Okay, you get to control 8 HD worth of undead per caster level, but how? There's no mechanic given for putting this into effect.
Okay, you get to control 8 HD worth of undead per caster level, but how? There's no mechanic given for putting this into effect.
That refers to the Control Pool you get when casting animate dead and similar spells which count against your control pool like ghoul gauntlet. The Control Pool is normally 4 HD per level, and Dread Necromancers have a much larger one.
Also note that all the undead you create with one casting are controlled whether they fit into the control pool or not. So Clerics with the Deathbound domain have an effective Control Pool of 6HD/level, provided that they make all of it with one casting.
-Frank
Okay, you get to control 8 HD worth of undead per caster level, but how? There's no mechanic given for putting this into effect.That refers to the Control Pool you get when casting animate dead and similar spells which count against your control pool like ghoul gauntlet. The Control Pool is normally 4 HD per level, and Dread Necromancers have a much larger one.
Also note that all the undead you create with one casting are controlled whether they fit into the control pool or not. So Clerics with the Deathbound domain have an effective Control Pool of 6HD/level, provided that they make all of it with one casting.
-Frank
Well, then that makes the ability useless until the necromancer reaches what, 5th or 7th level?
Well, then that makes the ability useless until the necromancer reaches what, 5th or 7th level?
You get animate dead at level 7, and you get the ability Animate that gives you affordable crap zombies at level 8.
So yeah, it's a useless ability from levels 1-6. The Necromancer specialist gets total crap that he doesn't even care about at levels 1 and 2, and at levels 4 and 6 he just gets a spell 1/day that he already knows (false life and vampiric touch respectively). Which means that the basic 3.5 Necromancer specialist who gets an extra Necromancy spell every level is way ahead.
At levels 7+ it starts becoming interesting, you can throw around three Fire Giant Skeletons instead of only 1, so properly played you'll reduce the Fighter player to tears. Actual tears. All in all, I'm not super fond of it. It doesn't help at all at the levels that Necromancer Specialists are weak and unrewarding, and it gets really grim at the levels where Necromancy specialists are having to voluntarily limit their power to keep the DM from throwing dice at their head.
-Frank
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So yeah, it's a useless ability from levels 1-6.
Command Undead might be tweaked to now work within this command rating, in which case the power would be relevant at level 3.
Still, it shouldn't be useless at levels 1 and 2...
At levels 7+ it starts becoming interesting, you can throw around three Fire Giant Skeletons instead of only 1, so properly played you'll reduce the Fighter player to tears. Actual tears.
I'd rather see the Unearthed Arcana ACF that allows the Necro to have an 'Undead Companion' that grows with him. One minion, humanoid, skipping all of the potential scariness of multiple pet Bone Creature 1/2 Black Dragon Pyrohydrae or whatever.
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(Sorry for the post length, but it's a lot of info)
Due to the ambiguity and apparent uselessness of the Necromancy School Specialist Bonus, my DM and I have agreed to a variation for my Necromancer in our unofficial game using PRPG rules. This variation is certainly not revolutionary, but it will give your Necromancer a Specialist Bonus that is comparable with the bonuses from the other schools. I thought I would post it here in the event that anyone wanted to use it.
The Specialist Bonus is basically an amalgamation of the Cleric Animal Domain, 1st level Summon Companion Ability and the Summon Undead 1 – 5 Spells from the Heroes of Horror Dungeons and Dragons Supplement. The Necro variation reads as follows:
Necromancy School
Specialist Bonus: As a standard action you can summon one undead companion to aid you as per Summon Undead I. The creature remains until you dismiss it , and you can never have more than one such creature in your service at one time. Once the creature dies or is dismissed, you must wait 1 hour before summoning another. At 6th level, and every four levels thereafter, you may summon a more powerful companion, increasing the Summon Undead spell by 1 (II at 6th level, III at 10th , IV at 14th , and V at 18th ).
Here is a link to the PDF for the Heroes of Horror Supplement: Heroes of Horror Supplement (page 132), but I am including the text and summoning tables for the spells below for convenience:
SUMMON UNDEAD I: Conjuration (Summoning) [Evil], Level: Blackguard 1, cleric 1, dread necromancer 1, sorcerer/wizard 1, Components: V, S, F/DF, Casting Time: 1 round, Range: Close (25 ft. + 5 ft./2 levels), Effect: One summoned creature, Duration: 1 round/level, Saving Throw: None, Spell Resistance: No
This spell functions like summon monster I (see page 285 of the Player’s Handbook), except that you summon an undead creature. Summon undead I conjures one of the creatures from the 1st-level list in the Summon Undead table at right. You choose which creature to summon, and you can change that choice each time you cast the spell. Summoned undead do not count toward the total Hit Dice of undead that you can control with animate dead, plague of undead, or other command undead abilities. No undead creature you summon can have more Hit Dice than your caster level +1. Focus: A tiny bag, a small candle (not lit), and a carved bone from any humanoid. Note: The descriptions of the summon undead spells presented here supersede earlier published descriptions.
SUMMON UNDEAD II: Conjuration (Summoning) [Evil], Level: Blackguard 2, cleric 2, dread necromancer 2, sorcerer/wizard 2, Effect: One or more summoned creatures, no two of which can be more than 30 ft. apart.
This spell functions like summon undead I, except that you can summon one undead from the 2nd-level list or two undead of the same kind from the 1st-level list.
SUMMON UNDEAD III: Conjuration (Summoning) [Evil], Level: Blackguard 3, cleric 3, dread necromancer 3, sorcerer/wizard 3, Effect: One or more summoned creatures, no two of which can be more than 30 ft. apart.
This spell functions like summon undead I, except that you can summon one undead from the 3rd-level list, two undead of the same kind from the 2nd-level list, or four undead of the same kind from the 1st-level list.
SUMMON UNDEAD IV: Conjuration (Summoning) [Evil], Level: Blackguard 4, cleric 4, dread necromancer 4, sorcerer/wizard 4, Effect: One or more summoned creatures, no two of which can be more than 30 ft. apart.
This spell functions like summon undead I, except that you can summon one undead from the 4th-level list, two undead of the same kind from the 3rdlevel list, or four undead of the same kind from a lower-level list.
SUMMON UNDEAD V: Conjuration (Summoning) [Evil], Level: Cleric 5, dread necromancer 5, sorcerer/wizard 5 Effect: One or more summoned creatures, no two of which can be more than 30 ft. apart.
This spell functions like summon undead I, except that you can summon one undead from the 5th-level list, two undead of the same kind from the 4th-level list, or four undead of the same kind from a lower-level list.
SUMMON UNDEAD OPTION LIST:
1st Level: Human Warrior Skeleton or Kobold Zombie
2nd Level: Owlbear Skeleton or Bugbear Zombie
3rd Level: Ghoul, Troll Skeleton or Ogre Zombie
4th Level: Allip, Ghast, or Wyvern Zombie
5th Level: Mummy, Shadow, Vampire Spawn, Wight
I've read a number of postings of players who are looking for a more “White” or “Non-Evil” Necromancer alternative. Clearly the above Summon Undead list won't really jive with that perspective.
I'm going to be playing a Lawful Neutral Osirian Necromancer who follows Pharasma. My DM and I are currently working on an alternate summoning list that focuses on the idea of summoning the (less evil) spirits of my Osirian ancestors. I'm going to roleplay it that these spirits are the unworthy, undead souls trapped in Pharasma's graveyard or athiests who have denied their own afterlives and are seeking favor with Pharasma to gain entry to the Boneyard. I will post this alternate list on this forum when it is done.
For those of you who like this alternate Necromancy School Specialist Bonus, do you have any additional ideas for a “less evil” summoning list?
Hope to hear from you. Thanks.
I think it's a good start. It kinda covers the earlier idea of a pet that grows as you level up.
The pet should be non-intelligent (or a max of 2 like an Animal).
Being non-intelligent the undead of course would be neutral and should cause no problems with non-evil summoners. They are just hollow animated shells made of previously living creatures. Essentially non-thinking, magically-animated machines.
Apparent desecration of dead bodies is a role-playing issue and not a function of alignent necessarily (especially if you are to allow the spell to be cast by non-evil PCs)
I think the creature should be unsummoned if the summoner looses conciousness, due to combat, spells, or just regular resting. The necromancer should conciously keep that pet animated, but not to the full extent of requiring 'concentration'.