I think that'd be a great way to do it. It'd keep options for the barbarian without all the book-keeping that the current incarnation has.
For instance...
Nightvision:
Level 1: Low-light vision.
Level 4: Darkvision 60 feet.
Level 7: Darkvision 120 feet.
Level 10: See through magical darkness.
Elemental Rage:
Half your weapon damage is converted to elemental damage of your choosing. The choice is permanent, or it can be chosen whenever you rage. (This automatically scales, so it doesn't need extra bonuses.)
Ignore Pain:
Existing damage reduction improves by DR 2/--, +1 DR/-- for every two levels you have.
Adrenaline Surge:
Fast healing 2, improves by +1 for every two levels you have.
Bestial Fury:
Level 1: Gain a bite attack, 1d6 damage.
Level 3: Bite attack improves to 1d8 damage.
Level 5: Bite attack improves to 1d10 damage.
Level 7: Gain two claw attacks at 1d4 damage.
Level 9: Claw attacks improve to 1d6 damage.
Level 11: Claw attacks improve to 1d8 damage; gain rend ability for 1d6 + 1.5x Strength modifier if you hit with both attacks.
Shriek:
Level 1: All enemies within 30' must make a Will save (DC = 10 + 1/2 your level + your Constitution modifier) or be shaken for 1 round/level.
Level 5: Range extends to 60'.
Level 10: Enemies taken a -4 penalty instead of a -2 for being shaken.
Level 15: Even enemies that save take a -2 penalty.
Thoughts?
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I think that'd be a great way to do it. It'd keep options for the barbarian without all the book-keeping that the current incarnation has.
For instance...
Nightvision:
Level 1: Low-light vision.
Level 4: Darkvision 60 feet.
Level 7: Darkvision 120 feet.
Level 10: See through magical darkness.
I'm not too fussed on this one. Especially if it's linked to rage (which I think is your intention?) as I see rage as a kind of "blinding anger". Even without rage I don't like the thought of a barbarian getting darkvision etc unless it's racial. Low light vision I can handle, being natural hunters and all but the others seem too far fetched for me (this is purely a style preference rather than anything concrete in terms of mechanics so I understand that we'll probably disagree on this one)
Elemental Rage:
Half your weapon damage is converted to elemental damage of your choosing. The choice is permanent, or it can be chosen whenever you rage. (This automatically scales, so it doesn't need extra bonuses.)
I can live with this one if we can come up with some good background fluff for why it's there. Possibly a regional thing (maybe better as a feat). However if this is linked to rage like it currently is without the points system then I'm good for it.
Ignore Pain:
Existing damage reduction improves by DR 2/--, +1 DR/-- for every two levels you have.
I don't mind this one either.
Adrenaline Surge:
Fast healing 2, improves by +1 for every two levels you have.
This would be nice. However, stacking this with the DR above could be overpowered. I'd have to try it in a few games to get a more concrete feel for it. Unfortunately my next scheduled RL game isn't for another week and this part of the playtest will be gone by then.
Bestial Fury:
Level 1: Gain a bite attack, 1d6 damage.
Level 3: Bite attack improves to 1d8 damage.
Level 5: Bite attack improves to 1d10 damage.
Level 7: Gain two claw attacks at 1d4 damage.
Level 9: Claw attacks improve to 1d6 damage.
Level 11: Claw attacks improve to 1d8 damage; gain rend ability for 1d6 + 1.5x Strength modifier if you hit with both attacks.
This one feels too much like a lycanthrope thing for me. In Eberron shifters get this type of attack but they actually grow bear like features or animal talons. This one reminds me of a set of druid spells. However, I do like this as an idea for a racial progression for a creature or race like the shifter. Maybe this could work as a feat progression, once againa regional thing.
Shriek:
Level 1: All enemies within 30' must make a Will save (DC = 10 + 1/2 your level + your Constitution modifier) or be shaken for 1 round/level.Level 5: Range extends to 60'.
Level 10: Enemies taken a -4 penalty instead of a -2 for being shaken.
Level 15: Even enemies that save take a -2 penalty.Thoughts?
This last one I like, but I'd like to see this type of system used for intimidate for all fighting types. I've proposed similar ideas in some other threads for intimidate. However, yours is an area effect so a bit more powerful than what I had suggested. The area effect could be barbarian specific.
One last thing I'd like to add, I think you could make most of the current rage powers as options to take during progression similar to rogue bonuses. The barbarian selects the ones they like then can use them when they rage. Keep number of rages as it worked for 3.5 with the feats that let you extend time (Eberron I think) and the extra rages per day feats.
Edit: The last part I stated sounds just like what you're suggesting in the post heading. I realised this afterwords, however you've also chucked in some level advancements which is not how I envision it working. Sorry if I've confused the issue.
Contributor, RPG Superstar 2008 Top 4, Legendary Games
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Most of the rage powers I think would work just fine as 'always on' powers when you rage. You could have them level-scale or you could have them just be flat numbers.
I already advocated for this idea with the "improved DR" rage power in particular, and I think it would make sense for a lot of the others. A few might feel a little wonky, but I think most of them would do just fine with this approach.
I wouldn't mind switching to many rage options being always available but some of them are too powerful to be always on. I'm thinking of Powerful Blow, Renewed Vigor, Terrifying Howl, and Unexpected Strike in particular... maybe a few others.
Having most powers always available and a few powers that are only usable once per rage would be a nice mix.
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Contributor, RPG Superstar 2008 Top 4, Legendary Games
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I wouldn't mind switching to many rage options being always available but some of them are too powerful to be always on. I'm thinking of Powerful Blow, Renewed Vigor, Terrifying Howl, and Unexpected Strike in particular... maybe a few others.
Having most powers always available and a few powers that are only usable once per rage would be a nice mix.
Yup. That's pretty much what I just posted over in the Barbarian Rage [Design] thread.
Yup. That's pretty much what I just posted over in the Barbarian Rage [Design] thread.I wouldn't mind switching to many rage options being always available but some of them are too powerful to be always on. I'm thinking of Powerful Blow, Renewed Vigor, Terrifying Howl, and Unexpected Strike in particular... maybe a few others.
Having most powers always available and a few powers that are only usable once per rage would be a nice mix.
Yeah, but you threw in for option 3... yeach. Rages per day?
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Contributor, RPG Superstar 2008 Top 4, Legendary Games
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Yeah, but you threw in for option 3... yeach. Rages per day?Yup. That's pretty much what I just posted over in the Barbarian Rage [Design] thread.I wouldn't mind switching to many rage options being always available but some of them are too powerful to be always on. I'm thinking of Powerful Blow, Renewed Vigor, Terrifying Howl, and Unexpected Strike in particular... maybe a few others.
Having most powers always available and a few powers that are only usable once per rage would be a nice mix.
Actually, you may have caught my post mid-edit.
I revised it to say that I'm provisionally for either 2 or 3, but ultimately don't care much. The thing I'm really after, regardless of whether it's per day, per round, or per point, is that rage powers (at least a lot of them) last beyond 1 round. If we do that, I'll be happy regardless of whether it's option 1, 2, 3, or 6.02 x 10^23!
We don't make casters re-cast their buffs every round, or dump and old one to pick a new one. Why make the barbarian do it?
Here's my proposal for running Rage Powers without the points:
Rage (Ex): A barbarian can call upon inner reserves of strength and ferocity, granting his additional combat prowess. Starting at 1st level, a barbarian can rage for a number of rounds equal to 4 + his Constitution modifier.
Temporary increases to Constitution, such as those gained from spells like bear’s endurance, do not increase a barbarian’s total number of extra hit points unless it was applied before the rage began. A barbarian can enter or end a rage as a free action, but must wait at least one round to re-activate rage.
Rages are renewed after resting for 8 hours, although these hours do not need to be consecutive.
While in rage, a barbarian gains a +4 Rage bonus to his Strength and Constitution, as well as a +2 morale bonus on Will saves. In addition, he takes a –2 penalty to Armor Class. When raging, he gains an additional number of temporary hit points ½ his barbarian level x his raging Constitution modifier, but these disappear when the rage ends and are not lost first like temporary hit points. Note that this can kill the barbarian if he is "living on his temp hp's" when he comes down from the rage.
While in rage, a barbarian cannot use any Charisma-, Dexterity-, or Intelligence-based skills (except Acrobatics, Fly, Intimidate, and Ride) or any ability that requires patience or concentration. A barbarian can end his rage as a free action and is fatigued after rage for a number of rounds equal to 2 times the number of rounds he spent raging. A barbarian must wait at least one round after a rage ends to enter a new rage. He can otherwise enter rage multiple times during a single encounter or combat. As long as he has rage rounds remaining, he can re-enter a rage while fatigued, but fatigue penalties are cumulative, so “coming down” after two ore more consecutive rages would reset the fatigue duration and make him exhausted until until the fatigue wears off.
I use different Rage types in my game, but here's how the powers work:
Quick Reflexes is now a class ability of the barbarian and is available whether he rages or not:
Quick Reflexes (Ex): The barbarian can make an additional attack of opportunity above the normal limit of one per round. This power is used as an immediate action when an opponent takes an action that provokes an attack of opportunity. This additional AoO stacks with the Combat Reflexes feat.
Now for the rage powers:
Rage Powers: Starting at 1st level, a barbarian gains one rage power. He gains an additional rage power at 2nd level, for every even level of barbarian attained after 2nd level, and at 19th level (instead of 20th). He gets a total of 10 rage powers over the course of his career.
A barbarian can use his rage powers at will an unlimited number of times per day unless otherwise noted, but only while raging. Some powers are usable once per rage or once per day.
Rage Powers: These powers may be selected at any time by the barbarian one he learns the appropriate "Rage type." Note that some powers are prerequisites for others.
Intimidating Glare (Ex): The barbarian can make an Intimidate check against one adjacent foe as a free action. If the barbarian successfully demoralizes his opponent, the foe is shaken for 2d6 rounds.
Knockback (Ex): Anyone hit by the barbarian’s melee attacks this round is puhed back 5 feet, if possible. This power is used before any attacks are made. If an enemy is knocked into an object or wall, he must make a reflex save (DC = damage dealt) or be knocked prone. If an enemy is knocked into another enemy, they both take an additional 1d6 damage and both enemies must make the save or be knocked prone.
Feral Instincts (Ex): The barbarian gains blindsense 30' and can activate Rage and take a standard action in a surprise round. This power is always on and costs no actions, but the barbarian must enter Rage normally.
Moment of Clarity (Ex): The barbarian does not take any of the penalties from rage for 1 round. This includes the penalty to Armor Class and the restriction on what actions can be performed.
Guarded Stance (Ex): When fighting defensively, the barbarian gains a dodge bonus to his Armor Class equal to 1/2 his barbarian level for against melee attacks. This power activates automatically when fighting defensively and requires no action.
Greater Rage Powers: The barbarian can select these powers if he has the Greater Rage class ability.
Fearsome Rage (Su): Prerequisite: Intimidating Glare.
The barbarian emits a 30 ft. aura of fear. Any opponent inside this radius must make a Will save (DC = 10 + ½ barbarian's level + Str modifier) or become shaken for 1d4+1 rounds. If an opponent successfully resists the Intimidate check, he need not make another save until the Barbarian rages again. For each enemy the Barbarian kills in combat, he gets a +1 morale bonus to his intimidate checks for the rest of the encounter. This power is “always on” during a rage once selected and requires no action.
Powerful Blow (Ex): Prerequisite: Knockback Rage Power.
The barbarian adds his barbarian level on one damage roll. This power is used as a swift action before the roll to hit is made. If the barbarian also has the Surprise Accuracy Rage Power, he may combine its effect with Powerful Blow with the same swift action.
Surprise Accuracy (Ex): Prerequisite: Knockback Rage Power.
The barbarian adds his barbarian level on one attack roll. This power is used as a swift action before the roll to hit. If the barbarian also has the Powerful Blow Rage Power, he may combine its effect with Surprise Accuracy with the same swift action
Strength Surge (Ex): Prerequisite: Knockback Rage Power.
The barbarian adds his barbarian level on one Strength check or combat maneuver check, or to his combat maneuver bonus when an opponent attempts a maneuver against him. This power is used as an immediate action and may be used in the same round as Powerful Blow and Surprise Accuracy for making Combat Maneuver attacks like trip and disarm.
Clear Mind (Su): Prerequisite: Moment of Clarity.
A barbarian may reroll a failed Will save. This power is used as an immediate action after the save is failed. The barbarian must take the second result, even if it is worse. Any mind-affecting abilities that would affect the barbarian are delayed for a number of rounds equal to his Con modifier. These rounds do not count against the mind-affecting spells' duration.
Rolling Dodge (Ex): Prerequisite: Guarded Stance. The barbarian gains Evasion and a dodge bonus to his Armor Class equal to 1/2 his barbarian level against ranged attacks. The barbarian does not need to be fighting defensively to gain the benefits of Rolling Dodge.
Mighty Rage Powers: The barbarian can select these powers if he has the Mighty Rage class ability.
Terrifying Howl (Su): Prerequisite: Intimidating Glare and Fearsome Rage. The barbarian unleahes a terrifying howl as a standard action. All enemies within 30 feet must make a Will save (DC equal to 10 + 1/2 the barbarian’s level + the barbarian’s Strength modifier) or be panicked for 1d4+1 rounds. Once an enemy has made a save versus terrifying howl (successful or not) it is immune to this power until the barbarian rages again. The effects of Terrifying Howl stack with those of Intimidating glare and Fearsome Rage. A Mighty Raging Barbarian trying to be frightening can cause quite a few enemies to flee in terror.
Elemental Rage (Su): All of the barbarian’s attacks deal an additional 1d6 points of energy damage for every 2 barbarian levels he has. The energy type must be acid, cold, electricity, or fire. This energy damage stacks with energy damage dealt by special weapon abilities. All damage from the attack is considered to be of the appropriate energy type.
Increased Savage Resilience (Ex): The barbarian gains additional DR 1/- for every 2 barbarian levels he has. This damage reduction stacks with that granted by the Savage Resilience class feature.
Renewed Vigor (Ex): The barbarian can heal himself of any negative status condition by one step. Stunned becomes dazed, nauseated becomes sickened. This is a swift action usable once per round.
Berserker Rage Powers: The barbarian can select these powers if he has the Berserker Rage class ability.
Raging Hurricane (Ex): Prerequisite: Powerful Blow, Surprise Accuracy, Strength Surge: The barbarian can take one additional standard action per round, and may take an attack action as a move-equivalent action. This power is “always on” while raging and does not require any action use to activate.
Feral Spirit (Su): Prerequisite: Feral Instincts, Clear Mind, Moment of Clarity. The barbarian can ignore illusions that grant miss chance and can hit incorporeal enemies as if he were using a Ghost Touch weapon. This power is activated as a swift action and remains active for the entire rage. It must be re-activated for each new rage.
Spirit of the Dire Bear (Su): Prerequisites: Renewed Vigor, Terrifying Howl. With a roar of defiance, the barbarian heals an amount of his own hp equal to his barbarian level times his Constitution modifier. This power is used as a standard action, and can be activated once per day. Any enemies who see him do this must make a Will save or be panicked for 1d6+1 rounds. The DC is the same as for Terrifying Howl. DC = 10 + ½ barbarian levels + his Str modifier.
Bella Sara Charter Superscriber
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I am strongly thinking that some of the rage powers will be "always on" while raging, while others might have limited use (or require points). The design on this front continues.
If possible, it'd be nice to have them all "always on", all limited use, or have a substantial majority one way or the other. The problem with a mix and match approach is that it will almost certainly slow down play at the table because for each ability, the DM and players will have to answer the question if a particular rage ability lasts the entire rage or only for a round. It's easiest to keep straight if all of them are one or the other, a little harder if most are one way or the other (so you only have to learn the exceptions to the general rule), and something of a pain in the butt if they are 50/50.
That being said, a keyword might prove helpful and eliminate this problem. So, all the always on abilities might have similar names (smiting rage, or whatever) whereas the activation ones would have evocative names (brutal strike, or whatever).
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If possible, it'd be nice to have them all "always on", all limited use, or have a substantial majority one way or the other. The problem with a mix and match approach is that it will almost certainly slow down play at the table because for each ability, the DM and players will have to answer the question if a particular rage ability lasts the entire rage or only for a round. It's easiest to keep straight if all of them are one or the other, a little harder if most are one way or the other (so you only have to learn the exceptions to the general rule), and something of a pain in the butt if they are 50/50.
That being said, a keyword might prove helpful and eliminate this problem. So, all the always on abilities might have similar names (smiting rage, or whatever) whereas the activation ones would have evocative names (brutal strike, or whatever).
Sebastian, just to be clear, are you suggesting the all Rage powers should be either "always on" or "one round only"? If so would tracking Rage points basically invole tracking the number of rounds the Barbarian is in the Rage and how many "one round only" powers are being used?
If I am understanding you correctly I love it. We get to keep the versitility of the Rage powers(allowing the Barbarian to do cool combat actions no other class can), the versility of Rage points (allowing the Barbarian to better conserve/manage his Rage without undue complication). GMing NPC Barbarians would be much simpler and you could easily still surprise the players with the Power selection(I have been only using one power with simple math).
Since adding and balancing the Rage powers is part of this weeks projects lets hope your idea gets picked up now.
The "half your level" power would be ridiculously powerful as a semi-permanent power, considering that a barbarian tries to rage as much as possible if they can. Something that powerful should still be round-based.