1) The poisoned/toxin-coverted creature template will need a new creature entry. Details of how a creature gets poisoned/toxin-converted in the first place may be needed to fill this out.
Nah. "As blahblahblahmonster, plus the creature's skin is poisonous (insert poison stats) to any creature it touches or touches it with natural weapons or unarmed strikes" works perfectly fine there. I love templates, but every change to a monster doesn't require a full template to explain it.
{2) The giant dinosaurs the trolls ride may need a new creature entry; even if the troll encounter were cut, these dinosaurs could be useful for random encounters in the underground jungle area.}
There are literally four million dinosaurs statted in the Bestiary, I'm sure one of them is suitable for riding. :)
{3) The undead mammoths may need a PFRPG update creature entry, if their Vudrani counterparts (of which they could be 'northern' variants) do not make it into the Bestiary.}
Or you can hand-wave it and use one of the skeleton or zombie templates in the Bestiary.
{4) The taiga giants may need a PFRPG update creature entry.}
Or, if they don't HAVE to be taiga giants to match the adventure, we can say "or use stone giants." Several of the later FR products I worked on referred to FR-specific monsters in another sourcebook, and we just included a sidebar that said "if you don't have that sourcebook, here are monster equivalents for these creatures: X = X1, Y = Y1."
{6) The whatever-it-is-which-is-the-plant/aberration-final-fight thing will need a new creature entry.}
Or, "It's a hydra, except it has the plant type."
One trick good GMs learn is to use existing monsters with just a little change to make them fresh and new--often with a new appearance so player's done immediately rattle off the creature's abilities once they recognize its shape. Monte wrote an article on his site about this very idea. No sense wasting space on repeating game stats when a "new" creature is really 90% of an old creature with 10% something new.
Creative Director
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I get that. It's just that when you mentioned that Tolguth place it took me a long time to even find it in the books. I had never heard of it. As a reader, Deep Tolguth's not the Space Needle.
Yet Deep Tolguth still exists. Part of my job as Editor in Chief is to guide new products in a way that they add to Golarion, that they work with Golarion. And to me, creating a second, very similar location to an existing location is a flaw. A flaw that would be relatively easy to fix, and if this module wins, I'll certainly be working with the author to address that problem. But it's still something that I need to worry about and track.
True enough. That's why they have the "book" in serial narratives in media, after all, to keep these things straight.
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To Mr. Jacobs: "Jokul" is not an invented word, it's Icelandic for "glacier," and it's really pronounced like that.Well... the module will be published in english, not Icelandic, and furthermore, there's no "Iceland" in Golarion anyway. We try to generally avoid naming things in the game so that they sound EXACTLY like real-world names. It's mostly a judgement call, as to whether or not one of the editors recognizes the name and feels that, for example, having a wine merchant character named Jacques, is too silly.
In this case, the word "Jokul" triggers the name alarm more if it says "this rhymes with yokel." And the more I think about it, that's less of a concern but the concern that it's building off of an Icelandic word is.
Names are tricky subjects, but fortunately, they're easy to change without impacting the entire adventure. A strange name like this wouldn't be an auto reject for me were this proposal coming in to Dungeon back in the day, for example, but in this case, I decided to turn up my nit-picky powers to near maximum and left no stone unturned.
Sorry James, lol, but I have to call BS here. Criticizing someone's choice of words that sound funny when you have Norberger (god of silliness right), Iomedae (HOW is that pronounced again? I-owe-me-die or day or what ever- stupid name regardless) and a host of just plain goofy sounding names spread ALL through Golarion... I think you of all people are not entitled to say someone using a funny sounding name should be disqualified. Sorry, but compared to Norberger Jokul works JUST fine. lol
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Jacobs complains a lot about the deviations from canon, but says there is a ziggurat and dino infested savage land in the area - just underground. OK, seems like a minor change to me.It's not that it deviates from canon as much as it does work that's already done. If the adventure were est in any other nation, it wouldn't have been such an issue for me, but since it IS set in the same region that already has a lost jungle realm cave... it'd be weird to have a second one as well. It'd be like building a second Space Needle in Renton, when there's already one 20 minutes away in Seattle. A space needle in Texas though... that's another story.
In any case, the feedback I've given on these four proposals is pretty much the same level of feedback I give for every module and/or adventure path adventure that I'm working on an author with. The only difference here is that I did my feedback in a public venue.
OK, so it is odd, there is more than one big cave in Missouri then or that two major rivers flow through it? I don't get the criticism here. BTW still looking for that other underground ice cave jungle, can anyone please tell me where it is. I'm just not finding it. Tolguth (silly sounding name) is not a giant tropical land in an ice cave.
Video-gamey ziggurat puzzle... just curious, but am I the ONLY one that plays video games, and sees that as cool? You know, sort of like puzzles in Indiana Jones, or National Treasure, or heck Stargate, or most like Fifth Element! for that matter. So how is this bad?
Radiant Wraith- mmm contrast in concepts... not being restricted to only what has come before... original idea... and face it a cool name... excellent monster!
Rivers flow out of glaciers... you know like rivers flow south... except for the Nile, of course. Actually I thought they flowed in the direction of the land fall... I was not aware that glaciers lower than surrounding hills and mountains had their water flow upstream...
There was a criticism about using dinosaurs in this adventure. Let me quote page 74 from the Campaign Setting: "Even dinosaurs occasionally range the Tusk lowlands and the freakishly warm canyons at the base of the great ice shelf..." Ummm, so why criticize dinosaurs when the Setting specifically mentions they DO exist in this setting?
I also remember a criticism about the barbarian games and the bonding they promote as being similar to ones already published. Ummm no... These are COOL... those were lame... BIG difference.
OK, I understand criticism is personal. If you don't like something, just say "I don't like it." If you are going to cloak it in reasons, be sure your reasons are sound. Otherwise it just sounds lame.
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...One trick good GMs learn is to use existing monsters with just a little change to make them fresh and new--often with a new appearance so player's done immediately rattle off the creature's abilities once they recognize its shape. Monte wrote an article on his site about this very idea. No sense wasting space on repeating game stats when a "new" creature is really 90% of an old creature with 10% something new.
So: I take it that Paizo will shortly scrap the bestiary sections of the Adventure Paths and modules? ;)
Yep! I agree! Obviously taking contrasting ideas and making a new monster is not something Paizo would endorse! lol
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Creative Director
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Sorry James, lol, but I have to call BS here. Criticizing someone's choice of words that sound funny when you have Norberger (god of silliness right), Iomedae (HOW is that pronounced again? I-owe-me-die or day or what ever- stupid name regardless) and a host of just plain goofy sounding names spread ALL through Golarion... I think you of all people are not entitled to say someone using a funny sounding name should be disqualified. Sorry, but compared to Norberger Jokul works JUST fine. lol
Obviously, I think Norgorber and Iomedae work better than Jokul. And I'm pretty much entitled to say which names are good and which names are bad; it's part of what I'm paid for, in fact. (And for the record, Erik Mona came up with Iomedae, so you should probably email him separately on the "you're not qualified" announcement.)
If you don't like a name we publish, change it in your game. That's what I do... it just so happens I'm the Editor-in-Chief at Paizo, so when I change things/request changes, it's more noticeable.
And for the record, I never said that ANY of the final four proposals should be disqualified. That's 100% you putting words in my mouth (or words in my post, I guess). All four adventures, you will note, have more "things I didn't like" than "things I did like," but no matter which writer wins RPG Superstar, that adventure gets to be a module. And as with last year's winners, I suspect that you'll be seeing the names of all four finalists on Paizo products before long.
In any event, Krome, I'm not sure what you're trying to accomplish here by attacking me. My job as a guest judge was to provide feedback to the authors, and to note what would need to be addressed or changed if that adventure wins. If something like "Jokel" has real-world roots, and if the author explained his reasons to me as to WHY he chose that name, then there's a good chance that I'll understand where he's coming from and will let the name stand. Your crusade against my comments is having the opposite effect.
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Creative Director
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If you don't like something, just say "I don't like it." If you are going to cloak it in reasons, be sure your reasons are sound. Otherwise it just sounds lame.
Now it's my turn to call BS.
If I say to someone, "I don't like it," and provide no further insight into WHY I don't like it... nothing happens. Criticism MUST have reasons, otherwise it's just petulant whining, not criticism. If the role's reversed, and someone tells me "I don't like Curse of the Crimson Throne," my only recourse is to say something like, "Oh, sorry, maybe the next one will be better." If they don't tell me WHY they don't like it, I can't address the things they don't like.
My reasons are sound. I stand by them.
Ah, the joys of having a Slavic language as my native ! Jokul, Iomedae, Norgorber and Fuzzlyplumphs ALL sound weird to us ! :)
Or other way around, names sound completely reasonable and then an English-speaker points out that Jokul sounds like yokel. Huh? Where do you come up with this stuff?
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Creative Director
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Ah, the joys of having a Slavic language as my native ! Jokul, Iomedae, Norgorber and Fuzzlyplumphs ALL sound weird to us ! :)Or other way around, names sound completely reasonable and then an English-speaker points out that Jokul sounds like yokel. Huh? Where do you come up with this stuff?
If you look at words all day long at work, and then end up looking at words during a lot of your time when you're not at work, you begin seeing things in the patterns.
Noting that Jokul sounds like yokel is nothing. One of the editor curses is that you have to have a filthier mind than any of your authors, so you can catch them if they try to sneak in some sort of inappropriate innuendo or hidden profanity. Good times.
After learning English, French, Japanese, and Chinese nothing sounds strange to me.
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The funny thing is, I wasn't aware of the word "yokel" until I read this thread.
(matter of fact: I love when I have to put the marzipan in tureen while stroking my proboscis, because it teaches me English far better than any handbook will)
I do understand that editing out American derogatory terms is what James gets paid for - after all, Paizo is an American company and PF books are American products, that makes sense, HOWEVER sometimes you end up with a word that might be a profanity in some other language.
If, for example, I would end up with an NPC in adventure named Dziwka ( the b-word in Polish), while it would be perfectly fine for an English-native, I would have to let out a loud *sigh* and make sure I swap that name for something appropriate.
So it's not always 100% bullet-proof, but I can live with that. What irks me more are names that sound slavic-ish but don't follow any rules of Slavic languages.
I do understand that editing out American derogatory terms is what James gets paid for - after all, Paizo is an American company and PF books are American products, that makes sense, HOWEVER sometimes you end up with a word that might be a profanity in some other language.
If, for example, I would end up with an NPC in adventure named Dziwka ( the b-word in Polish), while it would be perfectly fine for an English-native, I would have to let out a loud *sigh* and make sure I swap that name for something appropriate.
So it's not always 100% bullet-proof, but I can live with that. What irks me more are names that sound slavic-ish but don't follow any rules of Slavic languages.
Oh, that happens that the perfectly nice name in English is not so nice in other languages...when King Kull stories by RE Howard were translated to Finnish, the translator wisely opted to rename him Kall which is not a nickname to male genitals.
And then there are the famous brand examples like Chevrolet Nova (in Spanish "no va"="doesn't go") and such. And there are some perfectly nice expressions and names in Finnish which are obscene or just weird in, say Italian or Japanese and other way around...Those are then issues that translators hopefully notice and the original version would just bring up smirks.
The close-but-not-quite names is something of an oddity, one could argue that there are no Slavic languages in Golarion and thus they don't need to follow the rules...there is a long old thread somewhere in these messageboards about pseudo-Japanese names in one adventure path which covered most of the points on both sides.
And now I assume Amanda Huggenkiss or I.P.Freely should not be used as NPC names?
One of the major questions raised about the viability of Neil and Eric's modules as 32 page adventures was the fact that both had to describe a new region, on top of describing their encounters.
Well, there's one module close in level that has that burden: Jason Bulmahn's Conquest of the Bloodsworn Vale (6th level PCs):
Combat, RP and Skill Encounters: 26 or 36
Tables: 6.5
Maps: 9
Special: Describes a fort and its inhabitants. There are ten encounter areas given and, since 3 encounters occur there, I was unsure about whether to "count" the described home base areas as encounters or not.
Again, Eric and Neil both come under the figures for this adventure, although I think they should be considered roughly equivalent due to the fact that this module's stat blocks are shorter due to the expected PC level.
...One trick good GMs learn is to use existing monsters with just a little change to make them fresh and new--often with a new appearance so player's done immediately rattle off the creature's abilities once they recognize its shape. Monte wrote an article on his site about this very idea. No sense wasting space on repeating game stats when a "new" creature is really 90% of an old creature with 10% something new.
So: I take it that Paizo will shortly scrap the bestiary sections of the Adventure Paths and modules? ;)
People love new monsters. The WOTC MM 2, 3, 4, and 5 are proof of this.
But there's a big difference between "I have a 64-page monthly book with a section devoted to monsters every month" and "I have a 32-page one-shot adventure."
For the first one, you can afford the space to create a bunch of new monsters; it's part of the design goal of the book.
For the second, people are buying the adventure to be an ADVENTURE, not 16 pages of adventure plus 16 pages of new monsters. If I buy a dinner at a nice restaurant, I don't want them to bring me a salad and a cool DVD, I want the dinner I asked for.
This is where the developer and editor make the decision to fiddle with the content to make things fit. If the adventure is long and the choice is "cut out two encounters" or "replace this new monster with a fiendish whatsit that's 90% the same," were's going to replace the whatsit because the book is an ADVENTURE, not a bestiary.
Good job with the "X of the Y" title, people seem to love that for some reason.
Way too large. There is no way this will fit in the format requested (32 page adventure)
Too epic for the level.
If this were for a much higher level, and for an adventure trilogy proposal, I would so vote for it. It has some great ideas (sailing a ship through a giant glacier? Fantastic but not really realistic enough for the prime material world I think)
Good ideas, but too much and too over the top in some areas for the required format.
Good luck though, and congrats on top 4.
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Great job Eric you got my vote. I really like the way you developed the story and the plot threads. Some of the adventure has problems ... but that is what editing is for. I think of all the adveture ideas this is the strongest. I hope you win the whole thing. You ahve certainly given me some ideas for my own campaign. I hope to see this come out sometime in December good luck to you.
I have been following this contest from the beginning but haven't posted. It seems from recent exit polling that this contest is coming down to Neil and Eric.
I have voted for both Neil and Eric in past rounds. Eric has my vote this time.
Here's why: I like my D&D big. I like to feel that my character is part of something epic, even at low to mid level. I love the old school charm of infiltrating the heart of a glacier. And I completely agree about this entry being the most METAL.
For me, the spirit of this contest is about ideas and this entry has them in spades. No, it does not have all of the professional polish that Neil brings to the table. But it is also, to my mind, more easily usable within an existing campaign. Fellnight Queen, like Sharina's Playhouse, is excellent presented, but feels niche to me.
Eric, excellent work here.
After some consideration, this submission has my vote as well! It's the best mix of polish and cool of the four.
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i liked this sotry very much
specially the frozen giagiant ship and the aztec temple
also the test of mettle and the soial ones were cool.
still its full of inconsistencies, so I voted elsewhere
still great images i see
and as I understand the battle with the amazons is a different one that the one with the aberration... that detial is neat :)
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Personal point that has no bairing on this adventure, for the editor and Cheif, There are volcanos on both the north and south poles, so that doesn't bother me what-so-ever.
As for the Adventure, i really like the idea. I did fall off the wagon as we got to the dinosaur riding mammoth lords. Other then that i can go with the whole adventure up to the ship. I can even go with the white ater rafting. Why is the an item on the boat that doesn't tie into anything in the rest of the adventure?
All my other points are covered by other posters.
A+ for effort
C- for staying on message
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Creative Director
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Personal point that has no bairing on this adventure, for the editor and Cheif, There are volcanos on both the north and south poles, so that doesn't bother me what-so-ever.
That's not what made me pause... it was the concept of volcanic superhetated lava under a glacier that gave me pause—specifically, the inclusion of salamanders in a cold environment. Certainly something that you can explain with more room, but as it appeared in the proposal, there wasn't enough for me and it felt weird, so I noted it as such.
For the second, people are buying the adventure to be an ADVENTURE, not 16 pages of adventure plus 16 pages of new monsters. If I buy a dinner at a nice restaurant, I don't want them to bring me a salad and a cool DVD, I want the dinner I asked for.
After all that 'monsters' here and 'monsters' there, I actually read your post as 'I don't want them to bring me a slaad and a cool DVD'. Come on, who wouldn't want a slaad? :D
>>it was the concept of volcanic superhetated lava under a glacier that gave me pause—specifically, the inclusion of salamanders in a cold environment. Certainly something that you can explain with more room, but as it appeared in the proposal, there wasn't enough for me and it felt weird, so I noted it as such.
Hmm.. Could he have been basing it off Iceland, which has substantial geyser and geologic activity?
It seems possible to have heat underneath a glacier... but it has to be based extremely, extremely, extremely far down and only pipe up perhaps once in 200 years.
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RPG Superstar 2008 Top 32, 2011 Top 16
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Star Voter Season 6, Star Voter Season 7, Star Voter Season 8, Star Voter Season 9
aka JoelF847
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Eric,
I read your entry first, and that made my earlier comments in the vacuum of not knowing what the other entries were like. Now that I've read all 4, I'm giving you my vote. While I did have some specific issues with bits and pieces of your entry, on the whole, I did like it a lot, and think that with writing the entire module and editing, my concerns will be gone with a final version. I do really like the pulp action style and plot of your submission, and I'll be looking to buy this in 2010.
I debated quite a while between "Fellnight" and "Mammoth Lords." The judges are the pros, they know what they're talking about; if they say "Mammoth Lords" isn't feasible in 32 pages, I assume that they're absolutely right. What's more, it's been very clear throughout the entire competition that sticking within wordcount is a critical skill, not just a couple of points off what may be an otherwise wonderful entry.
And yet. "Mammoth Lords" has something to it, something important, that I didn't find in any of the other entries, as good as they were. It feels different, fresh, exciting. "Fellnight," for all its charm and creativity, still seems to me to boil down to "Bad Guy X wants to enslave Location Y. Kill things and find out who to fight next until you get to X." That's a game a lot of players will just play by the numbers. "Mammoth Lord" is so much more. It achieves suspense, excitement, even wonder. It also has a large sense of variety - players are doing things that are new and different.
And I reached my decision when I realized I have an excellent justification for voting for "Mammoth Lords": I think it'll be the best adventure, even after the necessary edits. You can chop off half of this adventure, as far as I'm concerned - just keep the barbarian plants strolling through the city, the festivities among the barbarians, and as far as I'm concerned have the rest of the adventure be fighting more of the barbarian-plants up until a big plant-baddie. I think that can still be a more exciting adventure, because each one of the elements grabs me, and even if you chop half of them out, that still leaves me with more than any of the other proposals.
So I wish you luck and success, Eric. And now, I just wait for the results...
I'd love to see this one in print. If it don't win (and for sheer spirit and joie de vivre in the proposal, it should), I'd love to see Clark pick this one up for the Necromancer line - it might need to be bigger than 32 pages, as the Judges have said, but Necro aren't constrained by the Pathfinder format...
So, Clark, what do you think??
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Creative Director
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With regard to the heating for the jungle, as far as I can see no indication is given that it might come from anywhere other than the prismatic array. The salamanders live in 'volcanic caves', but nop mention is made of current activity, and these could just be old lava tubes which have not seen any magma flow for decades or centuries.
And that gets to the actual crux of my concern, honestly. I don't mind as much the mix of volcanic caves and glaciers. What does start to feel awkward is having salamanders encountered in regions that should normally be pretty cold weather, or even normal weather. But particularly in cold, since their vulnerability to cold would be very bad for them.
RPG Superstar 2013
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Dedicated Voter Season 6, Dedicated Voter Season 7, Dedicated Voter Season 8, Star Voter Season 9
aka Steven T. Helt
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I haven't been here lately, as I am studying for a licensing test. But I wanted to read the proposed adventures and vote.
I feel that Mammoth Lords falls short in two categories: It is too large an adventure (even having some random, unsynergistic combats) for the end product, and it takes a lot of liberties with the fledgling game world that is Golarion. I sensed a few such liberties during my reading (diosaurs, Witch Queen's involvement), but James Jacob's post makes it very clear - a lot of reworking the adventure would have to be done to fit snugly into Golarion, and to make the adventure run smoothly.
Despite that, I like its 'viking pulp' feel, and while you took a lot of liberties to craft them, your encounters and locations are very memorable and evocative. Good luck in final voting.
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Creative Director
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James Jacobs:
On the subject of ice with regard to the margins of the Crown of the World, could you clarify the extent of the ice? Is the whole top of Golarion covered by ice, or is it more a case of a cold (and freezing) high altitude desert, with individual glaciers on the mountains around the edges?
If it's a massive ice-cap I have no problem with travel for days by boat in/beneath it, with a jungle somewhere established as a hideaway by a civilisation (maybe it wasn't the Earthfall as such that was a problem for them, but that they were enemies of Lamashtu who ascended to divinity at some point during the Age of Darkness, if I recall other debates correctly, which was why they needed to hide somewhere obscure) but if it's only a few glaciers around the margins, then the amount of travel indicated under ice seems to be a bit bizarre to me.
The fold out map in the Campaign Setting indicates the white shaded area along the north edge to be 'glaciers', but in the real world the 'outflows' for ice from the Antarctic cap are all regarded as glaciers as far as I know, so this in itself is inconclusive.
The ice, as shown on the map, is aggressive. Especially when you stop to realize that Varisia is about where Oregon and southern Washington is on the globe, were Avistan really North America. If/when we ever do something with the northern reaches, the strip of "ice" on the map will likely go away to be replaced by new terrain features. (The equator
While I have, in my head, a lot of ideas about the Crown of the World, those ideas are not ready for the public yet. What's written about the northern continent in the Pathfidner Campaign Setting hardcover is all we're really willing to say about the place so far. It's certainly not a featureless expanse of ice, though. There's a lot more going on up there than the map shows, and the ice is, to a certain extent, an artistic flourish to show the basic "edge" of the region between Avistan and the Crown of the World.
Hey James I wonder are u a big fan of "At the Mountains of Madness" and "The Thing" ...then I may have a clue as to what lies up in the northern expanse...I wonder with all your pulp excitment, is there an entrance to a "Hollow Earth" as well. So many opprtunities up there it really is exciting, I would love to see some adventure up North.
This is a neat adventure and most of the troubles can be taken care of by just adjusting some of the locations--moving the final site to somewhere in the established hollow earth portions of Golarion, checking the course of the rivers, etc. But as said elsewhere, there's some great pulp feel here, and I love the idea of a frost giant longboat frozen into a glacier.
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Creative Director
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Hey James I wonder are u a big fan of "At the Mountains of Madness" and "The Thing" ...then I may have a clue as to what lies up in the northern expanse...I wonder with all your pulp excitment, is there an entrance to a "Hollow Earth" as well. So many opprtunities up there it really is exciting, I would love to see some adventure up North.
At the Mountains of Madness is often my favorite Lovecraft story (it moves around from 1st to 4th place, along with Colour Out of Space and The Dunwich Horror and The Shadow Over Innsmouth).
The Thing is my 2nd favorite movie (behind Alien).
Golarion doesn't have a hollow earth; it's core works like Earth's (although there IS a prison demi plane down there somewhere that imprisons Rovagug). There are lots of large underground vaults in Golarion though.
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Creative Director
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So they're basically a number of small, local, glaciers, on really high mountains? (And I assume that the route from Tian-Xi comes across and down one (Campaign Setting, Page 156) because the glacier is occupying one of the low points across the mountain chain?)
Perhaps. We haven't worked it out yet. The terrain is probably more like a cross between Siberia, northern Canada, and eventually Antarctica.
I know Neil won but when can I play this? =)
Judging by the exit polls, this was relatively close.
Good work Eric. And please submit to future Paizo open calls; you certainly have a lot of talent!
~LD
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Director of Brand Strategy
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Good work Eric. And please submit to future Paizo open calls; you certainly have a lot of talent!Well, hopefully Paizo is going to contact Eric with some not-so-open calls in the near future. Based on what I've seen of his work, he's earned it.
Nothing's stopping him from making this and releasing it for free under the Community Use License either. Or making it under the Pathfinder RPG Compatibility License and setting it in a world other than Golarion (that might have some coincidental similarities).
I'd actually like to hear some designer note responses as Neil has done from the other entries, especially this one. Eric, care to respond to some of the feedback from the judges or voters?
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RPG Superstar 2009 Top 4
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Star Voter Season 6
aka raidou
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I'd actually like to hear some designer note responses as Neil has done from the other entries, especially this one. Eric, care to respond to some of the feedback from the judges or voters?
I'd be happy to give it a shot.
When I began writing up the Mammoth Lords proposal, I wanted to do a "journey" adventure in the style of the pulps. I don't think this style has been done much (if at all, these days), and even the Paizo "J" series of adventures seem to focus more on the exotic destination than the journey itself. When I first began playing D&D, the adventures that most caught my imagination were the "Expert" series... the Isle of Dread, Master of the Desert Nomads, Quagmire, etc. These all had themes of cross-country exploration that I find wildly appealing, even today.
With the title, I hoped to build on this idea. I wanted to portray the barbarians at a turning point, one that could define their continued way of life (Their "last" ride). But I also wanted to use "ride" more literally and give the PCs and their new barbarian pals a LOT of things to ride upon. Triceratops mounts (and megaraptor mounts if wrested from the trolls), mammoths, frost giant longships, giant birds, and ancient moveable ziggurats.
The point that seems to have brought this proposal to its knees is the scope. Could it fit into 32 pages? The people who KNOW seem to agree that it wouldn't. I developed this with a number of encounters comparable to the "journey" style adventures already mentioned, and thought I was within an acceptable range.
Given a chance to do it again I would probably slice off the starting town and begin the whole journey at the barbarian festival itself. I contemplated this during development but I just couldn't let go of my "trolls riding dinos" scene. Ah, well.
So on to some specific points:
Q. Plant-Barbarians. Why'd we see them in the opening scene and nowhere else?
A. They would show up throughout the PCs interactions with the mammoth lords. During the journey to the festival, a couple of Haendir's barbarians fall ill. There are plenty of sick barbarians at the festival. I had envisioned a small encounter chart for events at this festival where the PCs could interact with some of these guys. Even more would fall sick on the journey to the glacier. Perhaps by cutting the trolls riding dinos, I would have had space to get into this more.
Which brings me to...
Q. Trolls riding Dinos doesn't further the plot. Just a random encounter.
A. As it ended up, this is correct: there's no plot advancement here. It furthers the theme of "cool stuff to ride" and gives the PCs a chance to be awesome in front of their new barbarian friends. Originally this was intended to be a scene in which the PCs were GIVEN the triceratopses as mounts if they proved able to control the beasts in battle. I moved that reward to the end and in doing so wrote the "story" out of this encounter.
Q. Why are there volcanic caves in the glacier?
A. The volcanic caves aren't terribly active. They contain geothermal vents, and most of this heat is absorbed by the Flame Cornerstone to produce light. The glacier packs enough cold energy to counter the heat produced by these vents, but the salamander living here finds the interior of the vents pretty cozy. The salamander is there for the same reason the jungle is there... to defy expectations and make the whole thing seem exotic and strange.
I am actually very, very happy with the amount of support Mammoth Lords received. It was a fantastic end to this contest, and I will gladly take "Most METAL entry" as a consolation prize!
-eric