I'm not a Seahawks fan—I just hate bad refs.
RPG Superstar 2008 Top 32, 2011 Top 16
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Ann Arbor ;)Let me put this as simple as possible.
Ohio sucks. tOSU sucks. The Blue Jackets suck. I needn't say more.
How nice for you. You wear bitterness so well. Did Columbus kick your dog? Where do you live again?
There are things I don't like about the city. But, overall, there are plenty of worse places to live. Like Toledo or Cleveland. <shudder>
And my interest in OSU has much more to do with academics than football. They have an awesome folklore studies program. Blue Jackets are barely a blip on my radar. Once it became apparent the team would likely never amount to much, I wasn't interested.
What's this? The scar in my hand started tingling, as it does everytime someone, somewhere, starts talking trash about OSU. As a Michigan grad, I swore a blood oath against OSU (it was a graduation requirement), and I feel compelled to join in.
GO WOLVERINES!
P.S. Ohio isn't half as bad as Indiana. My god, the whole state is like a truck stop. And not one of those nice truck stops where friendly men want to assist you in the stalls. Oh no, it's one of those grimey truck stops where they sell glass tubes for smoking crack and condoms made of sand paper. Unless you are in desperate need of some cheap smokes or powerful firecrackers, I advise against entering into the state if it can be avoided.
It's great to see so many Wolverine fans here on the Paizo boards!
GO BLUE!
Go ARMY!
Beat NAVY!
HOO-AH!
Oh, wait, wrong fight. Excuse me.
CEO
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I'm not a Seahawks fan—I just hate bad refs.Me to
Vic hates bad refs so much that he is getting quite a reputation at the Seattle Storm games that we go to as season ticket holders. We have seats in the second row and Vic is on those bad refs all night. Man, I would hate to be them. :)
-Lisa
GO HAIRY just doesn't have the same ring to it.....
I'm confused... did Wolverine get a new costume? Perhaps you're thinking of the Beast or Mystique—they're the blue ones.It's great to see so many Wolverine fans here on the Paizo boards!
GO BLUE!
Go animal that no longer lives in our state!
It got out of here well before everyone else got wise and started leaving.
And for ANYONE complaining about their NFL teams. One word: LIONS.
*sigh* GenCon here yet?
I'm confused... did Wolverine get a new costume? Perhaps you're thinking of the Beast or Mystique—they're the blue ones.It's great to see so many Wolverine fans here on the Paizo boards!
GO BLUE!
Go animal that no longer lives in our state!
It got out of here well before everyone else got wise and started leaving.
And for ANYONE complaining about their NFL teams. One word: LIONS.
*sigh* GenCon here yet?
Yes, it is a sad thing to live in SE MI these days.
Wow. That's fantastic news...but I wonder what that will mean for those of us who pre-ordered them through other venues. Has a second run already been determined?It is fantastic news. I hope their sales go through the roof. If they need additional paper for more print runs, I'm certain there are many unsold 4E books that can be shredded and turned into pulp for recycling.
Hey there, Az. Tell me what you really think. ;)
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Go animal that no longer lives in our state!
Certainly better than a friggin' poisonous nut.
How can you be a fan of a team whose mascot can only kill through ingesting it. Wolverines? Great, they can tear you apart. Buckeyes? They just sit there waiting to kill stupid students.
In Columbus there are all sorts of ads about the state of the Buckeye tree and how the region is no longer amiable to their growth. It appears Michigan is actually a better environment. That thought amuses me.
I figure I must have been freak. The time I spent at OSU had very little to do with the Buckeyes. I didn't even go to a game until after I left the school. It was cold and miserable that day too. I wouldn't have known a member of the football team if he came up and bit me on the leg while I crossed the Oval. Which, knowing the Buckeyes, is entirely possible.
Hockey and soccer are more my thing and those teams barely get a mention at the university.
Edit: Here is the link about the Buckeye tree and global warming: Save the Buckeye
RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8
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Go animal that no longer lives in our state!
Certainly better than a friggin' poisonous nut.
How can you be a fan of a team whose mascot can only kill through ingesting it. Wolverines? Great, they can tear you apart. Buckeyes? They just sit there waiting to kill stupid students.
Hockey and soccer are more my thing and those teams barely get a mention at the university.
Edit: Here is the link about the Buckeye tree and global warming: Save the Buckeye
Well if you thow 'em hard enough...
Ever see the BCS commercial with all the mascots chasing the cup? I have to laugh every time I see the 10' tall buckeye rolling down the way.
Heh, I was a branch student, so I avoided most of the campus hijinks. I had to take one course at main campus, very illuminating.
Student Government elections were going on, and one of the candidates comes up to me to glad hand. When he started his speil, I went blunt.
"I'm a branch student. The only time we have to put up with you is durning things like this. Tell you what; Stay the Hell away from the branches year round, let me work on my classes and then maybe I'll vote for your aft." The look on his face was priceless.
Reason # 234 why I will never be in management, doesn't work well with others.
Wow. That's fantastic news...but I wonder what that will mean for those of us who pre-ordered them through other venues. Has a second run already been determined?It is fantastic news. I hope their sales go through the roof. If they need additional paper for more print runs, I'm certain there are many unsold 4E books that can be shredded and turned into pulp for recycling.Hey there, Az. Tell me what you really think. ;)
You like apples? How 'bout them apples?
Holy Blockbusters Batman! You mean there's only one product out of the top 10 products on that list that isn't WotC... and that product is at the #1 spot?
Pretty exciting, eh, Veector?
Yeah, it is interesting. Above all their core books, except the gift set.
This works out best for myself and my FLGS. We were planning a World of Warcrack Day in September, using the old S&S books and converting them to Pathfinder. We can now prep the event for December instead, with the Pathfinder books on the shelves for enthusiastic converts ;-)
I, for one, would love to see the fruits of that labor when completed as there are a couple of things I'd like to 'Pathfinderize' with those WoW source materials.
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This works out best for myself and my FLGS. We were planning a World of Warcrack Day in September, using the old S&S books and converting them to Pathfinder. We can now prep the event for December instead, with the Pathfinder books on the shelves for enthusiastic converts ;-)I, for one, would love to see the fruits of that labor when completed as there are a couple of things I'd like to 'Pathfinderize' with those WoW source materials.
I second that motion. I have often wanted to run a Warcraft style campaign, without all the baggage of the Warcraft setting.
Ya know...I'm thinking about, maybe, moving soon. So you can send my order right awy if you like. I promise not to open it early.
I second that motion. I have often wanted to run a Warcraft style campaign, without all the baggage of the Warcraft setting.This works out best for myself and my FLGS. We were planning a World of Warcrack Day in September, using the old S&S books and converting them to Pathfinder. We can now prep the event for December instead, with the Pathfinder books on the shelves for enthusiastic converts ;-)I, for one, would love to see the fruits of that labor when completed as there are a couple of things I'd like to 'Pathfinderize' with those WoW source materials.
There is a 3.5 WoW series of material. Since Pathfinder is backward compatible, I'm sure it would work well.
U of I Grad. Go Hawks!!!!
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There is a 3.5 WoW series of material. Since Pathfinder is backward compatible, I'm sure it would work well.
I actually own most of it. I just haven't been able to get my hands on the Horde Player's Guide. I was more hoping for some ideas on incorporating things like Night Elves and Blood Elves into a different type of setting.
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I actually own most of it. I just haven't been able to get my hands on the Horde Player's Guide. I was more hoping for some ideas on incorporating things like Night Elves and Blood Elves into a different type of setting.
There is a 3.5 WoW series of material. Since Pathfinder is backward compatible, I'm sure it would work well.
Shouldnt be to hard to bring over the races from WoW into Pathfinder RPG. Just gotta find the appropriate feats to replace/rename those for the races. Or just keep them as is, especially in regards to the blood elves and their magic eatting.
Cheers
This is a win for gaming, and this is significant. For the past decade I've been concerned that the "only game in town" existed under an extremely large and uncaring corporate entity (even if I for a time worked for said entity). After rounds of nonsensical layoffs and corporate decisions that were misguided and just plain mean spirited, I was losing hope that this industry was ever going to re-balance itself and find some of what it enjoyed under TSR at its height. It was my desire to see the game shift to a company that was run by people who actually played RPGs and worried about the state of the game rather than treating it like it was just another one of many expendable brands. That is not to imply that RPGs are not a business and that the people who work in it do so out of pure altruism, but there is spot where good business decisions meet with good products, as well as the proper respect for the game, the people who originally brought it to life, and those who have worked on it ever since.
Last year everything changed when Paizo committed to a course of action that some decried as misguided, foolish, and destined to fail. "Who still wants to play third edition?" They asked. Paizo asked for the community involvement to tell them what we were looking for in our game, and for a year we told them. Today we are beginning to see the results of this gambit and they are good. We at last have a strong, viable RPG company that is committed to including the players and the fans. After watching them and their products, and after working with them on several Pathfinder AP pieces now, I can say that Paizo is exactly the company I've been hoping would come along and provide some much needed leadership.
Congrats Paizo! You've come a long way from the jettisoned "Periodicals Department" and I look forward to seeing what's next.
Every single word Darrin said I whole heartedly agree with. Go Paizo Go!
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Every single word Darrin said I whole heartedly agree with. Go Paizo Go!This is a win for gaming, and this is significant. For the past decade I've been concerned that the "only game in town" existed under an extremely large and uncaring corporate entity (even if I for a time worked for said entity). After rounds of nonsensical layoffs and corporate decisions that were misguided and just plain mean spirited, I was losing hope that this industry was ever going to re-balance itself and find some of what it enjoyed under TSR at its height. It was my desire to see the game shift to a company that was run by people who actually played RPGs and worried about the state of the game rather than treating it like it was just another one of many expendable brands. That is not to imply that RPGs are not a business and that the people who work in it do so out of pure altruism, but there is spot where good business decisions meet with good products, as well as the proper respect for the game, the people who originally brought it to life, and those who have worked on it ever since.
Last year everything changed when Paizo committed to a course of action that some decried as misguided, foolish, and destined to fail. "Who still wants to play third edition?" They asked. Paizo asked for the community involvement to tell them what we were looking for in our game, and for a year we told them. Today we are beginning to see the results of this gambit and they are good. We at last have a strong, viable RPG company that is committed to including the players and the fans. After watching them and their products, and after working with them on several Pathfinder AP pieces now, I can say that Paizo is exactly the company I've been hoping would come along and provide some much needed leadership.
Congrats Paizo! You've come a long way from the jettisoned "Periodicals Department" and I look forward to seeing what's next.
*nods vigorously*
May the gaming gods bless Paizo
*makes arcane sign and rolls the die*
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There is a 3.5 WoW series of material. Since Pathfinder is backward compatible, I'm sure it would work well.
Hmm I have a copy of the WoW Core Rules sitting around...
what an excellent idea! ThanksThat book may get some use now :)
Current plan is to form two groups: one Alliance, one Horde. Run them through their own games, then have the survivors clash in a third game ala classic WoW PvP.
So... not to be a wet blanket here or anything, but... and keep in mind I am a massive Paizo fan, so this is more a random speculation / philosophical / 'bidness' question.
Do we love Paizo now because they are the enemy of our enemy? I know some may say that's not it, but I know I certainly feel that way. I feel very bitter towards WoTC and to tell you the truth I really wouldn't care who it was as long as some random company came along and stood up against WoTC and tried to be the underdog, as we all probably feel we are. We, the consumers, know what we want, and the previously only game in town decided they knew what we wanted better than we did and basically stopped giving us what we thought we wanted and changed formulas drastically (see New Coke! lol)
However, we are all falling all over ourselves in love with Paizo. I really hope Paizo doesn't take this the wrong way, but is that love temporary, because we see in them an ally who we hope might bring balance back to the force? None of us can do it alone but with Paizo we can help them succeed against the Empire and all that?
Again, this is just me spouting random gibberish. Take away the above and replace it with my true feelings of massive appreciation and support because thats how I really feel, its just that I am just throwing out there the question.
The next question is, we love Paizo now, because they listen to the fans, and they incorporate what we said, and all that. But, is it a sad fact of life that any business entity, once it reaches a certain critical mass, HAS to behave differently? I mean, all companies are all warm and fuzzy in the beginning when they are just starting out but it seems like every single one of them, once they reach a certain size and all that, they can't possibly continue being "the little guy" and all lovey-dovey with joe random internet fan etc.
Fast forward 10 years. Paizo has taken over the world, Pathfinder is into PF 2nd Edition, and has 90% of the medieval rpg market. WotC was shed by Hasbro 2 years ago due to multiple years of losses. Paizo has been considering buying up the IP for D&D but at this point, who cares. Do they really need it? The've gotten so big now they can't possibly answer silly fans on the forums or in chat rooms etc. They're far too busy figuring out how to market the Iconic Action Figure toy line and negotiating movie deals with Paramount and getting Peter Jackson all lined up as director etc. How can they possibly deal with the nobodies at that point? I mean is JJ really going to be in here discussing rules with joe random fan boy?
Sorry, none of the above means anything, its just me rambling lol
*A lot of confessional, honest stuff*
Speaking as somebody who came to Paizo after the epochal events you allude to, I feel I can say, if you come for the hate, you stay for the love. If you'll allow me a prediction, you'll start to feel better. (So funny. A friend I was talking to just last night made the same "New Coke" comment.)
ADD: Epic Meepo, the great thing about Lisa's commitment to this model means that it leaves room for other small companies (see Compatibility Registry) to succeed as well, while preserving Paizo's character.
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Stuff
Personally I was a fan of Paizo before they announced they would not be going 4e. I was happy because I liked 3e over 4e, but what I love about paizo is.
1) They interact with their fans.2) Their books are well written and made of high quality.
3) They make things I am interested in buying.
As long as 2 and 3 hold out I will always be a fan. 1 is just a nice bonus.
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Do we love Paizo now because they are the enemy of our enemy?
Can't speak for everyone here, but I like Paizo because of its and service first and foremost. Same with WotC and Dungeons and Dragons. I weigh spending my spouse's hard-earned $$$ on those criteria on those two principles, and go elsewhere if they botch either one. And so far I've had no problem with either company or their products.
The next question is, we love Paizo now, because they listen to the fans, and they incorporate what we said, and all that. But, is it a sad fact of life that any business entity, once it reaches a certain critical mass, HAS to behave differently?
No. In fact, it's usually considered a mistake if a company stops listening to its fans. Bad customer service and all that. Examples include the old General Motors. For nearly two decades, upper management ignored both dealerships and the customer over their products (e.g., cars, SUVs, etc.) Now the result haunting the automaker, which has been releasing competitive products for the last five years. In the other direction is BMW, Honda, Toyota, and now Ford, who are giving consumers what they want.
Fast forward 10 years. Paizo has taken over the world, Pathfinder is into PF 2nd Edition, and has 90% of the medieval rpg market. WotC was shed by Hasbro 2 years ago due to multiple years of losses. Paizo has been considering buying up the IP for D&D but at this point, who cares. Do they really need it? The've gotten so big now they can't possibly answer silly fans on the forums or in chat rooms etc. They're far too busy figuring out how to market the Iconic Action Figure toy line and negotiating movie deals with Paramount and getting Peter Jackson all lined up as director etc. How can they possibly deal with the nobodies at that point? I mean is JJ really going to be in here discussing rules with joe random fan boy?
Over Lisa Stevens', Vic Wertz, and Erik Mona's (un)dead bodies ;-)
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Ok, so I have a business question about which I'm genuinely curious: what's the rationale or usefulness in the industry as a whole to not sharing unit sales numbers?
I get the price/volume issue: sell 10 books for $1000 each and you make more than selling 1000 books at $1 each so unit sales does not equal profitability. Check.
Is it just considered gauche to brag? Is it about not attracting the attention of competitors?
I wonder because I can see advantages to bragging about unit sales. Unit sales might be useful in persuading even more 3PPs to go PFRPG, for example, by giving them an idea of how large is the "installed base" (so to speak) at whom they can pitch product. However, I'm not seeing the downside, which I'm sure is just my ignorance.
Is it like advertising, the way advertisers share circulation numbers to potential advertisers but not to the public at large?
To me, as a fan, wishing to know about unit sales is just the desire to have something to cheer, like a sports team: "Yeah, baby! My favorite RPG, Pathfinder, was bought by 300,000 people before they even launched, AND they're printing another 300,000 they exepect to sell out in a month, we rock! My game rules!"
Like being able to point to season standings and say, the Yankees won again, we rock! Where "we" really means "all those guys playing ball that I like to watch..."
Can I entice Lisa or Vic or Erik or someone to shed some light? I'll do sweet things for you at Gencon. Promise. :)
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Every single word Darrin said I whole heartedly agree with. Go Paizo Go!This is a win for gaming, and this is significant. For the past decade I've been concerned that the "only game in town" existed under an extremely large and uncaring corporate entity (even if I for a time worked for said entity). After rounds of nonsensical layoffs and corporate decisions that were misguided and just plain mean spirited, I was losing hope that this industry was ever going to re-balance itself and find some of what it enjoyed under TSR at its height. It was my desire to see the game shift to a company that was run by people who actually played RPGs and worried about the state of the game rather than treating it like it was just another one of many expendable brands. That is not to imply that RPGs are not a business and that the people who work in it do so out of pure altruism, but there is spot where good business decisions meet with good products, as well as the proper respect for the game, the people who originally brought it to life, and those who have worked on it ever since.
Last year everything changed when Paizo committed to a course of action that some decried as misguided, foolish, and destined to fail. "Who still wants to play third edition?" They asked. Paizo asked for the community involvement to tell them what we were looking for in our game, and for a year we told them. Today we are beginning to see the results of this gambit and they are good. We at last have a strong, viable RPG company that is committed to including the players and the fans. After watching them and their products, and after working with them on several Pathfinder AP pieces now, I can say that Paizo is exactly the company I've been hoping would come along and provide some much needed leadership.
Congrats Paizo! You've come a long way from the jettisoned "Periodicals Department" and I look forward to seeing what's next.
THIS!
On a side-note, I added another query to the sales-tracker page at http://www.d20pfsrd.com/sales-tracker
The new one lists specifically the PF RPG book, the 3.5 PHB, the 4E PHB, and the PF Bestiary, showing their current ranks.
I thought it would be interesting to compare apples to apples so to speak (pf rpg being an apple, 3.5 phb being an apple, and 4e phb being an apple) the pf bestiary was just thrown in as a ready whipped topping :)
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So... not to be a wet blanket here or anything, but... and keep in mind I am a massive Paizo fan, so this is more a random speculation / philosophical / 'bidness' question.
Do we love Paizo now because they are the enemy of our enemy?
In the dark future of RPGs, there is only Paizo.
[[ Insert image of Paizo golem in Warhammer scene blasting baddies]]
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To me, as a fan, wishing to know about unit sales is just the desire to have something to cheer, like a sports team: "Yeah, baby! My favorite RPG, Pathfinder, was bought by 300,000 people before they even launched, AND they're printing another 300,000 they exepect to sell out in a month, we rock! My game rules!"
And what happens when it goes in the other direction? As a member of the press, I can think of several ways to spin such plummeting numbers to indicate a company's failing financial health. And we know the consequences to a company's reputation and sales when that hits the public, right? ;-)
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Ok, so I have a business question about which I'm genuinely curious: what's the rationale or usefulness in the industry as a whole to not sharing unit sales numbers?
I get the price/volume issue: sell 10 books for $1000 each and you make more than selling 1000 books at $1 each so unit sales does not equal profitability. Check.
Is it just considered gauche to brag? Is it about not attracting the attention of competitors?
I wonder because I can see advantages to bragging about unit sales. Unit sales might be useful in persuading even more 3PPs to go PFRPG, for example, by giving them an idea of how large is the "installed base" (so to speak) at whom they can pitch product. However, I'm not seeing the downside, which I'm sure is just my ignorance.
Is it like advertising, the way advertisers share circulation numbers to potential advertisers but not to the public at large?
To me, as a fan, wishing to know about unit sales is just the desire to have something to cheer, like a sports team: "Yeah, baby! My favorite RPG, Pathfinder, was bought by 300,000 people before they even launched, AND they're printing another 300,000 they exepect to sell out in a month, we rock! My game rules!"
Like being able to point to season standings and say, the Yankees won again, we rock! Where "we" really means "all those guys playing ball that I like to watch..."
Can I entice Lisa or Vic or Erik or someone to shed some light? I'll do sweet things for you at Gencon. Promise. :)
I think the sports analogue is exactly why. As gamers we are a niche hobby and a fairly small one. Yet we already have big problems with the... my game is better than yours and you game sucks too cause X. Weather that is 4e, pathfinder, GURPS or World of Darkness games.
Instead of supporting each other we tend to fight among ourselves and I think releasing numbers would just fuel that. Which is not really healthy for our collective hobby.
But thats just my speculation.
Ok, so I have a business question about which I'm genuinely curious: what's the rationale or usefulness in the industry as a whole to not sharing unit sales numbers?
I get the price/volume issue: sell 10 books for $1000 each and you make more than selling 1000 books at $1 each so unit sales does not equal profitability. Check.
Is it just considered gauche to brag? Is it about not attracting the attention of competitors?
I wonder because I can see advantages to bragging about unit sales. Unit sales might be useful in persuading even more 3PPs to go PFRPG, for example, by giving them an idea of how large is the "installed base" (so to speak) at whom they can pitch product. However, I'm not seeing the downside, which I'm sure is just my ignorance.
Is it like advertising, the way advertisers share circulation numbers to potential advertisers but not to the public at large?
To me, as a fan, wishing to know about unit sales is just the desire to have something to cheer, like a sports team: "Yeah, baby! My favorite RPG, Pathfinder, was bought by 300,000 people before they even launched, AND they're printing another 300,000 they exepect to sell out in a month, we rock! My game rules!"
All I can imagine is that unless the numbers are crazy high, a company like Paizo has nothing to gain by sharing the numbers. If they know that WoTC has sold 10 million 4E PHB's, and they sold 100,000 PF RPG books, someone on some side will point to it and say "look how miniscule their silly market is". Basically, a company has nothing to gain by sharing the numbers, and possibly a lot to lose. Fans could get discouraged if the numbers are lower than they thought they should be. By not saying, and simply saying "the sales were far better than expected" they could sell 10 copies and as long as they only expected to sell 3 then the fans are happy. They (we) don't know any better. Not saying they would do that, but just saying, there's no sense in sharing the numbers. Its a competitive thing if you ask me.
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1) They interact with their fans.
2) Their books are well written and made of high quality.
3) They make things I am interested in buying.As long as 2 and 3 hold out I will always be a fan. 1 is just a nice bonus.
Same reasons that drew me into the Paizo fold. I've been playing in a Shackled City game now for years, met the guys at GenCon and started liking the company. Started getting into Pathfinder APs right before they made their decision to stay the 3.5 course.
I couldn't be happier with my choice.
[Over Lisa Stevens', Vic Wertz, and Erik Mona's (un)dead bodies ;-)
but I would definately get those action figures
Do we love Paizo now because they are the enemy of our enemy? I know some may say that's not it, but I know I certainly feel that way. I feel very bitter towards WoTC and to tell you the truth I really wouldn't care who it was as long as some random company came along and stood up against WoTC and tried to be the underdog, as we all probably feel we are.
I know I don't speak for everybody, but I don't consider WotC "the enemy." The people who work in R&D are intelligent, talented, hard working people who are generally nice guys. Sure, 4E doesn't sit right with me, but the fact is that WotC R&D are not the people who are responsible for the layoffs and other poor business decisions that have helped alienate much of their fan base. I'd hate to see 4E fail because that would mean that a lot of good people would be out of a job. I don't want that. I'm not a fan of what they did with 4E, so I can't exactly support them, but are they the enemy? No way!
Speaking as somebody who came to Paizo after the epochal events you allude to, I feel I can say, if you come for the hate, you stay for the love. If you'll allow me a prediction, you'll start to feel better. (So funny. A friend I was talking to just last night made the same "New Coke" comment.)
I'll offer some unasked-for advice: don't waste time and energy hating.
I have long said that sooner or later, some edition of D&D will go the way of New Coke. (In fact, in a casual conversation, I once compared Windows Vista to New Coke.) No one can get it right EVERY time. Perhaps 4th Edition will be that edition, and perhaps it won't. But whichever edition goes that way, I hope that WotC (or whoever owns D&D by that time) will be able to admit to its mistakes (something many people find difficult to do), learn from them, and emerge stronger than ever for the experience.
More to the point (for me, anyway) is their PDF downloads. When WotC pulled the plug on those, I was horrified. I still regret not buying more of those old Mystara materials when I had the chance. But though I felt horror and regret, I didn't waste my energy hating. I promptly bought a slew of other RPG materials... published by three RPG companies other than WotC. If a company doesn't want my money, I go elsewhere. That's all.