Best advice you never got


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What's the best, most useful, or favorite piece of Pathfinder information you found out by playing and experiencing, instead of from the message boards or as advice from other players/GMs?


The feat Gang Up is awesome if you are a rogue. If you have spring attack it can be even better.

Grand Lodge

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Pathfinder Adventure, Rulebook Subscriber

Reach Metamagic is highly useful on spontaneous casters, as the full round action doesn't stop you as much when you can reach out and touch your targets at any range. Especially since you don't need to make touch attacks for communal spells on your allies.


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As a GM: Being fluent in the setting and knowing your players is worth more than several hours of prep per session. With enough of the aforementioned, you can run a session with no more prep than a five word plotseed.

Silver Crusade

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Dont play a fighter, is dumb, boring and uninteresting ...

Should have received that advice long ago before starting a homebrew campaign two years ago.


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MuertoXSky wrote:
Dont play a fighter, is dumb, boring and uninteresting ...

Well, don't play a class. Play a character.

Have the fighter have skill ranks in a skill you don't need (like perform (percussion) or something, even if it's just 1 point in 3 or 4 levels) and have him bang his weapon on his armor before engaging in battle.
Work with the GM to have your character be recognized for that trait.
I'd give a player and his allies a morale bonus if the perform check is good.


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If your class doesn't have a high will save, do everything you can to crank it up. Yes, even if it means delaying that feat or purchase you've been eyeing.

Silver Crusade

Franz Lunzer wrote:
MuertoXSky wrote:
Dont play a fighter, is dumb, boring and uninteresting ...

Well, don't play a class. Play a character.

Have the fighter have skill ranks in a skill you don't need (like perform (percussion) or something, even if it's just 1 point in 3 or 4 levels) and have him bang his weapon on his armor before engaging in battle.
Work with the GM to have your character be recognized for that trait.
I'd give a player and his allies a morale bonus if the perform check is good.

Oh, dont worry i did that and much more. However, the firsts levels, which IMO are the most entertaining, were sooo boring.

Besides, the OP asked for an advice we wished to have, thats what i did.


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Quote:
Have the fighter have skill ranks in a skill you don't need (like perform (percussion) or something, even if it's just 1 point in 3 or 4 levels) and have him bang his weapon on his armor before engaging in battle.

Funny, because I was going to mention how I learned the hard way that burning skill points on flavor often bites you on the ass because you end up lacking when it counts. Especially for classes that get 4 or less and aren't investing in int.


I found this out in Star Wars Saga, but I immediately applied it to D&D /Pathfinder after getting jumped and jacked up. ---> Do not ignore perception even if you do not intend to max it.

I had died before in a 3.5 game from getting jumped by rogues. For some reason I didn't get the hint the first time around.


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In our campaigns I'm the only one that puts anything in perception.

Guess who always rolls ones, twos, and threes on every single f$%#ing perception check!

Yup. :-D


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Had to learn most of these the hard way... -.-'

#3 is particularly important, IMO... And something I wish more GMs would tell their players.

1- CARRY A FREAKING BOW! If you are proficient with them, there is no reason not to! It's unbelievable how often players (even veteran players!) forget about this! Then a flying enemy comes along and their uber-warriors can't do anything.

2- Carry backup weapons. Because you'll eventually be disarmed or have your weapon destroyed. Have a back up. It doesn't have to be as good as your main weapon, but it has to be good enough to keep you alive until you find a better one.

3- Remember: There are no aggro mechanics in Pathfinder. If you want your enemies to focus on you instead of the squishy wizard, you have to give them a reason to! Most often, this reason is raw damage output, but there are other ways.

4- Don't underestimate consumables. I know potions/scrolls are wasted after you use them, but sometimes, they're all you need to get through that one encounter/challenge.

5- Don't overspecialize. Be awesome at whatever it is that you want to be awesome, but don't do it at the cost of being ineffective at everything else. Sometimes, your usual course of action will not be a viable solution.

6- Knowing is half the battle. Always try and get as much information about your next challenge/enemies/puzzles/quest/etc as you can.

7- Carry wands of Cure Light Wounds and wands of Lesser Restoration. They'll save your life more often than your party. ;).

8- Put skill ranks in Perception. Even if your Wis score is not very good and Perception is not one of your class skills. You'll be rolling Perception skill checks more often than any other, so you might as well invest in it. It'll probably save your life at some point.


I have an Elven Medium, that despite having a wisdom of ten has a +7 in perception at first level. 1 rank, +3 class, +2 racial, +1 campaign trait.

I'm going to play him a lot like Sterling Archer. :-)


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understand that gaining knowledge of the mechanics of the system is just as important here as it is in a video game


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Unless you're playing Street Fighter 2, then you just take Chun-Li and mash buttons. :-)

Liberty's Edge

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Alignments are houserules. They should be clarified by the GM before character creation begins


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How much fun you're going to have is probably 80% based on the people you play with and their personalities/styles; 20% based on the system mechanics.
its why there are so many arguments over the mechanics where both sides -know- they're right...because they both are right regarding their table.


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Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Don't be afraid to let players break the rules if they think of something cool to do. Precisely locking into whether the rules cover a situation is a waste of time, and detrimental to fun. Make a judgement call, and run with it.


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You know this weird person who sits at the end of your table? Who throws enemies at you? And says things that move plot forwards? This "GM" dude?

You can discuss pretty much everything with him.


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The best advice I could give would be to cap starting ability scores to something like 16 or 17 AFTER racial adjustment.

This one thing will do more to balance the classes then anything else. It also helps tone down the one-trick-pony type characters who tend to disrupt play, whether it is the level 1 barbarian death machine, or the 15th level wizard who makes gods weep at his power.

Beyond that, I have a nice long list of things to discuss with your group before play begins.

Liberty's Edge

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Best advice I never got:

Don't house rule things until you've tried the original way they work to see if they're a problem. Or unless you're really familiar with the system.

Feel absolutely free to House Rule things extensively once those prerequisites are met.

Keep your House Rules in a written document, so people can access them without reading your mind. People are almost always willing to go with any remotely reasonable House Rules if they're written down and they can examine them.

Fergie wrote:

The best advice I could give would be to cap starting ability scores to something like 16 or 17 AFTER racial adjustment.

This one thing will do more to balance the classes then anything else. It also helps tone down the one-trick-pony type characters who tend to disrupt play, whether it is the level 1 barbarian death machine, or the 15th level wizard who makes gods weep at his power.

16 seems excessive. 18 is a pretty solid plan, though.


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Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
Klara Meison wrote:

You know this weird person who sits at the end of your table? Who throws enemies at you? And says things that move plot forwards? This "GM" dude?

You can discuss pretty much everything with him.

And sometimes the GM is a she, and you can discuss everything with her too!

Have a session 0/character creation session where the party gets to know each other a little bit. It can make things a lot smoother down the road.

Have a general idea of your players' backstories and where want to go with their characters, if possible. It'll make it easier to personalize things later on, and tailoring a few things to the PCs can make it more fun for everyone.

Don't panic. Seriously. Everyone makes mistakes sometimes, and you'll probably screw up a rule here or there, because there are a lot of them. It's not the end of the world.

A lot of problems can be solved or headed off by talking to your players. Make sure everyone knows what kind of game you're running. If you have house rules or things you've banned, make sure everyone knows that before the game starts.

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2015 Top 32, RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

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• Wealth is a second XP track. Magic items aren't "treasure" or cool extras your characters might uncover and proudly wield in dramatic fashion. Magic items are "the rest of your class features", and the Bestiaries make assumptions about which of them you'll have by a given level. If you want loot to be treasure instead of just XP by another name, play a different game or houserule extensively (more and more extensively as you go up in level).

• Organized play has some merits, including some awesome people. It also has some flaws, including some pretty toxic and unhealthy people. Ironically, the latter are very much NOT the group that I keep seeing non-PFS players cite as the reason they don't try PFS. In fact, if you've avoided PFS because you're sure it's probably infested with a certain type of player, I'd venture a guess you're wrong and would actually enjoy PFS a lot more than I did.

• A roleplaying game is not something where you alternate back and forth between "roleplaying" when you're not in combat and "gaming" when you are. Those who treat it that way are really missing out on what it can really be.


swoosh wrote:
Quote:
Have the fighter have skill ranks in a skill you don't need (like perform (percussion) or something, even if it's just 1 point in 3 or 4 levels) and have him bang his weapon on his armor before engaging in battle.
Funny, because I was going to mention how I learned the hard way that burning skill points on flavor often bites you on the ass because you end up lacking when it counts. Especially for classes that get 4 or less and aren't investing in int.

Actually, something I always do is choose a "useless" skill, something no one else would have or consider having, and find ways to take advantage of it. I've managed to get Perform (Dance) banned. XD

Generally, I find that the rest of the party will be thinking about those typical skills. And I'm not saying you should ignore perception (or bluff and sense motive in an ultimate intrigue game). Just that having something out of the box often gives you options the other character won't possess which can become relevant. Having a carpenter or engineer around can let you construct something. Perform dance can be a distraction. Photojournalism can be used to document a crime scene.

It helps though if your GM uses the background skills system. Eventually everyone is going to get bored of being a master linguists in stuff the GM never uses. :p


Ricardo Bolas wrote:
As a GM: Being fluent in the setting and knowing your players is worth more than several hours of prep per session. With enough of the aforementioned, you can run a session with no more prep than a five word plotseed.

Exactly how I run most of my games.


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MuertoXSky wrote:

Dont play a fighter, is dumb, boring and uninteresting ...

Should have received that advice long ago before starting a homebrew campaign two years ago.

Fighters are my favorite class to play.


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Chemlak wrote:
Don't be afraid to let players break the rules if they think of something cool to do. Precisely locking into whether the rules cover a situation is a waste of time, and detrimental to fun. Make a judgement call, and run with it.

I can't agree with this enough.


MuertoXSky wrote:

Don't play a fighter, is dumb, boring and uninteresting ...

I think I've seen your username in the past in some other forum...do yu know sociedadnocturna by chance?


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As a DM I learned that saying "yes, and..." to all of my players' choices created a much better gaming experience at the table. This is in opposition to saying "yes, but..." or flat-out "no" to the players.

That's the improviser in me speaking.

Dark Archive

Organization. No matter what game you play, if you aren't keeping proper track of your supplies and your character sheet is sort of a mess, it can be a slog to play.

Silver Crusade

Nicos wrote:
MuertoXSky wrote:

Don't play a fighter, is dumb, boring and uninteresting ...

I think I've seen your username in the past in some other forum...do yu know sociedadnocturna by chance?

Yeah, I used to play there, until all the players left and all the DM where I played aswel.

Back to the OP question : "Dont play rol games in forums ... "

Another piece of advice I was given, but decided to ignore.


Make sure your caster has "attack" spells that can affect more than a single target.

Getting my butt kicked by swarms(not game term) of much lower CR monsters because I only had single target spells taught me a valuable lesson.


Anything you can do as a class without magic you can do better as another class with magic...unless it's full attacking on a charge.


HyperMissingno wrote:
Anything you can do as a class without magic you can do better as another class with magic...unless it's full attacking on a charge.

Well... There are always Druids, Synthesist Summoners and Primalist Bloodragers. Those are pretty good at Pouncing.

Sovereign Court

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Don't be the only GM in your group for too long. Build up the GMing skills and appetites of everyone in your group, then set lengths of campaigns accordingly so that everyone is the GM at some point over a set timespan (say, a year).

Wish I'd been given this advice: would have ended up with the whole group being good at GMing rather than me being periodically burnt out by running campaigns for too long...


Lemmy wrote:
HyperMissingno wrote:
Anything you can do as a class without magic you can do better as another class with magic...unless it's full attacking on a charge.
Well... There are always Druids, Synthesist Summoners and Primalist Bloodragers. Those are pretty good at Pouncing.

Don't forget alchemists!


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Right, nevermind me. I keep forgetting Primalists, Synthesists, and Beastmorphs are things.


HyperMissingno wrote:
Right, nevermind me. I keep forgetting Primalists, Synthesists, and Beastmorphs are things.

You apparently forgot about the Bard's metal loving cousin too.

The Barbarian, a top tier martial, can full attack on a charge.

The Skald, a middle tier hybrid caster, can hand out the ability to charge to the entire party.

Scarab Sages

"No gaming is better than bad gaming."

Not Pathfinder-specific, and I didn't "never" get it, but if only I'd heard it many years sooner than I did, I might be much better off now.

Sovereign Court

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1. If you use a sword as a primary weapon, start every campaign with a backup cold iron Morningstar. And some javelins.

2. Always bring a butterfly net and a torch on low level adventures - it's the cheapest way to deal with swarms.


have a set time limit on players rounds.

keeps any rule lawyers from pulling out the book every time its their turn to find the perfect way to do things and taking an hour for their six seconds in combat.


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As an addendum to my previous list, I'd like to say that #2 also applies to spell component pouches and holy symbols... Oh, and silversheen weapons are really freaking cheap! Buy them!

And here's something for GMs too... I also had to learn most of them the hard way.

1- Don't use DMPCs. That is, resist the temptation of having a character of yours in the party, unless it's absolutely necessary, and even then, it should NEVER outshine the players.

2- Don't Get Attached to Your NPCs. Chances are they will end up dead or forgotten. Memorable NPCs are a real thing, but you should always think of them the same way you think of characters in Game of Thrones. ("This guy is kinda cool. He'll probably die.")

3- Learn to Improvise and Be Willing to Adapt. Your players will often surprise you with completely unexpected ideas. Learn to accept them and mold the story around their choices instead of forcing their choices to match your preconceived script.

4- Give Them Real Challenges, But Don't Get Adversarial. Remember, the PCs are the heroes! They are supposed to be the stars of the game. Don't be pissed off just because they one-shot'd your villain. It happens. Get over it and move on!

5- Assume Players Will Kill Everything! I'm exaggerating, of course. My point is: Always be prepared for the possibility of the PCs killing (or at least attacking) anything you place in front of them. Sooner or later they will attack someone or something when you were sure they had absolutely no reason to do so. Be prepared.

6- ALWAYS Remember: Your Priority is to Make Sure the Players Are Having Fun! I know it sounds cheesy, but it's true: The GM has the most fun when the players are having fun. You'll quickly notice that you enjoy the game the most when your players having a blast.


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Advice for GMs:

Game mechanics are just a tool for telling a compelling and exciting interactive story. Game mechanics should never get in the way of the story, and should NEVER detract from the fun.

When running a game, be sure that every character gets roughly equal time in the spotlight. But don't let any one character/player hog the spotlight, or you'll start to see resentment among the other players.

When running a prepared adventure, always tailor it to your party. Make sure that there are encounters that can let each PC strut their stuff. Likewise, alter the loot given away to make it more interesting to your PCs.

Never let an inconvenient die roll get in the way of the story.

PC death totally sucks for the player, unless it's really meaningful to the story. Going out in a blaze of glory to protect the Realm can be an awesome way to end a character; getting cut down in an alley by Cultist #4 who got max damage on a critical hit with a scythe is not. Try to avoid putting the PCs in situations where meaningless death is likely.

Don't take away players' autonomy over their PCs. While getting captured by the enemy is a tried-and-true movie plot, players HATE THAT... especially if they feel like they had no say in the matter.

Don't run scenes of sexual violence in your game. It's lazy writing while also potentially traumatic to the players. Just don't do it.
Whenever possible, when a player says, "I do this..." you say, "Yes, and..."

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure, Rulebook Subscriber
Haladir wrote:
Game mechanics are just a tool for telling a compelling and exciting interactive story. Game mechanics should never get in the way of the story, and should NEVER detract from the fun.

And if you find mechanics are getting in the way, you should be playing with fewer mechanics.


Always ask the DM for details about your environment. Knowledge of your immediate surroundings can go a long way to survival.


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TriOmegaZero wrote:
And if you find mechanics are getting in the way, you should be playing with fewer mechanics.

Freaking grease monkeys always spoiling everyone's fun...

XD


TriOmegaZero wrote:
Haladir wrote:
Game mechanics are just a tool for telling a compelling and exciting interactive story. Game mechanics should never get in the way of the story, and should NEVER detract from the fun.
And if you find mechanics are getting in the way, you should be playing with fewer mechanics.

Exactly.

Shadow Lodge

This is where I plug Minimus.


Lemmy wrote:

3- Learn to Improvise and Be Willing to Adapt. Your players will often surprise you with completely unexpected ideas. Learn to accept them and mold the story around their choices instead of forcing their choices to match your preconceived script.

This is my Number One rule.


TOZ wrote:
This is where I plug Minimus.

I got 404'd with that link...

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