.)
Undead Master would work going from +4 to +8.
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● set
Static, unchanging, non-modular, set in stone
● numerical
relating to numbers as opposed to relating to conditions(fatigued) or effects(character is killed).
● bonus
as opposed to malus, beneficial, increase, all from your point of view.
● any aspect
anything the spell effects in the above ways.
that's my two coppers.
Bonus is a defined term within Pathfinder:
If it doesn't fall under that definition, then Spell Perfection simply does not apply.
I worry that the devs will not only clarify this situation, but will also apply an overeaching nerf because of this thread. Therefore, let's stay on topic. This is about getting clarification on one singular aspect of Spell Perfection, not whether it is balanced or anything else. Create another thread for that.
well writen question with good references.
FAQ'd
x2 is not a set numerical bonus, its a set numeric modifier. Its bonus will vary widely depending upon the starting number. +2 is a set bonus...it is not reliant on the starting number to accomplish anything.
So, any feat which has a multiplier effect is not viable for Spell Perfection.
Heighten spell does not have a set numeric bonus...the effect is chosen at the time of use, and actually isn't even a bonus. That makes it neither set nor a bonus, and ineligible for the feat.
A feat that added +1 dmg/die would also not be eligible. It's a set number per die, but not a set number for each and every spell. Weapon Specialization is clearly a fixed number for each and every spell.
Of the Metamagic feats listed in the OP, only Intensify Spell has a set benefit that would qualify for Spell Perfection. Whether the language is 'proper' for it to qualify is another argument...numerically, it's good. I will also note that a viable way of writing the feat is "Damage Dice Cap for a spell +5 caster levels", which is clearly a fixed bonus. Note that the Metamagic cost is a cost, not a bonus.
Nice catch with Undead Master.
The other feats would all seem to be eligible. I would suggest listing Weapon Focus (Ray) and Greater Weapon Focus (Ray) as +1 TH instead of +1 ATK, however.
A good list, I'll dot it as a favorite for a reference point.
==Aelryinth
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Incorporated feedback/observations – especially WRT the definition of BONUS. Please continue to mark the original post as a FAQ candidate if you’d like to see a developer clarify Spell Perfection.
Bonuses are numerical values that are . Most Bonuses have a type, and as a general rule, Bonuses of the same type are not cumulative (do not “stack”) — only the greater Bonus granted applies.
Elemental Focus: +1 → +2 DC
Focused Spell: +2 → +4 DC vs one target
Spell Focus: +1 → +2 DC
Spell Focus, Greater: +1 → +2 DC
Spell Penetration: +2 → +4 CL check vs SR
Spell Penetration, Greater: +2 → +4 CL check vs SR
Weapon Focus (ray): +1 TH → +2 TH
Weapon Focus, Greater (ray): +1 TH → +2 TH
Weapon Specialization (ray): +2 → +4 DAM
Weapon Specialization, Greater (ray): +2 → +4 DAM
Witch Knife: +1 → +2 DC
≠ Empower Spell: 50% → 100% DAM
≠ Enlarge Spell: x2 → x3 Range
≠ Extend Spell: x2 → x3 Duration
≠ Intensified Spell: +5 → +10 LVL cap
≠ Undead Master: +4/x2 → +8 HD (animate dead)/x3 Duration (Command Undead)
≠ Widen Spell: x2 → x3 Area
● Augment Summoning: +4 → +8 STR/CON
● Bloodmage Initiate: +1 → +2 CL
● Burning Spell: +x2 → +x3 spell LVL DAM
● Heighten Spell: +X → +2X DC
● Mage's (Varisian) Tattoo: +1 → +2 CL
● Piercing Spell: +5 → +10 SR
● Spell Specialization: +2 → +4 CL
● Superior Summoning: +1 → +2 # of creatures
● Tenebrous Spell: +1/-2 → +2 CL/DC / -4 versus Dispel
● Tenacious Transmutation: +2/+1 → +4 CL vs Dispel/+2 rounds Duration
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On one hand, it seems to me the doubling was intended to only apply to non-metamagic feats. All 3 feats given as examples are not metamagic and the word "other" may mean "other" than "any metamagic feat", not other than the one you picked. I think this is really a FAQ candidate, did they mean non metamagic or not? I always thought they did, but apparently others disagree.
So if that is true, then I wouldn't allow Piercing Spell to be doubled, nor Burning Spell, Heighten, Tenebrous etc.
I am not sure about Augment Summoning, since the bonuses do not modify the spell, they modify the creatures you summon.
Superior Summoning ... I suppose yes , since the # of creatures could be considered an aspect of the spell just like damage is.
Spell Specialization .. I suppose yes. I can see it either way, but I think the tie would go to the player. At 15th level getting +2 more levels is not something I'd consider game breaking enough to worry about.
for undead master, +8 HD to your cap is a static caster level bonus limited to controlling undead.
Duration x3 does not, however, qualify.
==Aelryinth
Spell Perfection plus spell spec and stuff is the entire basis behind the Master Blaster to increase the caster level of your favorite spell. Can't hit that CL 25 hit dice cap without them caster level boosts!
==Aelryinth
Spell Specialization .. I suppose yes. I can see it either way, but I think the tie would go to the player. At 15th level getting +2 more levels is not something I'd consider game breaking enough to worry about.Combining it with the **Word spells is crazily effective. Varisian Tattoo and Spell Specialisation give you a CL21 Holy Word at level 15. Add in a necklace of prayer beads and you are looking at CL25.
Muahahahaha! CL27 Holy Words.
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Other means other than spell perfection.On one hand, it seems to me the doubling was intended to only apply to non-metamagic feats. All 3 feats given as examples are not metamagic and the word "other" may mean "other" than "any metamagic feat", not other than the one you picked. I think this is really a FAQ candidate, did they mean non metamagic or not? I always thought they did, but apparently others disagree.
...
I assume you mean other than spell perfection AND the feat you picked. (otherwise you'd double the feat you picked to get for free, if it applied a set numerical bonus).
Why do those who think other metamagic feats could be doubled think so? It looks to me RAI is other than metamagic, mainly due to their examples.
Also I'm not sure why some think you can't get Heighten spell free like this, as long as you don't go above 9th level.
I have a master abjurer who can actually use greater dispel magic VERY effectively thanks to that caster level increase. I would never have considered playing a dispeller otherwise.
Other means other than spell perfection.On one hand, it seems to me the doubling was intended to only apply to non-metamagic feats. All 3 feats given as examples are not metamagic and the word "other" may mean "other" than "any metamagic feat", not other than the one you picked. I think this is really a FAQ candidate, did they mean non metamagic or not? I always thought they did, but apparently others disagree.
...I assume you mean other than spell perfection AND the feat you picked. (otherwise you'd double the feat you picked to get for free, if it applied a set numerical bonus).
Why do those who think other metamagic feats could be doubled think so? It looks to me RAI is other than metamagic, mainly due to their examples.
Also I'm not sure why some think you can't get Heighten spell free like this, as long as you don't go above 9th level.
Name the set, unchanging bonus that Heighten provides.
Hint: You can't, because it doesn't grant a bonus, nor does the effect it does provide fixed. It fails on both counts.
==Aelryinth
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I agree with that, but I did not mean for the "double" effect of a set bonus, I meant for the first: "you may apply any one metamagic feat you have to that spell without affecting its level or casting time, as long as the total modified level of the spell does not use a spell slot above 9th level"
It sounded like people were against using Heighten for that as well:
"I think Jason Bulmahn's past comments indicate Heighten can't be used for the free metamagic feat"
I don't see why that would be so, as long as you stay under 9 and stay under/equal a level of spell that you can actually cast. (Unless i totally misread that, and no one objected to applying Heighten for free, just that it could not count for the "in addition, if you have other feats..." phrase)
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It sounded like people were against using Heighten for that as well:
"I think Jason Bulmahn's past comments indicate Heighten can't be used for the free metamagic feat"
I don't see why that would be so, as long as you stay under 9 and stay under/equal a level of spell that you can actually cast. (Unless i totally misread that, and no one objected to applying Heighten for free, just that it could not count for the "in addition, if you have other feats..." phrase)
The quoted comment refers to Jason Bulmahn's past comments on using Heighten with Spell Perfection:
I am still looking into this, and this is a totally unrelated issue really, but of note..
I am not sure that Spell Perfection and Heighten Spell work together in any way. Spell Perfection prevents a spell from having its level increased by a metamagic feat, and that is really all that Heighten Spell does. Without the level increase, Heighten Spell does not do anything.
Still investigating..
I don't have a problem with Spell Perfection as a whole. I do have a problem with using it with Heighten Spell. Its kinda ridiculous.
Looking into it..
My goal isn't to argue the PROs / CONs of a specific viewpoint; it is to have a Developer FAQ Spell Perfection and clarify RAW / RAI. I was making an observation that the Developer comments we have are that the two "may not work together in any way".
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I also wonder how it applies to mythic versions of the feats above.
Example: you have Spell Focus, Mythic Spell Focus, you normally have +2 to the DC.
But with Spell Perfection, would that increase to +4? (double both Spell Focus and the extra 1 from Mythic Spell Focus).
And Spell Focus, Greater Spell Focus, and Mythic Spell Focus, would it increase from +4 to +8 with Spell Perfection?
Can you add that to the list?
I agree we need clarification.
(Thanks, I THINK I see the heighten issue, allowing Heighten would mean the spell slot would be lower than the spell level. Sorry I did not open those 2 dev comments in your original post. )
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I also wonder how it applies to mythic versions of the feats above.
Example: you have Spell Focus, Mythic Spell Focus, you normally have +2 to the DC.
But with Spell Perfection, would that increase to +4? (double both Spell Focus and the extra 1 from Mythic Spell Focus).
And Spell Focus, Greater Spell Focus, and Mythic Spell Focus, would it increase from +4 to +8 with Spell Perfection?
Oh Gods - I hadn't considered Mythic feats...
I've got the book but no experience with the rules set. I'll add what I can figure out and leave it to the other posters to help.
Yeah, pretty sure Heighten and SPell Perfection can't interact. heighten only works if its cast out of slot x. Since using Perfection would mean its not cast out of slot x, nothing would happen.
A nice compromise would be that the spell is Heightened to whatever spell slot it is actually cast out of, if Perfection is applied to the Heighten. but that would require re-wording the feat.
==Aelryinth
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Added:
- feedback/observations
- definitions for Check, DC, Feat, Level, Penalty, SR (included at the bottom of the post)
- created ad hoc definition for Statistical Score
- Fire Magic feat
- Mythic feats: Elemental Focus (Mythic), Fabulous Figments (Mythic), Fire Music, Fire Music (Mythic), Guided Hand (Mythic), Spell Focus (Mythic), Spell Penetration (Mythic), Undead Master (Mythic), Weapon Focus (Mythic), Weapon Specialization (Mythic) (ray), Witch Knife (Mythic)
Please mark the original post as a if you’d like to see a developer clarify Spell Perfection.
Augment Summoning: +4 → +8 STR/CON
Bloodmage Initiate: +1 → +2 CL
Elemental Focus: +1 → +2 DC
Elemental Focus (Mythic): +1 → +2 DC
Focused Spell: +2 → +4 DC vs one target
Mage's (Varisian) Tattoo: +1 → +2 CL
Spell Focus: +1 → +2 DC
Spell Focus, Greater: +1 → +2 DC
Spell Focus (Mythic): +1 → +2 DC
Spell Penetration: +2 → +4 CL check vs SR
Spell Penetration, Greater: +2 → +4 CL check vs SR
Spell Specialization: +2 → +4 CL
Tenebrous Spell: +1/-2 → +2 CL/DC / -4 versus Dispel
Tenacious Transmutation: +2/+1 → +4 CL vs Dispel/+2 rounds Duration
Undead Master: +4/x2 → +8 HD (animate dead)/x3 Duration (Command Undead)
Weapon Focus (ray): +1 TH → +2 TH
Weapon Focus, Greater (ray): +1 TH → +2 TH
Witch Knife: +1 → +2 DC
Witch Knife (Mythic): +1 (+2) → +2 (+4) DC →
≠ Burning Spell: +x2 → +x3 spell LVL DAM
≠ Empower Spell: 50% → 100% DAM
≠ Enlarge Spell: x2 → x3 Range
≠ Extend Spell: x2 → x3 Duration
≠ Heighten Spell: +X → +2X DC
≠ Intensified Spell: +5 → +10 LVL cap
≠ Superior Summoning: +1 → +2 # of creatures
≠ Piercing Spell: -5 → -10 versus SR
≠ Weapon Specialization (ray): +2 → +4 DAM
≠ Weapon Specialization, Greater (ray): +2 → +4 DAM
≠ Weapon Specialization (Mythic) (ray): +1/2 → +tier to DAM → +2*tier to DAM
≠ Widen Spell: x2 → x3 Area
● Fabulous Figments (Mythic): +tier → +2*tier DC versus Identify Spellcraft check
● Fire Music: fire resistance 5 / +1 fire DAM (natural ATK) → fire resistance 5 / +2 fire DAM (natural ATK)
● Fire Music (Mythic): +5 fire resistance / +1d4 fire DAM (natural ATK) → +10 fire resistance / +1d4 fire DAM (natural ATK)
● Guided Hand (Mythic): +WIS DAM → +2*WIS DAM
● Spell Penetration (Mythic): +1/2 tier → +1 tier to CL check
● Undead Master (Mythic): +tier/x2 → +2*tier HD (animate dead)/x3 Duration (Command Undead)
● Weapon Focus (Mythic) (ray): x2 → x3 Bonus from Weapon Focus/Greater Weapon Focus; +1/2 tier → +tier TH (swift; expend Mythic Power use)
- What is the definition of “statistical score” (see below)?
- Are we sure Damage, Spell Damage Dice CAP, Spell Level, Area, Range, Duration, etc., aren’t statistical scores?
- Are there any feats we’ve missed? :-)
A check is a d20 roll which may or may not be modified by another value. The most common types are attack rolls, ability checks, skill checks, and saving throws. Editor’s Note: Includes: To Hit (TH), Caster Level check (CL Check). Does not include: Damage (DAM), Difficulty Class (DC)
Whenever a creature attempts to perform an action whose success is not guaranteed, he must make some sort of check (usually a skill check). The result of that check must meet or exceed the Difficulty Class of the action that the creature is attempting to perform in order for the action to be successful. Editor’s Note: DC is not a Check but Spell Perfection allows modification to DC with the Spell Focus feat. That implies DC is a Statistical Score.
A feat is an ability a creature has mastered. Feats often allow creatures to circumvent rules or restrictions. Creatures receive a number of feats based off their Hit Dice, but some classes and other abilities grant bonus feats. Editor’s Note: no distinction between “regular” feats, metamagic, combat or mythic…
A character's level represents his overall ability and power. There are three types of levels. Class level is the number of levels of a specific class possessed by a character. Character level is the sum of all of the levels possessed by a character in all of his classes. In addition, spells have a level associated with them numbered from 0 to 9. This level indicates the general power of the spell. As a spellcaster gains levels, he learns to cast spells of a higher level. Editor’s Note: is Level a statistical score? There are three defined: Class Levels, Character Levels and Spell Levels. Caster Level equates to Class Level (is it the same)?
● Bonuses are numerical values that are .
● Penalties are numerical values that are .
● The term Statistical Score is not defined in the PRD. It is only referenced in the definitions of Bonus and Penalty.
Definition of “Statistical Score” is key to understanding the nuances of Spell Perfection RAW/RAI. I’ll start a separate thread...
Thanks Pupsocket, Calth, kinevon, Onyxlion, Bandw2, Archaeik, andreww, Ravingdork, Franko a, Aelryinth, Berti Blackfoot and Scavion for weighing in on the subject! […and the 26 folks that have marked it as a FAQ candidate!!!]
It's a bit of a corner case but I believe that taking greater eldritch heritage in the arcane bloodline to gain the arcane sorcerers School Power ability would technically fall under the purview of spell perfection.
It's a bit of a corner case but I believe that taking greater eldritch heritage in the arcane bloodline to gain the arcane sorcerers School Power ability would technically fall under the purview of spell perfection.
Honestly I thought it was cut and dry to begin with but now do we have to consider class abilities gained through feats like Eldridge Heritage?
Agreed. ANd I'm also pretty sure that SPell Perfection shouldn't have any effect on a Mythic Feat.
==Aelryinth
Do trait bonuses apply if you get them through the Additional Traits feat?
why wouldn't they?
==Aelryinth
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if you have other feats which allow you to apply a set numerical bonus to any aspect of this spell
Just my two cents: I'd think the Additional Traits feat doesn't meet the criteria. It is an "other feat" but it does not "allow you to apply a set numerical bonus to any aspect of this spell". The traits it provides might do something but traits do not impact Spell Perfection (regardless of how the trait was acquired).
BTW - does anybody know how many FAQ candidate requests you need for a Developer to weigh in? We have 31 total :-)
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According to the developers, they ALL get answered eventually, though they prioritize which gets answered first based on the number of clicks it gets. In practice though, that means some will never effectively get answered as they are pushed down the queue over and over again. Also, they do prioritize certain issues over others regardless of clicks.
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Another feat to add is Deific Obedience. Some of the Deific Obediences add set numerical bonuses to spells.
For example:
Urgoatha gives +1 CL for all Necromancy spells, at any character level.
Some of the other gods Deific Obedience gives set numerical bonuses to spells at 12, 16 or 20th character level, or earlier if you take the Evangelist prestige class. Some give one of those kinds of bonuses if you take Exalted prestige class (maybe there are some for Sentinel too??)
Another feat to add is Arithmancy. If you make the Spellcraft check you get +1 CL on your spell.
Another feat to add is Outer Planes Traveler. +1 CL with all spells of a certain descriptor.
Another feat to add is Tapestry Traveler. +2 CL to all Teleport subshool spells, and 1 step more familiar in some cases. Useful for Spell Perfection Reach Planeshift and Maddening Obliette, etc...
I am curious if Arcane Discoveries for Wizards would qualify since they are taken as feats, some of those (like the one that gives +1 DC (or was it CL?) on all spells shared by Druid and Wizard list, the one that does the same for Alchemist and Wizard list, and might be others I'm not thinking of.)
-Goh